Third Party & Independents Archives

Will It All Come Apart?

Post-debate, Trump’s poll numbers are up. Barring a major blow up, Trump is on a roll to win the thing. Fer shure the establishment is hard at work to lay some land mines for him.

Likewise for Bernie, if he continues to win h-u-g-e going forward. We'll be into county chad and flipping coins in short order, IMO.

Trump says he will give up expletives which will likely help his numbers. And, as more of Hillary's emails surface, Bernie will likely get a rise as well.

Six weeks ago neither candidate was given a snowballs chance in hell of getting the nod. Something going on and it is h-u-g-e, IMO.

Both parties have fewer members these days. Indies are approaching half of the electorate. Bob Schieffer recently stated that the parties may break up.

Looking like the time is right for a new 3rd party w/a/dif/pol/att and so on - - -

How did it come to this? Both parties are beholden to various sources of special interest money. The dems primarily cater to unions, finance, and big pharmas. The reps are tended by big energy and big business in general. In brief, big money has the pols by the short hairs. On social issues party extremists make sure there is no room for compromise on any issue.

After 30 years of globalisation and job losses, 30 years of pushing amnesty and open borders as a way to lower worker wages, years of fighting over social issues, gun control, etc, the silent majority has finally, finally stood up, IMO.

Could have been different. Instead of globalisation we could have had a policy of sending NGO's and similar to foreign countries to work with them on developing their resources, including manufacturing, agribusiness and so on - - -

Instead of open borders, the NAU and rampant smuggling operations, we could have built a wall, adopted E=verify and green card rules, enforced visa entry rules and so on - - -

Instead of lying to the folks on all the above, pols and media could have been truthful with the folks. When trust is impaired/destroyed it ain't easy to get back on track. But, it worked for the corpocracy as they have won it all, 1% owning 40%, etc.

US pols should serve long prison sentences, IMO, for the crap that's gone on on the Southern border the last 50 years. Couple of hundred thousand murdered over the last decade alone, right on our back door step.

Chickens finally coming home to roost. $20T debt, 8 year recession and here we go again, every household owes $50k toward national debt, basically no growth for 10 years running, piss poor leadership as in no WMD, 2 wars on a credit card, 'being more flexible' with Putin, bailing out of the ME leading to disaster, millions displaced with no where to go, Benghazi lies and on and on and on - - -

Well, when Trump or Bernie win the Presidency the corpocracy will still be there. Neither man could move the peg a notch, IMO.

Nope, it will take a new 3rd party w/a/dif/pol /att. A party designed at founding to shunt special interest money to ground and implement real CFR.

Otherwise, we have the corpocracy we deserve.

Posted by Roy Ellis at February 14, 2016 10:44 PM
Comments
Comment #402591

Roy,
HRC’s last batch of e-mails will be out 2/29. I don’t see Sanders lasting much past March. He has run an outstanding campaign, but there are too many primaries coming too quickly for his style of campaigning to succeed. The states are too big for rallies to generate lots of enthusiasm. The internet is effective for fundraising among the young, but once momentum is lost- possibly as early as the primary in SC 2/27- it will hard for Sanders to find his mojo.

Trump has a much better chance of succeeding. I watched the entire debate this past weekend, and it was really something to see. Accusations of lying flew back and forth. As of today, Trump polls 37% in SC, and his nearest competitor, Cruz, is at just 20%. That is even after the debate!

It really was a remarkable thing. Trump is the leading contender for the GOP nomination, and he stood there at the Republican debate and called Iraq “a big fat mistake,” insisted George W Bush “did not keep us safe,” and accused the Bush administration of lying about WMD’s.

That’s just for starters.

He is personally staging an intervention for conservatism. The talking points from the George W Bush administration and Rove no longer work. The delusions have been tossed aside, and some conservatives are shocked to see what everyone else knew all along. George W Bush was a terrible president, Iraq was “a big fat mistake,” and that administration lied to get us to go to war. And perhaps most shocking of all, 9/11 happened on Bush’s watch. Simply put, he did not “keep us safe.”

I’m not sure why this should be such a shock. Most people realized this a long time ago. That understanding now apparently includes a substantial portion of the Republican base.

Posted by: phx8 at February 15, 2016 6:34 PM
Comment #402593

ph, it seems the so-called ‘silent majority’ is starting to rise up. Understandable, after so many years of poor leadership and corrupt corpocracy.

Carrier Air Conditioner is heading to Monterrey, Mexico. So is Nabisco, Ford, and some others. I don’t know that the President has protested.

Trump says he will take it out of their hides for moving overseas. Maybe yes, maybe no.

Well, a President can’t manage real reform by himself. President Obama is a very good exemplar there.

Still, I would like to see a ‘big man’ willing to poke a stick in the eye of corpocracy.

But, for real reform, it’s going to take a new 3rd party w/a/dif/pol/att and so on - - -

Folks were expecting the last batches of emails to be the ‘hot skinny’ but, alas, just ‘bum scoop’. Still, I can’t see Hillary becoming President if she can’t obtain a security clearance.

Otherwise - - -

Posted by: roy ellis at February 15, 2016 8:31 PM
Comment #402597

Roy,
It is two very different groups rising to support Sanders and Trump. Sanders is primarily appealing to Millenials. He stresses economic issues, economic inequality, college debt, and health care. Trump stresses issues of civic inequality. Much of his appeal is to whites with high school educations who feel their opportunity has been taken away by illegal immigrants, among other things.

I do think Trump is on the right track by talking about Carrier moving to Monterrey, Mexico. That is pure gold for any American politician. Why would anyone go along with this? A profitable company with a CEO receiving big paychecks is moving to Mexico in order to become even more profitable, while laying off 2100 Americans! What the heck!

One thing both Trump and Sanders are doing is successfully appealing to real issues, ones that affect the silent majority. These are problems that affect a lot of us every day. No one cares about lowering tax rates for the rich, or repealing the estate tax, which only applies to multi-millionaires, or ISIS, which plays upon fears but has virtually nothing to do with everyday life. No one cares about whether Christians are being persecuted in this country because it simply is not happening.

People DO care about college debt, health care, and keeping their jobs.

For all her corporate ties, I think HRC might get it and make the necessary adjustment. The GOP field, other than Kasich, seems absolutely clueless, and there is a good chance Kasich will be forced to drop out soon.

Posted by: phx8 at February 15, 2016 11:28 PM
Comment #402613

Meanwhile, Trump is creaming the rest of the field in SC. According to the latest poll, which factors in the debate Saturday, Trump has 37%, Cruz & Rubio 18%, Kasich 10%, Bush and Carson 7%. It really is amazing. Trump staged a one-man intervention for conservatism on that debate stage. He made it clear Bush did not keep us safe because 9/11 happened on his watch, the War in Iraq was “a big fat mistake,” and Bush lied about WMD’s. The crowd booed, and Trump insisted that was because it was stacked with wealthy Jeb people.

The polls suggest Trump is right. He now says the RNC is not treating him fairly because they stacked that debate crowd, and he floated the idea of running independently again because the RNC violated their agreement. An independent run could easily happen. Cruz and Jeb could stay in the race a long time, thanks to backing from the richest of the rich. That could split up the delegates enough to throw the convention to a nominee by establishment Republicans. As for the other candidates, Kasich does not have the resources to last much longer, and neither does Carson.

Rubio might- or might not- last. Rumors about a mistress could tank him. That would be ironic, considering the presence of Trump. The story obviously does not come from the Trump camp. Jeb is more than capable, but despite his family’s reputation for dirty politics, he isn’t doing much of that. Guess that can be attributed to the absence of Rove. Then again, he isn’t doing much of anything. His brother showed up, and the GOP establishment dutifully praised W and speculated about how he would give Jeb a boost- but oh, they wondered, how much of a boost? The answer? None. Nobody likes him. It’s not the kind of dislike people have for Cruz. It’s more just wishing he would stay away.

Cruz, however, is a very dirty campaigner, and a good suspect for the rumor about Rubio. Trump and Rubio have already openly called Cruz a liar- another remarkable result of that Saturday debate. It’s not everyday you see the leading candidate for president in the GOP field call an opponent and sitting Senator the most dishonest person, and the biggest liar he has ever met.

Here is Cruz talking about Trump:

“And if Donald Trump becomes president, the Second Amendment will be written out of the Constitution because it is abundantly clear that Donald Trump is not a conservative.”

Huh? Cruz isn’t even trying to tell decent lies anymore. Tsk, tsk, Ted. You can do better than that.

Posted by: phx8 at February 16, 2016 1:28 PM
Comment #402634

Trump would not nominate a conservative to the court, he would nominate a wishy-washy so-called moderate who could probably care less about the original intent of the 2nd Amendment.

If on the extremely remote chance that Trump becomes President, our 2nd Amendment rights will be reduced to nothing more than a privilege.

Posted by: kctim at February 16, 2016 4:23 PM
Comment #402653

kctim,
I have no idea who Trump would put on the court, you do not know, and Cruz does not either. Personally, I can’t even guess. Trump might nominate Anita Hill just to piss of Clarence Thomas. He might nominate Judge Moore from Alabama. No one knows. I’m not sure Trump knows.

The current interpretation of the 2nd amendment is a relatively recent one. In the past, possession of a firearm was linked to service in a militia. This was thrown out in District of Columbia v Heller. It can easily revert to a different interpretation again. A “well-armed militia” has not been involved in the defense of a state for the past century.

Posted by: phx8 at February 16, 2016 6:16 PM
Comment #402656


It’s certainly clear at this point that the folks have two choices for the next Pres. One is that we could choose an establishment candidate and two, that we could choose a so-called outsider candidate.

My personal support would be for Trump first and for Bernie second.

px, your are right in that the GOP base has looked askance at any weaknesses their reps have exhibited. The base supporters for both the dems and reps have squelched any criticism of their elected officials.

That leaves the Indies and Mr. Trump to bring these to the forefront in the debates and going forward.

As Trump acknowledges, the Southern border is still wide open to people and contraband. The Northern border is too, but, the folks believe the Canadians will work with us to keep a lid on up there. Meanwhile, the Mexican gov’t is waving them on, like ‘hurry up so you don’t get caught;, etc.

Trump just got kicked up another notch what with the President suggesting he wouldn’t make a good President. Jimmy Carter and Herbert Walker are serving as exemplars in how to act as an Ex=president, IMO.

kctim, you state that a moderate court justice would kill the 2nd. Cognizant that over 200 years the Constitution has been amended 15 times. If one browses the 10 bill of rights plus the 15 amendments it is very clear that 99% serve to increase/improve rights. No court in the land will ever take on any one of the first ten amendments (bill of rights).

Currently, there are five SC’s proclaiming to be catholic, three proclaiming to be jewish and, no evangelicals. Should the President to put forth a ‘moderate’ mulism there will be pushback fer shure.

Otherwise - - -

Posted by: roy ellis at February 16, 2016 7:28 PM
Comment #402670

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Posted by: jameslee at February 17, 2016 1:43 AM
Comment #402673

Phx8, of course we don’t know what any of the candidates will do once elected. But, what we do know is that Trump is not a Conservative and that makes it less likely he would nominate a Conservative to the court.

IMO, Trump would be nothing more than Bill Clinton 2.0

Posted by: kctim at February 17, 2016 10:45 AM
Comment #402674

Roy, liberals don’t have the support to amend the Constitution, that is why they use activist courts to reinterpret in their favor.

They don’t need to ‘take on the Bill of Rights,’ Roy, they just reinterpret it’s meaning to forward their agenda.

Posted by: kctim at February 17, 2016 11:15 AM
Comment #402692

kctim, aware that the House and Senate are controlled by repubs and that Trump is way likely to win the Executive, I don’t see a Trump nomination to the SC as harmful. Whomever Trump nominates he/she has to go thru the establishment/corpocracy. Should Trump nominate a liberal there would be a h-u-g-e effort to impeach him.

Astounding that Trump is at 45% in Nevada. Better get ready to ring in the next Pres kc.

And, why haven’t the repub’s axed Obamacare/ACA? Corpocracy.

Otherwise - - -

Posted by: roy ellis at February 17, 2016 4:27 PM
Comment #402699

kctim,
Trump is certainly not a moderate. Although he is not an ideologue, he generally fits into the conservative mold and goes along with the Republican party platform. Some people question his sincerity and the fact that he has changed a lot of his views over the years. Fair enough. But today he still checks most of the boxes. Trump has always been a businessman, so a lot of his views come through that filter.

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