Third Party & Independents Archives

Trump On Russia Sanctions

The dims/Communist News Network are beating up on Trump for making nice with Putin

People, Trump said, over and over during the election that he wouldn't show his hand in dealing with sensitive foreign matters. Just like with Muellers revelations, we don't know what is going on in intel agencies.

As the revelations relate the Soviets spent something like a million dollars to foment discontent among the voters. I would suggest the US spends a minimum of $100M on propaganda going in to Russia. Therefore, the advantage is to us, IMO.

Posted by Roy Ellis at February 18, 2018 3:41 PM
Comments
Comment #424498

Our Democratic Republic was, and is, the Russian target in election meddling. They cared less about the candidate.

It is unfortunate that so many of our Democrat and Liberal Pals do not understand that the Russians are still working to foment dissent and violence in the US. They fall for all the fake news on social media and our national Liberal media.

Don’t believe me? Just read some of the crazy comments right here on Watch Blog. They fall into the arms of the Russians and don’t even know it. Don’t you suppose it would please Russian aims, and the aims of tyrants around the world; to disarm the American public?

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 18, 2018 4:25 PM
Comment #424505

Exactly Royal, disarm the public and make them easy pray for terrorist and criminals. The left seems to think by making more gun laws the criminals and terrorist will obey them.

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at February 18, 2018 6:06 PM
Comment #424506

First, I would encourage everyone to read the indictment. It is 37 pages, but some of it can be skimmed, and there is a lot of amazing information in it.

RF,
“Our Democratic Republic was, and is, the Russian target in election meddling.”

That is correct.

“They cared less about the candidate.”

That is false. The Russians favored Trump, and they did everything in their power to stop Hillary Clinton. That included supporting Sanders, and opposing Cruz and Rubio.
The indictment is already out of date because it suggests the Russians decided to attack the election “in or around” 2014, but there has already been a trove of tweets showing Trump was being groomed by the Russians in 2013, when he visited Moscow.

“They fall for all the fake news on social media and our national Liberal media.”

The best known examples of current Russian interference are their boosts of #releasethememo, #Schumershutdown, and #MAGA.

“Don’t you suppose it would please Russian aims, and the aims of tyrants around the world; to disarm the American public?”

Actually, the Russians are supporting gun ownership and the NRA. They like the idea of Americans killing Americans. More importantly, they like anything that sows discord.

Correction to the article- the Russians spent over a million per month on the troll farm.

Trump is treason. Every time he called the Mueller investigation a “hoax” he was lying, and he knew it was a lie. Every single time. Trump intentionally undermined the safety and security of American democracy to further his own personal aims.

Every time Trump attacked Mueller and the FBI and pretend it was a “witch hunt” by Democrats, he sought to obstruct justice. He tried to deflect and distract.


Posted by: phx8 at February 18, 2018 6:15 PM
Comment #424507

Rich, all these “smart” liberals fall for the strangest ideas. The Russians probably planted the idea, in social media, that one’s gender can be changed by just thinking about it. Then, the country will divide itself trying to decide what to call these ah, ah, people; who are unable to believe and understand what they see between their own legs.

The Russians are probably behind the ever increasing abortion numbers. Our “dumb-ass” Pals don’t realize abortion means fewer “legal” citizens able to resist tyranny, fewer taxpayers, and fewer available for our military.

The “Darwin” award goes to sanctuary cities who shelter known criminals, some who murder legal citizens, and decry the legal citizen who owns a firearm. What laws can a citizen break in California; and be sheltered, by the state, from the consequences?

“Disarm they yell”…we will protect you from criminals. What a f*cking joke. They shelter criminals and disarm the honest law abiding citizen.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 18, 2018 6:24 PM
Comment #424508

Yep they sure do Royal, all you have to do is read phx8’s comments and posts they are super hilarious.

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at February 18, 2018 6:30 PM
Comment #424509

My favorite Russian stooge is my pal phx8. He writes; “…a trove of tweets showing Trump was being groomed by the Russians in 2013, when he visited Moscow.”

We wonder if Mueller can use this “trove” as evidence to indict the president for something. The Russians knew Trump was going to run for president even before Trump did.

Can you believe it? Anyone? Despite the declaration by Rosenstein, commenting on the Mueller investigation, that there is no evidence of any citizen knowingly being involved in the Russian adventure, our Russian stooge keeps playing into their hands.

“Actually, the Russians are supporting gun ownership and the NRA.”

There you have it folks. From the demigod’s keyboard to your eyes.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 18, 2018 6:36 PM
Comment #424510

Here is a very readable version of the indictment:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43091945

Notice what this indictment does: it sets the stage for a criminal prosecution of obstruction of justice. If Trump were charged without any underlying crime, it would be difficult to convict him; however, if obstruction is related to a specific crime, convicting him becomes much more feasible. So this indictment sets the stage. It does not directly address ‘collusion’ or obstruction or money laundering or any of the rest. It establishes the underlying crime, that the Russians interfered with the US election in 2016.

Defendants, together with others known and unknown to the Grand Jury, knowingly and intentionally conspired to defraud the United States…”

Pay attention to the phrase “known and unknown.”

“By in or around September 2016, the ORGANIZATION’s monthly budget for Project Lakhta submitted to CONCORD exceeded 73 million Russian rubles (over 1.250,000 U.S. dollars)…”

And remember, that was just one organization.

“30. Defendants and their co-conspirators also travelled, and attempted to travel, to the United States under false pretenses in order to collect intelligence for their interference operations.”

Item 30 goes into a lot of detail about Russians gathering intelligence in the US.

“The Russia story is a total fabrication. It is just an excuse for the greatest loss in the history of American politics. That’s all it is.”
Donald Trump, Huntingdon WV, August 2017

“Have you seen any Russians in West Virginia or Ohio or Pennsylvania? Are there any Russians here tonight? Any Russians?”
Donald Trump, Huntingdon WV, August 2017

“The Democrats had to come up with a story as to why they lost the election, and so badly (306), so they made up a story - RUSSIA. Fake news!”
Donald Trump, February 2017

Remember, by this time Trump had been briefed in detail by the IC. He knew about Russian interference, yet he lied to the country.

Trump repeatedly dismissed Russian meddling in the election as a hoax, and he attacked those who said otherwise. He lied, again and again. His lies directly harmed the security of the United States and undermined our elections and democracy. He did this to benefit himself.

Why did the Russians back Trump? Why did they opposed Hillary Clinton?

Trump was compromised. His presidential run in 2012 was based on the racist conspiracy theory about Birtherism, and it failed. He was a tool the Russians could use, and if he succeeded, he would be the worst possible candidate for the US, and the best possible one for Russia. Conversely, if Hillary Clinton won, she would be best for the US and the worst for the Russians.

Trump is treason.

Posted by: phx8 at February 18, 2018 7:13 PM
Comment #424511

“YAWN”

The only Russian “tools” are the Liberals who can not accept defeat. Hillary lost because of Hillary. Trump won because of Trump.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 18, 2018 7:23 PM
Comment #424512

“43. By 2016, Defendants and their co-conspirators used their fictitious online personas to interfere with the 2016 U.S. presidential election. They engaged in operations primarily intended to communicate derogatory information about Hillary Clinton, to denigrate other candidates such as Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio, and to support Bernie Sanders and then-candidate Donald Trump.”

Posted by: phx8 at February 18, 2018 7:24 PM
Comment #424516

I can see the veins in phx8’s neck stick out from here!

Posted by: Weary Willie at February 18, 2018 8:21 PM
Comment #424517

phx8, I have been telling you Russia and others have been meddling in our elections for decades. Why didn’t Obama, Bush, Clinton, Bush, and on down the line do something about it. Now you and every other snowflake has their panties in a wad because Hillary lost Russia did meddle but from what sources I have seen they supported as well as not supporting all the candidates. Russia loves liberals like you because you believe all the BULLS**T they push and they know people like you will pass it off as fact.

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at February 18, 2018 8:23 PM
Comment #424520

All the evidence, as I know it, points to HRC, Fusion GPS, and Soviet Intel. Don’t know if Mueller will ever go there. If he doesn’t I am sure Jeff Sessions will.

Fusion GPS, Uranium One, HRC’s emails, corruption within/tween HRC and the DNC, so much to cover after Mueller has done his thing.

Meanwhile, just enjoy the olympics and wait for the IG report coming out in March, just around the corner…

Posted by: Roy Ellis at February 18, 2018 8:51 PM
Comment #424522

KAP,
“… Russia and others have been meddling in our elections for decades. Why didn’t Obama, Bush, Clinton, Bush, and on down the line do something about it.”

Cite an example.

This is the first time Russia interfered on behalf of a specific candidate.

Allow me to save you some trouble. There are NO examples of Russia attempting to interfere. The Soviet Union made three known attempts. Stevenson and Humphrey declined the aid. The Soviet Union also tried to smear a candidate, Scoop Jackson.

Oh, and you’ll like this: all three attempts by the Soviet Union were done through the Soviet Ambassador. Think about that.

“… Russia did meddle but from what sources I have seen they supported as well as not supporting all the candidates. candidates.”

Not exactly. Read the previous quote I cited from the indictment. The Russians worked against Cruz and Rubio, but most of all, Hillary Clinton. They helped Sanders as a way of undermining HRC, but most of all, they backed Trump. Read the indictment. Or if you are not up for it, let me know & I will cite additional quotes.

Roy Ellis,
Spoken like a Russian bot.

Posted by: phx8 at February 18, 2018 9:23 PM
Comment #424525

phx8, a WAPO article dated Jan. 8 has an article about Russian meddling from 1991 to now. Also 1960 Stevenson was offered help by the Russian ambassador but declined it, Humphrey was offered help in 1968 by the Russian Ambassador but declined it. That is just going back 58 years. In one news article I heard their meddling goes as far back as 1920. The Russians worked both sides of the fence on all the candidates this time around. They even held a rally and protest for Trump the same day. You need to look at all the NEWS not just your snowflake BULLS**T!!!!

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at February 18, 2018 10:26 PM
Comment #424526

KAP,
The WaPo article lists two major waves of Russian interference: 1) From 1991-2014, Russia interfered in the elections of former SSR’s, and 2) from 2014 to the present, Russia has been interfering with elections among western democracies.

Russia used to be the Soviet Union, of course, and their attempts to bribe candidates prior to the break-up was far different from the information warfare we are experiencing. We are under attack. Western democracies are under attack. The attack is continuing today, and it is expected to continue into the midterms.

Trump is doing nothing, nothing whatsoever, to defend this country against a foreign enemy- not only that, he is actively undermining our defense by dismissing the attacks as a hoax perpetrated by the IC, media, and Democrats. That is treason. The attacks are coming from the Russians, as the indictment detailed. The House & Senate passed a bill outlining a menu of sanctions, 517-5. Trump did NOTHING. To this day he has done nothing to punish the Russians for their past attacks and current ones, and he has done NOTHING to deter expected future attacks.

“They even held a rally and protest for Trump the same day.”

True. One of their goals is to sow discord, to polarize the electorate as much as possible. But recognizing that is one of their goals does not mean that was their ONLY goal, or that the only thing they sought to do was play both sides against one another. The Russians wanted to promote Trump because he was the best choice for helping them and hurting the United States. They focused their attacks on Hillary Clinton because she was their most capable foe. That effort became very focused in mid-2016.

Read the indictment.

Posted by: phx8 at February 18, 2018 10:58 PM
Comment #424527

phx8, OK I read it. Their sole purpose was to sow discord. While all this was going on, on the Obama watch you have the audacity to pitch a b***h about Trump not doing anything, but give Obama a pass? Obama knew what was going on why didn’t he do something? What Russia did didn’t change the election Hillary was just a lousy candidate and would have made a SH***Y president. O and by the way in 1984 Ted Kennedy asked the Russians for help, you can add that to the list. Lets see you say Trump isn’t doing anything to curb Russian involvement, but isn’t that the job of the FBI, and Justice Dept? Maybe Trump already ordered them to look into it, I don’t know! Also there is NOTHING in this indictment that shows Trump had anything to do with the involvement. So unwed your panties phx8 Trump will still be president.

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at February 18, 2018 11:33 PM
Comment #424529

“Obama knew what was going on why didn’t he do something?”

He did not do enough. Obama wanted to publicize the Russian attack in October 2016, but Mitch McConnell opposed it, and said he would accuse Obama of playing politics if Obama said anything. Obama should have said it anyway. Expectations worked against our country. There was a widespread assumption, based on polls, that HRC would win. The actions of Comey, combined with the Russian attack, were just enough- barely enough- to put Trump over the top with an electoral win- just 70,000 votes spread over three states.

Would Trump have won without Russian interference? Maybe. Maybe not. We will never know. IMO it made the difference.

“Trump isn’t doing anything to curb Russian involvement, but isn’t that the job of the FBI, and Justice Dept?”

Trump is in charge of the DOJ and FBI. He has actively obstructed the investigation, most notably by firing Comey. He has also attacked Mueller and the MSM for reporting it.

“Also there is NOTHING in this indictment that shows Trump had anything to do with the involvement.”

Right. The indictment establishes that a serious crime has been committed. The Russians went to great lengths to interfere with our election.

By the way, I don’t expect the Mueller investigation will accuse Trump of anything unless they have convincing evidence. They are running a criminal investigation. Just my opinion, but I think they will have a raft of evidence to convict Trump, Kushner, and Trump Jr., along with others.

Posted by: phx8 at February 19, 2018 12:03 AM
Comment #424530

I think we’re all forgetting the fact that what the people paid by the Russians were doing is typical behavior for political participants. They were doing what both parties do. The only thing that is wrong was the people who were paying weren’t telling the truth about themselves. I wish the government would look at Mexicans the same way they look at Russians. Mexicans insinuate themselves into our election process. They use faked documents to appear to be legal. Why give Mexicans a pass when they do this but single out Russians?

Posted by: Weary Willie at February 19, 2018 12:04 AM
Comment #424531

If you don’t think Mexicans are meddling in our elections you are a hypocrite to single out Russians.

Posted by: Weary Willie at February 19, 2018 12:20 AM
Comment #424532

Phx8, your side wanted Comey fired also so you can quit with the obstruction BULLS××T there was no obstruction. The investigation is still on going. If Mueller had anything on Trump, I am sure that it would be out by now and I think all you have is wishful thinking nothing else.

Posted by: Richard Kapitan at February 19, 2018 12:21 AM
Comment #424563

The very fact that many of our Liberal Pals on WB still believe Hillary would have won if not for the Russians, is evidence of the Russian plan working on susceptible minds incapable of filtering propaganda nonsense from common sense.

Who can argue that Russian propaganda has not influenced our national news media to a great extent. The evidence can be found in their fake news reporting every single day.

The Russians are still supporting the democrats and Hillary this very day by the slick use of surrogates such as phx8 and j2t2 and many in the media. Just read the stuff that these two guys print on WB and, apparently, believe.

The Russians love “useful idiots” as Lenin used to call the stooges who unknowingly promoted the Soviet line.

Just imagine if the Russians attacked our Constitutional Rights as our home-grown Liberal and Socialist do. The Russians need not spend a penny on getting laws passed to outlaw private ownership of guns. The Liberal and Socialist lemmings are doing the job nicely.

Imagine the Russian plan to bankrupt the United States. Again, they use the Liberals and Socialists to demand spending for every and any purpose imaginable with borrowed money. Obama played into the Russian plan by adding $10 Trillion to our debt. The Liberals and Socialist argue and rail against more defense spending to the delight or Putin and the Russians.

Wow…once again our Founders were correct. They warned us against those who would use our freedom “rights” to destroy our Democratic Republic.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 19, 2018 5:28 PM
Comment #424564

The 17th amendment eliminated the states from the check and balance equation defined in the constitution. The 17th amendment took the senate from the states and gave it to the people, a direct reversal of the purpose of the senate.

The 16th amendment transferred the original funding mechanism of the federal government from the states to the people.

Our government more closely resembles a democracy because of these amendments in a way as it is the people who are the decision makers on a 2 year rotation. They don’t have to actually vote. They simply scare their politician into voting for what they want at the time. In 1790 2 years was a very long time. Today it is a blink of an eye.

The people have indeed found a way to unlock the treasury. The key was to eliminate the influence the states had over the federal government and give it to the people.

If we are serious about changing the way our government works we should seriously look at the repeal of the 16th and 17th amendments. A more appropriate funding mechanism can be found and administered by the states as per the original constitution.

I see nothing wrong with a state administering it’s own version of Social Security and making it available to every citizen of the United States. There is nothing wrong with having 50 versions of the Social Security program available to choose from, nothing at all!

Posted by: Weary Willie at February 19, 2018 6:25 PM
Comment #424565

WW,
You’re comparing the behavior of Mexicans in elections to the Russians? Really? Just a quick reminder, Trump said there were millions of “illegal” votes and formed a Presidential Advisory Commission on Voter Integrity under Kris Kobach. The Commission found nothing and was quietly disbanded last month.

“Kobach examined 84 million votes that were cast in 22 states, but referred only 14 cases to be prosecuted.”
Wikipedia

And in the following comment, you demand more stress on States Rights. Hmmm. How did that work out during the Civil Rights movement?

KAP,
“… Your side wanted Comey fired also so you can quit with the obstruction BULLS××T there was no obstruction.”

A lot of people were upset with Comey because of his actions re HRC. However, she never called for him to be fired, and Obama did not fire him, nor did he ever suggest such a thing. Trump, on the other hand, fired him. First, he directed a letter be created saying he was doing it because of the way Comey treated HRC. That was a laughably implausible lie. The day after the firing, Trump met with the Russian ambassador & foreign minister-

-In the Oval Office

-In a meeting requested by Putin

-With no American media attending

-And told them he fired Comey to take off the pressure from the Russian investigation.

In an interview later that week, Trump also said he was thinking about the “Russia thing”- NOT HRC- when he fired the FBI Director.

RF,
Poor thing. You’re backing a traitor and spouting the Russian line at every turn. How many times have you repeated conspiracy theories, only to never have them pan out? Somehow the facts and evidence never materialize. Be careful. In the end you might turn into a Russian bot. Just look at Roy Ellis.

Remember how Roy Ellis used to end WB comments with something about the bad influence of corporations? Now he cheers for corporate tax cuts. He really thought the Nunes memo would result in something… Instead, just crickets. He will support anything that attacks law enforcement, the FBI, the IC, the MSM, Democrats, Republicans, the Mueller investigation, and virtually everyone who is not a Trump supporter. Do you really want to buy into a cult of personality? How long before you sink that low? That is, if you haven’t already.

Posted by: phx8 at February 19, 2018 10:48 PM
Comment #424569

Phx8, the investigation still went on without Comey did it not? So all your talk about obstruction is you blowing hot air and nothing else. How many other foreign dignitaries have there been in the Oval Office of any President without the media? Phx8 you need to cool your jets before you blow a gasket. There was no collusion and there was no obstruction.

Posted by: Richard Kapitan at February 19, 2018 11:29 PM
Comment #424581

“… the investigation still went on without Comey…”

Trump thought firing Comey would either stop the investigation, or at least replace him with a more ‘loyal’ Director. He thought obstructing justice would work. Trump had no idea it would result in a special prosecutor.

According to “Fire and Fury,” Trump fired Comey against the advice of all of his staff. Everyone else thought it was a terrible idea, for obvious reasons. The idea came from Jarvanka- Jared & Ivanka, and Trump himself. Jared and Ivanka believed Democrats would be happy to see Comey fired as revenge for what he did to HRC. They miscalculated. Badly.

Posted by: phx8 at February 20, 2018 10:46 AM
Comment #424582

I don’t care much about Comey, with his stupid self-righteous boy scout act, or the FBI either. Dumpty is shooting at his own partisans, and I would encourage him to continue to do that.

Putain watching a Dumpty impersonator at about 15:20 into this. The whole russian audience is laughing:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCjk_NPsIqU&t=924s

Some of manafort’s political history:

The New Yorker, August 12, 1996 P. 21 Manafort is a longtime Republican lobbyist and political consultant. He is also Bob Dole’s convention manager, which means that he is the chief architect of next week’s Republican National Convention. Manafort has been in politics for pretty much his entire life; when he was 27, he worked the 1976 Republican Convention as a delegate handler for Gerald Ford…
Posted by: ohrealy at February 20, 2018 11:22 AM
Comment #424584

phx8, THERE WAS NO OBSTRUCTION, the investigation continued, the timing of the firing was the problem. If Trump would have fired Comey on day one you probably would still be having the same thoughts phx8. We all understand you hate Trump and fall for any derogatory information so you can blow it all out of proportion. Phx8 anything Trump does is wrong to you.

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at February 20, 2018 12:05 PM
Comment #424585

Danger Alex van der Zwaan. He knows too much. He could provide info on all the shell companies to Mueller, and his indictment may be an attempt to get manafort to flip, if Gates can’t.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/public-safety/mueller-probe-london-based-son-of-russian-businessman-to-plead-guilty-to-false-statements/2018/02/20/142f4d2e-164b-11e8-b681-2d4d462a1921_story.html?utm_term=.359f49866e4c

Posted by: ohrealy at February 20, 2018 12:08 PM
Comment #424589

“According to “Fire and Fury,”…”

That says it all phx8. Quoting from a book written by a person with zero credibility is the bottom of the barrel for Liberals. We are not surprised however as our Libbie and Socialist Pals are still swallowing the Moscow cool-aide.

Despite our past differences phx8, we would still welcome you to join us in denouncing Russian manipulation of the Left.

Here is just one example of the “useful idiots” I wrote about yesterday.

CNN and MSNBC Helped Russia Sow Discord by Promoting Fake Anti-Trump Rally

“Russian attempts to sow disunity in 2016 included the organization of both pro- and anti-Trump rallies in New York City on the Saturday after Election Day.

A check of their November 12 coverage showed both CNN and MSNBC gave enthusiastic coverage to the Russian-organized anti-Trump rally that day, with live reports every hour. Correspondents celebrated the idea that it was “a love rally,” and repeated the marchers’ anti-Trump mantras, such as: “We reject the President-elect.”

https://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/nb/rich-noyes/2018/02/19/flashback-cnn-and-msnbcs-enthusiastic-coverage-russian-sponsored-anti

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 20, 2018 3:47 PM
Comment #424593

Some one said today that Nancy Pelosi spent more on lunch today than the Russians spent trying to affect the election in Wisconsin, Pennsylvania or Michigan.

According to Senator Richard Burr (R., N.C.), ad spending in Wisconsin totaled just $44 during the general election, against $1,925 during the primary; and Pennsylvania’s ad spending totaled $300.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 20, 2018 5:43 PM
Comment #424626

I am so pleased that my last two posts completely befuddled the Left and they have to response.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 21, 2018 6:30 PM
Comment #424629

Correction: “no response”

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 21, 2018 6:54 PM
Comment #424650
According to “Fire and Fury,” Trump fired Comey against the advice of all of his staff. Everyone else thought it was a terrible idea, for obvious reasons. The idea came from Jarvanka- Jared & Ivanka, and Trump himself. Jared and Ivanka believed Democrats would be happy to see Comey fired as revenge for what he did to HRC. They miscalculated. Badly. Posted by: phx8 at February 20, 2018 10:46 AM

Beyond Comey’s October surprise, the FBI was an integral part of Dumpty’s campaign, more significant even than Putain’s involvement. Notice how cousin-forking Ghouliani has disappeared from view. They worked hand in glove with Burr, Corker and Johnson, their USHOR counterparts, and their staffs, to create false stories, and confirm them to news outlets like they were not in collusion, one that an interagency counterintelligence referral was a criminal referral about HRC. Dumpty may not even know or comprehend the extent of the bureau’s involvement in his campaign.

https://www.politico.com/story/2015/11/hillary-clinton-email-no-highly-classified-215599

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