Third Party & Independents Archives

Andrew MacCarthy's Plea to Special Counsel Mueller

Have a great weekend! Sorry, have a Grand weekend. The jury’s still out on what you will be doing this weekend, but almost certainly it will have those two words in the news you see, read, and hear. So Mueller has impaneled a grand jury which means we are now in a criminal investigation and not merely a counterintelligence investigation. And that matters, because they are two distinct processes.

One gathers facts to determine if criminal charges should be laid. The other is an information-gathering exercise that is open-ended and does not result in charges being laid. But as we can see, a counterintelligence investigation can always lead to a criminal investigation. And this is what seems to have happened.

It looks like Paul Manafort's supposed debts with Russian or pro-Russian Ukrainian actors is the key issue here in terms of the focus of this grand jury. Now as far the supposed secrecy involved in a grand jury, Andrew MacCarthy in the National Review (he's a prosecutor with experience in national security issues as well) says the following:

The obligation of secrecy applies to the grand jurors and government personnel who examine witnesses and collect evidence through subpoenas. But subjects of the investigation, witnesses and their lawyers are under no duty to remain silent - even though it's usually a good idea to do so, since statements can be used as evidence. Of course, there are often government leaks. __ You don't say. The release this week of the full transcripts of the president's phone calls with President Nieto of Mexico and the Prime Minister of Australia demonstrate in the words of Mike Allen - a progressive media wonk if there ever was one - that this leak was:

... a real breach and a real sign of animus towards Trump somewhere in the government.

Somewhere?? How about nearly everywhere in the hallways and cubicles of the administrative state?! Especially in the corner offices, one suspects. And the fact that these outrageous leaks have barely caused the media to bat an eye, shows the general level of animus, as Mike Allen would say, towards the president.

Returning to Andrew MacCarthy and his piece in National Review, he pleads for a higher level of transparency on the part of Mueller's prosecutors despite the fact, as he points out, that normally with a grand jury, investigators prefer to operate in secrecy in order to gain advantages over the witnesses they interview.

But this is the President and his associates that are under investigation. As MacCarthy says, we should know and Trump should be told whether he is under criminal investigation. Or whether this is a fishing expedition looking to turn up some hard evidence of collusion. Which they very well might, unfortunately. But so far that is still not the case.

Given how Washington D.C. works at this point, it is likely that any information gleaned from the grand jury process will be delivered in standard format: anonymous leaks.

Posted by AllardK at August 4, 2017 2:53 PM
Comments
Comment #419016

Allard, please back up you comment that president Trump is under investigation.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 4, 2017 4:03 PM
Comment #419019

Trump himself confirmed he is being investigated in a tweet:

“I am being investigated for firing the FBI Director by the man who told me to fire the FBI Director! Witch hunt”

Perhaps Trump was being loose with his language, but an investigation into Obstruction of Justice would be an obvious thing to do after he fired the FBI Director. By itself, that would probably not result in impeachment.

But I think we all know where this is going. Trump will be impeached for Obstruction and money laundering. The people on his campaign will be convicted for money laundering and violation of election laws. Before we get there, Trump will trigger a constitutional crisis. We all know it is coming.

Posted by: phx8 at August 4, 2017 5:10 PM
Comment #419021

“…an investigation into Obstruction of Justice would be an obvious thing to do after he fired the FBI Director.”

I really believed that phx8 was more knowledgeable about the power of the presidency granted by the constitution.

Firing a member of the executive branch is not obstruction of justice under any interpretation.

Regarding the predictions made by phx8, phooey, balderdash, moonbeam dreaming.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 4, 2017 5:22 PM
Comment #419022

ph is suffering from the same mind disease as Maxine Waters. It must be contagious among lefties. The disease is called “the I have no idea what I’m talking about syndrome”.

Posted by: Blaine at August 4, 2017 5:42 PM
Comment #419023

I agree Blaine. The Left wakes up each morning with hatred in their hearts for the president and the country as it is now. They do every thing they can to disparage our Democratic Republic and the free enterprise capitalism that helped bring much of the world into prosperity.

Individual Freedom and Liberty scares them as they are emotional juveniles. They feel safe only when the heavy hand of government is either patting them on the head or spanking them on the rear.

They even find fault with the notion that we should have rules regarding those we invite here to become citizens. They fear immigrants with skills and resources. How will they convince successful people to vote for poverty and death?

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 4, 2017 5:58 PM
Comment #419024

“Under the special counsel regulations, Mueller may be “disciplined or removed from office only by the personal action of the attorney general.” Attorney General Jeff Sessions has recused himself from all matters related to the 2016 presidential campaign, so only Rosenstein has the power to fire Mueller.” According to Rosenstein, “The chain of command for the special counsel is only directly to the attorney general — and in this case, the acting attorney general.”

Trump does have the ability to fire Rosenstein, for no reason at all, as a member of the executive branch.”

http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/22/politics/donald-trump-robert-mueller-authority/

So firing Mueller is not an option for Trump. Firing Comey obviously was an option, as we all know. If the Special Counsel refers it to Congress, they could impeach Trump for Obstruction of Justice for the firing of Comey, as part of a larger effort to prevent looking into Russian interference in the 2016 campaign, and the criminal investigation into the Trump campaign.

We already know subpoenas are going out to the attendees of that Trump Tower meeting, including Kushner and Trump Jr. They will be able to personally tell Trump what happened when they went before the Grand Jury, what documentation they face, and how strong the case looks. At that point, Trump will panic, and his typical reaction when threatened will be to attack. That will spark the crisis.

Posted by: phx8 at August 4, 2017 6:04 PM
Comment #419025

Once again our legal beagle puppy did not read all of the link he posted. His emotions outpaced his reading.

“”Our Constitution gives the president the full prosecution power in Article II; accordingly, any federal prosecutor works ultimately for the president,” Katyal explained. “The president, therefore, would have to direct Rosenstein to fire Mueller — or, somewhat more extravagantly, Trump could order the special-counsel regulations repealed and then fire Mueller himself.”

When will the tea leaf readers on the Left actually understand our constitution and the powers allotted to each branch of government? They grasp for straws hoping that an appointee can wag the tail of the boss.

What phx8 and others on the Left reveal by all their hopes and aspirations regarding Special Counsel Mueller, is that they believe him to be biased in favor of the Left. In this, I agree.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 4, 2017 6:28 PM
Comment #419027
If the Special Counsel refers it to Congress, they could impeach Trump for Obstruction of Justice for the firing of Comey, as part of a larger effort to prevent looking into Russian interference in the 2016 campaign, and the criminal investigation into the Trump campaign.

Posted by: phx8 at August 4, 2017 6:04 PM

I don’t think impeachment is likely to happen this year or even next year. Remember, his partisans are almost as crooked as he is. If the owners of the USHOR want it, then it might happen sooner rather than later. These are some other possibilities that I think might happen sooner than that:

!. Death by natural causes
He’s old, overweight and gaining, and probably hasn’t seen a sensible doctor in decades.

2. Death from above
Lightning does strike on golf courses, although I don’t know if this happens as often in New Jersey as it does in Florida.

3. Death by misadventure
He dies, and we never know exactly what happened, leaving David Pecker to come up with the theories.

4. Assassination
He crossed Putin, and he’s opening himself up by his attitude to the Secret Service and reliance on private security.

5. Suicide
Not likely, but it could happen. This would also leave David Pecker to theorize. If an unsuccessful suicide attempt, this could trigger number six.

6. 25th amendment solution
Everyone already knows that he’s completely bonkers, and no one can rely on him. “His” generals are IMO the most likely to turn on him.

7. Resignation
The family gets him to pardon them all. He declares himself pardoned also and resigns. Legal battle ensues.

8. Impeachment
The democratic leadership doesn’t want this yet. In the USHOR, they could vote against it with wingnuts to keep him in, or abstain in enough numbers to make it all the other party’s responsibility. If it gets to the Senate, then, yes I think they might vote for impeachment.

Posted by: ohrealy at August 4, 2017 7:05 PM
Comment #419028

Yikes…the door to the asylum must have been left unlocked and Ohrealy escaped.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 4, 2017 7:11 PM
Comment #419029

Sorry, the last line of my last post should read, “vote for removal”.

Posted by: ohrealy at August 4, 2017 7:13 PM
Comment #419031

“… Trump could order the special-counsel regulations repealed and then fire Mueller himself.”

There is a concept of the Executive Branch, promoted by people like Alan Dershowitz, that the president is for all practical purposes above the law, with ONLY impeachment holding him accountable. It is a recipe for dictatorship.

Like I said, we can all see this crisis coming. Trump won’t wait for Mueller to complete the investigation. As soon as Trump knows what Mueller is has found (through Kushner & Trump Jr), and if it is threatening enough, then Trump will go on the offensive. Perhaps he could repeal the special counsel regulations & fire Mueller, but Congress would certainly re-appoint Mueller as a Special Prosecutor beyond Trump’s reach. That would slow the investigation and create even more enmity between Trump and Congress, but would push the GOP to the brink? Right now Trump has a 33% approval rating. That would undoubtedly drive it even lower. The Senate will impeach him. Will the House?

Posted by: phx8 at August 4, 2017 7:37 PM
Comment #419032

Give it a rest phx8. All your imaginings are a futile expression of your juvenile emotional inability to deal with reality and fact.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 4, 2017 7:47 PM
Comment #419033

The left thinks they are still in power.

One thing the establishment hasn’t considered, Trump isn’t an insider. Perhaps Trump is allowing this charade to go on as long as he can find out useful information.

I think the left believes they will force Trump from office by way of insinuation, much like they do with insiders. They embarrass them and charge them and the media harasses them until the left gets what they want. Trump doesn’t work that way.

Trump is not an inside the beltway mentalist. He takes people to court instead of apologizing. Wouldn’t it be embarrassing for the left if Trump cleans Mueller’s clock in a court of law?! That would be hilarious?! And, who’s to say it couldn’t happen? Most of the guilty verdicts handed down by the media are from unrelated charges stemming from an unrelated investigation. Does anyone remember what the initial investigation was that got Libby a guilty verdict for perjury? It wasn’t a perjury investigation, was it? There were no other guilty verdicts handed down from that investigation, either. So, Libby was collateral damage from a failed investigation. The Whitewater investigation changed to the Lewinsky Affair, to perjury, to impeachment, but he was a Democratic. It was a failed investigation, none the less.

Let’s see Trump in court against a charge of “collusion”. Let’s see the evidence of money laundering, or any of the charges the left is throwing out, in public court. Let’s see the proof brought up in front of a judge and jury instead of in front of a camera. Let’s watch Trump’s lawyers take the phony out of the equation and see if the left’s predictions will pan out for them as well as the election did.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 4, 2017 8:10 PM
Comment #419035

You guys on the left need to get back on your mess. This is the most ridiculous chatter I have ever heard. Talk about conspiracies and hypotheticals; there is no proof of anything that you two have said.

Posted by: Blaine at August 4, 2017 8:37 PM
Comment #419036

Meds

Posted by: Blaine at August 4, 2017 8:42 PM
Comment #419037

Probably ole hat by now but: Hannity noted that the first FOIA for info on Lynch went to the FBI and the FBI responded that they had no information on the Clinton/Lynch tarmac meeting.

Some months later a 2nd FOIA request went to the DOJ and they came back with 240 pages of detail commo between the DOJ and FBI working to develop ‘talking points’ re the tarmac meeting. Every word of text of what was said was redacted.

Comey’s FBI responded that ‘there is no records’.

This cesspool created by the dem’s is going to be the largest political scandal, by far. A historical event is in the making. Will take several years to play out.

The dem party should disband itself for a myriad of reasons.

GOP incumbents should be voted from office asap.

We need a new 3rd party w/a/dif/pol/att … .

Otherwise, we have the corpocracy we deserve …

Posted by: Roy Ellis at August 4, 2017 11:37 PM
Comment #419042

Once again we see the ignorance of the left. The left is now complaining it is a violation of their civil rights for AG Sessions to crack down on security leaks. Only in the mind of a leftist could it be a violation of one’s civil rights if caught leaking top secrets of the nation.

The WH is having weekly bible studies, seeking divine guidance in running the country, and leftist atheistic organizations are crying that it’s a violation of the constitution. It’s a never ending assault on the beliefs and morals of America. Seven percent of Americans have claimed to be atheists and yet they believe it is their right to dictate to the other 93% how to live their lives.

Every time the left opens their mouth, they turn more Americans against them. Their radical beliefs do not match up with the beliefs of normal Americans. What the east and west coast believe are not in alignment with flyover country. There is a reason why the democrats have lost over 1200 state and local political seats during Obama’s presidency.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 8:36 AM
Comment #419043

When Maxine Waters and Nancy Pelosi start down the path of their leftist rants, people literally laugh at them. They sound like a couple old hags that have lost their minds. The arguments of the leftist on WB are no different. Please explain what difference in the message of SD, WP, ph, j2, or any other liberal, is there from the message of the two old crazy women? I read the comments of ph and j2 and literally laugh out loud at the ignorance.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 8:54 AM
Comment #419044

Reading Trumps supporters’ comments here, I can only be reminded of the line from Hamlet, “Methinks the lady doth protest too much”. Conservatives brazenly take refuge in the fact that Mueller’s investigation has hardly leaked a thing since its creation 2 months ago. But this silence cannot be taken as an indication that Mueller’s team won’t find any evidence of wrongdoing. It means Mueller is a competent leader who commands the respect and admiration of those around him and nothing else. Not everyone is as feckless and undisciplined as our current President.

Donald Trump insists that these allegations are all one giant hoax. He hangs his hat upon the gullibility of his supporters, the sort of people he believes would stand by his side if he shot a man in open daylight on Fifth Avenue. It’s incredibly condescending, to be honest, but apparently it’s okay as long as lip service is paid to issues of immigration, religion and taxation.

So, it comes to this: Robert Mueller has something cooking in the oven and us bystanders are witnessing a plethora of olfactory sensations. Is that citrus aroma a lemon, an orange or a lime? Nobody but chef Mueller and his kitchen aides knows, but it certainly doesn’t smell like there’s a nothingburger in the oven.

Apply Occam’s Razor and a little bit of common sense and it’s quite clear that this investigation will not end well for Donald Trump. The only question at this point is the magnitude of the damage. The DOJ is not in the business of fabricating scandals against our President. If there really was no there there, then none of the current rumors or innuendos would exist.

But alas, if such reasoned speculation offends a conservative’s blind loyalty to his dear leader, I am willing to still concede to those pearl clutchers that it is best to wait until after Mueller has finished his investigation before reaching any final conclusions. I’m just saying that I won’t be holding my breath for complete vindication of President Trump & Company. For your own sake, I recommend you do the same. Consider the rash of articles written defending Richard Nixon from the Watergate allegations in 1973. They have not aged well. It would be a pity for comments here to join those ranks.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 5, 2017 9:36 AM
Comment #419046


Roy

“This cesspool created by the dem’s is going to be the largest political scandal, by far. A historical event is in the making. Will take several years to play out.”


The deep state is doing everything in it’s power to destroy the one person who has vowed to dismantle it. The globalist and establishment will not be taken down without a fight. Trump needs to clean house. Anyone that does not support his agenda, and actively works to undermine him needs to go, and sooner rather than later.

Posted by: dbs at August 5, 2017 10:59 AM
Comment #419047

“little bit of common sense and it’s quite clear that this investigation will not end well for Donald Trump.”

I wouldn’t hang my hat on that. There was ample evidence to impanel a grand jury for hilarys mishandling of classified data, and obstruction of justice for destroying evidence. It never happened. This investigation is nothing more than a distraction designed to bog down the trump agenda. Mueller and the others assigned to this investigation are political hacks, who have all supported democrats. If this were a regular case, they would all be dismissed because of conflict of interest. There has been no evidence leaked because there is nothing of substance to leak.

Posted by: dbs at August 5, 2017 11:11 AM
Comment #419048

And I’m sure that WP remembers the watergate allegations of 1973…Oh, wait a minute, WP wasn’t even a glimmer in his father eye in 1973. All he knows about 1973 is the leftist revisionist history crammed into his head by his 1960’s pot smoking, flower children, communist professors.

Secondly, I have seen WP’s plethora of comments hoping that Trump succeeds because in WP’s words, “he could be a very successful president”. Then we read WP’s conclusion that Trump must be guilty, because, “if there was no there there, then none of the current rumors and innuendos would exist “. So now WP has found Trump guilty of “SOMETHING” based on rumors and innuendos. Of course, WP loves to go on to say let’s wait until the investigation is over, but make no mistake folks, WP has already found Trump guilty and is rooting for guilt. As much as WP wants to sound intellectual and above the fray, he nothing more than a ph or j2, using big words.

I hate to bust the left’s conspiracy bubble, but Trump is not being investigated for anything. There is no Russian there there and Trump is well within his rights to call this a witch hunt from the democrats and the socialists media.

But heck, let’s just keep accusing Trump supporters of being blindly loyal, gullible, and falling for a hoax. Perhaps if you say it enough times, someone will begin to believe you. WP has said nothing original. The comments he has said can be read and heard in the daily MSM, for I might add the past 10 months.

Lastly I would say that WP’s comment about leaks from the Mueller investigation is illogical. There has been NOTHING kept secret where the democrats are concerned. The president can’t even talk by phone to foreign heads of states without a transcript of the exact words being released to the press. The democrats and some republicans have released everything. Yet WP wants us to believe that Mueller and his investigators are able to keep secret anything they find that would hurt Trump. Sorry WP, but if we’re not hearing anything, it’s because there is nothing. A grand jury was convened, which was supposed to be secret, but it was released. Mueller was supposed to investigate a Russian interference in our election, but now is looking into Trump finances and the history of the finances of anyone related to Trump, and I’m not talking about just blood relatives. All of this was leaked for the purpose of making Trump look guilty of something. No WP, if there was anything there, we would know it.

Where you mouth the words about waiting until Mueller is finished, I actually believe in innocence until proven guilty.

You’re nothing special WP, just another liberal pushing hypotheticals and conspiracies.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 11:19 AM
Comment #419050

Evidently Blaine was hanging around those pot smokers, if he thinks what we know of Watergate is revisionists history. This is his normal dribble not based in reality.

Posted by: Cubed at August 5, 2017 12:34 PM
Comment #419051

ALL history provided by liberals is revisionist history. Liberals are liars and they NEVER tell the truth. I listened to a liberal today, while condemning the weekly bible study in the WH, made the comment that separation of church and state is in the Constitution. Needless to say, the conservative he was debating didn’t let him get by with his revisionist history.

Actually, I have never smoked pot and have never done drugs, but I was a teenager in the 60’s, so I know who ended up with the professor’s positions. It’s not rocket science.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 1:16 PM
Comment #419053
I wouldn’t hang my hat on that. There was ample evidence to impanel a grand jury for hilarys mishandling of classified data, and obstruction of justice for destroying evidence. It never happened. This investigation is nothing more than a distraction designed to bog down the trump agenda. Mueller and the others assigned to this investigation are political hacks, who have all supported democrats. If this were a regular case, they would all be dismissed because of conflict of interest. There has been no evidence leaked because there is nothing of substance to leak.

Last I checked, the FBI’s investigation into Hillary Clinton damaged her significantly. I have no prediction as to whether or not Mueller’s grand jury will issue an indictment or not.

Then we read WP’s conclusion that Trump must be guilty, because, “if there was no there there, then none of the current rumors and innuendos would exist “. So now WP has found Trump guilty of “SOMETHING” based on rumors and innuendos.

You speak of ‘guilt’ four times when I made no such insinuation. It’s quite possible for things to be politically damaging, yet not break the law. I believe Hillary Clinton can attest to that.

I hate to bust the left’s conspiracy bubble, but Trump is not being investigated for anything. There is no Russian there there and Trump is well within his rights to call this a witch hunt from the democrats and the socialists media.
You have provided no reasons to justify your speculation that Mueller will exculpate President Trump. Relying on the public’s temporary obliviousness of the internal details of Mueller’s work is foolish.
A grand jury was convened, which was supposed to be secret, but it was released,
Sounds like Blaine forgot to do his homework. AllardK cited Andrew McCarthy’s article in The National Review, a conservative political magazine. Here’s what he had to say:
It is frequently observed that grand-jury proceedings are secret. That is not quite accurate. The obligation of secrecy applies to the grand jurors and government personnel who examine witnesses and collect evidence through subpoenas. But subjects of the investigation, witnesses, and their lawyers are under no duty to remain silent — even though it is usually a good idea to do so, since statements can be used as evidence.

We learned of Mueller’s grand jury from the subjects of the investigation and NOT from the investigators. People were served subpoenas and they passed that scoop onto the press. That is the difference between strong leadership demonstrated by Robert Mueller and weak leadership demonstrated by the White House, where all sorts of sensitive matters are leaked.

WP has already found Trump guilty and is rooting for guilt
I root for nothing other than the truth. It does not matter whether the truth is exculpatory or incriminating. However, I am not going to deride an investigation as a witch hunt just because they have been judicious not to release the evidence they have collected thus far.
ALL history provided by liberals is revisionist history. Liberals are liars and they NEVER tell the truth.

So says the person who has lied repeatedly on Watchblog and has been caught numerous times. On topics from Taqiyya to the US Constitution, Blaine is just a fountain of falsehoods. It must be the opioid-addicted talking heads he outsources his thinking to. Anyway, these sort of absurd absolute statements are an obvious tell for cognitive dissonance. They are a truly desperate gasp from a brain in pain from the truth.

In the meantime, I will maintain my previous positions. Regardless of whether or not Donald Trump is personally culpable of any wrongdoing, it is reasonable to expect that Mueller’s investigation will ultimately leave permanent political damage. It’s hard to imagine a scenario where Michael Flynn or Paul Manafort avoid indictments unless they work out an immunity deal that nabs a bigger fish. When the public learns the truth regarding financial entanglements between Flynn, Manafort, Russia and Turkey, it will not be good for Trump in the short term. In the long term, there is a chance Trump can weather this tempest and rise again. Like a phoenix, I think he is capable of returning stronger and better than before. But, he will need to surround himself with different people for that to be the case. The Democratic Congress that will be elected next year will do a good job facilitating that, but I am getting ahead of myself.

For the time being, it is best to sit and wait for Robert Mueller to do his work unmolested. In the end, he will find the truth and it is the truth that will set us free.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 5, 2017 2:07 PM
Comment #419054

Warren Porter, and you have provided no proof that Trump is being investigated for anything.

Pick and choose WP; you claimed we would not know if Mueller had evidence because the secrets wouldn’t leak out. I gave you several examples of leaks from Mueller’s group and all you answered was that I was wrong about the grand jury. I still stand by my comment that if Mueller has something, it would be leaked.

Secondly, I stand by my comment that the left are liars. The left is represented by politicians and the media. Schumer lied, Harry Reid certainly lied, Maxine Waters lied, Nancy Pelosi lied, Terry McCaullif lied, MSNBC lied, CNN lied, ABC, NBC, CBS all lied, WAPO and NYT lied; and I could just keep quoting the liars. These are the people that your side quotes. That makes you liars too.

And thirdly; if you’re going to try to change the subject by calling me a liar, then you should have told me what I lied about at the time. That would be like me saying, “WP made a racist comment 3 years ago”.

And lastly, you say let’s wait and see what Mueller says, but in reality you have already made up your mind and are promoting your beliefs.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 3:05 PM
Comment #419055

“If there really was no there there, then none of the current rumors or innuendos would exist.”

Hurrah for Warren, he found another way of saying; “Where there’s smoke, there’s fire!” Brilliant!

I suggest our Pal review all the “rumors and innuendos” regarding Obama and his minions. phx8 and others insist there really was no there there”.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 5, 2017 3:10 PM
Comment #419056

As we get closer to the senate primaries leading to the candidates for 2020, I believe the Republican senators up for election will begin to feel the heat from their failure to pass legislation to fix or eliminate Obamacare and other pressing issues which propelled Mr. Trump into the White House.

When the electorate go to the polls in November 2020 will they be thinking about some murky connection between Russia and some Republican campaign underling?

Or, will the electorate be thinking about electing senators who will carry out the agenda that the president ran on and won. Americans want illegal immigration stopped, legal immigration fixed, tax reform that helps both the working class and corporate American to create more and better paying jobs, and the failed Obamacare legislation fixed or eliminated.

Some hazy connection to Russia pales in comparison to the big issues on which voters will express their desire.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 5, 2017 3:24 PM
Comment #419057

I’ve said many times on WB that the country is drifting, and that the generals and Goldman Sachs guys are in charge. Now others are noticing that we have undergone a soft coup. Now the generals are in charge of the country, and the Goldman Sachs guys will run the economy.

General Kelly is the new Chief of Staff, and controls access to Trump. General McMasters heads the NSA. General Mattis heads Defense.

Kelly finally made a prolonged effort by McMasters come true. He fired Ezra-Cohen Watnick over at NSA. He was originally brought into the administration by Flynn, and then protected by Bannon and Kushner. Ezra-Cohen earned the enmity of McMasters for helping Congressman Nunes concoct the fake unmasking stories. Republican Senator Burr and others repeated yet again that Susan Rice did nothing wrong, and that there were no issues associated with unmasking.

Bannon launched a full scale assault on McMasters using Breitbart, with repeated demands for his resignation. What makes this really interesting is that Russian bots did everything in their power to help Breitbart and Bannon, swamping social media with stories about how McMasters should resign.

Trump sided with McMasters.

According to the AP, since the first months of the administration, Kelly and Mattis have agreed that both can never be out of the country at the same time, because one of them has to monitor Trump.

Congress is now not only ignoring Trump, they tied his hands by refusing to go into recess, thereby denying Trump the opportunity to fire Mueller and make a recess appointment- that is, an appointment without a confirmation hearing. Congress is also ignoring Trump’s demands to continue working on repeal and replace. In a way, they don’t have a choice. There are not many days left when they will be in session, and they have to pass some critical legislation.

The military is completely ignoring Trump’s tweet about transgender discrimination.

And I doubt many military people appreciated Stephen Miller going to the Press Room podium, spouting alt-right attacks on legal immigration and the Statue of Liberty, while using Neo-Nazi/Stalinist vocabulary to put down all who oppose, words like “cosmopolitan.”

Funny. I heard Limbaugh after that Miller speech. Conservatives freakin’ HATE the Stature of Liberty, especially that poem encapsulating what America is all about. The idea that America is about freedom, liberty, and opportunity is anathema to them.

Posted by: phx8 at August 5, 2017 3:51 PM
Comment #419058

phx8 forgot a couple things in his hypothetical conspiracy theory:

1. The government is hiding real evidence at Area 51 of aliens who have visited earth.

2. Bigfoot has been spotted in California.

3. There is evidence that JFK was killed by the Russian mob.

4. And lastly, Al Gore has said, “no kidding, the earth is going to melt”.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 4:34 PM
Comment #419059

Blaine,
If you doubt ANYTHING I wrote, choose one or two and I will provide links from credible sources.

The word ‘cosmopolitan’ is very interesting. See if you recognize yourself in this quote from the World Press:

“… the country is in ruins, its economy robbed blind by international capital, while the foreign ownership of some newspapers and other types of mass media outlets made Poland into a colony, infecting Poles’ minds with rootless cosmopolitanism. … What is at stake is Polish Christian national values that must be protected at all cost, namely the linguistic and religious homogeneity of the country. Only Poles should reside in Poland, and a proper Pole must be a Polish-speaking Catholic.”

Trump visited Poland prior to the G-20 meeting and gave an ethno-nationalist speech. Shortly afterwards, Polish democracy faced collapse as the right-wing Law and Justice Party threw out judges in order to replace them with its own. That matters in Poland because the Judiciary oversees elections. They effectively underwent a far right, anti-democratic coup.

It is ironic, given Poland’s experience with ethnic purity in WWII. It is also ironic that Stephen Miller, who is jewish, would use a word like ‘cosmopolitan’ to attack opponents.

Posted by: phx8 at August 5, 2017 4:58 PM
Comment #419060

phx8 believes a “poem encapsulate(s) what America is all about”.

Sure, we know how much easier it is to understand a few lines in a poem rather than read and comprehend our Founding documents that actually reveal why we declared our independence and the form of government we want for ourselves to ensure individual freedom and liberty from oppressive government.

Lady Liberty could grace the harbors of many nations where our brand of freedom and liberby under our Democratic Republic is not practiced.

The poem by Emma Lazarus is not unique to America. The essence of the poem is “yearning to breathe free”. So many uneducated believe it is about immigration.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 5, 2017 5:03 PM
Comment #419061

pdx8, judging by the stories that have come out recently, Bannon is probably the next target of the generals. It brings up an interesting subject in this ethics waivering swamp. Just how many people working in the administration are employed or paid by outside persons or entities besides those who have been waved?

Posted by: ohrealy at August 5, 2017 5:06 PM
Comment #419062

Does the left understand that the words at the base of the Statue of Liberty do not supersede the Constitution and the Bill of Rights?

But here phx8, I’ve got one for you…is it truth or lie?

The Democrats have been attempting to erode the credibility of the Trump administration by promoting the narrative that Trump only won because of interference by the Russian government.

While Democrats in Congress and the media have not yet produced substantial evidence of collusion between Russia and Trump, GOP Congressman Steve King has shed light on President Obama’s interference in the Macedonian elections. Obama funneled millions of dollars into Macedonia to fund left-wing George Soros-sponsored groups.

President Obama used his office and public money to push his preferred type of progressive socialism in the small Balkan country. The public funds, channeled through the government agency USAID, were even used to translate Saul Alinsky’s infamous leftist work Rules for Radicals.
King stated: “I learned that the United States government, borrowing money from China and Saudi Arabia, had handed over at least $5 million dollars in contracts transferred through USAID into George Soros organizations that were used to manipulate elections in the Balkans. And that’s just particularly Macedonia – not including the neighboring countries that are there.”

Congressman King described how Alinsky’s book was used as a basis for undermining Macedonia’s conservative ruling party: “And some of that money was used to translate Saul Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals into Macedonian to distribute the book, and the Rules for Radicals and actions of radicals were manifested in the election efforts in that part of the world.”

Obama’s election interference expenditures in Macedonia, which have reached $5 million so far. A total of $9.5 million up to the year 2021 has been earmarked by the US State Department specifically for this purpose.

In Macedonia, USAID has been working hand-in-hand with George Soros’s Open Society Foundation. Obama’s Macedonian policies were aimed at defeating the center-right government, a pro-life, low-tax administration that is one of the most conservative in Europe.

Much of the money has gone to news outlets supporting the leftist Social Democratic Union of Macedonia (SDSM). Members of this party, who donned “Soros Army” t-shirts, took to Macedonia’s streets to throw rocks at police guarding the conservative Internal Macedonian Revolutionary Organization (VMRO) headquarters.

Although VMRO managed to win a plurality of the vote in the 2016 parliamentary elections, SDSM formed a coalition with the left-of-center Albanian DUI Party to claim a majority in parliament. The DUI aims to completely reshape Macedonia by making Albanian the official language and changing the country’s flag and national anthem.

This is not the first case of election meddling for either Obama or Soros. The American Spectator detailed President Obama’s extensive involvement in foreign elections, including funneling State Department grants to Israeli groups that opposed Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. In another case, Obama threatened Honduras after they legitimately removed their Hugo Chavez-allied president–who had illegally tried to make himself a lifetime ruler.
George Soros has played a massive role in European and American politics for decades. Most recently, Soros has been funding anti-Trump groups in America.

Obama not only worked to entrench far-left socialism in the US, but abroad as well. Many of his programs to manipulate foreign elections are still in place. It now falls on President Trump to put an end to the Obama-era exportation of progressivism.

http://conservativefighters.com/news/watch-congressman-breaks-house-floor-says-one-thing-obama-wanted-hidden/?utm_content=buffercf064&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 5:20 PM
Comment #419063
I gave you several examples of leaks from Mueller’s group and all you answered was that I was wrong about the grand jury.

This is a straight, bald-faced lie. You gave me a single alleged ‘leak’ regarding Mueller’s group regarding the Grand Jury, which I refuted. Apart from that you have given me nothing.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 5, 2017 5:21 PM
Comment #419064

Blaine,
Macedonia is complicated. It is a poor, small country of just 2 million people that used to be part of the communist empire. They are currently dealing with epic amounts of corruption, and they face threats from Russia, who wants to see the EU and NATO weakened, and prevent a free market economy from flourishing. Macedonia is a candidate for both the EU & NATO.

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/international/328398-gop-senators-dont-side-with-russia-on-macedonia

And you should know better than to listen to Representative Stephen King. When you see people attacking Macedonia and American relations with that country, you are seeing people doing the work of the Russian government and Putin.

Posted by: phx8 at August 5, 2017 5:45 PM
Comment #419065

WP, so you don’t consider the fact that Mueller was supposed to look into Russian influence in the presidential election, but it now comes out that he is looking into Trumps financial records, as a leak? Or that he is looking into the financial records of Trump’s associates as a leak? This information has been all over the media, could you explain where it came from? The only one that knew Mueller was investigating finances was Mueller.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 6:27 PM
Comment #419066

ph, so you ignored the fact that Obama used taxpayers money and worked with George Soros to affect the outcome of a foreign election? Not to mention the spreading of Saul Alinsky book “Rules for Radicals”. You instead call congressman King a liar when he is speaking on the House floor.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 6:44 PM
Comment #419067
you don’t consider the fact that Mueller was supposed to look into Russian influence in the presidential election, but it now comes out that he is looking into Trumps financial records, as a leak? Or that he is looking into the financial records of Trump’s associates as a leak? This information has been all over the media, could you explain where it came from? The only one that knew Mueller was investigating finances was Mueller.

You never said anything about finances in your earlier comments in this thread. Your earlier statement, “I gave you several examples…” remains just as false as before. You are a liar.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 5, 2017 6:48 PM
Comment #419068

Whoops! Scratch that recent comment. I shot first and asked questions later and made a mistake. Sorry.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 5, 2017 6:50 PM
Comment #419069

Anyway, it is my assumption that the reports regarding Mueller’s investigation into financial histories of Trump and his friends comes from the mouths of the banks and financial institutions that have been served subpoenas from Mueller and his subordinates.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 5, 2017 6:52 PM
Comment #419070

Comment #419048, 5th paragraph down. You’re an idiot.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 6:53 PM
Comment #419071

So you assume? I assume Mueller would have told anyone he was going to question, that this information was not to be released to the press. It doesn’t change the fact that it was released and if Mueller had anything on Trump it would have been released too.

Posted by: Blaine at August 5, 2017 7:03 PM
Comment #419073

The organization funded by Soros “promotes democracy, government accountability and freedom of expression.” But there is not doubt, Western values are under attack.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/01/world/europe/after-trump-win-anti-soros-forces-are-emboldened-in-eastern-europe.html

The attack is being led by the Russians in order to further Russian interests. The Russians have found willing allies in Eastern Europe, Western Europe, and the United States. The attackers favor ethno-centrism. They oppose economic and military cooperation between the western democracies. They favor nationalist cultures and national religions because those prevent cooperation across borders. They oppose immigration as well.

There is a good reason the Statue of Liberty infuriates these people.

Congressman King is one of those favoring ethno-nationalism. He is much worse than a liar. He is a bigot and a racist, and terrible for the future of this country.

So is Trump. That is part of the reason Trump will argue with allies such as Australia and Mexico, yet never say anything negative about him. More importantly, Trump has been compromised. That will come out in the investigation, but it has been glaringly obvious from the beginning.

Posted by: phx8 at August 5, 2017 7:19 PM
Comment #419074
I assume Mueller would have told anyone he was going to question, that this information was not to be released to the press.

There’s no reason to assume that. People who receive subpoenas are generally under no legal obligation to keep them secret. Regardless, it would not be the fault of Mueller or his team if any of these people being questioned released information to the press.

It doesn’t change the fact that it was released and if Mueller had anything on Trump it would have been released too.
Just because banks and financial institutions leak doesn’t mean Mueller’s team does too. Mueller has led a pretty tight ship. Most of the media reports are sourced to the White House itself. The leaks are the currency expended by Jared Kushner, Steve Bannon and others as they vie for power. Posted by: Warren Porter at August 5, 2017 7:27 PM
Comment #419101

Glad to see Louise Mensch, Claude Taylor and Keith Olbermann are all still here at WatchBlog.

No doubt MUFON and BFRO have seen their traffic slow.

Posted by: kctim at August 7, 2017 8:43 AM
Comment #419107

There are democrats and there are liberal democrats. Some are even able to use logic and think for themselves. But here at WB, we are cursed with the dregs of socialism. They are parrots, they simply repeat what the likes of Olbermann, Maxine Waters, Pelosi, etc. etc. etc, tell them to say. The democrats and establishment republicans are dumping classified and nonclassified information on Trump as fast as they get ahold of it. Yet WP will continue to argue that Mueller would never let any information get out. WP lives in a fantasy world. A snake will bite you, because that’s what snakes do. An enemy of Trump will dump secrets because that’s what they do. WP himself would dump secrets to the media, if he knew any.

Posted by: Blaine at August 7, 2017 1:10 PM
Comment #419108

The country is adrift, being run by generals and Goldman Sachs guys. As long as they leave the Obama legacy intact, the country can continue to drift. The big concern is, what happens when something big goes wrong, some external event?

We have essentially seen a soft coup by the generals. The Congress has pulled Trump’s teeth.
1. Congress stayed in a pro forma session rather than going on recess, thereby preventing recess appointments by Trump.
2. Congress will not spend any more time on repeal and replace.
3. There is bipartisan legislation to prevent Trump from destroying Obamacare by withholding CSR’s.
4. There is bipartisan legislation being crafted which will explicitly prevent Trump from firing Mueller.
5. Congress forced Trump to eat a sanctions bill- the only major piece of legislation seen to date.

As McCain said today, Republicans see weakness in Trump. Several Senators are in open revolt- McCain, Collins, Murkowski, Flake, and more.

Posted by: phx8 at August 7, 2017 2:49 PM
Comment #419109

Comment #419107 was just vindicated by comment #419108.

The parrot is acting like those were his comments.

Posted by: Blaine at August 7, 2017 3:01 PM
Comment #419110

Well Blaine, you’re right again about the parrots.

It is a wonderment that anyone with even handshake knowledge of the Constitution would believe that one branch of our national government can pass laws that repeal the Constitutional power of another branch.

While our Pals on the Left are reading the latest “fake” news about President Trump being ineffective, he just continues to rack up success.

I am astonished that President Trump can remain so focused on his job to make America great again; all the while swatting at these pesky Liberal flies.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 7, 2017 3:12 PM
Comment #419112

Obama’s only legacy is his creating a decade of division in order to force his progressive transformation on the country. Creating division is standard operating procedure for ‘community’ activists.

With the ‘MSM’ colluding with the democratic party to influence our elections with lies and attacks on our form of government and our electoral process, it seems the Obama ‘legacy’ of destroying political opponents at all cost, is well intact.

Hopefully normal Americans will tire of the lefts fascist tactics.

Posted by: kctim at August 7, 2017 3:25 PM
Comment #419113

I wouldn’t give them pleasure of being called liberal flies. I would have to classify them as “Pecker Gnats”. Pecker gnats spend their time in the cesspool of human waste. For the left, that means they make their abode in outhouses.

Posted by: Blaine at August 7, 2017 3:27 PM
Comment #419114

Not as democrats, but as WB leftist; their job is not to debate and certainly not to make sense; their job is to stir excrement. Or sling it, whichever comes first.

Posted by: Blaine at August 7, 2017 3:33 PM
Comment #419122

Comments by Blaine contain no content.

A content by RF makes a vague statement about branches of government “passing laws” that infringe on the power of other branches, followed by a claim about all those Trump successes… That somehow no supporter can name. And apparently Trump is focused on… something. Probably golf.

kctim. Let’s see. Obama was divisive. The MSM colluded with Democrats to influence elections with lies. Uh huh. Remarkably free of facts.

Look at my previous comment. I specified examples of what is going on, and why Trump is being ignored by his own party, Congress, and military.

Posted by: phx8 at August 7, 2017 5:49 PM
Comment #419123

Just for my Pal phx8, here’s a link to a few of President Trump’s successes. It will be fun to read his dissing of them. We all know that a Republican/Conservative success must be denied as harmful, hurtful, or illegal by our Buddies on the Left and Lefter and Leftist.

http://video.foxnews.com/v/5532499447001/?#sp=show-clips

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 7, 2017 5:54 PM
Comment #419125

Remarkably free of facts? Come on Phx8, that all came from ‘unnamed sources’ and we all know that means they are verifiable facts.

Posted by: kctim at August 7, 2017 6:00 PM
Comment #419126

Does our boy phx8 need help understanding my “vague statement” regarding the separation of powers as provided by our constitution? I will sign him up for a free course on the constitution offered by Hillsdale College if he can’t bring himself to do it.

The website is: http://lp.hillsdale.edu/constitution-101-signup-3-ppc/?utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=con101&appeal_code=MK617PP10

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 7, 2017 6:04 PM
Comment #419129

I’m offended, my comments certainly do contain content. I gave the definition of pecker gnats, I explained how democrats stir excrement, and how they sling excrement to see if it sticks.

Posted by: Blaine at August 7, 2017 7:26 PM
Comment #419130

RF,
Hillsdale College is a small, mediocre school in Michigan. Erik Prince, the brother of Nancy DeVos, went there. I’ve seen their pamphlets. A person would do better consulting a precocious high school sophomore for advice on the Constitution.

Wow. I watched that link about Trump’s successes. About half of the two minute video brags about the economy, for which I have just two words: Thanks, Obama.

Remember when those same numbers under Obama were denounced as fake, fraudulent, fixed, terrible, and so on? Oceania is at war with Eurasia. Oceania has always been at war with Eurasia.

The other accomplishments mostly consist of… well… not much. Using EO’s to undo some Obama EO’s. Using Review to undermine some late Obama legislation. And hey, when it comes to renaming Post Offices, Trump is a beast! He named a few judges. The video tries to make it look like a lot, but it is not. Rule changes made it harder to Obama to approve them early in his administration. Trump has failed badly when it comes to appointments, especially in the Executive Branch.

Successes, let’s see… Illegal immigration is down. But then again, so is tourism. A LOT fewer people want to come to the United States anymore. Nothing like trashing the national reputation. Thanks, Trump. Let’s see… Trump created a task force that might do something. Someday. Maybe. And that is counted as a success! FOX had to go there to fill out a 2:37 video with ‘successes you never heard of.’ Hoo boy.

The video ends talking about Trump signing to ban lobbyists. I don’t think that is accurate. Trump has already waved more lobbyists into government than Obama did in 8 years. Or maybe he bans them and then immediately waves them. Or maybe he just plays golf with them.

Posted by: phx8 at August 7, 2017 7:54 PM
Comment #419131

Interesting. The IBD/TIPP poll shows Trump with a 32% approval rating. It was one of the two most pro-Trump polls in the 2016 election. 32%? Ouch. That’s gonna leave a mark!

kctim complains about divisiveness, but when it comes to Trump, the American people appear to be remarkably unified. They agree Trump is terrible.

And to put the economic numbers in perspective: in its first 6 months, the Trump administration has added 1.038 million jobs; in its last 6 months, the Obama administration added 1.048 million jobs. Virtually identical numbers.

Posted by: phx8 at August 7, 2017 8:57 PM
Comment #419133

phx8,

Given Trump’s paltry accomplishments, it is no wonder that Watchblog’s conservatives do nothing but whine and call the Left insulting names. They have nothing happy to talk about. The pathos is extraordinary.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 7, 2017 10:11 PM
Comment #419135

I found this annotated Steele Dossier via a sub-reddit. I’m curious what anyone here, those with normal functioning brain anyway, think about Kaspersky’s denials of any involvement with the russian government, considering the Bloomberg report that Flynn was also paid by Kaspersky. Bloomberg

Posted by: ohrealy at August 7, 2017 10:40 PM
Comment #419136

I’m not going to comment on any specific unproven allegations until Mueller finishes his investigation.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 7, 2017 11:38 PM
Comment #419138

ohrealy,
Flynn reportedly updated his financial disclosure again, just recently.

It doesn’t get talked about much, but near the end of the Obama administration, they asked Flynn if it would all right to proceed with a major operation, an attack against Raqqa, headquarters for ISIS, using Kurdish troops. Flynn said not to do it. The question is, did Flynn do it to promote US interests, or to promote Turkish interests? Flynn was on the Turkish payroll. The Turks strongly objected to the Kurds doing much of anything, never mind taking credit for destroying ISIS.

WP,
The Mueller investigation could go on a long time, especially the money laundering aspect. The Russian and American Mafia conduct their laundering knowing that it has to be hidden from law enforcement. They are pretty clever about it. Not clever enough though. American law enforcement has bagged some of them, and some of the same people who have jailed the top mobster money launderers are on the Mueller team.

But I don’t think Trump will let it go that long. When Trump Jr and Kushner see the documentation they face, they will let Trump know, that will be the decision point.-**********************************
Heh. That was the cat on the keyboard. Beautiful Bea, my Persian.

Posted by: phx8 at August 8, 2017 12:15 AM
Comment #419141

pdx8, I don’t know if Flynn was ever really working for Turkey. He may have been working for russia all along. We catered to the Turks because of the long standing alliance, which is falling apart. We tried to get the Europeans to accept them into the EEC, and later into the Eurozone, which has stalled because of their purges. Because of our entanglements in Iraq, our policy had changed in ways that the turks don’t like. Blast from the past:


Comment #246717

The war on terrorism becomes an excuse for creating huge deficits on our side, to fight against the newest named boogeyman, while grabing some oil wells.

The Turks are just settling old scores. We should have supported independence for Kurdistan at the time of the first Gulf War, but the Turks didn’t want it, and we wanted all the allies we could get.

How does their incursion plays in the rest of Iraq?
Posted by: ohrealy at February 28, 2008 10:33 PM

from http://www.watchblog.com/democrats/archives/005859.html

Posted by: ohrealy at August 8, 2017 1:28 AM
Comment #419154

Phx8,
I can’t decide whether to laugh at the idea that polls actually mean anything, or at how you selectively pick and choose polls thinking they prove some kind of point.
They don’t.

I am hardly a fan of Trump, and I too probably would have said I disapprove. But I would take the worst of Trump over what you would consider the best of Clinton, any day.

As the left has already proven, over and over, your hatred of Trump has absolutely nothing to do with any possible wrongdoing that you think he may be guilty of. This is ALL about disagreeing with progressive policy and that makes Trump nothing but another target for your hatred.
This isn’t based on any actual love or concern you have for the country, it is based entirely on protecting the oppressive policy that you desire. Policy you want so bad that you are willing to create division between the people and harm the country, to get. A despicable tactic that those on the right have suffered under for the past decade.

Now, please continue with the baseless lynching of your President simply because he doesn’t support abortion on demand, oppressing Christians, banning guns, letting grown men shower with little girls, and redistributing wealth to your liking.

Posted by: kctim at August 8, 2017 9:04 AM
Comment #419155

“They have nothing happy to talk about.”

How would you know that when all that is being talked about is this Russian conspiracy nonsense?

ICE is enforcing our laws once again.
We are out of that Paris BS.
The 2nd Amendment is no longer under constant attack.
Russia Russia Russia

Posted by: kctim at August 8, 2017 9:21 AM
Comment #419158

kctim,
Polls mean nothing? The politicians follow them closely- Democrats, Republicans, liberals, conservatives, and most of all, Trump. They provide information. They illustrate trends. Trump constantly cites polls as long as they are favorable. When they become unfavorable, then everything is fake.

You write: “But I would take the worst of Trump over what you would consider the best of Clinton, any day.”

What does that even mean? Hillary Clinton never served as president. A more apt comparison would be with Obama.

“This is ALL about disagreeing with progressive policy and that makes Trump nothing but another target for your hatred.”

Then why do so many Republicans disagree with him? Why do so many conservatives disagree with him? Why is Trump so incredibly unpopular abroad, among every single country except Israel and Russia?

When have you ever been “oppressed” by a progressive policy.

“… abortion on demand, oppressing Christians, banning guns, letting grown men shower with little girls, and redistributing wealth to your liking.”

I am pretty sure you are male, so unless you feel like you need to control women, that couldn’t be it. I am pretty sure you have always been able to practice your faith in church without interference. There is no such thing as a policy allowing grown men to shower with little girls. And as for wealth…

If wealth was divided equally in the US, every family would own $528,000 in assets.

Instead, almost all of the wealth is concentrated in the top 1%. Did they earn it? Some. But about 60% inherited their wealth.

Posted by: phx8 at August 8, 2017 11:46 AM
Comment #419160

Phx8,

I couldn’t care less what Trump and his ego thinks of polls. The only ‘poll’ that matters is the vote.

“What does that even mean? Hillary Clinton never served as president. A more apt comparison would be with Obama.”

It means that while I would have stated my disapproval of Trump in a poll, it does not mean I would support a democrat over him.
And yes, I would take Trump over Obama in a heartbeat.

“Then why do so many Republicans disagree with him?”

Because Republican voters don’t tend to fall in lockstep with each other. That doesn’t mean they’re now voting democrat.

“Why do so many conservatives disagree with him?”

Because he isn’t a Conservative.

“Why is Trump so incredibly unpopular abroad”

Because they are democratic socialists who have no clue about the individual rights and freedoms that our Constitutional Republic was founded on. They support society over the individual.

“When have you ever been “oppressed” by a progressive policy.”

Progressive policy requires infringing upon individual rights. It is burdensome and unjust.

“I am pretty sure you are male, so unless you feel like you need to control women, that couldn’t be it.”

Like you, I am pro abortion. But you are being intentionally dishonest in claiming that being anti abortion has anything to do with controlling women.

“I am pretty sure you have always been able to practice your faith in church without interference.”

I am an atheist. However, our free exercise of religion was never meant to be prohibited to government approved places.

“There is no such thing as a policy allowing grown men to shower with little girls.”

That is what the entire ‘trans’ debate is all about; people pretending to be the opposite s^x being able to use the facilities of the s*x they are pretending to be.
You guys pushed your luck with the gender identity BS and you got called on it.

“Instead, almost all of the wealth is concentrated in the top 1%. Did they earn it? Some. But about 60% inherited their wealth.”

Um, so? Their wealth, their right to do with it as they please. Who are we to determine what others do with it?

Posted by: kctim at August 8, 2017 1:59 PM
Comment #419161

kctim, it only matters to phx8 if the 1% are republicans. Trump’s man Miller was hammered in the liberal media for buying a condo worth 1 million dollars, yet Bernie Sanders owns at least 3 houses worth millions of dollars and the liberal media is silent. Al Gore has lied his way into multiple millions of dollars spreading BS, yet there’s nothing in the press about how rich Gore has become. Wealth is the result of capitalism, and there are still people wanting to come to America, the land of opportunity, to get their piece of the pie. He talks about inherited wealth as being evil, yet in the land of his love…the socialists land of Europe. The land every democrat wants to pattern America after; the wealth has been passed down for centuries. Not decades, but centuries.

Regarding the polls and Trump following them; if Trump had followed the polls leading up to the election, he would have just quit. Every time Trump farted, the media immediately showed Trump dropping in the polls. Clear up until the MSM talking heads stood in front of the cameras with their mouths hanging open, the polls were still showing Hillary winning. No ph, I don’t think Trump puts much stock in polls. But explain to me how Trumps support is dropping, but at the same time the numbers of people who see Trumps economic policies as being successful are very high. In fact in the sixties. The numbers don’t jive.

The NYT just got busted running another fake story about GW.

Posted by: Blaine at August 8, 2017 2:40 PM
Comment #419162

You are doing pretty good, kctim. But, we do need strong anti-trust law, IMO. Companies should not be allowed to monopolize/consolidate to a point where they effect growth, economy and so on - - -

You might like the term ‘illuminati’ or the ‘establishment’ instead of corpocracy but, it’s these folks that are determined that Trump will not be able to change NAFTA, build a wall (destroy the NAU), reduce HC cost and so on — -

We need to check out the uranium-1 deal. We need an informed electorate.

Otherwise - - -

Posted by: Roy Ellis at August 8, 2017 3:01 PM
Comment #419163

Blaine,
The point of the coverage of Miller’s condo is that this was the guy who was denouncing people for being “cosmopolitan.”

Al Gore has been a congressman, Senator, Vice President, and won the popular vote for president. After politics, he has been on the cutting edge of technological companies, made a famous film, won a Grammy and an Oscar, and won the Nobel Peace Prize.

That a distinguished careers.

Do you think passing down wealth for generations and concentrating it in a tiny percentage of the population is a good idea?

“No ph, I don’t think Trump puts much stock in polls.”

Do you remember anything at all about the 2016 campaign?

“But explain to me how Trumps support is dropping, but at the same time the numbers of people who see Trumps economic policies as being successful are very high.”

Simple. The number of Democrats who believe the economy is doing well is identical under both Obama and Trump. It has remained the same. Conservatives have gone from believing the economy was terrible under Obama, but the same economy is terrific under Trump. The economic numbers are literally identical, the trends the same. Only the views of conservative Republicans have changed, and that change is directly a result of partisanship and tribalism.

That is not the only place you see this happen. It was the same with Syria. The number of Democrats who thought we should bomb them remained the same regardless of who was president. Republicans opposed bombing when Obama was president, but approved of it with Trump.

Posted by: phx8 at August 8, 2017 3:13 PM
Comment #419164

“A person would do better consulting a precocious high school sophomore for advice (rather than Hillsdale College) on the Constitution.”

We know just such a person phx8. Look in the mirror. No wonder you make such ignorant statements regarding the Constitution.

I predicted that my Pals on the Left would trash all of President Trumps accomplishment so early in his administration. But, I accomplished what I intended. Since they argued that they disagree with his accomplishments; they can no longer write that he has none. LOL, these people are so easy to lead by the nose. Scratch a Liberal with the truth and stand back and watch the explosion.

Trump has not had much support from Republicans on the big legislative issues so far. I don’t blame Trump, I blame the RINO’s and fence-sitters. Perhaps this will change after the 2018 election as some of these swamp-dwellers go home for good.

With most of the media trashing the president every single day, and with little or no reporting of this administrations accomplishments by the media, it it a testament to the presidents skill that his polling is as high as it is.

The president remains focused on the campaign promises that got him elected. He is also dealing with some really bad actors around the world. We should all hope that the president remains committed to stopping North Korea and Iran from hostile actions that could start another war.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 8, 2017 3:26 PM
Comment #419168

Lost in the “Russiamania” Media scam is some positive news for American taxpayers.

Dr. Carson Putting an End to Obama’s Illegal Section 8 Scheme

“The Department of Housing and Urban Development is poised to reverse the Obama administration’s policy and return to a competitive bidding process to award Section 8 housing, according to a well-placed source in the department.

The move would overturn the Obama-era methodology of using a grant-style process that was rebuked by administrators and ultimately the U.S. Supreme Court.”

http://thepoliticalinsider.com/carson-hud-8-scheme/?utm_content=be1670ff7de66b30a6473c7b9fa19141&source=CI&utm_campaign=TPI_Afternoon_Newsletter_8_8_2017&utm_source=TPI-Newsletter-8-8-2017-afternoon&utm_medium=email

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 8, 2017 4:14 PM
Comment #419169

“I am for doing good to the poor, but…I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. I observed…that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer.”


― Benjamin Franklin

Posted by: dbs at August 8, 2017 5:12 PM
Comment #419170

Repeal that [welfare] law, and you will soon see a change in their manners. St. Monday and St. Tuesday, will soon cease to be holidays. Six days shalt thou labor, though one of the old commandments long treated as out of date, will again be looked upon as a respectable precept; industry will increase, and with it plenty among the lower people; their circumstances will mend, and more will be done for their happiness by inuring them to provide for themselves, than could be done by dividing all your estates among them.

Benjamin Franklin, letter to Collinson, May 9, 1753

Posted by: dbs at August 8, 2017 5:16 PM
Comment #419171

“…more will be done for their happiness by inuring them to provide for themselves, than could be done by dividing all your estates among them.”

Benjamin Franklin, letter to Collinson, May 9, 1753
Posted by: dbs at August 8, 2017 5:16 PM

Thanks for the Franklin quotes.

I wonder if we can get even one Liberal/Progressive/Socialist to agree with Franklin on poverty. I doubt it. Franklin will be viewed as a mean, uncaring, doting old fool.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 8, 2017 5:24 PM
Comment #419174

The left loves to contemplate how much more intelligent they are than to the old guys that wrote the constitution. But I would guarantee the are no congressmen or senators living today who could write the document. Our republic was the most successful experiment in the history of humanity. I think it was either ph or j2 who mocked Hillsdale College as being some dinky little substandard school. I wonder if ph understands that John Adams went to Harvard when it only consisted of 4 buildings and a handful of students. I would venture to say the grads of Hillsdale are constitutionalist.

Posted by: Blaine at August 8, 2017 7:55 PM
Comment #419175

I would venture to say the grads of Hillsdale are constitutionalist.
Posted by: Blaine at August 8, 2017 7:55 PM

You would be correct Blaine. Take a look at their faculty, courses and student body. Outstanding in every respect. I donate frequently to their program of providing free copies of our Founding Documents to High School teachers and students. Their guest speakers are simply outstanding.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 8, 2017 8:04 PM
Comment #419177

That’s pretty funny. I received a Hillsdale flyer in the mail today. It consisted of nothing other than a plea for money, based on their being Christian. That’s it. That was the sum total of the tract. “I’m a Christian. Give me money.’

Posted by: phx8 at August 8, 2017 8:52 PM
Comment #419178

So?

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 8, 2017 9:59 PM
Comment #419179

That’s the best ph can do. Doesn’t he want to argue that today’s democrats could have come up with a better constitution than the founding fathers? Doesn’t he want to slam the founding fathers as being out of touch with today’s modern progressive democrat? Doesn’t he want to argue about why a small college in the 1700’s was better than a small college today?

I have 3 grandchildren that graduated from a small Christian college in WV. All three have El Ed degrees and are teaching in public schools. Two things noted. Number one, when they took their Ohio state certification exams, they were told by teacher friends to forget the morality they were taught if they wanted to pass the exams. They were told to think like and answer the questions as if they were liberals. And secondly, they have been told by their school administrators that they are the most prepared and qualified teachers they have had in years. So I guess being a graduate of a large liberal college doesn’t necessarily mean you get a better education. I’m quite proud of them. They are Christians, and they are very conservative.

Posted by: Blaine at August 8, 2017 10:38 PM
Comment #419196

Hillsdale ‘alumni’ wouldn’t know the Constitution if it bit them in the ass. Conservatives love their revisionist histories, but there is only one word to describe them: Wrong.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 9, 2017 10:17 AM
Comment #419197

What”revisionist history” would that be ? Do tell. Lol

Posted by: dbs at August 9, 2017 1:09 PM
Comment #419199

“Hillsdale ‘alumni’ wouldn’t know the Constitution if it bit them in the ass.”

Well of course Warren believes this. His Liberal University indoctrination is complete. He has been taught that the American History of our Founding has been wrong for nearly 200 years and only now has been corrected.

My guess is that Warren, throughout his entire learning experience, has never been exposed to views in opposition to the Liberal Mantra.

Liberals only believe what their hierarchy feeds them. They even believe that MMGW is “settled science”.

“There is nothing more anti-scientific than the very idea that science is settled, static, impervious to challenge. You sit in front of a computer screen for 10 years and you start to think of your model as being real.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/charles-krauthammer-the-myth-of-settled-science/2014/02/20/c1f8d994-9a75-11e3-b931-0204122c514b_story.html?utm_term=.5caf86ec7e75


Posted by: Royal Flush at August 9, 2017 2:40 PM
Comment #419202

Despite Royal Flush’s unfounded allegations, I did not learn anything about the US Constitution or politics when I was in school. Most of what I know is stuff taught to me by my parents or what I have taught myself. School for me was a matter of mastering mathematical proofs and learning to apply that knowledge to understand our world. For an elective, I may have taken a class studying the music of Beethoven or the philosophy of Alan Turing, but those are far removed from the Constitutional issues we discuss here. I’ve told Royal Flush this before, yet he continues to shoehorn a talking point template meant for someone else onto me. I’ve heard before that the definition of insanity involves trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

What”revisionist history” would that be ? Do tell. Lol

Laughing doesn’t make your interpretation of the Constitution correct; it only makes your incorrect beliefs look more foolish. If you don’t know my position on things, you haven’t been reading my comments here very closely.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 9, 2017 3:19 PM
Comment #419204

Poor Warren. He is simply out-of-step with those who understand our Founding. He can’t help it. I understand that, and have some pity for his faulty and admitted, self-study of American history.

Warren has been corrected many times by me and others on his revisionist thinking to no avail. He has closed his mind which is not a scientific attribute.

It is sad, and truly a waste of a good mind, when some of our youth are only exposed to the “stinking thinking” of Liberalism, Progressivism, and Socialism.

After years of being shut off from true debate and unbiased study, their brains develop a sort of callous; a hardening that allows nothing but preconceptions to enter.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 9, 2017 3:41 PM
Comment #419210
After years of being shut off from true debate and unbiased study, their brains develop a sort of callous; a hardening that allows nothing but preconceptions to enter.

Thank you for such an apt description of the typical conservative mind. I wonder when was the last time RF conceded an argument and changed his view in accordance with new information.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 9, 2017 4:24 PM
Comment #419211

I am complimented by Warren usurping my words. It’s a beginning. Now, the challenge is to persuade him to usurp Conservative political views.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 9, 2017 4:29 PM
Comment #419212

I should add to my last comment that Warren supports those who prevent speakers with opposing political viewpoints to freely speak at many Liberal places of “learning”.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 9, 2017 4:35 PM
Comment #419217

“Hillsdale ‘alumni’ wouldn’t know the Constitution if it bit them in the ass. Conservatives love their revisionist histories, but there is only one word to describe them: Wrong.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 9, 2017 10:17 AM”

If WP did not study the constitution in college, and his only knowledge of the constitution comes from his parents or self study, then please explain what qualifies him to make the above statement. It’s the height of arrogance to claim Hillsdale college professors are ignorant of the very subjects they teach. And before WP goes bananas and says “I said alumni”, we might add that alumni are the product of the professors.

I too, would like to hear the revisionist history of conservatives, since WP is the one who made the comment. In all my years, I have never heard conservatives called historical revisionists.

And if WP believes conservatives are wrong, then pray tell in what way?

Posted by: Blaine at August 9, 2017 5:25 PM
Comment #419225

Warren Porter demonstrates his lack of understanding of the constitution quite clearly when he says conservatives are “wrong”. Using that word defies the very core of what the founding fathers envisioned.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 9, 2017 11:01 PM
Comment #419230

“Laughing doesn’t make your interpretation of the Constitution correct; it only makes your incorrect beliefs look more foolish. If you don’t know my position on things, you haven’t been reading my comments here very closely.”

That doesn’t answer the question. What “revisionist history”? You made a blanket statement about conservatives. If you cant answer the question that’s okay.

Posted by: dbs at August 10, 2017 6:09 AM
Comment #419231

https://www.facebook.com/dickmorriscom/


“JUSTICE DEPT REOPENS HILLARY E-MAIL AND CLINTON FOUNDATION CASE; NEGOTIATING PLEA DEAL. Deep 6 The Deep State with Dick Morris”

Posted by: dbs at August 10, 2017 6:15 AM
Comment #419235
What “revisionist history”?

I’ve written for years about Constitutional issues. If you haven’t figured out where I stand, you haven’t been paying attention. I do not want this thread to go further off topic with a discussion on whatever arbitrary revisionist history I may cite. I will name a few examples, but in depth discussions will have to wait for another day. I have neither time nor energy to simultaneously debate the 2nd Amendment, Separation of Church & State, the Article I power for Congress to provide for the general Welfare of the United States, the 14th Amendment’s equal protection clause or the other multitude of issues conservatives get wrong about the Constitution.

If you are truly curious, look in Watchblog’s archives. Numerous times, I’ve laid out the reasoning for why I believe conservative reinterpretations of the Constitution are inconsistent with the ideals of the Founding Fathers. It’d be a waste of my time to rehash the specifics of those old arguments over and over again and I frankly have better things to do today.

Using that word defies the very core of what the founding fathers envisioned.

WW,

This sounds like you are arguing that there is no “right” or “wrong” when it comes to the Constitution. I didn’t know you were such a relativist.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 10, 2017 10:35 AM
Comment #419239

Warren Porter interjects into the conversation the fact that conservatives have revised history and that Hillsdale College is a below par college the produces ignorant students. And when asked to explain his ignorant comments, his answer is “I discussed these things somewhere back in history and refuse to discuss them again because I don’t want to change the subject of the thread”. So why did you bring it up Mr. I learned the constitution from my parents and by self help studies from Carl Marx and Joseph Stalin.?

Posted by: Blaine at August 10, 2017 12:32 PM
Comment #419245
So why did you bring it up

I’m not the one who brought it up. I believe it was you and Royal Flush who first began mentioning revisionist histories and suggesting that phx8 needed to take remedial coursework at a laughingstock of a school. If you are the first to make a claim, the onus is on you to back the claim up. Until you actually explain to the rest of us what is wrong with phx8’s understanding of the Constitution, your comments here are meaningless.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 10, 2017 2:46 PM
Comment #419247

You mentioned the general welfare of the United States. The federal government is to provide for the general welfare of the united states.

The key word is “general”. The left’s revisionist history of the constitution substituted “general” with “personal” whether you believe that or not, and with that revision has created a dependency class of citizens through Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, federal unemployment, welfare, and a myriad of other personal subsidies that exclude most of the general population of the U.S.

You cannot provide for the general welfare of the country one victim at a time. The clause has been bastardized by the left to promote a dependence on the federal government using class warfare. It is harmful and it results in a reduction of the general welfare of the country. It defies the constitution.

The founding fathers didn’t write the constitution to say this group is wrong, or that group is wrong. They wrote it to include the individual. They outlined rights given to all citizens by their Creator. To say conservatives are wrong simply because they disagree with you is what the founding fathers were fleeing, not what they wanted to create here.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 10, 2017 3:57 PM
Comment #419248

“The founding fathers didn’t write the constitution to say this group is wrong, or that group is wrong.”

Absolutely correct and right on target Weary. The Left instituted “identity politics”; designed to place the electorate into groups which could then be pandered to as a means of gaining votes.

Thus, we have the “privileged white man” group, religious, gun owners and others, which the Left can demonize as they glorify the morally corrupt, the wastrels, the illegal immigrants, the abortionist, the bastardization of academia, and more.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 10, 2017 4:17 PM
Comment #419249

Weary Willie,

Thank you for your comment. Let me first preface by saying I prefer doing away with most of those cited programs and replacing them with a robust universal basic income. I think a UBI is more faithful to the idea of providing for the general welfare than those specific programs.

That said, I do not espouse the idea that these programs completely contradict the founders’ wish for a government that promotes/provides for the common welfare. I acknowledge the little tension that is there, but I do not subscribe to a binary mode of thinking where anything short of 100% strict compliance is wrong. (But I do regard such dichotomous thinking as absolutely wrong).

It is important to remember that all law-abiding US citizens have the ability to benefit from the programs you cite. None of them are restricted to individuals of a particular race, creed or geography. Anyone who finds himself or herself destitute or in old age is eligible for public assistance. And anyone who is not currently destitute benefits from the security of knowing that a safety net is available should bad luck strike.

So, it isn’t completely true to describe these programs as , “personal subsidies that exclude most of the general population of the U.S.” because all US citizens benefit from these programs. Nevertheless, I freely acknowledge that the welfare state is the element of modern liberalism that is on the shakiest ground from a Constitutional point of view. But the gap here is relatively small compared to the vast chasms that lie between conservative interpretations of the Constitution and the founders’ intentions.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 10, 2017 4:23 PM
Comment #419251

One thing we as United States Citizens are supposed to share is a love for our country. I have a love for my state. I’m a proud Hoosier. My pride for my state extends to the United States because we’re all supposed to support common beliefs. Those beliefs used to be enshrined in the Constitution, but the Progressive movement from T. Roosevelt on has corrupted those beliefs. The left is going so far as to use those beliefs as a weapon against those who disagree with the Progressive movement.

The citizens of the United States thrived for over 150 years without the influence of a federal government. Not until 1913 did the federal government have any influence on the individual or his property. The amendment was sold as a tax on only the rich.

“If you like your income you can keep your income! Only the rich will pay their fair share.!”

Nobody saw what the left hand was doing. World War after World War, tragedy after tragedy, social program after social program, failure after failure, fix after fix, dominated the 20th century. All the while the citizens of this country suffered loss of freedom after loss of freedom.

One question I have is:
Is it designed to be like this? Do the powers that be build up to tear down? Tear down to rebuild? Have they caused the crime and discontent around the world to suit their own goals? The US federal government built it’s entire social network off the spoils of WW II. We had no competitors, only customers and a spent Russia provided the need for a Military Industrial Complex.

The real question we should be asking is:
Are we being manipulated by a select few? Are we being led by the nose with issues like Russia and Korea, faux rights, budgets and shutdowns, Non-stop scare tactics brought to you daily, on the half hour, by the MSM? Are we being forced to accept our current environment by people who are immune to the repercussions?

How do we know?


Posted by: Weary Willie at August 10, 2017 4:55 PM
Comment #419252

The 16th amendment isn’t needed, has caused great harm, and should be repealed. State and local governments are not prohibited from applying income tax if they choose. State and local governments can provide for the destitute and elderly. Those governments can better serve their own needs more efficiently than a federal government can.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 10, 2017 5:03 PM
Comment #419253

We should also not forget the responsibilities the family has to the destitute and elderly. Let’s also not forget the influence the church should be wielding.

Many of the positive influences of the past have been dismantled and replaced by the federal government. The 16th and 17th amendments have facilitated that destruction. I know of only 10 laws that were written in stone. The rest of them can be amended.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 10, 2017 5:06 PM
Comment #419254

A basic income is a handout with another name. Soon it wouldn’t be enough, because of inflation or opinion. It will not solve the problems it was promoted as solving. It very well could be the sealant on the cast of a socialist society.

A much better basic income can be achieved with individual tax cuts across the board.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 10, 2017 5:11 PM
Comment #419255

Weary, the Left is proficient in devising political plans that favor one class of American over another.

A guaranteed “basic income” is a communist/socialist dream. It has worked nowhere.

We have watched Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid become bloated and politicized.

The fiscal year 2016 spending on Medicare, Social Security, Medicaid, and net interest paid on the debt are up significantly. Together, they total $2,152 billion and make up 56.6 percent of the budget.

Would anyone care to guess what percent of the national budget these three existing welfare plans, plus an added welfare plan (basic income) would represent as a percentage of the budget? My guess is that within ten years these programs would suck up around 80% of our national budget. The Liberal answer would be to tax and borrow more. Within another ten years, if the Libs get their way, our national debt would approach $30 Trillion. The economy would crash from high taxes. Why produce when you get to keep so little of what you earn?

What…me worry? Hell no. I won’t be the one paying for this catastrophic idea.

Warren Porter will pay.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 10, 2017 5:46 PM
Comment #419260

When I meet people who’ve just started social security they are happy. They also think it’s their money. They have little concern for the people who actually pay them every month.

Warren Porter must still believe the way my father believed. He must also think he will receive the same return my father did. He must not realize the benefits of a world destroyed by war and the potential of an untouched economy. I think he believes his generation will receive the same joy people experience now, but he’s not taking into account the difference a competitive world will have on his future compared to the leisurely, and abundant life generated by being the only functional economy in the world.


Posted by: Weary Willie at August 10, 2017 7:16 PM
Comment #419261

Warren Porter must, first and foremost, guarantee the U.S. wins the next world war. Otherwise we’re only going to be someone Else’s “customer”.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 10, 2017 7:20 PM
Comment #419265

WW, you make good points. While you are correct about every scheme the government has designed to fill their coffers; it is a fact that they are running out of other people’s money. Hence the government debt and borrowing. Whether democrats or republicans, the goal is to create more income. This is where Obamacare and Global Warming come in. The HC scheme creates unlimited income and global warming opens the door for the government to have unlimited taxing abilities upon the American people. It will be done in the name of taxing those evil corporations. But corporations don’t pay taxes, consumers do.

Posted by: Blaine at August 10, 2017 8:14 PM
Comment #419266

I used to think it would be great if everyone that had a car drive it up as close to the capitol as they could get and park it. If everyone did that it would stop the government and the rest of the country would go on without it.

I also thought it would be great if we could opt out of SS and mandated healthcare taxes. What do you think would happen if we told Warren Porter that after he paid into Medicare all his working life he still has to pay a premium each month for his medicare benefits? Do you think if given the choice the average Joe Kid would pay all his life for something he can’t benefit from until he’s older, and then have to pay premiums each month to be able to use it? Do you think if Joe Kid understood how medicare and social security really worked they would voluntarily pay into it all their lives? It’s been a ponzi scheme from the beginning. The only reason it’s failing is because we don’t have the customer base we had after WWII. We got stuck with the empire, and the rest of the world enjoys functioning economies.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 10, 2017 8:45 PM
Comment #419271

“the Article I power for Congress to provide for the general Welfare of the United States,”

I just read article 1, and don’t see this mentioned anywhere. I’d also add that promoting the general welfare, and providing for the general welfare are completely different things. It would seem you are the one reinterpreting the constitution. But I’ll leave it there.

Posted by: dbs at August 11, 2017 6:14 AM
Comment #419275

I stand corrected. Sorry for confusing you. You are right to point out the difference in provide and promote. However, neither dictate the personal subsidies mentioned above. My point was that the general welfare clause has been revised by the left to promote their agenda to populate a dependency class.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 11, 2017 9:17 AM
Comment #419276

WW

I was responding to warren. And I agree with you on the left bastardisation of the “promote the general welfare” statement.

Posted by: dbs at August 11, 2017 9:35 AM
Comment #419281
Those governments can better serve their own needs more efficiently than a federal government can.
We should also not forget the responsibilities the family has to the destitute and elderly. Let’s also not forget the influence the church should be wielding.

WW,

This statement represents wishful thinking and perhaps a bit of speculation or conjecture. However, there are no hard facts to back up your claim. In fact, given the longstanding impact of racial segregation, there is reason to suggest that the Federal government is better at these tasks.

Voluntary charity and family support should have as much a role in providing general welfare as non-governmental have in providing the common defense.

A basic income is a handout with another name. Soon it wouldn’t be enough, because of inflation or opinion. It will not solve the problems it was promoted as solving. It very well could be the sealant on the cast of a socialist society.

A much better basic income can be achieved with individual tax cuts across the board.

We can discuss the politics of a UBI another time. All I am saying is that a UBI is more faithful to the Constitution than existing welfare programs.

Warren Porter must still believe the way my father believed. He must also think he will receive the same return my father did. He must not realize the benefits of a world destroyed by war and the potential of an untouched economy. I think he believes his generation will receive the same joy people experience now, but he’s not taking into account the difference a competitive world will have on his future compared to the leisurely, and abundant life generated by being the only functional economy in the world.

Actually, as far as I am concerned, I do not expect to see a single cent of the money I contribute to Social Security or Medicare. All the money I pay in FICA taxes today goes to support the likes of Royal Flush, Blaine and others. Maybe there will be someone younger willing to support me when I am retired or maybe not, only time will tell. In the meantime, I am not holding my breath over it.

I just read article 1, and don’t see this mentioned anywhere. I’d also add that promoting the general welfare, and providing for the general welfare are completely different things. It would seem you are the one reinterpreting the constitution. But I’ll leave it there.

dbs,

You are confused. The preamble discusses promoting the general welfare, but Article I Section 8 says, “The Congress shall have Power To lay and Collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States;”

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 11, 2017 5:23 PM
Comment #419284

WP, you arrogant little wise a**. You are so fond of reminding me what have written. Perhaps you have forgotten, I receive no SS. I paid into a private retirement fund and invested. So stop with your comments that you are paying for my retirement.

Posted by: Blaine at August 11, 2017 6:04 PM
Comment #419286

All the money I pay in FICA taxes today goes to support the likes of Royal Flush, Blaine and others.

Exactly the way intended by Liberals.

At least Warren recognizes that these plans are likely to fail before he gets on the receiving end. It does make one wonder why our chum Warren would support other government entitlements such as guaranteed basic income and Medicare for everyone.

But then, the Lefty never looks back at the carnage their political policies leave in their wake. They wake up in a new reality every day. It is called insanity.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 11, 2017 6:26 PM
Comment #419288

This article in The Wall Street Journal succinctly describes and follows the path outlining how, and why, the Democrat Party is destroying itself.

The Liberal Crackup

“Liberals should reject the divisive, zero-sum politics of identity and find their way back to a unifying vision of the common good”

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-liberal-crackup-1502456857

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 11, 2017 6:55 PM
Comment #419290

The democrats instituted SS, and the democrats robbed SS, and now the left cries about paying into it. It does my heart good to hear them cry.

Posted by: Blaine at August 11, 2017 7:00 PM
Comment #419303
Maybe there will be someone younger willing to support me when I am retired or maybe not, only time will tell. In the meantime, I am not holding my breath over it. Posted by: Warren Porter at August 11, 2017 5:23 PM

Immigrants will be paying into social security for your retirement, once we’re out of this long national nightmare. Six months seems like ten years already.

Posted by: ohrealy at August 11, 2017 10:52 PM
Comment #419304

It sounds more like whining, not crying.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 11, 2017 10:55 PM
Comment #419307

Anyway, it seems conservatives have devolved into criticizing SS and Medicare on their political merits rather than on the basis of their Constitutionality, exactly as I predicted. They don’t have a leg to stand on when it comes to interpreting the Constitution with their revisionist histories and take to attacking and vile language when the ruse is exposed.

Posted by: Warren Porter at August 12, 2017 12:40 AM
Comment #419311

Crying is a signal of distress. Whining is a spoiled child trying to get his daily fix of selfishness.

It is the left who has determined SS and Medicare are “third rail” in D.C. It is the left who portray Republicans rolling their crippled grandmother into a chasm. The left has politicized SS and Medicare from it’s “I’ll get every nigger to vote for the Democratic party for the next one-hundred years” declaration by Lyndon Baines Johnson at the Great Society’s conception.

It’s sad how the only things the left want to conceive are programs designed to control anyone utilizing them.

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 12, 2017 2:11 AM
Comment #419333

I don’t believe even using Wonder Women’s Lasso could get Warren to tell the truth about the big three entitlement programs that are draining our treasury and increasing our debt.

Posted by: Royal Flush at August 12, 2017 3:28 PM
Comment #419351

“It is the left who has determined SS and Medicare are “third rail” in D.C.”

Royal,

Then conservatives should have no trouble getting rid of them. Republicans control the executive and legislative branches. They aren’t constitutional rights. So, vote them out.

I think that you will find that it isn’t just the left that is fond of SS and Medicare. But, maybe not. I strongly encourage you to give it a try.

Posted by: Rich at August 13, 2017 1:21 AM
Comment #419354

Sure, who could not be fond of a program that’s been holding a gun to our heads while removing our money from our pockets for our entire lives?

Posted by: Weary Willie at August 13, 2017 9:02 AM
Post a comment