Third Party & Independents Archives

How Will Trump's Wall Compare With The Pope's Wall

http://www.theamericanmirror.com/photos-pope-calls-for-us-to-embrace-illegals-while-maintaining-massive-wall-around-vatican/

Does anybody know how high this wall is? Can we get one for the southern border?

Posted by Roy Ellis at May 28, 2017 1:27 PM
Comments
Comment #416778

We’ll have an electronic wall that will be much more efficient. Satellite and drone surveillance. Roving cameras and animals. Sufficient manpower to turn illegals around instead of taking them into custody. Massive penalties for hiring illegals. Data chips in documents. Cutting off of federal funds for programs that support illegals. It’s a wall that will be built with much more than bricks and mortar.

It will be a mighty wall.

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 28, 2017 6:00 PM
Comment #416779

whooo hooooo !!

Posted by: Roy Ellis at May 28, 2017 6:08 PM
Comment #416787

Today’s Washington Post features a power rebuttal to Trump’s characterization of his administration’s leaks. Here’s an excerpt:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2017/05/29/the-fake-news-comes-from-within-the-white-house/?utm_term=.64b13ef0b6bf
To believe Donald Trump, you must believe two largely contradictory things. You must believe that there are a slew of leakers in the executive branch who are providing damning details to the press illegally, and who must be rooted out and punished…You must also believe that the press makes up imaginary leakers simply to slowly and incrementally report false stories that are tangentially embarrassing to the president.


And while Trump administration officials often speak on the record to the media, they nearly as often speak only on background as so-called “senior administration officials,” faceless voices praising Trump without being able to be held accountable for what they said…. Here, for example, are a number of things that the White House has provided to the White House press corps using sources who refused to be named. (All quotes are from pool reports filed by members of the media.)
…[Over 10 such instances are cited]…
Again, these are the anonymous comments of senior officials reported by the press, precisely what happens in situations that lead to stories Trump doesn’t like. But since Trump doesn’t like those stories, those anonymous sources are decried as criminals or imaginary. The guys telling the press how well Trump’s trip went? They’re just regular old unnamed senior officials, and their word is unimpeachable.

Posted by: Warren Porter at May 29, 2017 10:06 AM
Comment #416789

What’s that have to do with the wall, Warren Porter?

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 29, 2017 12:31 PM
Comment #416790

There will be no wall, no more than there was all along. Trump lied about that. Not only was no money appropriated for it in the latest spending bill, the bill specifically forbid funding it.

And no, Mexico will not pay for it. That was a lie too.

A wall is a physical and metaphorical symbol of divisiveness.

Of course, that is how Trump got his start in politics, claiming Obama’s birth certificate was fake. It was a fundamentally racist accusation, another example of divisiveness.

“He doesn’t have a birth certificate, or if he does, there’s something on that certificate that is very bad for him. Now, somebody told me — and I have no idea if this is bad for him or not, but perhaps it would be — that where it says ‘religion,’ it might have ‘Muslim.’ And if you’re a Muslim, you don’t change your religion, by the way.”
Donald Trump, March 30, 2011

Trump said he would send investigators to Hawaii, and ‘you won’t believe what they’re finding.’ That was a lie too.

Why on earth would you believe a wall is going to be built? You just got burned on a hateful conspiracy theory about Seth Rich and Wikileaks. FOX retracted the story and scrubbed it from the web site. Hannity is going on an ‘unscheduled’ vacation. Having just made into absolute fools, now you start talking about a wall again?

Posted by: phx8 at May 29, 2017 4:23 PM
Comment #416791

Nothing. There’s nothing to talk about. The Vatican has a wall, so what? Their military is mostly armed with pikes and halberds, but that doesn’t mean the US should eagerly abandon their current firearms in exchange for polearm weapons.

Posted by: Warren Porter at May 29, 2017 4:54 PM
Comment #416792

Wrong j2. There will be a wall. Trump’s base will see to that. He wouldn’t go anywhere in 2020 if there is no wall.

Posted by: Roy Ellis at May 29, 2017 8:37 PM
Comment #416793

Trump will not be running in 2020. Never mind politics- his health will not allow it. On the recent trip he had to skip a scheduled event in Saudi due to exhaustion, and at the G7, six leaders walked ahead while he took a golf cart. Trump is overweight (the third heaviest in US history after Taft and Cleveland), has a florid complexion suggesting high blood pressure, does not exercise, and eats fast food. Someone analyzed his speech patterns from the 80’s and 90’s and compared it to today. His vocabulary has noticeably diminished and his sentence structure has become simpler. This may be normal and age appropriate. It may also be a sign of dementia or Alzheimer’s. In any case, he is already 70, and not a healthy 70 either. Another term is not in the cards.

Posted by: phx8 at May 29, 2017 10:21 PM
Comment #416794

ph, I don’t know how to spell seyance but you’ve got it bad ….

Posted by: Roy Ellis at May 29, 2017 10:35 PM
Comment #416795

ph, I don’t know how to spell seyance but, you’ve got it bad.

Posted by: Roy Ellis at May 29, 2017 10:38 PM
Comment #416814

“A wall is a physical and metaphorical symbol of divisiveness.”

The only thing causing disagreement or hostility between people has been the lefts words and actions over the past decade.

It has always been known that the left puts their agenda before the country, but now that their pure hatred for all who disagree has gone mainstream, things are going to continue to get uglier and uglier.

Roy, in today’s climate of left-wing extremism being mainstream, it’s not about comparing one wall with another wall, it’a ALL about determining support by comparing what one believes, to what another believes.

Posted by: kctim at May 30, 2017 8:45 AM
Comment #416815

kctim,
“The only thing causing disagreement or hostility between people has been the lefts words and actions over the past decade.”

That is a silly thing to say. You know perfectly well that is not true.

“It has always been known that the left puts their agenda before the country…”

Uh huh. Cite an example. Everything sure gets loosey goosey when you throw around these vague accusations.

“… their pure hatred for all who disagree has gone mainstream…”

Is this one of those ‘they won’t tolerate our intolerance’ things? Another ‘why won’t they just let us hate!’ complaints?

If something is ‘mainstream’ it is by definition not ‘extremist.’ The agenda of the left- and mainstream America- has changed very little over the decades. The Democratic party is one of inclusion. It is a diverse coalition of races, religions, and genders. It seeks to defend and expand constitutional rights.

The agenda of the extremist right has changed so much, conservatism has become virtually unrecognizable. The GOP and Trump followers call for walls. They want to exclude Mexicans, Muslims, and others from entering the country. For example, in a 10-3 decision, the latest immigration EO was shot down by the 4th Circuit. The chief judge wrote that the EO “drips with religious intolerance, animus, and discrimination.” They denounce decency and basic civility as political correctness. They regularly attack the MSM media, that is, the free press, as “the enemy of the American people.” They ignore the findings of the intelligence community about Russian involvement in the 2016 election and accept, even defend, almost any lie Trump tells, no matter how ludicrous, whether it is something as petty as crowd size at the inauguration, or an outright fabrication about how 3 to 5 million “illegal” votes cost him the popular vote, or how Obama wiretapped Trump Tower, or… well… recounting Trump’s lies could go on all day.

Conservatism has become an anti-science movement. It is not just the denial of Global Warming. The denial extends to almost any field you care to name. One Executive Order ignored scientific findings about the dangers of an herbicide, and approved Dow Chemical’s product for use in fields. (Dow is a BIG money contributor). 15 farm workers near Bakersfield promptly got sick from exposure.

I can cite specific examples all day and back up my assertions with links from non-partisan sources.


Posted by: phx8 at May 30, 2017 12:08 PM
Comment #416818

“A wall is a physical and metaphorical symbol of divisiveness.”

Obviously phx8 has never visited the Vatican, Hadrian’s Wall or the Great Wall in China. Incidentally, many would be surprised at the arms at the ready inside the Vatican walls. The Swiss Guards and pikes are merely tradition.

“The chief judge wrote that the EO “drips with religious intolerance, animus, and discrimination.”

Just imagine a Federal Judge who is supposed to be ruling on Constitutionality instead decides the Constitution doesn’t matter, it is the judge’s perceptions of the nation’s chief executive and commander-in-chief that counts.

It is truly sad that the Left has even perverted some of the judges within our judicial system. A Lefty above managed to exceed previous hypocrisy by writing that Democrats protect the Constitution.

“It is not just the denial of Global Warming.”

Obviously phx8 didn’t get the memo. Global Warming has been discarded as the Globe isn’t warming. The correct term Pal is now “Climate Change”. That one should stick as nearly every person agrees that climate does change; as it has done often in the past.

Posted by: Royal Flush at May 30, 2017 3:03 PM
Comment #416824

Global Warming refers to worldwide warming temperatures due to increases in greenhouse gases in the atmosphere.

Climate Change is a broader term. It can refer to long-term changes in climate. It can include changes in wind, rain, season length, weather patterns, ice and snow coverage, as well as the frequency of natural disasters like drought or hurricanes.

It would be more accurate to say Anthropogenic Global Warming since humanity is the cause of the rise in greenhouse gases. It would also be more accurate to say Anthropogenic Climate Change. However, the terms are cumbersome. A lot of people go glassy eyed at the mere mention of science.

Interestingly, Global Warming can actually result in a mini ice age for the eastern US and Europe; in other words, an unexpected version of Climate Change. A rapid melting of the Greenland ice cap would reduce the salinity of the thermohaline Atlantic current. Reducing salinity changes water density, so the current would cease circulating, and the warm water brought up from the tropics would no longer warm Western Europe…

Posted by: phx8 at May 30, 2017 3:40 PM
Comment #416828

Freud said sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, and by the same token, sometimes a wall is just a wall. However, a wall can also be a powerful symbol of separation and divisiveness, both physical and metaphorical. One of the best known recent examples is “The Wall” by Pink Floyd. Roger Waters is responsible for much of its thematic content, with bricks in the wall including authoritarianism, skinhead bigotry, and more. Right now, Waters is touring the US. The tour opened in Kansas City. For the song “Pigs,” a giant pig with Trump’s face flies over the audience.

There is the potential for a lot of trouble in Portland, OR. Recently there was a horrific murder. A man screamed racist epithets at two young women, one wearing a hijab, demanding they get off the train and ‘get out of my country.’ Three good Samaritans intervened. Two were killed with a knife and one other wounded.

Over the next two weekends there are two ‘Trump Free Speech’ rallies being held by white supremacists. Neo-Nazis often attend. The one on June 10th targets sharia law. The killer attended these rallies, although Patriot Prayer disavow any connection with him.

A lot of people are frantically searching for a way to stop these rallies, including the Mayor of Portland. The problem is obvious. These people have the right to free speech and assembly, and the ACLU will defend their right. However, if these protests take place, a lot of people will object, and some of them, such as the antifascista, will object violently.

Posted by: phx8 at May 30, 2017 6:16 PM
Comment #416829

I imagine that many of my Pals on the Left will love the “Pig” tour. Shame on them.

The Left is becoming more violent and anti-social, and their words more hateful and racist. Who can be surprised when this behavior results in serious injury and death? The college campus is no longer about learning, it has become a foul stinking place for social unrest and social injustice fanned into flames by the ignorant and led by the elite.

phx8 and others will of course deny any part in this violence and point the finger at middle class working white folks. We can be certain than none of them own a mirror or live in a glass house.

Posted by: Royal Flush at May 30, 2017 6:50 PM
Comment #416830

It appears that no one is monitoring WB functionality and as a result it’s not working well. But then, does anyone care?

Posted by: Royal Flush at May 30, 2017 7:02 PM
Comment #416831
The Left is becoming more violent and anti-social, and their words more hateful and racist.

It is the far left that is becoming more willing to stand up to the far rights attacks on them Royal. It is sad you turn a blind eye for years to the violence of the far right but then when the far right no longer gets a free ride, as we have seen in Berkeley and now Portland, you get all emotional and falsely claim it is racism by the far left.


Who can be surprised when this behavior results in serious injury and death?

Yeah, who can be surprised since we have the extremism of the far right as an example.

The college campus is no longer about learning, it has become a foul stinking place for social unrest and social injustice fanned into flames by the ignorant and led by the elite.


I guess I do agree with you that since the fascist and racist far right has tried to take their violence and hatred to the college campus or “fanned into flames by the ignorant” as you say, some places has become fouler than it was. But you seem to blame the college not the far right Royal!
Speaking of “led by the elite” this all started with the election of Trump! But to say he is leading it is a bit to much he just turns a blind eye to the actions of Trump voters as well Royal.

But I do have to say that unrest at Berkeley after the fascist celebration of the Trump electoral college victory is hardly reason to blame, as you seem to do, all colleges. So emotional, so PC, so blown out of proportion when the shoe is on the other foot.

Posted by: j2t2 at May 30, 2017 8:48 PM
Comment #416844

Umm… The Vatican walls, to the extent they exist, were built in medieval times, and reflect a day and age where they had military value. They were not built by some rabble-rousing politician looking to build a completely ineffective barrier to illegal immigration.

One reason I try to step beyond the political propaganda of my party is simple: party rhetoric is often about conformity, and it often asks us to infect ourselves with whatever stupidity our leaders might see fit to inflict on us. If you want to reduce how much BS you’re saddled with having to defend, you might take a more skeptical eye to arguments from your own side.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at May 31, 2017 2:24 PM
Comment #416845

Ummm…Stephen; it was phx8 who wrote:

““A wall is a physical and metaphorical symbol of divisiveness.”

Posted by: Royal Flush at May 31, 2017 2:45 PM
Comment #416847
The Left is becoming more violent and anti-social

Yet, it’s the conservatives who seem to be the ones doing the stabbing. Both in Portland, Oregon and in College Park, Maryland, we’ve seen yet another chapter in the rash of racism that has plagued society once the norms of courtesy and political correctness were heaved aside.

Posted by: Warren Porter at May 31, 2017 9:30 PM
Comment #416862

Phx8

Sorry I didn’t get back earlier than this, but I didn’t show any updates until now.

The lefts words over the past decade declared that all who disagreed with leftist policy were uncaring racist sexist brainwashed bigots, especially on matters President Obama directly addressed.
The lefts actions over the past decade resulted in businesses and individuals being targeted, threatened and attacked. In public and private property being destroyed.
That’s not silly, that’s reality.

You guys just ran and supported a candidate who was shown to have lied to the American people, and proven to have mishandled classified information, all because she was a woman that now claims to support leftist policy, and you need an example of putting agenda before country? Seriously?

“Is this one of those ‘they won’t tolerate our intolerance’ things? Another ‘why won’t they just let us hate!’ complaints?”

Actually, no it’s not, so there is no need to try and hide the hypocrisy behind such weak sauce as that nonsense.

What I am referring to is the inexplicable disdain and contempt you hold for your President and all who voted for him, simply because of their supposed non-leftist politics. To the violence and destruction that the leftists are guilty of, simply because they are afraid of losing some of the nonsense their leftist minds think as progress.

“If something is ‘mainstream’ it is by definition not ‘extremist.’”

Just because the hate for all who disagree has been pushed into the mainstream by the left, doesn’t mean there is support for it to be mainstream.
You guys have taken the left-wing version of InfoWars and are printing and broadcasting it on a national level.

“The agenda of the left- and mainstream America- has changed very little over the decades.”

Is that why it is so easy to find where what Hillary supposedly supports now, isn’t what she supported before? Is that why liberals are trying to destroy President Trump at all costs, even though actual Democrats once said a lot of what he says now? Is that why your constant attacks on religion and the 2nd Amendment have cost you guys more elections than you are willing to admit?

“The agenda of the extremist right has changed so much, conservatism has become virtually unrecognizable.”

BS. The extremist right holds the same views they have always held. Your problem is that you are trying to associate Republicans and Conservatives with those views in order to garner support for leftist policy.

“The GOP and Trump followers call for walls.”

Border security is an issue actual Democrats once supported, but it’s actually an extremist right position?

“They want to exclude Mexicans, Muslims, and others from entering the country.”

Sigh, no. What they want is to stop, or at least slow down, ILLEGAL entry into their country.

“The chief judge wrote that the EO “drips with religious intolerance, animus, and discrimination.”

No, he is mind reading and basing his activist stance on what was said in the past, not on what the EO actually states.

“They denounce decency and basic civility as political correctness.”

Because they are subjective and emotionally driven. Things government has no business dictating onto individuals.

“They regularly attack the MSM media, that is, the free press, as “the enemy of the American people.”

Of course they do. That MSM actively works for left-wing policies and for getting leftists elected to push them.

“They ignore the findings of the intelligence community about Russian involvement”

Absolute proof would be helpful in changing their minds. Then again, it didn’t change any minds about Hillary, so maybe not.

“whether it is something as petty as crowd size at the inauguration, or an outright fabrication about how 3 to 5 million “illegal” votes cost him the popular vote, or how Obama wiretapped Trump Tower, or… well… recounting Trump’s lies could go on all day.”

IF Trump supports tax cuts, why should I care how many he says were at his inauguration? Why should I care if he thinks he received more legitimate votes than Hillary? Why should I care if he used an old out dated word like wiretapped, instead of using surveillance? Why should I care what cveftet or whatever means?

“Conservatism has become an anti-science movement.”

Sigh, no. Some of them disagree with the lefts position on so-called wedge issues, so you guys claim they are “anti-science” in hopes of scaring up some support.
That’s not anti-science, that’s disagreement.

“I can cite specific examples all day and back up my assertions with links from non-partisan sources.”

And if you are talking about GMOs, Monsanto and stuff like that, I can probably find the same ones on right wing sites.
The lefts hatred of those who don’t hold an alarmist belief about global warming just prevents them from seeing where the two sides agree.

Posted by: kctim at June 1, 2017 2:16 PM
Comment #416868

Thank you Mr. President for pulling the United States out of the Paris Climate Accords. Your stated reasons are clear and every American should thank you for not bowing to pressure from our Left in this country and all those around the world who were hoping to have American taxpayers line their pockets with our dollars.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 1, 2017 4:11 PM
Comment #416871

America is no longer a world leader.

First came the disastrous NATO and G7 meetings. By the time it was over, Trump failed to endorse article 5, publicly berated allies to create an aura of disunity, and behind closed doors, called Germany “bad” (or “evil” depending on the translator) and threatened to stop German car imports to the US. Merkel responded by saying the US could no longer be counted upon as an ally.

That is pretty incredible all by itself.

Trump failed to denounce Russian meddling in western elections, yet another failure in leadership. Soon afterward, the French leader publicly berated Putin onstage as the Russian stood right next to him. That is what real leadership looks like. Trump? Not so much.

Now Putin is saying the hackers were not state actors, but just some “patriotic” Russians. Anyone buying that? Anyone?

Today Trump further diminished the US by withdrawing from the Paris Climate Accord. Everyone in his cabinet except Bannon and Pruitt opposed withdrawal. Over 1100 corporations, including Exxon and other Big Oil companies, opposed withdrawal. Over 190 countries opposed withdrawal.

This has been a horrendous failure in leadership. What. An. Embarrassment. Withdrawal sacrifices opportunities for industry in renewable energies. The idea seems to be that the US will go back to coal, which is NOT going to happen, simply because coal cannot compete with the low cost of natural gas.

Posted by: phx8 at June 1, 2017 7:08 PM
Comment #416872

Not being a world leader, if that is true, may have advantages. I am willing to allow the EU to take over the obligations, both financial and military, of “world leader”.

The president managed to persuade our NATO partners to honor their commitments. None of the three previous presidents could manage that.

The president got promises from our EU trading partners to redo their trade deals with the US to make them fair and equitable. Good deal.

Merkel was wire-tapped by the previous administration, not by Trump. Her country is drowning in immigrants, some of whom will perhaps attempt terrorist acts. Her country will suffer under the rules of the Paris climate accord.

The Left is now praising the corporations that just yesterday were villains, thieves and robber barons. Why is that?

Coal is necessary at this time to generate electric power. Coal is a valuable export.

President Trump is for America First, and always. I applaud him and hope he continues to deconstruct all the barriers erected by the Left that harm working Americans in the work place, and in their individual liberty and freedom.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 1, 2017 7:36 PM
Comment #416874
Not being a world leader, if that is true, may have advantages. I am willing to allow the EU to take over the obligations, both financial and military, of “world leader”.

Why on earth would you believe it will be the EU that steps up to the “world leader” position? Are you willing to allow China and Russia to take over the “world leader” position?


The president managed to persuade our NATO partners to honor their commitments. None of the three previous presidents could manage that.

Really Royal? Which countries have upped a penny, they haven’t already planned on, based on the Trump visit and/or rhetoric?


The president got promises from our EU trading partners to redo their trade deals with the US to make them fair and equitable. Good deal.

Specifically Royal what promises did he “get” that involves redoing trade deals? I ask because he didn’t understand for so long that it is the EU not individual countries that negotiate trade deals.

Posted by: j2t2 at June 1, 2017 11:13 PM
Comment #416875

kctim,

You live in a delusional world, that’s all I can say. For the past decade, the Left has tried its best to make this country a better place for all to live after the tumult of the previous conservative administration. This means protecting the individual rights of people who aren’t heterosexual Christian white males and doing what we can to erode the privileges some people possess by nature of their birth. I’m sorry you are offended by the prospect of actually implementing the ideals expressed in our foundational documents, but it is what it is.

At this point, the Republican party seems to be interested in aggrievement and victimhood rather than actually bettering anyone. Vengeful thinking predominates. You can’t go three comments without a boilerplate repetition of the lie that people were called bigots for merely dissenting with the Left. Now, you take glee at the current administration as it tramples upon individual rights and liberties. Abandoning the Constitution makes sense if it puts tears in the eyes of a few liberals, right?

All I can say is that the American spirit is stronger than you and your ilk. Reckoning will come sooner or later and the diverse America imagined by the Left will ultimately triumph.

Posted by: Warren Porter at June 1, 2017 11:34 PM
Comment #416876

Good way of telling, good post to take facts regarding my presentation subject matter, which i am going to deliver in my college
Managerial Accounting Homework Help

Posted by: Managerial Accounting Homework Help at June 2, 2017 12:26 AM
Comment #416878

Please ignore the bolding, that was my mistake.

Posted by: Warren Porter at June 2, 2017 12:36 AM
Comment #416902

Well, another full blown, self-inflicted disaster for Trump. Despite the advice of the Department of Defense, the National Security Advisor, his economic team, Rick Perry in the Department of Energy, over 1100 major corporations, the Secretary of State and former CEO of Exxon, Rex Tillerson, and more, Trump withdrew from Paris. He did it based on the advice of his political advisor, Steve Bannon. This is as bad as the Immigration executive order, maybe worse.

Trump gave a speech that will keep fact checkers busy. It was full of falsehoods. He refused to even say the words ‘Global Warming’ or ‘Climate Change.’ If he understood the Paris agreement at all, it is not apparent from the boondoggle of a speech. Trump is refusing to say if he accepts the science behind AGW. He will not say. No one in his administration will say either.

The negative headlines generated are overwhelming. The ill will generated in the international community is nearly unanimous. The move is so bad, people are wondering if Trump is intentionally trying to harm the country. I mean, it is that bad.

Posted by: phx8 at June 2, 2017 4:30 PM
Comment #416904

Unlike my Pals on the Left, I do not want my president alone to make agreements on behalf of the United States. Any climate agreement should be considered a treaty and require following the constitution.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 2, 2017 5:10 PM
Comment #416905

I have good news and bad news about the withdrawal from the Paris accord. The good news is the story is getting swamped in the headlines. The bad news is that it is getting swamped by bad news about Trump and Russia.

There is so much bad news for Trump it is hard to pick one story, but the worst one came from the two former high ranking state department members who offered interviews about what happened shortly after Trump took office. His administration was in a rush to repeal sanctions against Russia and reinstate their spy nests that Obama closed. In return, we were going to receive… nothing. We would do it just to “lower tensions.” These two men called attention to the effort and stopped it.

http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/336032-trump-officials-pressed-state-dept-staffers-for-plans-to-lift-russia

It doesn’t take a Sherlock Holmes to figure out what happened. That was Trump’s pay-off to the Russians for helping him get elected.

Posted by: phx8 at June 2, 2017 5:21 PM
Comment #416906

phx8, As far as the Paris agreement, Trump had 2 choices 1, Do nothing, or 2, withdraw, he chose 2. As far as Russia goes, you know the saying keep your friends close and your enemies closer. And where is your proof Sherlock that the Russians helped him? Did they brainwash anyone into voting for Trump, did they hack voting machines and change the vote, or did they hold the electoral college at gun point and make them vote for Trump? Or are you like Hillary and can’t seem to grasp that you lost and you have to blame everyone for the loss?

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at June 2, 2017 5:50 PM
Comment #416907

“His administration was in a rush to repeal sanctions against Russia and reinstate their spy nests that Obama closed. In return, we were going to receive… nothing.”

Had phx8 not rushed to judgement, and instead followed the story to its origin (Yahoo) he would have read what Trump was demanding in return for sanctions relief.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 2, 2017 6:00 PM
Comment #416908

“His administration was in a rush to repeal sanctions against Russia and reinstate their spy nests that Obama closed. In return, we were going to receive… nothing.”

Had phx8 not rushed to judgement, and instead followed the story to its origin (Yahoo) he would have read what Trump was demanding in return for sanctions relief.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 2, 2017 6:01 PM
Comment #416909

RF,
From the Yahoo article: “There was serious consideration by the White House to unilaterally rescind the sanctions,” said Dan Fried, a veteran State Department official who served as chief U.S. coordinator for sanctions policy…”

‘Unilateral’ means nothing was asked for in return. By the way, Fried gave live interviews on this topic.

“… Top Trump administration officials, almost as soon as they took office, tasked State Department staffers with developing proposals for the lifting of economic sanctions, the return of diplomatic compounds and other steps to relieve tensions with Moscow.”

“Relieve tensions” is not a viable reason for lifting sanctions and otherwise rewarding the Russians shortly after they interfered with our election.

“… The administration was developing a plan to lift sanctions — and possibly arrange a summit between Trump and Russian president Vladimir Putin — as part of an effort to achieve a “grand bargain” with Moscow. “It would have been a win-win for Moscow,” said Malinowski…”

And no, giving the Russians everything they wanted and THEN negotiating with them over… something, who knows… That is not an acceptable way to deal with a country that just attacked us using cyber warfare.

Face it. There is a whiff of treason about this White House.

Posted by: phx8 at June 2, 2017 6:33 PM
Comment #416911

phx8 will get a one-time hand-up from me since he can’t read comprehensively.

“Just days after President Trump took office, officials who had moved into the secretary of state’s seventh-floor office sent a “tasking” order to the Bureau of European and Eurasian Affairs to develop a menu of options to improve relations with Russia as part of a deal in exchange for Russian cooperation in the war against the Islamic State in Syria, according to two former officials.”

Many of us believe the deal secretly made with Iran by Obama and Kerry is treasonous. It involved air lifting billions of dollars in cash to give this terrorist regime the ransom they demanded despite their open call for the obliteration of Israel and the US.

If Obama can make a deal, all by himself, with these murderers, certainly President Trump can explore mutually beneficial exchanges with Russia.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 2, 2017 6:47 PM
Comment #416912

Were the sanctions ever lifted, phx8???????

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at June 2, 2017 6:49 PM
Comment #416913

Does anyone ever wonder why these facts are never presented to the American public by our popular Leftist media?

U.S. Outshines Other Countries in CO2 Emissions Reductions

According to the Energy Information Administration (EIA), U.S. carbon dioxide emissions were 2.5 percent less in 2015 than in 2014. In fact, since 2007, when they peaked, carbon dioxide emissions in the United States have been reduced by 12.2 percent. According to the Washington Times, the United States has reduced its carbon dioxide emissions more than virtually any other nation in the world. For comparison, the European Union, which has spent $1.2 trillion on support for wind, solar and bio-energy, increased its carbon dioxide emissions by 0.7 percent in 2015 over 2014 levels. The biggest increase was in Belgium, where carbon dioxide emissions increased by 4.7 percent.

The average European pays 26.9 cents per kilowatt-hour for electricity—more than 2.5 times the average cost to a U.S. consumer. Denmark, which generates almost 40 percent of its generation from wind, and Germany, which generates almost 33 percent from renewable energy, have the highest electricity bills in Europe, paying about 39 cents per kilowatt-hour because of their support for “green energy.” These policies have not provided them with the environmental benefits they expected. As a result, these countries are now backing away from green energy. Denmark, for example, is reducing its spending on research for “green energy” by 67 percent.”

http://instituteforenergyresearch.org/analysis/u-s-outshines-countries-carbon-dioxide-emissions-reductions/

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 2, 2017 7:50 PM
Comment #416914

“Why on earth would you [Royal] believe it will be the EU that steps up to the “world leader” position? Are you willing to allow China and Russia to take over the “world leader” position?

Excellent point, j2t2. But, it won’t be Russia, though, it will be China. Why Trump would cede leadership on such an important environmental and economic issue is a mystery to me.

Posted by: Rich at June 2, 2017 8:02 PM
Comment #416915
‘Unilateral’ means nothing was asked for in return.

No, it doesn’t.


Posted by: Weary Willie at June 2, 2017 9:30 PM
Comment #416916

Maybe it does. My name’s not Webster.

All of these energy sources will be obsolete when we figure out how to use the earth’s magnetic characteristics to generate electricity.

It’s a simple process. Building a circuit to move electrons from one point to another. No one says it has to be generated on earth’s surface. Solar power in space would be completely reliable.

Why don’t we talk about these types of possibilities, instead of calling each other names?

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 2, 2017 9:46 PM
Comment #416917
Unlike my Pals on the Left, I do not want my president alone to make agreements on behalf of the United States. Any climate agreement should be considered a treaty and require following the constitution.

But you find it ok that your president pulls us out of a climate agreement without the consent of Congress? BTW aren’t treaties binding? Which is unlike the climate agreement…right?

Posted by: j2t2 at June 2, 2017 9:51 PM
Comment #416918

I don’t think that was a treaty, was it? Wasn’t it one of Obama’s agreements? A “unilateral” decision made by Obama himself, which left the congress out of it, right?

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/448156/paris-agreement-treaty-requiring-two-thirds-senate-vote

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 2, 2017 9:58 PM
Comment #416920

Weary it is, I believe, a non-binding agreement not a treaty. A treaty would need the approval of Congress, which is what Royal, in his hypocritical way, is referring to. He tells us it is alright for Trump to make a unilateral decision to pull us out of it but it was wrong of Obama to make a unilateral decision to put us into it.


Posted by: j2t2 at June 3, 2017 12:17 AM
Comment #416921

KAP,
The sanctions were not lifted because the State Department people let the Senate know what the Trump administration was trying to do. Graham (R) and Cardin (D) put together legislation to codify the sanctions and prevent them from being lifted. Six days after the State Department’s warning, Flynn was fired, and effort to give the Russians everything they wanted dissipated in the glare of publicity.

Meanwhile, Mueller ordered the NSA to do a deep dive unlike anything we have ever seen. The Directory of Operations is prioritizing an investigation of all connections & communications between the Trump campaign and the Russians, using every department within the DO. All resources are being put into this. It is literally the biggest search in history.

Posted by: phx8 at June 3, 2017 12:49 AM
Comment #416929

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7W33HRc1A6c

Posted by: dbs at June 3, 2017 8:19 AM
Comment #416930

“But you find it ok that your president pulls us out of a climate agreement without the consent of Congress?”

Wasn’t ratified by congress, doesn’t need their approval.

Posted by: dbs at June 3, 2017 8:21 AM
Comment #416931

Phx8, you keep talking about the Russians but offer nothing but your opinion. Everything you have said on this blog I can never find in the MSM. Why is that? I can only believe you get your info from the grocery store tabloids or you are just making stuff up.

Posted by: Richard Kapitan at June 3, 2017 9:35 AM
Comment #416933

KAP,
See the link to The Hill earlier in this thread. The Hill is considered a centrist online publication. In addition, the State Department employees went onto MSNBC and gave a live interview. The same story was also reported in Politico.

Here is the Daily Caller (a conservative site) take on the story:

“Former Obama administration officials waged a secret campaign against President Donald Trump’s efforts to normalize relations with Russia in the early weeks of his presidency, blocking White House attempts to unilaterally lift sanctions and other measures designed to relieve tensions with Moscow.”

The key word is ‘unilaterally.’ The Daily Caller goes on to suggest this was just the opening gambit in a “grand bargain” that would involve… Syria… or something… Although “unilaterally” giving up sanctions over the invasions of Crimea & Ukraine, and reinstating the spy houses that were closed by Obama would have already given everything important the Russians could have asked for, for the laughable goal of “relieving tensions.” That is NOT how a negotiation is conducted- giving an adversary everything they want and removing consequences for bad behavior, in the hope they will cease bad behavior and be more friendly in the future.

KAP, if you do not see these stories, either you are not watching or looking at the MSM, or you believe the MSM consists of sources which are not part of it. If you are watching FOX that would explain a lot. They are trying very hard to ignore all the bad news about Trump.

Posted by: phx8 at June 3, 2017 10:28 AM
Comment #416934

Can never find them on CNN or MSNBC or ABC , CBS or any other of the MSM phx8, Why is that?

Posted by: Richard Kapitan at June 3, 2017 10:39 AM
Comment #416935

Obama unilaterally put the sanctions in place with executive orders. Why wouldn’t Trump be able to rescind them the same way?

And diplomats define foreign policy now, phx8? Diplomats can override the president? I didn’t know that. I would have thought doing something like that would be gross insubordination.

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 3, 2017 11:02 AM
Comment #416936

I find stories about the house and senate proposing bills to “codify”, but I don’t see any stories saying either bill passed and was sent to the President, let alone either of those bills being vetoed and overridden by Congress.

That’s how it’s supposed to work, right phx8? Where are those news stories?

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 3, 2017 11:11 AM
Comment #416937

“The Daily Caller goes on to suggest this was just the opening gambit in a “grand bargain” that would involve… Syria… or something…”

With enough prodding and poking I finally got phx8 to read the entire article to which he, himself, linked.

He makes light of a “grand bargain” with Russia. OK. I don’t.

Could phx8, Warren, or j2t2 give us their opinion about paying over 39 cents per KW/hr for electricity as Germany does. We too can have high energy costs. All we need to do is sign on to the climate agreement and follow their lead.

I pay a fixed 10 cents per KW/hr on weekdays and nothing on weekends. I also get a $300 kickback over three years.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 3, 2017 2:36 PM
Comment #416938

“The Daily Caller goes on to suggest this was just the opening gambit in a “grand bargain” that would involve… Syria… or something…”

With enough prodding and poking I finally got phx8 to read the entire article to which he, himself, linked.

He makes light of a “grand bargain” with Russia. I don’t.

Could phx8, Warren, or j2t2 give us their opinion about paying over 39 cents per KW/hr for electricity as Germany does. We too can have high energy costs. All we need to do is sign on to the climate agreement and follow their lead.

I pay a fixed 10 cents per KW/hr on weekdays and nothing on weekends. I also get a $300 kickback over three years.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 3, 2017 2:39 PM
Comment #416940

Connecticut’s Tax Comeuppance

With the rich tapped out, the state may resort to Puerto Rico bonds.

“Gov. Malloy has spent two terms treating business as a bottomless well of cash to redistribute to public unions. Now that his state is losing millionaires and businesses, he has seen the light. But the price of his dereliction will be steep.”

https://www.wsj.com/articles/connecticuts-tax-comeuppance-1496443958

The Democrats claim that punishing the wealthy and big business through high taxes is good for America. Really?

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 3, 2017 3:18 PM
Comment #416941
39 cents per KW/hr for electricity as Germany does

German electricity costs are more of a reflection of the demise of German nuclear power than anything having to do with the Paris Agreement.

Posted by: Warren Porter at June 3, 2017 3:53 PM
Comment #416942


Could phx8, Warren, or j2t2 give us their opinion about paying over 39 cents per KW/hr for electricity as Germany does. We too can have high energy costs. All we need to do is sign on to the climate agreement and follow their lead.

Royal you frame the issue as if the KW/hr cost is the only cost for energy. You seem to forget the damage the world is experiencing due to the use of carbon based energy. I know you believe climate change to be anything but what it is. However most of the rest of the world realizes we are peeing in our own pool. If we were to include the total cost of continued damage I wonder what the average KW/hr would be in this country. I also wonder if the reason Texas has such low KW/hr prices is due to its abundance of solar and wind generators.

Here is an interesting article on the problems Germany faces with the renewable energies they use. Interestingly it seems the problem is due to the low cost of renewable energy making the older sources not cost effective when the solar power isn’t producing.

The grid they currently have not being able to support the storage of electricity needs to be upgraded.

https://global.handelsblatt.com/companies-markets/electricity-prices-in-a-free-fall-478046

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaellynch/2016/02/19/negative-electricity-prices-are-not-a-sign-of-renewable-success/#1192eedc3806

Posted by: j2t2 at June 3, 2017 3:58 PM
Comment #416943

WW,
You write: “And diplomats define foreign policy now, phx8? Diplomats can override the president? I didn’t know that. I would have thought doing something like that would be gross insubordination.”

No one overrode the president. The diplomats made Senators aware of what was going on. There was never any bill or anything else passed to prevent it because Flynn was fired.

Treason was prevented.

RF,
As for that “grand bargain”-

If North Korea invaded South Korea, would it make sense to let the invasion stand, and then respond by lifting sanctions, and allowing the North Koreans to open two diplomatic facilities in the US? If North Korea influenced the outcome of our election by successfully seeing a North Korean sympathizer elected, would that be acceptable? Would it be a good idea to give them everything they want in order to “relieve tensions”? Because THEN we could negotiate?

Russia invaded Crimea and Eastern Ukraine. Why would we let that invasion stand? Why would we lift punitive sanctions and let Russia re-open two diplomatic facilities? They influenced our election and put a Russian sympathizer in office. So no, we should not give them everything they want in order to “relieve tensions.”

Face it. We are dealing with a nest of crooks and traitors.

Posted by: phx8 at June 3, 2017 4:26 PM
Comment #416944

Thanks for the links j2t2. I found this quote in the “handelsblatt” article very interesting.

“The electricity market is the collateral damage of the ecological boom. A megawatt-hour of electricity from a new wind farm on land is currently remunerated (paid) with €85 – that’s a good four times the market price. Solar energy producers receive €110 per megawatt-hour – a good five times. And offshore wind turbines are paid €150 the megawatt-hour – about seven times the price of electricity.

The taxpayers of Germany are paying four, five, and even seven times more than the actual cost of electricity. Wow…what a deal. Even a Liberal loves this kind of government intervention. Screw the workers and business that pay taxes.

From the Forbes link j2t2 provided we find this quote…

“This year (2013), German consumers will be forced to pay €20 billion ($26 billion) for electricity from solar, wind and biogas plants — electricity with a market price of just over €3 billion.”

Wow…that’s even worse than the ridiculed $100 toilet seat purchased by the US military some years ago. And the Left in American think Wall Street is bad. LOL

The article really did a good job of explaining German government policy with regard to electric power generation and how it is taking billions from the pockets of ordinary working class Germans.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 3, 2017 4:33 PM
Comment #416945

Poor phx8. He has no idea of what was being discussed between Trump and Putin. He just knows it must have been bad and treasonous.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 3, 2017 4:36 PM
Comment #416946
Graham (R) and Cardin (D) put together legislation to codify the sanctions and prevent them from being lifted.

That legislation went nowhere. It didn’t pass the senate. The house version didn’t go anywhere. Where do you get the idea they passed legislation? Or is this just another sly trick the media uses to get us to think it was a big deal?

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 3, 2017 5:25 PM
Comment #416947

I keep saying phx8 spends to much time in the grocery store tabloids.

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at June 3, 2017 5:28 PM
Comment #416948

We should start calling him Gruber, because he thinks we’re all stupid.

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 3, 2017 5:50 PM
Comment #416949

Royal you make it hard to have an intelligent discussion when you cherry pick. I guess having both sides of the discussion available is something you aren’t use to.

As an example comments like “Germany’s electricity market has become collateral damage in the country’s transition to renewable energy. Fast falling prices pose an existential threat for the operators of conventional plants like E.ON and RWE.”

OR-

“the average German wholesale price for June 2013—essentially the price such big industries pay—fell to a record low of 2.8 Euro cents or 3.7 U.S. cents per kWh, well below his 5-cent U.S. benchmark.””

Seem to have went right over your head. It is the conventional electrical producers that have the problem because the transition isn’t complete.

This inability causes one to think you are so partisan that the big picture is beyond your grasp. Tell you what instead of your silly nitpicking why not address your inane framing as I described in my previous comment?

Posted by: j2t2 at June 3, 2017 8:56 PM
Comment #416953

KAP & WW,
You’re defending crooks and traitors, and it will not be good for anyone.

Next week FBI Director Comey will publicly testify. If he says what is expected about his interactions with Trump, then Mueller will be in a position to call it Obstruction of Justice. I doubt it will take long. The only question is whether Sessions and Rosenstein will be dragged into it. Once Mueller makes his conclusion, it will be up to Republicans to decide what to do with Trump.

They may defend him, but that will only make matters worse, because the Special Counsel investigations into money laundering & Russian influence and cooperation are continuing. Flynn, Manafort, Kushner, Nigel Farage, and others are under scrutiny.

“If you triangulate Russia, WikiLeaks, Assange and Trump associates the person who comes up with the most hits is Nigel Farage. He’s right in the middle of these relationships. He turns up over and over again. There’s a lot of attention being paid to him.”
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jun/01/nigel-farage-is-person-of-interest-in-fbi-investigation-into-trump-and-russia

Farage was seen walking out of the Ecuadorian Embassy just two days after Wikileaks did the CIA leak. And just to be clear, Director Pompeo- a Republican partisan during his days in Congress- called it a “hostile intelligence service.” This was a guy who liked to site Wikileaks in his attacks on Hillary Clinton during the campaign. Now that he realizes they are enemies of America and work with the Russians, he sure changed his tune.

So how long are you two going to follow these crooks and traitors? It’s no good waiting for the final verdict and then saying ‘well, whaddya know,’ because these crooks and traitors will do a lot of damage in the meantime.

If you can’t bring yourself to create some distance, then you’d better brush up on the talking points for why you support Obstruction from the White House.

Posted by: phx8 at June 3, 2017 10:48 PM
Comment #416954

Not defending anyone phx8, what I am doing that you are not doing is waiting for the FACTS from someone who is reputable not some half backed story by some left wing conspiracy nut job reporter. Like I said many times, I NEVER find anything you write about on any of the MSM networks. IMO if what you say is true it would be all over the MSM, and all I see you do is write what you read from some left wing source that has about as much credibility as the grocery store tabloids.

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at June 3, 2017 11:00 PM
Comment #416956

Democratics are expecting Comey to say something that should have been said months ago if it is true at all. If Trump pressured Comey to back off an investigation then Comey had an obligation to bring it up when it happened, not months later when he needs sympathy. Comey is going to get up there and say he can’t discuss anything in that setting, then he’s going to go into the private meeting and say what? that he neglected to point out Trump’s pressuring him? Ha!

The only obstruction going on is Democratics trying to stop their world from ending.

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 4, 2017 11:22 AM
Comment #416959

Director Comey may have felt pressured by Trump’s effort to interfere, but Comey may have thought he could handle it, and continue the criminal investigation into the Trump campaign. Once Trump fired Comey for continuing the investigation, that settled it. Now it will be up to Mueller to recommend Obstruction charges.

Posted by: phx8 at June 4, 2017 2:08 PM
Comment #416960
something that should have been said months ago

Why do you say that? If obstruction of justice occurred, Comey was under no obligation to tell anyone about it. There is a law that mandates that people report certain felonies to law enforcement, but Comey IS law enforcement. That said, the news reports regarding his memos says that those memos were circulated among a small circle of people at the DOJ. It would be my guess that Rosenstein or Sessions might be one of those people.

Anyway, we’ll learn the truth on Thursday. Better buckle up, things are going to get quite bumpy for sycophants like you.

Posted by: Warren Porter at June 4, 2017 2:52 PM
Comment #416963

Be interesting to see if Trump distract attention away from Director Comey’s testimony. Maybe wait to see how bad it goes; if it is bad enough, start a war with North Korea.

He still has not replaced the Director of the FBI, but that will only slow the investigation so much.

He still has not appointed anyone to head NOAA or FEMA. We are already into hurricane season. What could possibly go wrong?

Posted by: phx8 at June 4, 2017 3:24 PM
Comment #416964

We are not surprised at the Left drooling over the testimony of Comey. They expect fireworks. My guess; a small sparkler or loud fart.

If President Trump wanted to, he could invoke executive privilege and prevent Comey from testifying.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 4, 2017 4:07 PM
Comment #416965

In your mind what could go wrong would probably be no hurricanes.

Trump has already saved millions of jobs!

The sea levels are still not rising!

The economy is the best economy we’ve had in eight years!

Comey opened up about why he sent his Oct. 28 letter about new evidence in the Clinton probe.

It came down to “speak” or “conceal,” Comey said. “Speak,” he reasoned, “would be really bad. There’s an election in 11 days. Lordy, that would be really bad. Concealing in my view would be catastrophic, not just to the FBI but well beyond. And, honestly, as between really bad and catastrophic, I said to my team: ‘We’ve got to walk into the world of really bad. I’ve got to tell Congress that we’re restarting this, not in some frivolous way — in a hugely significant way.”

Did I bust your eggshell, Warren Porter? What prompted the name calling this time, the truth?

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 4, 2017 4:24 PM
Comment #416966

RF,
Fireworks? No. Damning? Yes. It will be interesting to see if Sessions and Rosenstein get dragged in.

Trump can invoke executive privilege. It will only delay the testimony. Trump has already publicly discussed the conversations, so it is pretty hard to make a case for confidentiality at this juncture. Executive privilege is not a gag order, so a court would almost certainly overturn it. Still, it might be worth a try. Remember, virtually everything Trump has done up until now has been what a guilty person would do. When it comes to Russia, he never does what an innocent person would do. A guilty person would declare executive, knowing it will get shot down, but anything would be better than Comey testifying, so, Trump just might go there.

Posted by: phx8 at June 4, 2017 4:27 PM
Comment #416968

WW,
Not appointing a FEMA or NOAA head is sheer incompetence, plain and simple. Sometimes bad things happen. That is why it is a good idea to prepare. Which is what Trump is NOT doing.

The economic performance under Trump continues the same trends we have seen under Obama. The last jobs report was week, but for now, everything is drifting.

Say, you never answered a basic question: if the economic statistics under Obama were all fakes and frauds, why are the same numbers under Trump suddenly real?

Sea levels are rising:

https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/sea-level/

It is a statistic, a measurement. There is nothing mysterious about this.

Posted by: phx8 at June 4, 2017 4:34 PM
Comment #416969

phx8, it is becoming difficult to converse with you. Your extreme views, backed by nothing but hearsay, unnamed sources, and innuendo are tiresome.

President Trump will not (in my opinion) invoke executive privilege as he, and his lawyers already know what testimony Comey is likely to give from previous testimony under oath. Any deviation will open him to charges.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 4, 2017 4:44 PM
Comment #416974

I wish j2t2 had better reading comprehension skills. Again, from the link he posted we find…

“While consumers are being forced to pay rising prices for electricity because of constantly higher taxes, fees and levies, the quoted rates on the wholesale market for electricity from coal, gas and nuclear power plants have been heading in the other direction for years. In recent weeks, they reached a dramatic low point that no manager would have thought possible.

At times, the price of electricity broke below the €20 per megawatt-hour mark on the futures market. Five years ago, before Germany’s energy transition was stepped up, the price was sometimes over €60. Since then, the market has been flooded with expensive wind and solar electricity.”

j2t2 doesn’t understand the article, which I must admit, is rather confusing.

I will simply ask j2t2 if he is drooling at the mouth in anticipation of paying the German going rate of 39 cents per KW/hr for electrical power in his home.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 4, 2017 6:00 PM
Comment #416975

Every state has an emergency preparedness program. Why would the federal government need one, except for the District of Columbia. They won’t need a federal agency for D.C. now would they?

Of course, any radio or TV station can do what NOAH does. The military probably does the same thing also.

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 4, 2017 7:24 PM
Comment #416976

Now if we can just convince big disasters to limit themselves to one state, everything should be fine.

Trump approval rating down to 36%. When it drops into the 20’s the GOP will cut him loose.

Posted by: phx8 at June 4, 2017 7:58 PM
Comment #417003

Are you saying only one state has a disaster preparedness program?

Posted by: Weary Willie at June 5, 2017 9:43 AM
Comment #417005

http://www.npr.org/2017/06/03/531088285/trump-s-approval-rate-decline-is-nothing-compared-to-other-presidents

While his approval rating has fallen and the gap between approval and disapproval has widened considerably, it has not shifted in any extraordinary sense. This is, in part, because of how those charts are scaled, as well as the fact that they show the widening gap between approval and disapproval

BTW, that you think he’ll go to 20 is interesting. You don’t think that the standard 25% diehards for both parties exist? These are the people who live and breathe partisan views and see anything that their opponents say is fake news? And yes, they exist on both sides…

Posted by: Rhinehold at June 5, 2017 10:50 AM
Comment #417006
j2t2 doesn’t understand the article, which I must admit, is rather confusing.

Royal Flush, you have conveniently ignored to address my earlier comment. The price of electricity in Germany is much more a reflection of the demise of German Nuclear Power than anything having to do with the Paris Climate Accord.

WW,

Of course, any radio or TV station can do what NOAH does.

As someone who is personally familliar with how weather is forecast in this country, I can assure you have no idea what you are talking about (and this goes beyond not even knowing the correct initialism for the National Ocean & Atmospheric Administration). Radio and television stations do not operate petascale supercomputers capable of simulating the atmosphere 2 weeks in the future, nor can they ever be expected to do so. The benefits of accurate weather forecasts are immense, but they are externalized, making it impossible for an investor to recoup his investment. Just like the common defence, it is better for the taxpayer to fund this.

The military probably does the same thing also.
While the FNMOC does run an operational NWP system, it is vastly inferior to civilian systems. Today, the armed services are heavily reliant on NOAA for their weather forecasting needs.
Are you saying one state has a disaster preparedness program
No, he is saying that if a natural disaster strikes multiple states at the same time, a Federal agency is necessary to coordinate the relief efforts across state lines. Posted by: Warren Porter at June 5, 2017 11:01 AM
Comment #417014
a Federal agency is necessary to coordinate the relief efforts across state lines

because state agencies are too stupid and incapable of coordinating those things themselves. We have to have the almighty federal overlords in place to tell us what to do or we would choke on our own spit.

Posted by: Rhinehold at June 5, 2017 1:35 PM
Comment #417017

“The price of electricity in Germany is much more a reflection of the demise of German Nuclear Power than anything having to do with the Paris Climate Accord.”

Not according to the links provided by j2t2 which I have responded to in my posts Warren.

I never mentioned the PCA. It is clear that the average working German is paying a huge price for electricity due to government favoring and mandating power generated by wind and solar devices. There is no free market in electrical generation in Germany and that is the primary reason for their astronomical prices. I don’t want that for Americans.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 5, 2017 3:36 PM
Comment #417020
There is no free market in electrical generation in Germany and that is the primary reason for their astronomical prices.
There is no free market in electrical generation in America and that is the primary reason for our astronomical externalized costs. Costs, which represent a debt that will be borne by taxpayers sooner or later. Unlike you (or Chancellor Merkel), I want a free market for electricity where the price of electricity reflects the costs at which it is produced.

RH,

because state agencies are too stupid and incapable of coordinating those things themselves. We have to have the almighty federal overlords in place to tell us what to do or we would choke on our own spit.

With logic like that, why even bother entrusting Congress to regulate interstate commerce? I guess Rhinehold must be foaming at the mouth in eager anticipation of letting each of the 50 states decide its own import and export tariffs. After all, he knows that each state will be intelligent and perfectly coordinate those tariffs with one another to create the best solution for the whole nation. Petty infighting is impossible, right?

Posted by: Warren Porter at June 5, 2017 4:23 PM
Comment #417022

“I want a free market for electricity where the price of electricity reflects the costs at which it is produced.”

Ah Yes, the typical answer from my Liberal Pal Warren regarding energy. They certainly don’t want a “free market” for wages, food, medicine, and most everything the government controls by subsidy, regulation or tax.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 5, 2017 4:27 PM
Comment #417024

Rhinehold,
Yes, 25% would probably be a bottom for Trump. Bush hit that at the end of term. Despite crashing the stock market, cratering the financial sector, doubling the national debt, exploding annual deficits, seeing foreclosures at a rate as high or higher than the Great Depression, not to mention the disastrous War in Iraq, 25% of Americans approved of the job Bush did. That is simply astounding. Trump has said he could shoot someone on 5th Avenue and his sycophantic supporters would still stand by him, and I believe Trump is right.

However, the GOP Congress might have other ideas. If Trump’s approval ratings drop into the 20’s, a lot of Congressmen are going to choose to keep their jobs rather than support Trump. That is the danger for Trump of such low approval ratings. It makes impeachment much more palatable for the GOP. They will probably have an option on whether to impeach over Obstruction of Justice. They will not do it if they think they can keep their jobs.

As for Trump not having anyone in place for FEMA and the NOAA, the problem is that some natural disasters, such as Hurricane Katrina, overwhelm state infrastructure. That is the whole point of a federal response. The federal government commands more resources, and can draw on aid outside the damaged area. With no one to coordinate at the top, it leaves us very vulnerable.

Remember, for as bad as Trump is doing, all of the missteps are self-inflicted. There has been no significant external event.

Posted by: phx8 at June 5, 2017 5:42 PM
Comment #417025
the typical answer from my Liberal Pal Warren regarding energy. They certainly don’t want a “free market” for wages, food, medicine, and most everything the government controls by subsidy, regulation or tax.
Ideally, I would rather live without subsidies for any private consumable good (such as wages, food or medicine). My preference is always in favor of free markets. Sometimes, conservatives bind my hands and I cannot get the free market solution that I desire, so I begin to support the least destructive alternative. But this is all a massive distraction from the energy policy discussion we were having. Posted by: Warren Porter at June 5, 2017 6:31 PM
Comment #417027

“Ideally, I would rather live without subsidies for any private consumable good (such as wages, food or medicine).”

I agree Warren. I don’t blame just one side or the other. Political parties of all stripes are guilty of pandering for votes. The disagreement always comes from deciding who benefits and who pays.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 5, 2017 6:44 PM
Comment #417029
It is clear that the average working German is paying a huge price for electricity due to government favoring and mandating power generated by wind and solar devices. There is no free market in electrical generation in Germany and that is the primary reason for their astronomical prices.

Not so Royal. On a yearly basis they pay no more than we do. And they have the costs associated with adapting to climate change figured into the costs now.


https://www.cleanenergywire.org/factsheets/what-german-households-pay-power

Posted by: j2t2 at June 5, 2017 7:16 PM
Comment #417033

“On a yearly basis they pay no more than we do.”

Really? I do not intend to wade through the long article you linked. Please give me the facts.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 5, 2017 7:33 PM
Comment #417035

I have no idea why j2t2 linked to this:

The power price for a family of three with an annual consumption of 3,500 kWh are 68 percent above 1998 levels. That is partly due to the surcharge for renewable energy, which rose more than tenfold in the period, increasing its share in the power price from 1 percent to almost 24 percent. The surcharge is the difference between the wholesale price and the higher, fixed price for green energy, guaranteed by law to renewable power producers. Grid operators pass on the difference to consumers. In contrast to high-volume commercial customers, households are required to pay all levies and taxes.

German customers pay more for electricity than they should due to government interference in the market (namely the phase out of nuclear fission plants).

I agree Warren
Your continued support for implicit fossil fuel subsidies says otherwise. You are accumulating debts that will need to be paid by others. Posted by: Warren Porter at June 5, 2017 9:41 PM
Comment #417040
With logic like that, why even bother entrusting Congress to regulate interstate commerce?

Because commerce between states requires someone as a referee.. Are you going to tell me you need a referee between states on aid coordination? You get that you are making my point for me, yeah?

As for Trump not having anyone in place for FEMA and the NOAA

Are you really going to sit there and type that those groups can’t function without acting heads? The entire organization is going to crumble unless someone is appointed to those positions?

j2t2, you really know better than that, I know you do. Why you insist on the partisanship when it makes you look so foolish is beyond me.

Posted by: Rhinehold at June 5, 2017 11:12 PM
Comment #417069

“Your continued support for implicit fossil fuel subsidies says otherwise. You are accumulating debts that will need to be paid by others.”

Warren is blind in only one eye it seems. He realizes that subsidies are paid by “others”, but only if that subsidy is in the form of a depreciation allowance for the fossil fuel industry. But then he writes; “I would rather live without subsidies for any private consumable good (such as wages, food or medicine).”

Clear hypocrisy.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 6, 2017 3:28 PM
Comment #417072
Really? I do not intend to wade through the long article you linked. Please give me the facts.

Royal -

Over 20 years, German households reduced their power usage by 10 percent, while consumption in the United States increased by 20 percent. A German household in 2014 used less than a third of the power of an equivalent household in the US, and also less than other major industrial countries in Europe such as France, Britain and Spain.

If you look at the chart at the bottom of the link it shows the averages for several different countries.Germans pay less, on an overall basis, than we do because they are much more energy efficient that we are.

Posted by: j2t2 at June 6, 2017 5:34 PM
Comment #417073

“Over 20 years, German households reduced their power usage by 10 percent…” Hurrah for them. Is there any reason why US households can’t reduce our power usage? Are we forbidden by law?

Indeed j2t2, the chart you reference shows the US paying 9 cents per KW/hr while the Germans pay 30 cents. However, our monthly energy bill is nearly identical.

What a lousy deal for the Germans who use one-third the energy we do and pay the same as we do. They willingly reduced their energy usage and their government sucks up all the savings from their sacrifice. Do the right thing and the socialist government penalizes you.

I have reduced my energy use and my government has not chosen to penalize me…yet. Should we get another Socialist president I am quite confident the government will reach into my pocket to make me pay for my thrift.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 6, 2017 5:54 PM
Comment #417074

j2t2, here’s the thing you aren’t getting. If the people want energy efficiency, they just need to demand it from their choice of appliances. Then, the producers of those will create appliances that are more energy efficient. The issue is that there are a lot of poor people who can’t afford new appliances that often and hold on to old ones. But that will sort itself out long before 2050…

The real clue is that people who want to reduce our dependence on fossil fuels want to do it on their terms. Meaning, putting us behind on developing those newer sources and making them affordable because they wouldn’t allow us to move to nuclear decades ago when we should have. Even nuclear has much more efficient technologies now nearly eliminating all byproducts, but still, the religion is hard set and hard to remove. One recent conservation group came out a couple of years ago demanding nuclear to lower CO2 output and they were excoriated and told they weren’t ‘good environmentalists’. That’s an example of what we are dealing with.

Posted by: Rhinehold at June 6, 2017 5:55 PM
Comment #417077

Oh and while j2t2 is extolling Germany…

http://blog.simplejustice.us/2017/05/10/meyer-lindenberg-hate-speech-never-go-full-europe/

Never Go Full Europe.

Posted by: Rhinehold at June 6, 2017 6:05 PM
Comment #417078

Thanks for the very funny link Rhinehold.

There is much I admire about Germany. Criminalizing “hate” speech isn’t one of them. It is interesting to discover who gets to determine what constitutes “hate”.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 6, 2017 6:24 PM
Comment #417084
“Over 20 years, German households reduced their power usage by 10 percent…” Hurrah for them. Is there any reason why US households can’t reduce our power usage? Are we forbidden by law?

Well the only thing stopping us is us Royal, you can blow smoke and tell us we can do it but the Germans have done it the past 10 years. We have a guy trying to bring coal back into the forefront of energy and you think we can do something like reducer consumption!

What a lousy deal for the Germans who use one-third the energy we do and pay the same as we do. They willingly reduced their energy usage and their government sucks up all the savings from their sacrifice. Do the right thing and the socialist government penalizes you.

Yet according to Trump the US is paying to much and is pulling us out of the Paris Climate Agreement because other countries including Germany aren’t paying their fair share! Amazing how wrong he is isn’t it ?

Posted by: j2t2 at June 6, 2017 11:43 PM
Comment #417094

Hmmm…PCA and NATO wear the same clothes according to j2t2.

My Pal applauds the Germans for reducing their power usage by 10 percent but forgets to tell us they did so with a gun (much higher electricity rates) pointed at their collective heads.

German families had to choose between electric power and food.

Posted by: Royal Flush at June 7, 2017 1:00 PM
Comment #417123
German families had to choose between electric power and food.

Not according to the fact sheet I linked to earlier Royal. Seems your ideological prognostications are wrong as usual.


“A possible explanation would be that electricity consumed only 2.3 percent of households’ disposable income in 2015, up from 1.78 percent in 1998 and back to mid-1980s levels, before the liberalisation of the power market in 1998 lowered prices.”

Yet according to Forbes here in America things are tougher, we can’t do it as well as those socialist Germans you complain about I guess. We have to be the no can do country, with the no can do president, it seems Royal.Yet you only pay 10 cents per KW/hr. You don’t plan for the future only the next quarter. No wonder you rely on Trump to “make America great again”!

https://www.forbes.com/sites/judeclemente/2014/11/24/americans-cant-afford-higher-electricity-prices/#153a54de5a05


My Pal applauds the Germans for reducing their power usage by 10 percent but forgets to tell us they did so with a gun (much higher electricity rates) pointed at their collective heads.

I do applaud the Germans in this instance Royal. Then have accepted responsibility as a country. They have the freedom of choice and they have chosen the high rode as a group, as a nation. Without a doubt some individuals in Germany would prefer to waste energy and resources, to pollute for personal gain like many Texans do, as some sort of a status symbol, but as a country they have decided to move into the future not yearn for the past. You make it sound as if they are actually held at the point of a gun and forced into paying their fair share!


Oh BTW, Trump, when withdrawing from the PCA said, “Thus, as of today, the United States will cease all implementation of the non-binding Paris Accord and the draconian financial and economic burdens the agreement imposes on our country. This includes ending the implementation of the nationally determined contribution and, very importantly, the Green Climate Fund which is costing the United States a vast fortune.” So when you tell us “Hmmm…PCA and NATO wear the same clothes according to j2t2” it seems you are uninformed.

So I wonder Royal you seem to see no reason to hedge your bet when it comes to climate change. You would have us believe it is some conspiracy and renewable energy has no place in America, right?

Posted by: j2t2 at June 8, 2017 12:53 AM
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