Third Party & Independents Archives

Sunday Morning Breakdown


A populist President carrying out populist ideas. President Trump actually working to immolate Andrew Jackson. How great is that?

And, how deftly he shut down the left's rant on Trump and company being in bed with Putin? Too good to believe it happened.

Old Farid was on the Commie News Networks this morning touting that President Trump has caused a great rise in anti-semitism. Farid leaves one believing that Trump himself is walking around Jewish cemeteries knocking over headstones.

Should we be astonished that not one person has been hauled in from any place in the country for doing these dastardly deeds? Or, should we believe that the leftist thuggery crowd has fronted the money and provided the folks to carry out anti-semitic acts wih the intended purpose of blaming it on Trump and the (surmised) David Duke connection?

I believe the Democrat's did it.

Posted by Roy Ellis at March 19, 2017 11:29 AM
Comments
Comment #414483

Russian bot.

Posted by: phx8 at March 19, 2017 1:41 PM
Comment #414485

Zowie ! Emulate vs immolate - - -

Posted by: Roy Ellis at March 19, 2017 3:10 PM
Comment #414491

So Roy shouldn’t that be a populist sounding president failing to carry out populist agenda? Other than attacking and blaming minorities what has he done? I have heard the speech at Flat Rock MI and it sounded good but his tax plan is a slap in the face to the populist that voted for him, same as his grow the military budget whilst ignoring the deficit and debt. His people killing replacement for Obamacare doesn’t seem populist to me. While we think he is emulating Jackson he seems to be immolating the working poor.

Posted by: j2t2 at March 19, 2017 8:36 PM
Comment #414495

Jackson confronted a bunch of arrogant east coast elitist, Trump is an arrogant east coast elitist. Unless of course Jackson’s wife and kid lived in NYC and took weekly trips at taxpayer expense, a very costly expense at that, for recreation along with Trump.

Lets see Jackson won the popular vote and lost the electoral college first time running as president just….like…oh never mind….Trump lost the popular vote. But both had prior… political…. experience… oh wait… Trump didn’t. Jackson grew up in poverty just …like… oops Trumps dad was one of the richest in America for a while, silver spooned all his life Trump wouldn’t know poverty if it bit him on the a**. How are they similar Roy?

Posted by: j2t2 at March 19, 2017 10:05 PM
Comment #414496

J2, similar in that both put America’s interest first. Both wanted to carry out the agenda expressed by the people who voted them into office.

Pay up Merkla, and others.

Posted by: Roy Ellis at March 19, 2017 11:05 PM
Comment #414497

Oh my God… Are you seriously suggesting Germany pay reparations?


Other than that what you seem to be saying is Trump makes a false claim Germany owes us vast sums of money and those that voted for Trump believe the false claims and now want vast sums of money from Germany! Seems to me Trump is playing on the fears of those same “security over liberty” voters you speak of and distancing the US from our European allies in favor of the oligarchy that is Russia. Once again how is that like Jackson? What oligarchy did Jackson try to align us with?


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2017/03/18/no-germany-doesnt-owe-america-vast-sums-of-money-for-nato/?utm_term=.7ed9afa5501f

Posted by: j2t2 at March 19, 2017 11:18 PM
Comment #414498

So what tariffs, always a part of the populist movement, has Trump actually enacted to date?

Tariffs, Racism to garner support from southerners and poor people, but… but… what has he done to restrict Wall Street, seems to me he is wanting to give them free reign, how populist is that?

Posted by: j2t2 at March 19, 2017 11:57 PM
Comment #414503

Where, in your link, does it mention reparations, j2t2?

Why do you need to make shit up?

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 20, 2017 9:10 AM
Comment #414504

j2’s fake news. Hey! I’m a poet!

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 20, 2017 9:11 AM
Comment #414506

Weary, Seriously “fake news”!! Are you so misguided you don’t know what fake news is? I asked a question.

Now for something real instead of your deflection. When the president tells the American people that Germany owes us “vast sums of money” and in reality Germany doesn’t owe us “vast sums of money” that could be considered fake news. Especially when the people of this country use this misinformation based upon a half truth or outright lie to create a myth and allow the fuhrer to break ties with our allies in favor of an oligarchy that he has business ties to. So please address the issues not deflect with nonsense as you have done. Or rebut what I have posted with facts and reasoning.

Posted by: j2t2 at March 20, 2017 10:38 AM
Comment #414508

What reparations are you talking about?

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 20, 2017 3:30 PM
Comment #414511

The noose is tightening on the shambolic Trump administration. Trump and Sean Spicer and pretending they don’t know Paul Manafort (campaign manager) and Carter Page (security advisor). Roger Stone will probably be going down too. The FBI is actively investigating collusion between the Russians and the Trump campaign. Let’s see if they can turn Manafort, Page, or Stone against Trump. That is what prosecutors do. It will take some time, but one of those guys will sing rather than do time.

Poor Russian bots won’t have anywhere to go in future elections.

Posted by: phx8 at March 20, 2017 6:23 PM
Comment #414512

phx8, your screaming orgasm might be “premature”.

Posted by: Royal Flush at March 20, 2017 6:27 PM
Comment #414513

He’s making it up. No link in this last comment, if you can call it that. It sounds more like incoherent blather to me.

j2t2 still hasn’t told us where this “reparations” idea of his came from. Probably from phx8.

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 20, 2017 6:33 PM
Comment #414514

RF & WW,
Did you not see what happened today? Sean Spicer & Trump are trying to put space between themselves and some of the likely suspects. According to the White House Spokesman, Manafort played a “very limited role” for a “very limited time” in the campaign. Actually, he was Campaign Manager. Spicer said Flynn was a volunteer. Heh. He was named National Security Advisor. I think Carter Page is the one who will be turned by government prosecutors. Roger Stone claimed to be in touch with Wikileaks. Scroll down to the timeline:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/20/politics/kfile-roger-stone-wikileaks-claims/

Stone is in deep and so is Manafort, but Page has a weak character. He’s just in it for the money. If I were a government prosecutor, I would go after him.

Posted by: phx8 at March 20, 2017 7:48 PM
Comment #414515

Lock her up !!

Posted by: Roy Ellis at March 20, 2017 9:24 PM
Comment #414516

Russian bot

Posted by: phx8 at March 20, 2017 10:55 PM
Comment #414517
He’s making it up.

Weary, it was a question that resulted from Roy’s comment.

No link in this last comment, if you can call it that. It sounds more like incoherent blather to me.

No link to my question? Seriously Weary did you expect some magic link to the the question I asked in the comment in this thread? I don’t know why you choose to deflect so much on this issue. It’s pretty simple, pretty clear. The Trump comment “Germany owes us vast sums of money” was without merit as I have explained in my previous comment. The same comment where I ask you to rebut with facts and reas…..oh thats why you thought I was blathering… it does sound kinda funny now that I think about it. Such a high expectation level I guess.


j2t2 still hasn’t told us where this “reparations” idea of his came from.

Wasn’t my idea Weary. but FYI….

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/sep/29/germany-reparations-first-world-war

Posted by: j2t2 at March 21, 2017 12:32 AM
Comment #414521

Did you read that article or just link to it because it had the word reparations in it?

The article was written in 2010! It also said Germany paid it off. The article was about Germany paying off the last of reparations for WW1.

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 21, 2017 8:02 AM
Comment #414522


http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/germany-rejects-trump-nato/

“Berlin’s defense budget has long been below NATO’s target of 2 percent of a member’s gross domestic product.”

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/trump-defend-germany/

“Only the U.S. and four other members currently reach the benchmark of spending 2 percent of GDP on defense. Germany currently spends 1.23 percent of its GDP on defense”

23 member countries are not paying their ‘fair share.’ They have taken advantage of our generosity and have grown accustomed to us picking up their slack.
The lack of some magical ‘past due’ symbolic account does not change that fact, or the reasoning.

Posted by: kctim at March 21, 2017 9:17 AM
Comment #414524
The article was written in 2010!

Very good Weary, but so what? You know this proves you can read and comprehend so why do you have such a tough time when I ask a question and you tell us it was a “claim” I made and it was my idea?


It also said Germany paid it off. The article was about Germany paying off the last of reparations for WW1.

Yes it was paid off Weary, excellent work my friend. So if it was paid off then Germany doesn’t owe us “vast sums of money” as Trump claims….right? Ya see Weary the point here is Trump makes these claims and his followers eat it up without question, yet when I try to guess on why Trump would say such a thing if it wasn’t true you defend and deflect instead of trying to provide any reason for him doing so.

It seems to me Trump is blathering but no one, least of all Germany, is falling for his nonsense. IMHO instead of picking on Germany for spending what he thinks is to little at 2% he should be looking at what we as a country spend on the military and look for room to cut it to 2% as well.

Ya see Weary we borrow to spend at a level 8 times that 2% NATO requires, and that lets small minded folks… er…umm…small government folks think we should lower spending on essentials like Medicare/Medicaid and Social Security to balance the budget. But a malnourished and sick people cannot fight, as the British learned during WWI. It is sad we have lost these lessons over time all because of conservative ideology and the need to be war mongers.

Now had Trump not gave a budget to Congress that greatly increased military spending and included billions for the wall Mexico was supposed to pay for, at a cost to our social safety net, then one may think he has a point when it comes to spending by Europe on the Just Europe Treaty…oh….wait…. the North Atlantic Treaty Organization.

With all the ties Trump has to Russia we really need to watch Trump and his attempts to derail NATO and make enemies out of our allies IMHO.

Posted by: j2t2 at March 21, 2017 12:02 PM
Comment #414525

“It seems to me Trump is blathering but no one, least of all Germany, is falling for his nonsense.”

https://www.thelocal.de/20170317/germany-wants-change-to-nato-two-percent-budget-goal

“instead of picking on Germany for spending what he thinks is to little at 2%”

Actually, Trump wants them to spend what they agreed to with President Obama in order to “counter a more assertive Russia.”

“attempts to derail NATO and make enemies out of our allies”

By simply asking them to contribute their ‘fair share’ to the unified effort to keep Russia at bay?

Posted by: kctim at March 21, 2017 1:04 PM
Comment #414526

“Did you not see what happened today? Sean Spicer & Trump are trying to put space between themselves and some of the likely suspects.”

OK phx8, I’ll bite; suspected of what?

Can you provide anything at all that proves the Russians tampered with the election?

I must tell you, and my Lefty Pals, that Hillary Clinton is the only person responsible for her losing the election.

She ran on her record and on promises to continue the Obama program. She lost.

Posted by: Royal Flush at March 21, 2017 2:07 PM
Comment #414527

“With all the ties Trump has to Russia…”

I wonder if our Pal could provide evidence of any ties to Russia that are not business related? Is doing business with Russia suspect?

As for Germany and its support of NATO; it is really quite simple if one is not trying to be an asshole.

Ms. Merkel said that Germany would meet its previously stated goal of increasing its military spending to 2 percent of its G.D.P. by 2024.

Who is confused by this statement?

Posted by: Royal Flush at March 21, 2017 2:18 PM
Comment #414528

Proving these ties is the job of the FBI Royal. The business related ties , as in using Russian steel in the pipeline instead of American steel, reek of crony capitalism,IMHO. The oil deal Tillerson is dealing with is another example of the Nixonion approach Trump displays as President. Seems some favors may have been earned by Putin. Or that golden shower thing has wings, who knows.

“Who is confused by this statement?” you ask, I say Trump is when he tells us “Germany owes us vast sums of money”. The fact is Germany spends the 2% already according to their defense minister but not all of it on NATO.

Posted by: j2t2 at March 21, 2017 2:30 PM
Comment #414529

“Proving these ties is the job of the FBI Royal.” What a strange belief j2t2. Why is the FBI interested in anyone’s legal business dealings? “Crony capitalism” illegal?

The CEO of Exxon dealing in oil…illegal and suspect?

“Putin favors”…prove it clown.

Look political hypocrite…I quoted Chancellor Merkel. Are you telling us j2t2, that she disagrees with her defense minister? Or, are you simply being a punk?

Posted by: Royal Flush at March 21, 2017 2:39 PM
Comment #414533

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t Germany paying 2% of their GDP on defense? Aren’t we picking up the tab for the rest of Germany’s defense? Isn’t that what Trump is trying to recoup? Isn’t he asking for reimbursement for the amount of money, over and above Germany’s 2%, we spend while defending Germany?

Trump is not talking about billing Germany for past wars (reparations). He’s talking about reimbursement of the money we spend on our military in Germany now, and that has nothing to do with Germany’s 2%. Germany’s 2% goes to Germany’s military, not ours.

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 21, 2017 3:47 PM
Comment #414538

“Can you provide anything at all that proves the Russians tampered with the election?”

Royal, the question today is not whether Russia tampered with the election with the purpose of hurting Clinton and electing Trump. That is certain. In fact, FBI Director Comey and NSA Director Rogers expressed curiosity at the fact that they had been so “loud” in their cyber attacks and disinformation campaign. Their characterization indicates that the US has very hard and indisputable evidence of their tampering.

The question today is whether any of the Trump campaign actively or passively participated in the Russian intelligence operation against Clinton. Comey was quite clear that the current investigation has to do with that issue. The fact that he used the term “coordination” would seem to indicate that the investigation is focused on information sharing and timing of political actions between the Russians and the Trump campaign. It may not be some grand conspiracy but the willingness to accept and utilize the fruits of the illegal Russian activities. A simple common criminal analogy would be trafficking in stolen property.

Many, including Royal, want you to believe that the Russians couldn’t have tampered or altered the outcome of our election if they didn’t actually hack the ballot boxes and electronic vote tallies. What nonsense! The Russian disinformation and cyber attack only had to influence less than 1% of the voters in three key swing states to steal the election from Clinton and install Trump in the Whitehouse.

Kudos to McCain, Rubio and Graham who spoke out forcibly before the election and after about the Russian attack on our sovereignty. As Rubio said, Republicans should be outraged and remember that it might be us the next time.


Posted by: Rich at March 21, 2017 4:42 PM
Comment #414541

Rich, would this be considered tampering?

“the United States seeks to:

Promote democracy as a means to achieve security, stability, and prosperity for the entire world;
Assist newly formed democracies in implementing democratic principles;
Assist democracy advocates around the world to establish vibrant democracies in their own countries; and
Identify and denounce regimes
that deny their citizens the right to choose their leaders in elections that are free, fair, and transparent.”

https://www.state.gov/j/drl/democ/

Posted by: Royal Flush at March 21, 2017 5:14 PM
Comment #414543

Are these cyber attacks and the disinformation campaign still about Podesta falling for a phishing scam, somebody using his password to get into the private DNC server, and then releasing some DNC emails?

Posted by: kctim at March 21, 2017 5:21 PM
Comment #414547

Royal,

In a word, NO. It doesn’t say that the US should engage in illegal activities to accomplish that goal. It also doesn’t say that the US should engage in illegal activities to favor one candidate over another in a clearly democratic election in another country.

Posted by: Rich at March 21, 2017 7:14 PM
Comment #414548

Rich, we did that in Iran and they are still trying to kill us because of it.

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 21, 2017 10:19 PM
Comment #414552

So you twisted my words into “The CEO of Exxon dealing in oil…illegal and suspect?”! Not the CEO of Exxon the Secretary of State Royal. The deal I speak of is the stalled Exxon oil deal due to sanctions against Russia, at least until Trump was elected. And you call me a clown, tsk tsk.

Posted by: j2t2 at March 22, 2017 10:03 AM
Comment #414558

“It doesn’t say that the US should engage in illegal activities to accomplish that goal.”

What do you think the word “assist” means Rich? Are you asking us to believe that the State Department requests permission to meddle in the elections and affairs of other nations? Naive?

Our Buddy j2t2 writes; “The deal I speak of is the stalled Exxon oil deal due to sanctions against Russia…”

OK, how is the SoS involved in that deal?

Posted by: Royal Flush at March 22, 2017 1:47 PM
Comment #414570

Weary and Royal,

What’s your point? That we shouldn’t be upset about Russian illegal efforts to effect the US election because we have done so in the past? Putting aside the moral equivalency issues, are you not simply concerned about the bald attack by Russia on our sovereignty? The attempt by Russia to shape our governance?

Your point Weary about the long term impact of the CIA assisted coup in 1953 which overthrew the democratically elected government of Iran and re-installed the Shah is well taken. I can add the coup in Syria (1949), assassination of Diem in Vietnam, Allende in Chile, Contras in Nicaragua, Hussein in Iraq, etc. While, in each instance, the US gained some short term benefit, they all ended badly in the long term.

Forceful and illegal regime change has long been a tempting short cut foreign policy. The US has admittedly bitten on the poisoned apple all too often. That doesn’t make it right morally, legally or even pragmatically. It always seems to end badly in the long run.

In 2009, Obama made a series of addresses overseas in which he admitted past transgressions by the US. They were widely criticized by the right and characterized by the right as an apology tour although there was never an apology.

How strange to now find the right defending Putin’s actions as something that we do also. We all do it, so what the hell is the big deal!

Well, to me, it is a big deal when done outside the parameters of international law. It should be condemned regardless of who is doing it.

Posted by: Rich at March 22, 2017 3:47 PM
Comment #414574

“What’s your point? That we shouldn’t be upset about Russian illegal efforts to effect the US election because we have done so in the past?”

Thanks for asking Rich, but first, I believe that there are no “legal” efforts available to countries to affect US elections.

Yes, all Americans should be upset if any country attempts to influence our elections. Any discovered attempt should not become political fodder for one party to bash another party.

Interference with our elections is offensive to us all. I include in the term “interference”, those who vote illegally. Proper authorities should investigate in private and when facts are found, should be reported to appropriate authorities.

There need not be any speculation or innuendo involved. The media need not be involved.

We don’t need, and should abhor, the daily political screeching and posturing by both parties that is happening. It does not help. It hurts us all. It negatively affects any investigation.


Posted by: Royal Flush at March 22, 2017 4:13 PM
Comment #414575

Good! Let’s have an independent investigation.

Posted by: Rich at March 22, 2017 9:59 PM
Comment #414577
Let’s have an independent investigation.

This morning, Devin Nunes did something very strange. He held a press conference and leaked classified information to the public. Meanwhile, he has compromised the integrity of the House Intelligence Committee’s investigation with his promise to share yet more confidential information with Speaker Ryan and the White House before telling Adam Schiff or even the FBI.

John McCain believes only an independent comission or select committee is fit for the task of investigating Trump’s collusion with Russia.

I agree.

Posted by: Warren Porter at March 22, 2017 11:37 PM
Comment #414586
Our Buddy j2t2 writes; “The deal I speak of is the stalled Exxon oil deal due to sanctions against Russia…”

OK, how is the SoS involved in that deal?

https://thinkprogress.org/putin-helped-trump-exxon-oil-deal-sanctions-6f169c4a4cd0#.wkvc2kirb

So much for draining the swamp. How come none of the CPM (conservative propaganda media) ever follows the money?

I remember our conservative friends here on WB telling us that, when it came to Clinton, where there was smoke there was fire. Yet they defend Trumps smoke with foolishness like “well we did it too” and “Why is the FBI interested in anyone’s legal business dealings? “Crony capitalism” illegal?” and call others political hypocrites!!!

Posted by: j2t2 at March 23, 2017 12:08 PM
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