April 10, 2005
Witnessing a Double-Edged Sword
Tens of thousands of Iraqis gathered today in Baghdad to protest the American invasion of their nation. There has yet to have been such a blatant example of the double-edged sword of the war in Iraq.
Cutting one way is the new found freedoms of the Iraqi people. No matter how you slice it, no matter why we went into their nation, no one should deny that two years ago this kind of gathering would not have been possible. The toppling of the government brought a freedom from the tyranny of Saddam Hussein. It brought elections and government structure. It brought hope to many.
Cutting the other way is the chain of violent repression shackled onto the feet of every man, woman, and child of Iraq now living under the instability and aftermath of a war torn nation. Thousands died in the bombing campaigns. Thousands more have died in the ground war. Unknown numbers will die in the future. It is clear that while some in Iraq found hope, others found utter destruction and tragedy.
That is the double-edged sword. The Iraqi people took to the streets today to rise up against the very invasion that gave them the freedom of dissent. They rose up against the lingering occupation and American involvement that precedes further death and destruction. They know more than anyone that it cuts both ways.
Two years and three weeks after the invasion of Iraq, it is high time to ask ourselves the tough questions. Is the safety and finances of America worth taking the lives of so many people? Must we still destroy lives to save them? Is the price of freedom really worth that much?
Posted by Adam Ducker at April 10, 2005 02:06 PMAs long as they don’t institute a Draft, YES!!!
I don’t think you are asking the right questions here, buddy. The question is, are you willing to give up your SUV or pay gas at $6 a gallon? This is about the Standard of Living of every American!!! Don’t get me wrong. I feel bad about the Iraqi deaths and US GIs getting killed there but think on the positives!!! We just gave Iraqis the right to freely elect a US-Friendly Government and our Troops are spreading Freedom too.
I completely support our Troops. I personally put a “Support Our Troops” Sticker on my car myself!!! Their willingness to sacrifice themselves inspite of reduced benefits is the hallmark of the US of A. It is tragic that there is a shortage of recruits now but I am sure that with No Child Left Behind giving data to the Army Recruiters, we will soon have enough inner city kids to fill the slots!!!!!!
Posted by: Aldous at April 10, 2005 02:41 PM“We just gave Iraqis the right to freely elect a US-Friendly Government and our Troops are spreading Freedom too.”
Aldous,
You’re right “WE” gave it to them.
Only time will tell if freedom, not won, but given takes hold and spreads.
Posted by: Rocky at April 10, 2005 03:34 PMYup. What’s sad is that my sarcasm has too many accurate details.
Posted by: Aldous at April 10, 2005 05:06 PMYah… Those accurate details threw me for a sec :P
Posted by: Zeek at April 10, 2005 05:38 PMAdam:
In the big picture of things, I think these demonstrations are fantastic. If you stop and think about all Iraq has been through, 10,000 demonstators is far fewer than I would ever predict.
What is so fantastic is that there is a new birth of freedom in an area where people have been suppressed for so very long.
I just hope we will see some sort of democracy spread to Lebanon, and someday and independent democratic palestine.
Craig
Posted by: Craig Holmes at April 10, 2005 08:41 PMCraig,
This will all be very wonderfull if those that wish freedom in the Middle East, are also willing to earn it.
Rocky:
It took a lot of courage to vote in Iraq, and a lot of courage to demonstrate in Lebanon. I am very encouraged.
Craig
Posted by: Craig Holmes at April 10, 2005 10:57 PMAldous:
“What’s sad is that my sarcasm has too many accurate details.”
That’s my favorite part! ;^)
Posted by: Adrienne at April 10, 2005 11:53 PMFor those of you who don’t know, the recently elected President of Iraq, Talibani has a reputation in that area of being just like Saddam. So what has changed?
Posted by: Tapia at April 11, 2005 12:26 AM
Tapia:
For those of you who don’t know, the recently elected President of Iraq, Talibani has a reputation in that area of being just like Saddam. So what has changed?
The form of government. Saddam was a dictator and his word was law. Talibani serves as head of a democracy, and is accountable to the people, and a parliment. I think we should rejoice in this.
Craig
Craig,
It takes a lot less courage to vote for a democracy than it does to fight for one.
We apprecieate something more if we actually have to do something to aquire it.
Talibani… is accountable to the people, and a parliment.
Craig, let’s not get ahead of ourselves. There is no parliament and no new elections are scheduled - and there’s no constitution spelling out when elections would be held anyhow. Talibani isn’t accountable to anyone but the Kurds, his collegues in the new governing council, and the US military.
I’d have been cautiously optimistic had the Iraqi people voted Allawi’s moderate secular party. Instead, they kicked his ass and elected a bunch of Ayatollah Sistani’s Islamic fundamentalists from the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution in Iraq, dedicated to ruling Iraq under Sharia Law.
BTW, did anyone else get a sick feeling when they heard Sadr’s protesters referring to the US as the Great Satan? Where have I heard that before..?
American Pundit,
“BTW, did anyone else get a sick feeling when they heard Sadr’s protesters referring to the US as the Great Satan?”
Noooo… cuz when I hear the term “Great Satan” I get a warm tingly feeling…
Posted by: Zeek at April 11, 2005 05:41 PMThe Iraqi people took to the streets today to rise up against the very invasion that gave them the freedom of dissent
I think this means the Democratic party has set up shop in Iraq.
CH
Posted by: Craig Holmes at April 11, 2005 06:27 PMDemocracy is just not that easy to take root. Look at how long it took our country to get it right (Remember the Civil War?)Post-war Germany was a success because of careful planning (two years after a bonafide end to hostilities) and a population who welcomed the change and our presence. The planning in Iraq, after a so-called end to hostilities, was poor,we were never invited and are hardly welcome.
Posted by: Tapia at April 11, 2005 07:34 PMIn the big picture of things, I think these demonstrations are fantastic. If you stop and think about all Iraq has been through, 10,000 demonstators is far fewer than I would ever predict.
First of all, most observers are putting the size of the demonstration at closer to 300,000 protesters. And second, their demands were many: speedy justice for Saddam, an immediate withdrawal of occupation forces, and for their elected officials to immediately execute these demands the January elections supposedly gave them power to implement.
You cannot compare this supposed exercises in Democracy creation to the Civil War or Germany, because they never had the existence of ongoing violence and Insurgency threat as a major factor in the equation.
Posted by: Bert M. Caradine at April 11, 2005 08:42 PMAnd why did my comparison models not have ongoing violence or an insurgency threat? Because there was no uninvited occupying country. For democracy to take root and thrive, it must come from within the country, not imposed from without. I doubt the elected officials will be able to use the power they were supposedlygiven, and if that is the case, that kind of exercise in democracy is definitely not worth the lives and money spent.
Posted by: Tapia at April 11, 2005 11:09 PMCraig Wrote: What has changed? “The form of government. Saddam was a dictator and his word was law. Talibani serves as head of a democracy, and is accountable to the people, and a parliment. I think we should rejoice in this.”
First of all, Talibani is not ‘head’ of the new Iraqi government. Ibrahim Jaafari, the new Prime Minister will have the most power under the new form of government and the Presidential and Vice Presidential roles are largely ceremonial. Also a correction - it was not ten thousand protestors but ten(s) of thousands.
We can celebrate once Iraq is on a stable path toward reconstruction and peace. Right now there are too many uncertainties and complications within the government that needs a 3/4 majority to get things done.
Paul, excuse my laziness, but could you tell me who elects the Iraqi Prime Minister?
Posted by: Zeek at April 13, 2005 11:12 PMHaha! Good one Zeek. Nobody elects the PM. He’s chosen by parliament from among the elected ministers.
Posted by: American Pundit at April 14, 2005 09:06 AMAldous,
I sincerely hope you were being sarcastic with your remark: “Their willingness to sacrifice themselves inspite of reduced benefits is the hallmark of the US of A.” My 20-year-old son has been in the army for 19 months, and has yet to see the “early enlistment bonus” his recruiter promised him, in spite of already having served in Iraq last year. In addition, there is a very good likelihood he will be redeployed in June. Is that something you consider the hallmark of the US of A? I don’t know, maybe you’re right, betrayal and misleading does seem to be a major part of our history.
Nevertheless, since no one has seen fit to address the needs of our veterans (you remember, the ones who so willingly make sacrifices for the rest of us?), before we say another word about our own needs or wants, I think it would be a good idea to check out these stories at:
johnkerry.com/features/militaryfamilies. Please ignore the John Kerry reference. This is not about him—- he just happened to be the conduit, but I think reading these stories will put a lot into perspective.
With all the “Support our troops” stickers going up, how come no one was upset when Congress decided not to fund the VA the $1.8 billion it so desperately needs to support our existing and returning vets? Support is not about being a cheerleader. It’s about putting your money where your mouth is, and giving concrete support when our soldiers’ bodies (or worse) spirits have been broken. I have posted this question at several blogs on both sides of the political fence, and hardly anybody has taken the time to even think about it. It’s like there are so many who are only concerned about issues that affect them physically, financially or spirtually, and not the people who are making the real sacrifices. Where is America’s heart? I’m having trouble finding a pulse.
Posted by: Tapia at April 15, 2005 03:14 AMTapia, you should check out Gen. Wes Clark’s organization. I have a lot of respect for that guy and what he’s doing for our military.
Posted by: American Pundit at April 15, 2005 11:59 AMAP,
Thank you. That was very heartening to see.
“I have posted this question at several blogs on both sides of the political fence, and hardly anybody has taken the time to even think about it.”
Tapia
Nobody talks about it because BOTH sides are guilty. Until either side can use some information against the other, it will continue to be a non-issue.
Its not about the vets, its about politics.
kctim, that’s pretty cynical - and totally untrue. Democrats have introduced legislation to help with the issues Tapia brought up. Take a look.
