Third Party & Independents Archives

The Big Black Hole Created By Pandering Progressive Hypocrisy


New Mexico Gov. Susana Martinez Loses Her Hair Stylist Over Gay Marriage Opposition

Here’s a case of a business person refusing a customer based on his beliefs. But if the shoe is on the other foot, and a business person refuses to serve a leftist, the business owner ends up in court.

Antonio Darden, a gay hair stylist, is having a snit fit and refusing to serve Governor Susana Martinez of New Mexico because of what the Governor thinks. Praise and adoration is being heaped onto the gay hair stylist for his stance, a political stunt to be sure. The left is holding this guy up as a staunch defender of his right to choose.

However, on the other side of the coin, A gay couple goes into a bakery and demands a wedding cake depicting a gay couple's... whatever. The baker refuses to bake the cake, or he doesn't carry gay cake decorations, or hasn't the time to fool with stuff like that, and he ends up in court. He's being sued for not serving a gay couple because of what he thinks. He ends up the scourge of the nation. He ends up a homophobe and a bigot. He ends up unemployed.

I realize hypocrisy is a way of life for the left. They have no problem with having double standards to further their demands on society. That is why Mr. Darden's tantrum is front and center, a banner for the faux injustices that perpetuate the Democratic party's existence.

Here is where the dilemma for the pandering progressives comes into play. Here is where the hypocrisy of the Democratics rears it's ugly head.

Judge Orders Colorado Cake Maker To Serve Gay Couples

When will the judges tell Mr. Darden he must cut the governor's hair or face fines? When will Mr. Darden be considered a hetrophobe and a bigot? When will Mr. Darden loose his job and his business?

He won't, will he? No, the blatant, obvious, double standard of the pandering left is front and center, parading out in broad daylight for all to see, yet hidden behind the savage discrimination, the relentless persecution, and the vicious slander perpetrated by the pandering progressive left.

Governor Martinez will simply go to another stylist. She may even go to another gay stylist who hasn't a political ax to grind, because Governor Martinez isn't a bigot or a homophobe. This is something Charlie Craig and David Mullins could do as well but didn't. Charlie Craig and David Mullins thought they can use the government to force their beliefs onto others, because Charlie Craig and David Mullins believe they can get away with being hetrophobes and bigots with the blessings of the pandering progressive left.


Posted by Weary_Willie at March 4, 2014 1:00 AM
Comments
Comment #377065

“…hypocrisy is a way of life for the left”

That pretty much says it all, Weary.

Their blatant hypocrisy is a direct result of their selfish desire to social engineer their version of ‘utopia.’ Where any and all disagreement with liberal/progressive belief and policy is declared hate. Where support of our founders makes one a radical and worshipping the ways of other countries makes one a patriot.

The worst part of their hypocrisy is that it only further divides us.

Posted by: kctim at March 4, 2014 10:11 AM
Comment #377067

I wish more people would start drawing correlations between how we are being divided by the Democratics and how this nation was divided by the Democratics before the Civil War.

To think we couldn’t have another civil war is just naive. Many assume the lack of a strong federal government caused the turmoil that lead to the Civil War. One could also say the states of the 1850’s under a weak federal government are synonymous with today’s groups created under a strong national Democratic party. The difference would be neighbor against neighbor throughout the country instead of state against state with battle lines drawn.

The only way to stop this is to quit giving money to the federal government and national parties. It’s like throwing money into a big black hole. More like taking the money out of our pocket and letting go of it as we’re falling into a big black hole. It does nothing to lessen the impact when we eventually hit bottom.


Posted by: Weary Willie at March 4, 2014 12:36 PM
Comment #377077

WW, you may be overlooking the Corpocracy’s part in all this. The corpocracy drives the federal gov’t, thus federal laws. Laws that overrule the states, no room for laboratories here. They demand the states follow all social laws, demand 100% efficiency in the movement of goods in and around the US.

Dare to be different and the business community, a la corpocracy will take you down. If I were you WW, I wouldn’t let my hair grow too long, or too short, and so on - - -

Otherwise - - -

Posted by: roy ellis at March 4, 2014 3:44 PM
Comment #377089

It’s about progressives winning elections. This is about the left bullying the majority to keep them off balance. The left needs a bad guy because they have nothing the majority wants.

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 4, 2014 10:32 PM
Comment #377097

An opportunity to start a reasoned debate, wasted. To use your own language:

“The rights blatant hypocrisy is a direct result of their selfish desire to engineer their version of ‘utopia.’ Where any and all disagreement with conservative belief and policy is declared hate. Where failure to believe in Jesus as the one true god makes one a Jihadist and only blind obedience to News Corp and our Republican leaders makes one a patriot.”

Posted by: Dave at March 5, 2014 9:48 AM
Comment #377099

Dave, that was me, not Weary who said that. You are still free to start a non-factual “reasoned debate” if you so desire.

You see Dave, I actually agree that Republicans and Conservatives also have their own problems on this, they just aren’t as dishonest and hypocritical as the left. They also stick way closer to the Constitution than the left.

Limited government and individual rights are our founders version of ‘utopia.’ Not giving people the material things they desire is not engineering anything.

Everything else you mention are nothing but liberal talking points created by taking an extreme and applying it to the majority.
Where I can prove almost all liberals/progressives support the things I say, you must rely on self created stereotypes to prove yours.

Posted by: kctim at March 5, 2014 11:02 AM
Comment #377108

It is a shame about the cake-maker, he or she, should have the unalienable rights to refuse service to anyone, he and/or she feels indifferent towards. This will undoubtedly go back in before a judge and hopefully get dismissed. Let’s hope.

It is a business after all, it could cost clients or make some, strangely.

Posted by: simpleheaded at March 5, 2014 4:24 PM
Comment #377109

I have wondered about this for some time…

Perhaps someone could explain the thinking for me? As a supporter of gay marriage and being a member of the only party that has always supported gay marriage, I still don’t see the issue with violating the rights of people to freely associate by forcing them to do something they don’t want to do…

An example. The same cake maker is asked to make a cake for a KKK wedding. The cake should be made with white icing and hoods, with some candles done in the style of crosses burning. The cake maker refuses to make the cake for them.

How is this different than if they decide not to do a cake for a gay wedding? If they ask for a cake and were denied the cake because they were gay, I would have a problem with that, but we are talking about an activity, not just because of the color or sexual orientation of the individual asking for the service, right?

Again, I would probably not want to buy a cake from someone who did make the KKK cake or who didn’t make the gay wedding cake, but that would be my choice, not something dictated by law…

Can anyone help me out here and explain the thinking?

Posted by: Rhinehold at March 5, 2014 4:38 PM
Comment #377113

Not sure if this helps but my son’s friend who is admittedly gay and has been since I met him many years ago had a posting regarding gay marriage. He said something like I can hardly wait until my gay marriage is official, it will go perfectly with my gay car and the gay lunch that I had today. Also fits nicely with all of the gay appliances he has in his house, not to mention the gay furniture and all the other gay things that he has. This was done tongue in cheek as his last comment was I will never have a gay marriage, I will however someday have a marriage. In your example would it be referred to as a KKK marriage, I think not. It would be called a marriage. Once we can get past stereotyping people we can address the legalities of denying them service when we feel as though we want to, if need be. That probably won’t satisfy your question, they never can be satisfied but perhaps you might consider what referring to another individuals marriage as a gay marriage really means.

Posted by: Speak4all at March 5, 2014 5:41 PM
Comment #377114

Speak,

I share your concern and have expressed it in the past. I extend it to all topics though… It is why I do not put my race or sex on any government document if I can, choosing rather to use the ‘other’ box to select ‘human’. I don’t believe that we can as a country be ‘colorblind’ until we stop mentioning it in any way in our governmental documents.

(I also reject the ignorant notion that opposition to Obama’s policies are ‘racist’ for the same reasons.)

It’s the same with ‘mixed race’ marriages, which the opponents of gay marriages seem to have forgotten about.

The instance I mention would be a ‘KKK Wedding’ because it is about the wedding that the issue is about, just as it would be a ‘Gay Wedding’ by those who ignorantly want to object to that.

But no, as you say, it doesn’t address the question. Perhaps you could tell me your opinion on that, is it ok in your opinion for the cake maker to reject making a cake for a KKK Wedding? Or a Nazi Wedding? Should they be allowed to deny making a cake for someone based on their political thoughts?

Posted by: Rhinehold at March 5, 2014 5:49 PM
Comment #377116

I’ll make this short for brevity’s sake. No. No. No. But like you I would not go to that bakery for anything.

Posted by: Speak4all at March 5, 2014 5:53 PM
Comment #377119

Speak, I just want to be clear, I’m seriously not trying to be obtuse…

When you say ‘No’, do you mean that no, they shouldn’t be allowed to deny making the cake? Or No, they shouldn’t be prevented from denying making the cake? I suspect a few double-negatives being an issue here… :)

I agree with choosing to avoid businesses that do things like this… I won’t buy anything from Hobby Lobby or Chick-Fil-A for obvious reasons, I most likely would avoid this bakery, and I think this is the way these things should be handled. But I also can agree with their right to decide to make the cake or not…

Posted by: Rhinehold at March 5, 2014 6:19 PM
Comment #377122

Could the baker reject a customer who wants a Democratic Party cake? What if the baker is a Republican and doesn’t want to make a cake for the Democratic Party? Or vice verca?

What about the Boy Scouts? Does the baker have to bake a cake for the Boy Scouts? What if he doesn’t want to support the Boy Scouts, but some gay person said he isn’t baking the cake because the Boy Scouts take gay people now?

What about just the insinuation of prejuduce? Can someone now get even with someone by just making the accusation?

Once you get the government to support a cause with the legal system you open up a big black hole that can suck in all the unintended consequences?

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 5, 2014 6:53 PM
Comment #377124

FYI, the bakers in Oregon who refused to provide a gay couple with a wedding cake went out of business.
Discrimination is never acceptable, regardless of whether it is based on race, gender, or sexual orientation.
When people denounce the haters and those who practice discrimination and exclusion based on appearance or gender or sexual orientation, that does not constitute discrimination.

It was not that long ago that conservatives ran a presidential campaign based on ‘God, guns, and gays.’ To the credit of Americans, we are changing fast. The GOP party platform continues to officially forbid gay marriage. Leaders of conservatism routinely denounce ‘the gay agenda.’ The voters will settle that one, and it will not turn out the same way as in 2004.

Speak,
Good comment earlier in the thread. Like I said, we are getting better as a society, and we are getting better at fulfilling the ideals of the Constitution, but we still have a ways to go.

Posted by: phx8 at March 5, 2014 7:52 PM
Comment #377127

They didn’t go out of business. They moved the business to their home. It was completely voluntary. Don’t make it sound like they went out of business because they were bigots and couldn’t keep customers.

I’m not sure what ideals you are talking about, phx8. The constitution states we should be equal under the law. It doesn’t say we should all be divided into groups and used as pawns to further someone’s political agenda.


Posted by: Weary Willie at March 5, 2014 8:26 PM
Comment #377131

They went out of business because they were bigots. Period. And good riddance.

The only agenda that is being promoted is the constitutional rights of all Americans, as well as the agenda of “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.”

Posted by: phx8 at March 5, 2014 9:12 PM
Comment #377132
Discrimination is never acceptable, regardless of whether it is based on race, gender, or sexual orientation.

The refusal to bake a cake for a gay wedding was not about sexual orientation, it was about the actions they were performing. They had no policy about not making cakes for homosexual people and routinely did. Just not for gay weddings. There is a difference here, phx8, that you seem to want to skirt around and ignore.

If a person making and selling signs was Jewish and some German people came in and asked for a sign for a “German Pride” or “Oktoberfest” celebration, do you think they should be able to turn them down? What if the Jewish person was the child of a holocaust survivor? Would you allow that then?

Where is that line drawn between the right of free association and the right not to be discriminated against? I personally see both sides of the issue, phx8 apparently is an absolutist (something he often tries to label me as, btw).

BTW, I noticed, phx8, that you avoided the question I raised before… Interesting.

FYI, the bakers in Oregon who refused to provide a gay couple with a wedding cake went out of business.

So… why would we want the courts to make them bake the cake then, seems to me that the market worked, as it should and would in these cases. I guess I’m confused as to your point here, you seem to be saying that the free market took care of it, yet you also seem to be saying that there should be a law bypassing the free market… Can you explain your thinking here please?

Posted by: Rhinehold at March 5, 2014 10:17 PM
Comment #377133
The only agenda that is being promoted is the constitutional rights of all Americans, as well as the agenda of “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.”

And the right to freely associate? Where does that all into play?

Posted by: Rhinehold at March 5, 2014 10:18 PM
Comment #377135

BTW, congratulations Illinois.

http://thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/marriage-is-now-legal-throughout-the-state-of-illinois2/marriage/2014/03/05/84062

Illinois couples can now marry anywhere in the state.

Although the Illinois’ Religious Freedom and Marriage Fairness Act granting marriage equality was not due to go into effect until June first, Governor Pat Quinn has decided couples should not have to wait.

Posted by: Rhinehold at March 5, 2014 10:21 PM
Comment #377147

Rhinehold
Brevity is not your middle name, we all know that. Please apply my 3 no’s as a literal translation to the questions you asked individually, no double negatives used none meant. I will only contend that I have no doubt that my son’s friend will attain his marriage. He is determined. I will support any legislation that brings about marriage equality. I intend to not refer to two people of the same sex being married as a gay marriage and I hope other people will eventually do the same. I will encourage my son’s friend to use everything he can to attain his goal. I have told my wife that I will now start referring to our wedded bliss as our UnGay Marriage (her first reaction was pretty good). Or maybe our heterosexual marriage. Of course she knows my sense of humor and got a laugh out of it, eventually.

Posted by: Speak4all at March 6, 2014 11:08 AM
Comment #377149

Speak,

I prefer accuracy and specificity over brevity, I hate for there to be misunderstandings in what is being discussed because I really despise getting things wrong, especially assuming someone said something when they meant something else. If that means I have to spend an extra minute writing, then to me it is worth it. I certainly don’t want to take something you say the wrong way and mis-attribute something to you, that’s not fair to you and it makes me uncomfortable.

I would also like to get your thinking behind your belief that the government should tell a cake maker that they have to make a cake for a KKK wedding or a family member of a holocaust survivor to make a sign for a Nazi Rally. To me it seems pretty clear that the government shouldn’t be allowed to do that, so I am obviously look at this differently than you. One of my goals is to try to understand, even if I disagree, how people come to their views. Sometimes I learn something, sometimes I can cause another to rethink their views, but in both cases I think the effort is worth it and should be the reason that we debate these things…

I get the feeling that you probably don’t want to go into it, but I would very much appreciate it if you would. I just want you to know that I am being very serious here, IMO it is that type of dialog that is more important than partisan sniping that usually passes as debate these days…

Posted by: Rhinehold at March 6, 2014 11:23 AM
Comment #377150

I don’t think you are being obtuse however I do still maintain that many of the questions you ask are meant to illicit the response you expect. In my case you have a difficult time pounding my round peg into the square hole that you have designated for me, I think. This will have to do as an answer for you. I respect that you want to understand me, I too would like to better understand the people who comment here but I do so with the tools and comments provided and do not request to much clarification. That’s just me and I do respect that you seem to need more. I guess I can only say that I don’t agree with people who think they can use their personal observations to enforce their beliefs on people that they come in contact with. Your KKK and Nazi analogies don’t fit that and I find it difficult to defend either position you might think I hold in that regard. Thanks for your support of marriage equality, it is admirable.

Posted by: Speak4all at March 6, 2014 11:49 AM
Comment #377151

Sorry meant to use “elicit” and not “illicit”.

Posted by: Speak4all at March 6, 2014 12:08 PM
Comment #377164

I’d like to get back to why this hair stylist is allowed to discriminate against his client when the baker can’t.

What makes the hair stylist different from the baker? Why can the hair stylist get away with it while the baker suffers legal fines and social repercussions?

And while I’m at it:

Another Fake ‘Hate Crime’: Transgender Student Admits Attack Was Hoax

In this article you will see many fake accusations that are used to acquire sympathy/votes/retribution.

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 6, 2014 6:16 PM
Comment #377179

“Why can the hair stylist get away with it while the baker suffers legal fines and social repercussions?”

For no other reason than the fact that one is gay and the other is a Christian.
That’s all there is to it, Weary.

Posted by: kctim at March 7, 2014 10:37 AM
Comment #377208

I just read about John Campbell and their Kickstarter diatribe… It’s … well, interesting.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/73258510/sad-pictures-for-children/posts

Basically, he shipped out the lower tiered of his supporters, and is now no longer shipping any more, thinking that the higher level supporters are affluent and can afford to lose the money he will be keeping and not returning to them.

He doesn’t think people should have money, or it should be definable in any way. He is looking for a group of people who will support him and another person so that they can live without having to work and worry about money anymore (how those people get money is seemingly not of consequence). This is how it should be, he says.

It’s about as far away from any sense of reality that I’ve seen in some time, though it kind of does sound a bit like the progressive agenda today. Except for the part where he is looking for willing suckers supporters instead of using the power of the state to provide them for him.

Posted by: Rhinehold at March 7, 2014 7:00 PM
Comment #377227

‘Completely Untrue, Scientifically’: Why a Transgender Woman Is Suing CrossFit


Where does it end?

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 8, 2014 10:36 AM
Comment #377232

willie,

This has happened before.

The author of your link failed to mention Renee Richards born Richard Raskind who sued the United States Tennis Association in 1976, and won the right to play in the US open as a woman in 1977.

Crossfit “assumes” a transgender might have an advantage.

But without allowing such to compete we will never know for sure.

Rocky

Posted by: Rocky Marks at March 9, 2014 9:51 AM
Comment #377233

I’ll bet there are rape victims that will disagree with you about the advantages a male has over a female in physical competition.

The Crossfit competition has established rules. Why should the government be allowed to invalidate those rules based on an individual’s choice? Should Crossfit simply ignore the results if transgender competitors are winning their competition overwhelmingly? Do you think Crossfit should allow the credibility of their competition be destroyed should this social experiment go awry? What purpose would it eventually serve?

Many people use the arguement “apples and oranges”. This is truly a case of apples and oranges. This is a position dislocated from reality. It cannot be compared to race. This guy chose to play the part of a woman. A person’s race is not a choice.

I asked when it will end, not when it started. I know when it started.

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 9, 2014 10:39 AM
Comment #377234

Transgender Man Who Gave Birth to Three Babies Unsuccessfully Begs for a Divorce in This Odd Legal Conundrum

He’s already divorced!

Beatie, who plans to appeal the ruling in his divorce case, was born a woman and later underwent a double-mastectomy and began testosterone hormone therapy to become a man, but retained female reproductive organs and gave birth to three children.


How much more divorced from reality can one get?!

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 9, 2014 10:54 AM
Comment #377235

willie,

“The Crossfit competition has established rules.”

So had the USTA, yet in 1976 the New York Supreme Court disagreed and ruled in Richards favor.

There is a legal precedent. The fact that you might find it repugnant is immaterial.

Rocky

Posted by: Rocky Marks at March 9, 2014 12:00 PM
Comment #377244

What I find repugnant is being ruled by a select few. What I find repubnant is the Supreme court pandering to political groups. What I find repugnant is a society so ignorant that it can believe the federal government can dictate minutia such as this.

Posted by: Weary Willie at March 9, 2014 3:50 PM
Comment #377245

willie,

This isn’t the federal government, this is the states. This was the New York Supreme court.

1976 was vastly different from 2014.

There was a Republican in the White House. Gay rights were merely a twinkle in far distant future. Hell, most gays were still in the closet.
Transgenders were rarely, if ever, heard about.
There was no such thing as Crossfit and would’t be for decades.

I think you’re making a big deal out of nothing.

Rocky

Posted by: Rocky Marks at March 9, 2014 4:17 PM
Comment #378124

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