Third Party & Independents Archives

We Want Answers, We Demand Answers

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/05/16/slain-dnc-staffer-had-contact-with-wikileaks-investigator-says.html

Inquiring minds would like to know the status and what is being done, if anything, to solve this murder mystery.

Hannity is pushing the supposition that this man was communicating with wikileaks, was found out and murdered. So, what did the investigation turn up on his DNC computer/laptop? Why is this and other information around this case being sat on?

Shot down on the street in DC, it is likely the FBI has responsibility for the investigation and has put the clamps on releasing info to the public.

A lot of stuff that happened under Obama's tenure that was shoved into a dark hole. But, hey, Trump's admin has been on the scene for over a 100 days and nothing has changed.

Hundreds of questions and no answers. This can't go on much longer - - ? ?

Posted by Roy Ellis at May 20, 2017 10:31 AM
Comments
Comment #416518
Inquiring minds would like to know the status and what is being done, if anything, to solve this murder mystery.

Read the Enquirer Roy or the propagandist rags that pass as conservative media. Wallow in the fake news.

Hannity is pushing the supposition that this man was communicating with wikileaks, was found out and murdered.

Hannity is a fascist clown, he is opinion not news, fake news not facts. Why not go to Alex Jones and Info Wars or other make believe BS if you seek fake news and propaganda.

The mans family has got a cease and desist on Faux News for their lies Roy, why lower yourself to their level with this stupidity?

Posted by: j2t2 at May 20, 2017 12:10 AM
Comment #416519

Just name calling, j2t2? Is that all you have, name calling?

Wikileaks has posted a reward to find this guy’s killer. The family’s investigator found the connection. And all you can reply with is name calling?

Now you know why Demcratics can’t win elections.

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 20, 2017 12:37 AM
Comment #416526
Just name calling, j2t2? Is that all you have, name calling?

Fighting fire with fire Weary, because thats all you guys have is fake news.

Wikileaks has posted a reward to find this guy’s killer.

So what Weary is that some sort of proof to you that this pig has wings?


The family’s investigator found the connection.

“But Tuesday afternoon, Wheeler told CNN he had no evidence to suggest Rich had contacted Wikileaks before his death.”

http://money.cnn.com/2017/05/16/media/seth-rich-family-response-claims-of-wikileaks-contact/index.html?utm_source=huffingtonpost.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pubexchange_article


And all you can reply with is name calling?

The mans family has got a cease and desist on Faux News for their lies Roy, why lower yourself to their level with this stupidity? Was my reply Weary. It is a lie, It is unsubstantiated and by the lowest of journalistic standards should not have been considered news. Yet these conservative propagandist spewed out the hatred and you and Roy bit on it.

It is sad to see you guys fall for this stuff whilst ignoring the Russian link to these emails. Spreading disinformation isn’t good for the country. Unfortunately that seems to be what conservatives do anymore, why not try sticking to facts for a change?

Posted by: j2t2 at May 20, 2017 9:45 AM
Comment #416527

” The Rich family issued a statement saying family members had seen “no facts” and “no evidence” to suggest Rich had worked with WikiLeaks.”

https://www.mediamatters.org/blog/2017/05/16/how-fox-affiliate-and-contributor-fueled-fringe-conspiracy-theories-about-murdered-dnc-staffer/216478

Posted by: j2t2 at May 20, 2017 9:46 AM
Comment #416528

“In a message to Newsweek on Tuesday, Wheeler said the Fox News report was misleading and that his information was secondhand from that “federal investigator.””
http://www.newsweek.com/seth-rich-dnc-staffer-wikileaks-leaked-emails-fbi-610383

If a lie is a lie and you call it out is it also name calling Weary?

Posted by: j2t2 at May 20, 2017 9:56 AM
Comment #416530

Well, MediaMatters is a rag and Holt is an idiot!

Newsweek is a self serving pile of rubbish worthy of birdcages!

There, we’re even.

And you’re right about the family’s investigator. However, the FBI has said there is a connection to Rich and Wikileaks. How about we insist the DC police and the FBI start working together on this and solve this “robbery”.

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 20, 2017 11:32 AM
Comment #416531

Not quite even Weary. You see what Media Matters and Newsweek said was an accurate reflection of the facts. What Faux and the other right wing propagandist said wasn’t. That is actually a big difference. Why would you use such dishonest, disreputable sites as a source of information? Why would you defend this type of disinformation by belittling reputable news outlets? IMHO it makes conservative arguments about the mainstream media nothing more than the whining of those unable to deal with truth and facts. You guys can and should do better when it comes to news sources, demand accurate reporting not disinformation.


However, the FBI has said there is a connection to Rich and Wikileaks. How about we insist the DC police and the FBI start working together on this and solve this “robbery”.

Now see what Roy has done and you have defended Weary. By allowing these fake news/alternative facts into the discussion you have created the impression that there is more to the story than there actually is. Why should the FBI investigate this murder when it doesn’t normally investigate murders in DC?

What we do know is 17 different agencies said it was the Russians that gave the emails in question to wikileaks. We know the Russians included fake news and other deceptions in the stolen emails thereby manipulating people such as yourself into being coming confused about the real issue.


“And NBC News reported this week that a current FBI official said that D.C. police never gave Rich’s computer to the FBI.”
http://www.npr.org/2017/05/17/528804792/unproved-claims-reemerge-around-dnc-staffer-s-death-here-s-what-you-should-know

Posted by: j2t2 at May 20, 2017 12:16 PM
Comment #416532

No, j2t2. You started it. Let’s stick to name calling. It’s easier.

NPR, a bias, attached at the mouth, herd of Democratics.

See? I didn’t need one fact, just name calling. See how easy that is?

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 20, 2017 1:29 PM
Comment #416534

Weary how would you expect me to react to such vicious outright lies such as the one Hannity perpetrated on the people of America?

Of course it seems you didn’t like my unPC characterization of Hannity but I am tired of people like him getting a free ride by conservatives for spouting such nonsense. It makes me sad to see so many Americans using Faux and the other propagandist outlets as actual news sources.

Where you are wrong Weary is the suggestion that I have used only name calling to get my point across where in fact I used several facts to make my point in this column. Which of course is where we differ. It seems you are fact free so far in this thread.

Perhaps it is because of your news source or perhaps it is because you are so PC that calling Hannity out is to much for you to take, talk about snowflake…oops another name…hey…. why is it ok for conservatives to call people here on WB snowflakes but it is name calling when I call one of their own a name?

Anyway Weary tell you what, since you want to continue to be fact free why not take this name calling to a personal level? Go ahead call me some choice names, get it out, get a good rant going and I will laugh along with you. It will make you feel better and besides I can’t think of any facts that supports you guys on this issue.

Posted by: j2t2 at May 20, 2017 2:54 PM
Comment #416536

j2t2, there is no evidence of no collusion. We need an investigation.

I guess it depends on what news we all listen to, right? Here’s a dilemma for you, j2t2. Since they all go to journalism school to learn how to be an accepted journalist, what makes you think your journalists aren’t as incompetent as my journalists? Why are your journalists as clean as the wind driven snow and those who contradict them are fascist clowns.

It sounds more like bias, j2t2, and we’re both guilty of it.

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 20, 2017 4:26 PM
Comment #416537

I learned much from listening to Alan Dershowitz in this video.

Dershowitz: Mueller’s special counsel appointment begs the question — are our civil liberties now at risk?

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/05/20/dershowitz-muellers-special-counsel-appointment-begs-question-are-our-civil-liberties-now-at-risk.html

Posted by: Royal Flush at May 20, 2017 5:49 PM
Comment #416538

Quite the assumption you make Weary. First of all did the fascist clown major in journalism? The answer of course is no he didn’t. Now lets pick one of my clowns, say Max Kutner from Newsweek the reporter from the link above.Seems he did go to school for journalism.
http://www.newsweek.com/authors/max-kutner

Perhaps the problem is more that Hannity is a talk show host who we mistake for a journalist. He doesn’t hold himself to any journalistic standard yet we trust him to be truthful. It might be useful to checkout some of the sites you visit and see if they are journalist or just someone with an opinion or worse.

Posted by: j2t2 at May 20, 2017 8:46 PM
Comment #416539

j2, we do know the man worked for the DNC in 2016. We know he was shot on the street early one morning in DC. We know nothing was taken from his body, like money, watch, etc.

That begs a legit question, j2. Who killed this man?

Beyond that there is conflicting information re the investigation. Who investigated - DC or FBI? Who has the laptop? What was on the laptop? Was there a laptop?

These are not fake news questions. What does the family think about this? Do they believe the case is being handled properly? They brought in one private investigator and apparently didn’t like his suggestions. Why would they not want to try again with a ‘better’ investigator?

There is not speculation here. Just legit questions about a man who was murdered, for no known reason. People would like some answers, been a year or so, etc.

Posted by: Roy Ellis at May 20, 2017 9:14 PM
Comment #416540

Fair enough. I’ll have to admit, I went to Politico and realized I would have to read the articles to know what the headlines meant. A lot of the headlines I couldn’t fathom what the article was about.

It made me realize I am trained to favor a different perspective. I let myself listen to Fox and Rush and Hannity when I get the chance, not because they have a mesmerizing effect on me, but because they provide an alternate point of view.
I guess it’s because Hannity is someone who asks questions and expects answers and not someone who always has the answers and is trying to explain them to us.

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 20, 2017 9:17 PM
Comment #416545
That begs a legit question, j2. Who killed this man?

Yes it does beg the question who killed him. However it doesn’t beg the fringe conspiracy theory spread by the conservative propagandist Hannity and his ilk, Roy. Did Hannity produce any evidence to link his death to providing wikileaks with stolen emails? Did you before you insinuated the FBI was suppressing information as to who was behind this man’s death? BTW does the FBI investigate all murders in DC? If not why would you think they were responsible for this investigation?

Instead you both relied upon a fake news story that reputable journalist blew apart with facts, simply by interviewing the “investigator” who backtracked on everything he said to the local Fox propagandist that “reported” the story as if it were based in fact.

Who investigated - DC or FBI? Who has the laptop? What was on the laptop? Was there a laptop?

OK Roy now is the time to go to the links I have provided and get these questions answered. The issue here is why did Hannity not do this? Instead he fooled you into thinking there is some sort of a conspiracy, yet these real journalist provided these answers by doing their job.


These are not fake news questions.

Yes they are Roy because you don’t have any legitimate proof to tie the emails to his murder.You do have 17 Federal agencies tying the Russians to the stolen emails however.

What does the family think about this?

Again read the links I provided in this thread and you will see they filed a cease and desist order to stop the propagandist from this fantasy speculation that conservatives pass around as news.


They brought in one private investigator and apparently didn’t like his suggestions. Why would they not want to try again with a ‘better’ investigator?

You forgot the part about who paid for the “investigator” Roy. But once again read the links to get your questions answered by reputable journalist. In fact that is what you should have done IMHO, prior to using the Hannity disinformation as a basis for asking these questions as if they had merit.

The positive thing about this is you did help to show how fake news and alternative facts have become such a new norm for conservative media outlets. How commentators such as Hannity fool the public into thinking they are getting serious news when they are in fact a**hats that obfuscate the issues.

Posted by: j2t2 at May 21, 2017 9:54 AM
Comment #416546

I let myself listen to Fox and Rush and Hannity when I get the chance, not because they have a mesmerizing effect on me, but because they provide an alternate point of view.

Yes they do. They are entertainers that provide entertainment not real news. They don’t hold themselves to any journalistic standard, choosing instead to use propaganda techniques to entertain their audience. Which is fine except when the audience believes they are getting news not entertainment. When the audience comes away thinking they have factual information because other media sites use these entertainers as news sources.What these entertainers don’t do is provide alternate factual information. That is what many seem to forget.


I guess it’s because Hannity is someone who asks questions and expects answers and not someone who always has the answers and is trying to explain them to us.

How true, it is sad how other conservative sites then use this as “news” and it passes around the internet as real news, not opinion, not entertainment. Which is where the damage occurs. Look at how Roy, in this thread, ties this wild speculation and fringe conspiracy theory into the Obama administration where a “dark hole” exits. With simple questions like “why haven’t they released information about (this ongoing) investigation to the public, as if they would normally do this! Or simple statements suggesting the FBI routinely handles local murder investigations instead of the DC police!

Nothing but wild speculation that resulted from a lack of knowledge about how murder investigations are handled, yet a slur on the Obama administration without any real substance to suggest the Obama administration is hiding something!

Meanwhile the emails in question were investigated by a slew of Federal agencies and the investigators found the Russians to be the thieves that stole the emails. Seems to me Hannity is protecting these hackers by insinuating this dead guy who cannot speak for himself is accused of the crime! Not to mention the slur on this guys reputation. Entertaining? Perhaps but not when we are fooled into thinking it has some basis in fact and then allow it to fester and cause us to hate the other guys. We are being manipulated into doing just this by these guys. So,IMHO, that is when this entertainment becomes propaganda and is harmful to others.

Posted by: j2t2 at May 21, 2017 10:23 AM
Comment #416548

How can you say this about this issue but be so cock sure Trump and Russia colluded to rig the election? Aren’t you playing the same game you’re accusing Hannity of playing?

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 21, 2017 11:15 AM
Comment #416549

I’m not cock sure that Trump and Russia colluded to rig the election Weary. I believe the evidence points to the Russians on the stolen emails. I believe Putin is arrogant enough to manipulate the American people. We have seen how easily manipulated the American people can be. I wonder if Trump was smart enough to be involved with Putin in planning the fake news and disinformation, or if it was Putin’s team alone that did the work.

Did Trump or someone from his campaign coordinate with Putin and other Russians in their oligarchy, probably but to what degree, who knows. But when you have a candidate that would accuse another candidates family of being involved in the Kennedy assassination one has to wonder how low the campaign would stoop to win the election.

Now the question is am I playing the same game as Hannity? Well did I make anything up to get to this point? Have I ignored any facts that would lead us to a different conclusion. Have I entertained you while using fake news to persuade you what I said is the truth? I would say I am not playing the same game as Hannity.

Posted by: j2t2 at May 21, 2017 11:38 AM
Comment #416563

You’re not sure,
You believe,
You wonder,
Probably,
Who knows,

We have seen how easily manipulated the American people can be.

Yes, j2t2, it is obvious in your last comment.

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 21, 2017 3:34 PM
Comment #416564


j2, only reason we are discussing this murder is because Hannity brought it up for public purview. You would think the parents would be grateful to anyone who keeps their son’s murder before the public.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/public-safety/family-of-slain-dnc-staffer-fights-back-against-conpiracy-theories-with-cease-and-desist-letter/2017/05/20/6da279c2-3d6f-11e7-8854-21f359183e8c_story.html?utm_term=.0915f35d996d

I’d like to see Hannity set up a fund to continue the investigation. Coming up on a year and we don’t know what was on the laptop, if anything. We don’t know if this is tied up in an FBI investigation. Why don’t we know some pertinent things about this murder?

Posted by: Roy Ellis at May 21, 2017 3:40 PM
Comment #416581

Roy, Perhaps the parents just don’t want their sons murder to be used by despicable pieces of s**t for political reasons.

You see I believe you are being disingenuous, just as Hannity and the other propagandist are. If you were truly interested in the murdered man there would be no need for the wild conspiracy theories that are always included with conservative talk on this murder. “The dark hole of the Obama administration” speaks volumes Roy.

The FBI has stated it isn’t involved in the investigation, you keep repeating this as if it has some importance yet haven’t bothered to answer why the FBI should be involved in a local murder.

It appears the only reason you don’t know the answers to your questions is because you use the conservative propagandist as a news source Roy.

Posted by: j2t2 at May 22, 2017 12:22 AM
Comment #416582
Yes, j2t2, it is obvious in your last comment.

Oh Weary you failed, back to step one for you. Propaganda 101 #2 accuse the other side of that which you are guilty of. Because I am giving my opinion I am manipulating , seriously? How discouraging you were doing so good.

Posted by: j2t2 at May 22, 2017 12:30 AM
Comment #416584

Is our disagreement based on the fact you can’t read? I didn’t say you were manipulating. I said you were being manipulated.

You insist there’s a case to be made with maybe and probably and wonder. Not once have you presented fact. Neither have the people who claim a crime was committed. You’ve got nothing but opinion and you expect me to believe it’s credible evidence.

I’m not the one being manipulated, j2t2. If you are going all in on this collusion thing, it’s you who are being manipulated because there are no facts to back up your assertions.


Posted by: Weary Willie at May 22, 2017 9:21 AM
Comment #416589

You don’t want answers. You think you already got them. You want conclusions that fit those ready-made beliefs. You want what you can’t have.

Seth Rich was likely murdered by a mugger. A professional would not leave his meal ticket breathing. Heck, he might not have even gone for a shooting on the street.

I know some folks who are older, or otherwise lacking in computer experience think that Rich had some sort of super broad access to the DNC’s whole computer system, when in all actuality, he probably had no more access to the e-mail system than any average office grunt. I’m IT, and I don’t have that kind of high level access to everybody’s email, to copy and offload as they were.

And why kill him? Doesn’t a dead body draw more attention to the matter? If I was writing the movie, I’d have them try to kill him before he released the data, not after.

Conspiracy theories are often very partisan in nature. They’re all about imputing the darkest of motives and deeds to a particular set of figures, to oppose something or someone. Some CTs have anti-semitism at their heart. Others oppose globalism. Others find fault with a capitalist system that seems content to let us get blindsided by product defects and such.

The trick is, though, because they’re often composed with the convenience of a certain idea or set of roles in mind, they’re often pushed, forced, onto scenarios that on closer examination don’t organically fit them that well.

I mean, the truth is, **** happens. Even the best vaccines cause inadvertent side effects in a small percent of the population. Same thing with any drug out there. The fact that some drugs that had serious side effects more common than advertised, though, helped feed paranoia about them, paranoia some alternative medicine advocates use to overcome people’s scientific skepticism about their wares.

Here, some people want to see the Democrats and the Clintons in particular as sinister, evil people. They’ll push that story to the point where any death is ruled to be no coincidence, even when the evidence is thin on the ground for some rational reason to back up the suspicion.

It’s also helpful when some set of dirty tricksters want to distract a suitably gullible audience away from some real conspiracies. Whether it’s claiming the media is biased or complicit in a given conspiracy, or asserting that this one guy had the IT access to copy the e-mail database and get away with all the e-mails before he got stopped (despite the fact he would be unlikely to have that access in his job), it’s all done to reassure their supporters that things are not as bad as they seem, and the truth, when revealed, will vindicate their people.

The voters of the GOP, though, deserve better than this tripe. The leaders of the GOP have made a cynical, elitist judgment on their voters, that this is the level of information, of knowledge that is good enough for them, that only the higher ups, the rich and powerful, get to know the whole story.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at May 22, 2017 12:18 PM
Comment #416591
Is our disagreement based on the fact you can’t read? I didn’t say you were manipulating. I said you were being manipulated.

My bad Weary I was confused because you said ” Aren’t you playing the same game you’re accusing Hannity of playing?” in the previous comment.

You insist there’s a case to be made with maybe and probably and wonder. Not once have you presented fact.

First of all Weary I don’t insist there is a case to be made on the Russian Trump collusion.

Neither have the people who claim a crime was committed. You’ve got nothing but opinion and you expect me to believe it’s credible evidence.

Secondly I wasn’t expecting you to believe I was offer proof/evidence or that I had proof and/or evidence.

Weary The response you are commenting on was in reference to your question ” Aren’t you playing the same game you’re accusing Hannity of playing?” I briefly went through my thoughts on the issue as we were discussing just the email part of the equation until that time. I didn’t feel the need to offer proof because I made no accusations just gave a quick blurb on my thoughts on the larger issue.

SO IMHO I am not being manipulated nor am I manipulating anyone when it comes to comment #416549.

Now when I made the comment “Hannity is a fascist clown” I was manipulating whoever decided to read this thread into becoming angry and giving me your best shot at proving Hannity isn’t a fascist clown. I wasn’t try to convince you he is a fascist clown because I called him one but offered no reliable source.

I include Hannity in the propagandist group and have offered proof however. This isn’t his first goat roping when it comes to the false claims so he has a track record at propaganda.

Posted by: j2t2 at May 22, 2017 3:03 PM
Comment #416599

That’s a lengthy retraction, if it was one. If it wasn’t it was just plain bullshit.

You want to make a big deal saying Trump colluded with Putin to get elected, but when push comes to shove you come up with crap like your last comment?

You’re getting better at transparency.

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 23, 2017 1:00 AM
Comment #416610
You want to make a big deal saying Trump colluded with Putin to get elected, but when push comes to shove you come up with crap like your last comment?

Jesus Weary where did that come from? We were actually talking about the bogus far right conspiracy theory being promoted by the propagandist Hannity and copied by most of the conservative media outlets as if it were news. You were the one who veered off into collusion by Trump and the Russian on the election, not me.

How is that for transparency?

Posted by: j2t2 at May 23, 2017 9:32 AM
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