Third Party & Independents Archives

Just in, Henry Paulson now wants to put American tax payers on the hook for non-American banks that are holding bad debt. Somehow that just doesn’t seem right to me. Why are we bailing out a foreign banks? Something stinks and it just isn’t my infant daughters butt.

A well thought out piece, David. I don’t always agree with you, especially on ‘border fences’, taxation, role of government, etc., but you’ve hit the nail on the head here.

PS…McPain has to be the biggest fraud foisted on America since Faux News (Fair and Balanced Reporting)…but, Faux can maybe make presidents, but it can’t be one. McPain may very well be one…oh, Gawd!!!

David, terrific article!

Dude, I couldn’t agree more. Our American goose is completely cooked if McCain wins. We’re no longer talking McSame, but clearly McWorse.

I like that, V V, McWorse. Well put. Good article David R R.

David

But, McCain is a sure path to failure for our nation.

Another well written article David. There imo is no doubt about another republican term being an absolute disaster on top of a current republican disaster. If the American people are indeed so blind as to not see what is glaringly obvious, well then I guess as d.a.n. would say, they will get the government they deserve. A government that will surely compound the stresses and failures of eight years of republican leadership.

VV

You might want to supersize that to a McMuchworse.

David -

Great article! There’s only one area in which we disagree, and that’s on McCain’s knowledge of military history.

He may know quite a bit of military history, but he obviously doesn’t UNDERSTAND it…the most glaring example of which is, after TWO wars in the region, his lack of understanding about the religious and cultural motives behind the various conflicts, especially the Shi’a/Sunni schism.

Most of us hold in very high regard the writings of Sun Tzu - and McCain violates three of Sun Tzu’s maxims: to know the enemy, to know oneself (one’s own strengths and weaknesses), and that the acme of generalship is to win without going to war.

I actually think that Clinton did well in this arena, and I base this on the domestic terrorism bombing in Oklahoma City back in ‘95. There’s a substantial amount of evidence (too many ‘coincidences’) that shows McVeigh and his cohort were indeed working with Islamic terrorist Ramzi Yousef (a prime example of ‘the enemy of my enemy is my friend’). This has been noted before and roundly ‘debunked’…but I honestly don’t buy the government’s story - it stinks like last week’s fish. I believe that Clinton chose to keep the focus on domestic militia groups and to allow the CIA and foreign intel agencies to concentrate on finding Ramzi Yousef and destroy his network.

If Clinton had instead acknowledged the link and followed the pattern that Bush II did six years later, we might have had to invade the Philippines to find Yousef…and this would have been every bit as great a disaster as Iraq is now.

So which pattern would McCain follow in the same circumstances? Peace with investigation and justice with minimal collateral damage? Or invasion?

I think we all know.

Glen

I think we all know.

From the same people that bought you “The wrath of Bush, Shock and Awe I” we will soon be bringing to a nation near you. “McCain’s Thunder, Shock and Awe II” the sequel.

McPain, McSame, McWorse, McMuchWorse, Faux News—the level of argument here is what I’d expect to hear on a playground during recess.

I actually think that Clinton did well in this arena, and I base this on the domestic terrorism bombing in Oklahoma City back in ‘95. There’s a substantial amount of evidence (too many ‘coincidences’) that shows McVeigh and his cohort were indeed working with Islamic terrorist Ramzi Yousef (a prime example of ‘the enemy of my enemy is my friend’). This has been noted before and roundly ‘debunked’…but I honestly don’t buy the government’s story - it stinks like last week’s fish.

That’s a nice little conspiracy theory there—this idea that American right-wing white-supremacists conspired with Islamic radicals. But what I really like is the way that you at once praise Clinton while saying that his government’s story “stinks like last week’s fish.”

So basically you’re saying the Clinton knew that someone had killed a large number of Americans on American soil but then covered it up so he wouldn’t have to do anything about it? And you consider that to be a wonderful quality in a Commander in Chief? Good grief. Even I give Clinton more credit than that, though I do think it’s a shame he didn’t take out Bin Laden when the guy was served up to him on silver platter— and Clinton lost his nerve after hearing the advise of his lawyers.

You can add this to the resume of McCain’s advisors:

Senator John McCain’s campaign manager was paid more than $30,000 a month for five years as president of an advocacy group set up by the mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to defend them against stricter regulations, current and former officials say.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/22/us/politics/22mccain.html?ref=us

McPain, McSame, McWorse, McMuchWorse, Faux News—the level of argument here is what I’d expect to hear on a playground during recess.

I guess you’ve somehow remained oblivious to the fact that the Left has learned the hard ‘n’ disgusting lessons brought to us by the Rovian Slime Machine? You see, the majority of us are now fully aware that we must frequently to bring our comments down to what can only be termed The Republican Level.
A level so mindlessly catch-phrase-y and moronically simple to understand that even the most mentally challenged and easily manipulated into voting against their own self-interests can get a firm handle on them — without even having to reach.
We’re talking stooping to the level of crap like “Straight Talk”, “Drill Baby, Drill!” or “Haaakey Maaam-Pyitbull-Lipstyick.”

Even I give Clinton more credit than that, though I do think it’s a shame he didn’t take out Bin Laden when the guy was served up to him on silver platter— and Clinton lost his nerve after hearing the advise of his lawyers.

Get real. You’re not giving anything to Clinton but more base Republican BS insults. The truth is, everybody knows that your chronically unwise and short-sighted failure of a political party was too busy trying to impeach Bill Clinton when he could have been focusing on something vitally important like taking out Bin Laden. But of course then your derelict party wouldn’t have had as easy of a time cobbling together the excuse they used to start their phony, unnecessary war in Iraq.

Max, thank you for that NY Times link. Fresh and further evidence of Rovian strategy, defend your vulnerabilities by projecting them on your opponent. McCain on the campaign trail points to Obama’s lobbyist ties in order to cover up his own in broad daylight.

But, this article you refer to is particularly damning against McCain because it puts McCain’s campaign members previously in the hip pocket of Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae even as McCain rails against their lobbyists whom McCain now employs on his campaign. [Fed. Law prohibits campaign employees from serving as lobbyists simultaneously, and at least that law has not been broken by the McCain camp.] But the ethics of the matter is a horse of a different color.

Of particular note is the following in the article where McCain acknowledges the ties and others denote the funding of Davis:

In an interview Sunday night with CNBC and The New York Times, Mr. McCain noted that Mr. Davis was no longer working on behalf of the mortgage giants. He said Mr. Davis “has had nothing to do with it since, and I’ll be glad to have his record examined by anybody who wants to look at it.”

Asked about the reports of Mr. Davis’s role, a spokesman for Mr. McCain said that during the time when Mr. Davis ran the Homeownership Alliance, the senator had backed legislation to increase oversight of the mortgage companies’ accounting and executive compensation. The legislation, however, did not seek to change their anomalous structure as private companies with federal support.

The spokesman, Tucker Bounds, also noted that the Homeownership Alliance included nonprofit organizations like Habitat for Humanity and the Urban League. “It’s not controversial to promote homeownership and minority homeownership,” Mr. Bounds said. More than a half-dozen current and former executives, however, said the Homeownership Alliance was set up mainly to defend Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac by promoting their role in the housing market, and the two companies paid almost the entire cost of the group’s operations.

The hypocrisy has no end. But the Rovian tactic of projecting McCain’s weaknesses and failures onto Obama in ads and campaign speeches has been largely effective in convincing voters McCain is the good guy and Obama the one with all the special interest ties, among Republicans and some independents/moderates.

Glenn, thanks. Of course military history is history; where McCain falls down is on current events. Just too much for him to absorb, both military history and current events, like who are the players in Iran in Iraq. That’s why he needed Joe Lieberman by his side to step and save him from his ignorance of current events at the microphone.

Marysdude, thanks.

It is good to know that though many of us disagree on somewhat lesser issues, we agree entirely on this most immediate and important decision coming up on Nov. 4.

timesend, Yes! That is incredibly disturbing. I am sure Paulson will defend the proposal arguing that as the international financial system goes, so goes our own. And there is merit to that argument, but that merit is a direct result of the debt Republicans have been taking on by foreign lenders these last 8 years. And now Paulson want’s to reward those lenders who have America’s balls in a vice.

Republicans have brought our nation to the point of having two choices on a number of issues, really bad, and worse. It is in times like these we need leaders with the vision to see past the short term expediency to the longer term future and keep our ship on course to a better day in the future where are choices are dramatically improved.

There is going to be enormous loss and sacrifice by Americans regardless of how we choose to resolve this crisis. But, if Democrats have any spine left at all in the face of an election, they will side America’s future and not with what will get them through midnight of Nov. 4.

I have my hopes and doubts on that prospect.

V V, thanks.

It is such a monumental failure of our two party political system that our nation is now faced with calamitous choices of bad and worse. America should never have been allowed to be cornered in this fashion. The question going forward is whether we will maintain this political system which has brought our nation to this point.

It is long past time for voters to dispense with voting by party, and begin voting for the candidate who inspires the greatest confidence in acting pragmatically and appropriately to our nation’s and our people’s needs going forward, providing them vastly better choices than we are now presented with.

RickIl, thanks.

You said: “If the American people are indeed so blind as to not see what is glaringly obvious,”

Given the Supreme Court’s ruling of late that their is no crime, or ethics violation in politicians lying to the public, it is hard to imagine just how the American public, lacking the education and experience in the complex affairs of state, are to acquire the truth and relevant information in any given election.

Even the Obama campaign is playing fast and loose with accuracy and fact in their campaign ads. Voters are not entirely to blame for being ignorant of the truth and relevant facts when all players demanding their attention are lying to them, deceiving them through omission, and spinning facts to say what the facts do not.

At the end of the day it does not matter. Every American citizen has the responsibility to stop a Muslim to be the President.

L.O. -

You think that’s impossible? How about looking up whether the Soviets sunk the USS Scorpion back in ‘69?

The government says what it says…but the evidence and testimony of officers and sailors on watch say otherwise. If the government had allowed it to be public knowledge that the Soviets had sunk one of our nuclear subs, how could we have avoided a thermonuclear exchange? Check it out, L.O. - you can find the testimonies online as easily as I can.

Sometimes, L.O., it’s better to look past what we are told, and look beyond the injustices to see the bigger picture. Sometimes justice, regardless of how richly deserved it may be, has a greater cost to society and to the world than simply letting it go.

And when it comes to OKC, try digging a bit for the evidence that connects McVeigh and Nichols with Ramzi Yousef and other terrorists. Do the research, check out BOTH sides of the story objectively, without any predisposition that one side or the other is right or wrong. I was sincerely surprised by what I found - I didn’t believe it at first, either. I don’t like conspiracy theories, but there’s too many coincidences to ignore.

Max, David R. The Times article pointed out that both McCain and Obama have received donations and advice from Fannie and Freddy people. If I am not mistaken, McCain voted to put stronger regulations on F & F while Obama voted against more regulation of F & F.

A quick trip to Fastcheck will make it perfectly clear that both candidates lie, distort facts and willingly mislead the American people in an effort to get themselves elected.

One could easily argue that Obama is more at fault for these kinds of actions because early and often in his campaign, he made no more lies and misrepresentations of facts to the American people, a hallmark of his campaign.

As usual, this election is about ideology rather than what is best for the American people. Unfortunately, the voters are conditioned to continue what is not in the best interest of their country. The American people as a whole are conditioned to accept whatever comes down from Washington. They might not like it, they may complain about it, but they are conditioned to do nothing about it.

The best solution for America would be to send Ralph Nader to Washington to confront these politicians, corporations, lobbyists and cronys.

It will not happen but, it is the best thing to do for this country.

timsend: If we don’t pay the foreign banks for the bad paper their holding, we won’t be able to borrow the money from them to pay for the bad paper. It is a tried and true method used by politicians and called Catch 22, with a healthy dose of rob Peter to pay Paul added for good measure.

With a budget deficit of nearly a half trillion dollars and this bailout on top of that, where looking at well over an additional trillion added to the national debt, this year alone.

When we talk about McCain, Obama and our other politicians, we should be talking about things like rails and tar and feathers. Instead, we are talking about reelecting them.

ada, what and idiotic and unAmerican statement. I am surprised you didn’t include Black American in that pearl of stupidity.

jlw:

If I am not mistaken, McCain voted to put stronger regulations on F & F

No, actually you are mistaken. While in 2005 McCain said this:

“For years I have been concerned about the regulatory structure that governs Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac…and the sheer magnitude of these companies and the role they play in the housing market…If Congress does not act, American taxpayers will continue to be exposed to the enormous risk that Fannie and Freddie pose to the housing market, the overall financial system, and the economy as a whole.”

That probably sounds pretty good now in retrospect, however, McCain did nothing more than give lip service with these comments. And in fact, he had previously been opposed to establishing an independent regulatory agency to regulate Fannie and Freddie. Back on July 1st, 1992, McCain was opposed to the Federal Housing Regulatory Reform Act which would have created an independent regulatory agency within the Department of Housing and Urban Development to oversee the activities of Fannie and Freddie. The Senate vote was #137 if you want to look it up.
McCain voted: No.
Joe Biden voted: Yes.

From the NYT link provided by Max:

Incensed by the advertisements, several current and former executives of the companies came forward to discuss the role that Rick Davis, Mr. McCain’s campaign manager and longtime adviser, played in helping Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac beat back regulatory challenges when he served as president of their advocacy group, the Homeownership Alliance, formed in the summer of 2000.

Davis is McCain’s TOP Advisor and was the PRESIDENT of this advocacy group.

Furthermore:

Mr. Davis did draw Mr. McCain to a 2004 awards banquet that the companies’ Homeownership Alliance held in a Senate office building. The organization printed a photograph of Mr. McCain at the event in its 2004 annual report, bolstering its clout and credibility.

McCain appeared at an awards banquet to bolster the “clout and credibility” of an advocacy group whose sole purpose was to “beat back regulatory challenges” to Fannie and Freddie.
As usual, McCain was paying public lip service to one thing (being concerned about the regulatory structure of F & F), while his actions show him and his closest associates to be supporting another stance entirely.