The Opposition Doesn't Care if a Wall Works

In just over 2 weeks we will see if Congress - under the aegis of a funded and therefore temporarily reopened government - was able to put together a deal on border security that President Trump would be willing to sign. This past weekend, Trump put the odds at 50-50.

He’s probably being optimistic.

Trump has unified two distinct groups of Democratic Members of Congress under the banner of no-to-whatever-Trump-wants. The hard-left progressives want what are basically open borders under the guise of diversity, human rights, and even environmental concerns. The slightly more centrist members (who tend to be older and remember their previous positions on border security even if they choose to ignore them) insist that an actual barrier of concrete or steel doesn't work and that high-tech solutions are the only possible answer, and of course, that there is no border crisis and illegal migrants (undocumented immigrants in their rhetoric) are coming across the southern border at much lower levels than in the early years of the century.

It's a marriage of convenience unencumbered by any worries over hypocrisy.

Because you either disagree with a border barrier/wall because it is "immoral" or because it doesn't work as well as drones and sensors. And not just drones. Nested comfortably within their border narrative is the fact that according to the opposition, you must also have border agents waiting with blankets, medicine and food for any illegals that cross the frontier. And ambulances to take them to local hospitals or newly built primary health clinics aimed at providing comfort and healthcare to the aliens. And a legal system that is tolerant and forgiving of any transgression of immigration law, and expansive as to what a qualifies as a refugee.

The point is that no one protesting Trump's wall really cares if alternative technologies work as well as a barrier in keeping the annual or monthly volume of illegal crossings down. They want a high-tech environment that sounds impressive, combined with a legal environment that is flexible and permissive, held together by a moral stance that condemns the application of America's immigration law as an outright evil.

The political result would therefore actively undermine whatever laws are on the books until Congress passes legislation that explicitly opens the border to almost anyone who dares cross it.

It is therefore highly unlikely that Congress can put together anything that Trump would sign. If he does, however, sign legislation that gives little to no money for a wall, then that would be a true cave-in. So far, The President has allowed a pause in the stand-off, a temporary truce. He has not caved as of yet, despite the headlines.

If Congress sends him a no-wall package by February 15th, then Trump will have to decide whether to resume the shutdown and declare a national emergency.

However, he might choose a different route: keep the government open with a longer-term spending bill that he signs but go ahead with the national emergency and find ways to use monies already allocated to what would probably be the Defense Department or DHS and use them to build the wall with the Army Corps of Engineers.

This would result in immediate legal challenges. They would not just seek to declare the use of emergency powers to build a wall unconstitutional. They would seek an immediate injunction from a compliant District Court judge (a not impossible outcome as the past 2 years have proven) to shut down any construction at all until the case wends its way to the Supreme Court. The arguments would revolve around the question of whether there was an immigration crisis in America and if so, whether it was a national emergency that threatened America sufficiently to invoke the use of emergency powers for President Trump (or any president of America).

And the question of whether a border wall actually works would be lost amidst the constitutional struggles and partisan stand-offs and policy chasms that divide the country.

Because of who Trump is and how America reacts to his presidency (both pro and con) what were once reasonable solutions are now stubborn face-offs that seem nearly impossible to solve.

Posted by Keeley at January 28, 2019 4:35 PM
Comments
Comment #437357

I thought Mexico was going to pay for it.

Posted by: phx8 at January 28, 2019 4:57 PM
Comment #437358

Mexico should build the wall on their side to keep all those nice immigrants from being harmed north of the border. Idiot in chief is going to make Mexico great. AMLO wants to keep the immigrants.

“Wall” is a word that is easy to say and remember. That’s the only reason for this silly discussion. I guess he never saw Midsummer Night’s Dream:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3zpW7o8vOw

They should nominate Walter the bulldog as their candidate:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Yg7_lwBcq0

I’m reducing my offer to shut down the site to 70 cents. I might need a quarter for Aldi because of all this wonderful snow. It could be the last we’ll ever see, so I want to enjoy it.

Posted by: ohrealy at January 28, 2019 5:20 PM
Comment #437359

“I’m a great builder. What do I best in life, I build. Your infrastructure is crumbling. Isn’t it nice to have a builder? A real builder. So you take precast plank. It comes 30 feet long, 40 feet long, 50 feet long. You see the highways where they can span 50, 60 feet, even longer than that, right? And do you a beautiful nice precast plank with beautiful everything. Just perfect. I want it to be so beautiful because maybe someday they’ll call it The Trump Wall. Maybe. So I have to make sure it’s beautiful, right? I’ll be very proud of that wall. If they call at this The Trump Wall, it has to be beautiful. And you put that plank up and you dig your footings. And you put that plank up — there’s no ladder going over that. If they ever go up there, they’re in trouble, because here’s no way to get down. Maybe a rope.”
Donald Trump, August 2015

“I get a call from one of the reporters yesterday, and they said, ‘The President of Mexico said they will not under any circumstances pay for the wall. They said to me, ‘What is your comment?’ I said, ‘The wall just got 10 feet higher.’”
Donald Trump, February 2016

“One of the things with the wall is you need transparency. You have to be able to see through it. In other words, if you can’t see through that wall — so it could be a steel wall with openings, but you have to have openings because you have to see what’s on the other side of the wall. And I’ll give you an example. As horrible as it sounds, when they throw the large sacks of drugs over, and if you have people on the other side of the wall, you don’t see them — they hit you on the head with 60 pounds of stuff? It’s over. As crazy as that sounds, you need transparency through that wall.”
Donald Trump, July 2017

“It’s an easy decision for Mexico: make a one-time payment of $5-10 billion to ensure that $24 billion continues to flow into their country year after year.”
Donald Trump, July 2016

Heey… Heeeeyy. Just a minute. You don’t suppose… You don’t suppose Trump was LYING to us, do you?

Remember all those slack jawed inbreds wearing MAGA hats? They believed him. They even voted for him. Oh oh.

Posted by: phx8 at January 28, 2019 5:29 PM
Comment #437360

Oh boy another post about the wall! Can’t wait to see D.’s uberlong list of crimes committed over the years by illegal immigrants. Of course this past week we had …what… 5 killed in an execution at a bank. another 5 by the son and 3 near PSU? But go on D. None by any MS-13 gang or drug caretel.

And guys lets remember…yes this means you D……


“Repetition does transform a lie into a truth”

FDR

Posted by: j2t2 at January 28, 2019 7:04 PM
Comment #437361

Oh boy another post about the wall! Can’t wait to see D.’s uberlong list of crimes committed over the years by illegal immigrants. Of course this past week we had …what… 5 killed in an execution at a bank. another 5 by the son and 3 near PSU? But go on D. None by any MS-13 gang or drug caretel.

And guys lets remember…yes this means you D……


“Repetition does transform a lie into a truth”

FDR

Posted by: j2t2 at January 28, 2019 7:04 PM
Comment #437362

Oops Repetition does not transform a lie into a truth

FDR

Posted by: j2t2 at January 28, 2019 7:06 PM
Comment #437363

I don’t know if anyone is subscribed to Vox, but they do great international stories. Colombia has taken in about a million refugees from Venezuala. They give you the news without the racism:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU0RqwweuWY

Nobody told them about the wonders of walls apparently.

There’s another one about the Hippos that got lose from Pablo Escobar’s compound:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_ViOLgvsuY

Posted by: ohrealy at January 28, 2019 7:37 PM
Comment #437390

First post - deflection
Second post - more meaningless gibberish
Third post - racist
Fourth, fifth and sixth posts - irrelevant nonsense
Seventh post - pure stupidity

Yes, leftists don’t care that walls work.

Posted by: kctim at January 29, 2019 9:11 AM
Comment #437391

Keeley, kctim,
Correct, there are many Democrats, and similar ilk who don’t care if walls work.

phx8 wrote: I thought Mexico was going to pay for it.
Only a moron would interpret “Mexico will pay for the wall” to mean that Mexico is going to pay for the wall directly. Most people of average intelligence understood that Mexico will pay indirectly for the wall, via:
  • (a) renegotiation of NAFTA/USMCA;
  • (b) temporary border closings;
  • (c) reduction of illegal immigrants successfully trespassing the border;
  • (d) fewer illegal immigrants sending money back to Mexico;
  • (e) a reduction in net monetary losses due to illegal immigration currently estimated to be $296 Billion (or more) per year;
  • (f) a reduction of the 2,000 homicides per year by criminal non-citizens,
  • (g) a reduction in numerous other crimes and deaths, 117 deaths per day due to drug over doses, human trafficking, and 90% of all drug trafficking is across the borders (10% comes through other ports-of-entry), tens of thousands of non-citizens voting in U.S. elections (source: dssusa.site/voting1.html), etc., etc., etc.
The cost of all of that far exceeds the $5.7 Billion requested for border barriers in certain locations (not the entire length of the southern border), $5.7 Billion far exceeds the $54 Billion per year in foreign aid to other countries, and $5.7 Billion is equivalent to only 4 days of interest on the national debt of $21.9 Trillion.

It is true that many Democrats, and similar ilk, do not care if walls work. j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy demonsrate that they do not care about illegal immigration, and actually want to promote it (especially phx8 who wrote: “I would be fine with open borders”). j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy only care about more votes, money, and power for THEIR party.
All of the things many Democrats do, and j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hreally demonstrate, has a common-thread, is that they have nefarious motives, to acquire more power via more votes and money:

  • (01) because many Democrats, most of the Main Stream Media, others on the left, and similar ilk (despicably) pit U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other for votes, by pandering to illegal immigrants for 30+ years for more votes (via more representation in the House, via more U.S. House representatives, via apportionment of representatives (i.e. more electoral votes, and more federal funding), based on population, based on the decennial CENSUS, which does not verify U.S. citizenship;
  • (02) because many Democrats are also fighting against a check-box on the CENSUS, despite the check-box being totally inadequate to prove citizenship. Democrats disguise their desire for power (for THEIR party) as compassion for illegal immigrants, while despicably pitting U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other for votes and money.
  • (03) because many Democrats (and most of the main stream media) lie about crime by illegal immigrants, and refuse to report the 2 thousand (or more) homicides per year by criminal non-citizens (source: DHS); and 32% of everyone in federal prison is a criminal non-citizen (source: Source#3: cis.org/Huennekens/32-Federal-Inmates-Are-Aliens);
  • (04) because many Democrats (and most of the main stream media) lie about how massive illegal (or legal) immigration is costing U.S. tax payers $296+ Billion (www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/sep/21/mass-immigration-costs-govt-296-billion-year-natio/) per year in net losses (which does not include all costs, and does not include the cost of crime by illegal immigrants); that is a net loss of about $2,349.00 per year per household (126.22 Million households in 2017), or $916 per year per person (U.S. population=323 Million in 2017);
  • (05) because many Democrats are calling for open borders;
  • (06) because many Democrats are calling to abolish I.C.E. (Immigration and Customs Enforcement);
  • (07) because many Democrats want another shamnesty, like the shamnesty of 1986;
  • (08) because many Democrats refuse legislation to require employers to use eVerify (to verify eligibility for employment);
  • (09) because many Democrats want to give illegal immigrants drivers’ licenses, and also automatically register them to vote;
  • (10) because many Democrats want more mayors like Libby Schaaf (Oakland, CA), who warns illegal immigrants (including criminal illegal immigrants) before an ICE raid to arrest criminal illegal immigrants;
  • (11) because many Democrats want more sanctuary cities and states, like California, where Democrats have passed sanctuary city and sanctuary state laws that protect criminal illegal immigrants (i.e. an illegal immigrant by the name of Garcia Zarate (who had already been deported 5 times) can shoot and murder Kate Steinle, and be (www.cnn.com/2017/11/30/us/kate-steinle-murder-trial-verdict/index.html)for that murder, despite Zarate admitting to shooting the weapon that killed Kate Steinle (which should have been, at the very least, manslaughter);
  • (12) because many Democrats want to abolish the 2nd amendment, but many Democrats and many on the left call for restricting or eliminating 2nd Amendment rights, and say it is worth it “even if it saves only ONE life”, but conveniently ignore 2,000 homicides per year by criminal non-citizens (sources: dssusa.iste/homicides1.html ; www.gao.gov/assets/320/316959.pdf);
It’s not easy to get much lower than that.

Sources for “Walls Work”:

  • www.amren.com/features/2018/02/border-walls-work/
  • www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/22/homeland-security-secretary-border-walls-work-yuma-sector-proves-it-elaine-duke-column/586853001/
  • www.cbp.gov/newsroom/video-gallery/video-library/walls-work
  • www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPmBLc7_aSE
  • www.aei.org/publication/the-places-where-walls-work/

But, there may be hope still that some Democrats are not totally on board with open-borders.
“Democrats Begin To Jump Ship: Massive Influx of Dems Begin Showing Support for Border Wall”.
Source: www.westernjournal.com/democrats-begin-jump-ship-massive-influx-dems-begin-showing-support-border-wall/?utm_source=push&utm_medium=westernjournalism&utm_content=2019-01-29&utm_campaign=manualpost

“Monmouth Poll: Trump approval rating jumps 10 points”.
“Trump’s job approval rating has spiked 10 points over the last month and Republicans have erased a double-digit deficit in the generic ballot for the House, according to a new poll. The jump in the Monmouth survey appears to be driven by voter attitudes toward the GOP’s tax reform overhaul.”;
Source: thehill.com/homenews/administration/371635-monmouth-poll-trump-approval-rating-jumps-10-points

Many thanks to j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy, the gifts that keep on giving. Please continue.

Posted by: d.a.n at January 29, 2019 9:14 AM
Comment #437395

>blockquote>Only a moron would interpret “Mexico will pay for the wall” to mean that Mexico is going to pay for the wall directly.

D., such a foolish statement. Thank you for the Big Lie. Remember repetition does not transform a lie into the truth.

But hey for any moron who believes this line of crap from D. answer me this, why, after Mexico told him to p**s up a rope, would Spicer right after the election tell us Trump was considering a 20% tax on Mexican imports as a way to get Mexico to pay for the wall? I mean if he really had this plan as you claim all along why? I think we know who the morons are D.

Posted by: j2t2 at January 29, 2019 11:46 AM
Comment #437396

Kctim,

8th post, even more nonsense
9th post, Big lies, moronic BS, and a vain attempt to use repetition as a means to perpetuate the Big Lie.
10th post, enlightened response to the repetition of the Big Lie.

Posted by: j2t2 at January 29, 2019 11:54 AM
Comment #437397
j2t2 wrote: I think we know who the morons are D.
And who would that be, based on your nasty, vulgar, racist comments here ?
j2t2 wrote: D., such a foolish statement. Thank you for the Big Lie.
Oh, like all of these lies ?

Thank you j2t2 for being the gift that keep on giving. Please continue.

Posted by: d.a.n at January 29, 2019 11:54 AM
Comment #437398

What happened to “Free Healthcare”, j2t2?

I know the “they did it too” argument doesn’t work, but why the hypocrisy? Why is there no shame on your side?

Democratics use that lie all the time. In my home town, the city built a community center. Town officials (Democratics) said it would be paid for with user fees, yet every year it is listed as a line item in my property taxes. Town officials (Democratics) built a “Serenity Park” out of abandoned property in the center of town. They said the gazebo and benches would be donated by High School students and private funds. They (Democratics) said there would be no cost to the tax payers. However, when it came to be finished, the land and $6000 was donated by a government organization funded by taxpayer money. There was electricity running to the gazebo, included in the city utility bill and paid for by the city taxes, and all the ground’s maintenance is done by city employees paid for by taxpayer funds. There hasn’t been a high school student on that property since it was completed.
The Community Center is considered to be another government building and is used by many government funded lectures and meetings, and the county uses it for a polling place. Both of these activities are hosted at the community center free of charge. These are just some of the lies Democratics use to get what they want.

One Democratic explains the Democratic’s tactic. Johnathan Gruber said that “the stupidity of the American voter” made it important for him and Democratics to hide Obamacare’s true goals from the public.

I don’t hold to the assumption it was the stupidity of the American Voter. I hold it to the Democratic’s assumption they can lie with impunity to get what they want. They lie with so much impunity they get up in front of their peers and brag about deceiving the American people.

Lying is standard operating procedure for politicians. I thought that was an age old understanding of the nature of politics! What’s new, or not, is the hypocrisy behind criticizing one party for something the accusers have been doing all along.

Posted by: Weary Willie at January 29, 2019 12:27 PM
Comment #437400

Thank you Weary for your honesty. Yes Trump was lying and doubled down on the lie so people like D. could deny it as a means to strengthen his argument for a monster wall at the border.

The free healthcare thing, I’m not sure what you are talking about? Is it the fact that it costs? Who actually says free healthcare amongst the dems?


Is it hypocrisy, based upon your examples, when people like D. deny it and continue to rail against it so it can’t be used against him. I mean if he had said yes it was just another one of Trumps lies then maybe you could make your case.

Posted by: j2t2 at January 29, 2019 1:15 PM
Comment #437401
And who would that be, based on your nasty, vulgar, racist comments here ?

Really D. , I wasn’t clear enough for you! But hey go ahead and continue to mischaracterize my words, but remember as FDR said repetition does not transform a lie into the truth.

Posted by: j2t2 at January 29, 2019 1:20 PM
Comment #437402
j2t2 wrote: Is it the fact that it costs?
The problem is that government meddling makes it unaffordable for those that previously had health insurance. Obamacare doubled and tripled premiums, despite Obama saying it would reduce premiums by $2,500 per year:
Obama said: “[Health Insurance] Premiums will be lowered by $2500” (among other numerous lies by Obama).

j2t2, and other socialist extremists don’t understand that government does little (if anything) efficiently; they think the solution to all problems is more government meddling. That is the mindset of socialist extremists.

Thanks again to j2t2 for being the gift that keeps on giving.

Posted by: d.a.n at January 29, 2019 1:31 PM
Comment #437403
j2t2 wrote: But hey go ahead and continue to mischaracterize my words, …
Whaa whaa. : (
Oh, you mean your words of wisdom here ?
Posted by: d.a.n at January 29, 2019 1:35 PM
Comment #437404
The problem is that government meddling makes it unaffordable for those that previously had health insurance. Obamacare doubled and tripled premiums, despite Obama saying it would reduce premiums by $2,500 per year:


Not the government meddling D., conservatives intentionally meddling with the law is the problem. It is no longer Obamacare it is Rubio and/or Trumpcare at this point. Y’all f**cked it up with malice and bad intentions because Mr. Art of the Deal couldn’t repeal it with both houses in repub control. Even prior to tat Rubio introduced and passed bills designed to ensure the ACA was a failure. Talk despicable.

j2t2, and other socialist extremists


Oh my D., your handlers must be proud, the latest talking point needed to smear your political opponents because you cannot compete in policy.

don’t understand that government does little (if anything) efficiently; they think the solution to all problems is more government meddling.


Why them handlers must just be jumping with joy D.. Using parts of the Big Lie in vague and ambiguous ways to keep the lie going. Worthy of the monthly Goebbels award for backhanded propaganda IMHO.

Whaa whaa. : (

Whining but nothing to refute the Trump lie about Mexico paying for the wall! oh wait is anyone surprised about that?

Posted by: j2t2 at January 29, 2019 3:15 PM
Comment #437405

J2,
Who pays for the wall has absolutely nothing to do with whether a wall works or not. Phx8 is against it only because Trump supports it, which is why he always deflects to the ‘thought Mexico was going to pay for it’ and ‘racist’ nonsense.

Ohrealy only posts incoherent gibberish that he doesn’t have the b*lls to defend.

Then you start yammering about shootings committed by citizens, which has squat to do with whether a wall would work or not.

As far as the ‘free health care thing’:
“I will sign a universal health care bill into law by the end of my first term as president that will cover every American and cut the cost of a typical family’s premium by up to $2,500 a year.” - Obama

The 50 million Americans without insurance did not get their free health care. Hard working Americans didn’t save $2500.

Just keep arguing with yourself about your ‘fascism’ and ‘big lie’ conspiracy theories, J2.

IF you ever want to have a factual and mature discussion on an issue again, let me know.

Posted by: kctim at January 29, 2019 3:26 PM
Comment #437406

kctim,
“Phx8 is against it only because Trump supports it, which is why he always deflects to the ‘thought Mexico was going to pay for it’ and ‘racist’ nonsense.”

No. Trump said ‘Mexico was going to pay for it’ dozens and dozens of times. Not ‘we will build it and they will pay for it.’ I even posted many statements made by Trump, like this:

“It’s an easy decision for Mexico: make a one-time payment of $5-10 billion to ensure that $24 billion continues to flow into their country year after year.”

In general, I am against the Wall for two reasons:

1) It is offensive
2) It is stupid

It is offensive because it caters to bigotry and racism. Period. It is stupid because it only addresses people crossing the southern border. About half of the illegal immigrants in this country arrive at airports on perfectly legal visas. They are employed. They stay after the visa expires.

I don’t understand the idea that Medicare-for-All or universal health care is somehow ‘free health care.’ We already pay for Medicare. We pay for privatized health care. Health care through the government costs less than the private sector, covers more people, and eliminates the interference of corporations more concerned with their own profit than the well being of human beings. Private health care insurance does literally NOTHING to improve health care. And it is not as if we do not have examples. Every major industrialized country has health care that covers more people at about half the cost of what an American pays. Not only that, the results of US health care are poor, with the US ranking below most industrialized countries in measurements.

The ACA moved the priority of health care from reactive treatment to preventative. It moved the accent from expensive specialists to the GP.

The GOP did everything in its power to stop the ACA, refuse to develop competitive exchanges, expand Medicaid coverage, and so on. Fine. Time for Medicare-for-All.

Posted by: phx8 at January 29, 2019 3:46 PM
Comment #437408

Phx8, all you have to do is look to TJ and you will see how Mexico is paying for the wall. They keep letting those caravans through they will indirectly be paying for the wall by having to put up with all those people.

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at January 29, 2019 4:18 PM
Comment #437410

for those that think Trumps economy is bigly or best

Kctim, you tell us “Who pays for the wall has absolutely nothing to do with whether a wall works or not.”. Yet whether the wall works or not has nothing to do with Trump telling us Mexico will pay for the wall. The fake crisis Trump trumped up is no reason to borrow from China , add to the debt and build a wall. Especially to stop drugs and cartel killers from entering the country.


We need to prioritize what we spend on, kctim. Infrastructure is much more important than another section of wall. Whether a wall works or not is a secondary issue IMHO.

Posted by: j2t2 at January 29, 2019 4:28 PM
Comment #437411
j2t2 wrote: Y’all f**cked it [Obamacare] up with malice and bad intentions because Mr. Art of the Deal couldn’t repeal it with both houses in repub control.
Whaa whaa.
Obamacare was a total failure from the beginning.
But, blaming others is typical of socialist extremists.
j2t2 wrote: Not the government meddling D., conservatives intentionally meddling with the law is the problem.
Oh, you mean like this, in which Democrats weaponized many federal agencies (i.e. DOJ, FBI, IRS, EPA, NLRB, etc.)?
phx8 wrote: In general, I am against the Wall for two reasons: (1) It is offensive; (2) It is stupid. It is offensive because it caters to bigotry and racism. Period.
Of course, phx8 is against walls or physical barriers, because phx8 knows that walls work. After all …
phx8 wrote: As for immigration, I would be fine with open borders.

Sources for “Walls Work”:

  • www.amren.com/features/2018/02/border-walls-work/
  • www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/22/homeland-security-secretary-border-walls-work-yuma-sector-proves-it-elaine-duke-column/586853001/
  • www.cbp.gov/newsroom/video-gallery/video-library/walls-work
  • www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPmBLc7_aSE
  • www.aei.org/publication/the-places-where-walls-work/

phx8 lied: Health care through the government costs less than the private sector, covers more people, and eliminates the interference of corporations more concerned with their own profit than the well being of human beings.
The truth is, Obamacare cost Americans billion$ in losses (possibly, worse):
  • Remember, Obama said: “[Health Insurance] Premiums will be lowered by $2500”;
  • Remember, Obama said: “If you like your doctor, you can keep him, PERIOD.”;
  • Remember, Obama said: “If you like your health insurance, you can keep it, PERIOD!”;
  • After 5 years, Obamacare has failed miserably on 4 important metrics (cost, coverage, competition, and choice): Source: www.heritage.org/health-care-reform/commentary/are-we-better-now-five-years-obamacare
  • fewer health insurance providers, and none in some counties; Source: time.com/money/4503325/obama-health-care-costs-obamacare/
  • Five years later, it is clear that Obamacare failed: Source: www.forbes.com/sites/sallypipes/2015/03/23/obamacare-at-five-years-old-a-disappointment/#25d817506ad2
  • Many people’s deductibles trippled, the max-out-of-pocket doubled, and the annual premiums trippled (but on the upside, they now have coverage for things they don’t need).
another demonstration of ignorance by phx8, who wrote: Private health care insurance does literally NOTHING to improve health care.
Really, despite:
  • $70 Billion per year in medicare fraud ? How, how many walls/fences/barriers could be built with $70 Billion PER YEAR ?
  • An estimate from fiscal year 2016 showed $144 Billion in misspending that year—an all-time high. ?
  • The DOA (Department Of Agriculture) noted $218 million in federal crop insurance overpayments in 2016. ?
  • Also, the Pentagon admitted that, in fiscal year 2016, it made more than $100 million in overpayments to commercial vendors, and more than $400 million in overpayments when reimbursing individuals for travel costs. ?
  • In 2014, The spending issues, ranging from Medicare and Medicaid mismanagement to transportation programs to weapon systems acquisitions, cost taxpayers $125 billion in improper payments, as highlighted in a new report from the GAO (Government Accountability Office). Solving that would give you enough money to kill the death tax, repeal the federal gas tax and airline ticket tax, end all federal excise taxes on alcohol and tobacco and remove all federal taxes on phone and Internet bills”. ?
  • Government agencies in charge of major federal programs such as Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security have doled out about $100 million in improper payments each year for the last five years. The payments include everything from outright fraud to errors made by the agencies or errors made by people claiming the payments. Between 2002 and 2012, federal agencies gave out about $688 Billion (about $68 Billion per year) to the wrong people. ?
  • Agencies are required to estimate the payment error rate of their programs. For example, Medicare’s Fee for Service program had an error rate of 10.1 percent in 2013 – about $33.2 billion of the program’s total payments were improper. ?
  • I.T. Failures Cost Taxpayers a Fortune: The Federal Bureau of Investigation’s new case filing system, “Sentinel,” is just the latest chapter in federal IT flops. The system, ridden with problems, has spiraled $100 million over budget – and it still barely works. Auditors say the system, which is supposed to make it easier to search case files, is so flawed it actually makes the process more time consuming and difficult. ?
  • FEMA spent $240 million building a high-tech system to help deliver supplies and coordinate the multi-agency response to national disasters. But a review by the Department of Homeland Security’s Inspector General found the Logistics Supply Chain Management System so riddled with errors that it can’t “interface” with other agencies – making it nearly impossible to locate and deliver emergency supplies. ?
  • $80 million on Iron Man suit: The DoD is pouring millions into a wearable weapon it calls the Tactical Assault Light Operator Suit (TALOS) otherwise known as the “Iron Man” suit. Some scientists think that someone at the Pentagon has been watching too many movies. ?
  • Billions on bad bullets?: The Defense Department purchased $16 billion worth of ammunition that it didn’t actually need. Some of the ammo is either too old to use or actually banned by international treaties. Now, the agency says it must destroy it—and estimates that will cost about $1 billion.?
  • Pork for sheep: A few members of Congress have fought to keep a sheep grazing station open and operating at a cost of $2 million a year. The USDA doesn’t need it—and neither does the sheep. ?
  • $1.1 million lost by rocket scientists The federal agency that put a man on the moon, can’t seem to figure out how to keep tabs on the $1.1 million worth of smart phones and tablets that it lets its employees and contractors use. And many of the devices distributed to NASA workers aren’t even being used $1.1 million lost by rocket scientistsWarner Bros. Pictures/The Fiscal Times ?
  • Disney Hits the Jackpot on Government’s Treasure Island: Through the Small Business Administration’s Surety Bond Guarantee Program, Disney’s Polynesian Resort received $455,684 in guarantees from the government for a construction company to build a skylight system in one of the resorts buildings. It also received nearly $1 million for other “rehab” work around the resort, where rooms cost a minimum of $429 per night. ?
  • $50,000 on Alpaca Poop Paks: The U.S. Department of Agriculture doled out $50,000 to Virginia Mary’s Alpaca, LLC to develop and market Alpaca poop as fertilizer for plants. With the help of your tax dollars, the company sells its “Poop Paks” in “colorful, unmistakable green bags.” ?
  • $638,910 on sending coal to military bases in Germany: A decades-old earmark requires the Air Force to use American anthracite coal to heat its military bases in Germany. The law has yet to be changed and taxpayers are left with an expensive and unnecessary tab. $638,910 on sending coal to military bases in GermanyREUTERS/Rick Bowmer/Pool ?
  • $124.3 million on fake or fraudulent background checks: The U.S. paid $124.3 million this year to the contractor that provided security clearances for Edward Snowden. The Department of Justice last spring accused the contractor of submitting more than 665,000 fake background investigations. As a result they may have allowed thousands of ineligible people to obtain security clearance. $124.3 million on fake or fraudulent background checksREUTERS/Maxim Shemetov ?
  • $100,000+ for Coast Guard as private beach patrol: Though the U.S. Coast Guard has been slapped with budget cuts, its sometimes being used to provide free patrols in “some of the country’s most exclusive real estate” to prevent people from crashing private parties. ?
  • $52,000 on rebuilding a bridge to use American steel: A small Colorado town received a federal grant to build a new bridge. But the bridge was constructed with Canadian steal and violated the “Buy America” provision of the grant. Now it’s going to get ripped down. ?
  • Yet despite decades of pledges to stop fraud and waste, the Government Accountability Office recently announced it found $137 Billion in improper payments in 2015, an increase of $31 billion in just two years ?
  • “Fraud, waste, and abuse.” A simple Google search returns about 35 million mentions of this term. ?
  • Rewarded for Bad Behavior: The Government Accountability Office revealed this year that the federal government paid $3.1 billion to federal workers on administrative leave over the last three years. Of this amount, $775 million went to 57,000 employees who were off work for a month or longer ?
  • For 2012, the federal government lost $261 billion, or 7 percent of total spending, to fraud and waste, said Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) during a February House committee hearing ? ?
    I See Dead People … Cashing Federal Checks. Therefore, Congress pass the “Stopping Improper Payments to Deceased People Act” (S. 2374/H.R. 4929) which (if not mismanaged like most federal programs) would provide all relevant agencies with access to the full death list maintained by the Social Security Administration, while still maintaining strong privacy and security protections for the data. Doh!
WASTE AND FRAUD BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT:
  • YEAR: 50B==60B==70B==80B==90B=100B=110B=120B=130B=140B=$150 BILLION
  • 2016: ########################################## $144 Billion
  • 2015: ###################################### $137 Billion
  • 2014: ################################ $125 Billion

phx8, there are some things that the government must do (i.e. national defense), but aside from that, please prove when and where the federal government EVER did anything more efficiently than the private sector (for profit and non-profit).
Good luck with that.
You like predictions, so I will predict now that you never produce any proof.

Thanks again to j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy for being the gifts that keep on giving.

Posted by: d.a.n at January 29, 2019 5:29 PM
Comment #437412
j2t2 wrote: Whether a wall works or not is a secondary issue IMHO.
See. j2t2 is caving. Now, j2t2 admits that he does not care if walls work. He also not care about (nor believe) the 2,000 homicides per year by criminal non-citizens.

Thanks again to j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy for being the gifts that keep on giving.

Posted by: d.a.n at January 29, 2019 5:35 PM
Comment #437413

Phx8,
Who pays for the wall has nothing to do with whether a wall works or not, which is the topic at hand. If it did, you would be able to make a valid argument, which you cannot do.

Your excuses for why you are against a wall only highlight Trump being the actual reason for your opposition.
First, you ignore the illegal alien problem and the barriers currently in place, in order to justify your personal feelings that more barriers would somehow NOW be ‘offensive.’ Hogwash.
If deer are eating your garden, you build a barrier to protect your money and what’s in it. Not because you hate deer, but because you care about your money and garden.

Then you use the ‘visa’ excuse? A document that The U.S. Department of State issues? One of the approved travel authorization processes? Where people provide identification and reason for entry into the country?
Come on man, all your new found hate is making you sloppy.

“I don’t understand the idea that Medicare-for-All or universal health care is somehow ‘free health care.’”

Seriously?
for all
universal
How much do people with no money contribute? $0
If you are paying zero dollars, you are getting it for free.

I don’t care about utopian fantasies or fearful propaganda. I care about our individual rights. Although, with your unwillingness to address the costs illegal aliens place upon us, I find it laughable that you would mention health care costs as one of your concerns.

“The ACA moved the priority of health care from reactive treatment to preventative.”

I was doing that BEFORE the ACA and it was less expensive.

“The GOP did everything in its power to stop the ACA, refuse to develop competitive exchanges, expand Medicaid coverage, and so on. Fine. Time for Medicare-for-All.”

Just as the dems are doing everything in their power to stop Trump from placing a barrier to address the illegal alien problems we face.
Now you know why those on the right use ‘health care’ to point out leftist hypocrisy.

Posted by: kctim at January 29, 2019 5:51 PM
Comment #437414

Illegal aliens create an undue and preventable burden on our infrastructure, J2.

Posted by: kctim at January 29, 2019 5:57 PM
Comment #437415
phx8 wrote: As for immigration, I would be fine with open borders.
j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy want free stuff, but what they really want more is socialism, and to get that, they want more votes, money, and power for THEIR party, via massive illegal immigration, by despicably pitting U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other for votes, by pandering to illegal immigrants for 30+ years for more votes (via more representation in the House, via more U.S. House representatives, via apportionment of representatives (i.e. more electoral votes, and more federal funding), based on population, based on the decennial CENSUS, which does not verify U.S. citizenship.

That is also why Democrats are also fighting against a citizenship check-box on the CENSUS, despite the check-box being totally inadequate to prove citizenship. Democrats disguise their desire for power (for THEIR party) as compassion for illegal immigrants, while despicably pitting U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other for votes and money.

That is also why Democrats want to give illegal immigrants drivers’ licenses, and also automatically register them to vote. Texas recently reported 58,000 illegal votes by non-citizens.

That is why they want to abolish I.C.E.

That is why they want more sanctuary cities and states.

That is why they refuse legislation to require employers to use eVerify (to verify eligibility for employment);

That is why they want another amnesty.

And that is why they want open-borders.

And that is why they say they want to abolish or restrict 2nd amendment rights, and say “It is worth it “even if it saves only ONE life !, but conveniently (despicably) ignore 2,000 homicides per year by criminal non-citizens (a homicide rate that is 61% higher than U.S. citizens in year 2018).

It all adds up; it all makes perfect sense.

Again, many thanks to j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy, the gifts that keep on giving. Please continue.

Posted by: d.a.n at January 29, 2019 6:35 PM
Comment #437416

What will be the cost of free healthcare for 25.9 Million non-citizens, because most immigrants to the U.S. are poor, and currently use about 50% more welfare than U.S. citizens.
IF a law like that is passed, you will see hundreds of millions (non hundreds of thousands) storming the borders.

Thanks again to j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy for being the gifts that keep on giving.

Posted by: d.a.n at January 29, 2019 7:07 PM
Comment #437419
See. j2t2 is caving. Now, j2t2 admits that he does not care if walls work.


What a drama queen D.. No one is caving because they say whether the wall works or not is secondary, FFS. Having a discussion with someone like D., unable to reason well, makes it hard to actually discuss the issue. And of course your nonsensical comment proves this point.

Anyway conservatives seem to be mobbing on this “the wall works” thing. Then of course the point to TJ , a city and use that as conclusive proof of how well a wall works. But there is a wall there already. Trump is talking about many miles of wall along the entirety of the border. So a wall in the middle of no f**king where may work to keep some people with little or no resources out but drugs and cartel members and terrorist would laugh at this contention.

Further to this point the real issue here is political. Trump started this push for the wall because he lost the HoR in the past election. Spending $5.7b on a wall along the border is a bad use of anything but political points. Unless Trump is willing to sign off on a portion of the $5.7b and give up something significant, say a major tax increase along the lines of A O-C’s proposal, why give it to him?

Posted by: j2t2 at January 29, 2019 11:23 PM
Comment #437453
What will be the cost of free healthcare for 25.9 Million non-citizens,

Probably 2 tax cuts for billionaires and many deaths D.. Bit lets not forget you do us a disservice when you use the term “free healthcare” as it is more aptly called single payer health care. The hospital will write the loss off so the cots would be less profit than they would make. Perhaps , to keep conservatives happy, we could jail these “non-citizens” in a poor house until their relatives pay up for them. Would that suffice for you guys? Or would you prefer we just shoot them outside the hospital after forcibly removing them from the hospital?

Texas recently reported 58,000 illegal votes by non-citizens.

And they are being sued for doing so D.. The conservative a**hat in Florida did the same thing a year or so ago and as it turned out less than 10 people were found not in compliance with voting laws. Wanna bet on the number in Texas?

Posted by: j2t2 at January 30, 2019 8:53 AM
Comment #437454

That’s because barriers work, J2. People point to other barriers as examples because they work. There is no factual evidence that proves otherwise.

What Trump is talking about is really not all that different than what has been discussed and accepted in the past. Trump is just willing to actually do something about it.

With the massive burden that illegal aliens place on our resources, our infrastructure and our treasury, adding barriers to our border security is a no-brainer.

Posted by: kctim at January 30, 2019 8:54 AM
Comment #437455

“you do us a disservice when you use the term “free healthcare” as it is more aptly called single payer health care. The hospital will write the loss off so the cots would be less profit than they would make.”

That is one of the silliest things you have ever written on here, J2.
If a person is receiving something at no cost or charge, they are getting it for free.

Posted by: kctim at January 30, 2019 9:02 AM
Comment #437459
j2t2 wrote: No one is caving because they say whether the wall works or not is secondary, FFS.
Nonsense. It is obvious that you don’t care IF walls work, despite ample evidence that they do.
IF walls did not work, then what is keeping thousands of immigrants in Tijuana, Mexico?
What is more important than reducing 2,000 homicides per year by criminal non-citizens?
Also, 90% of drug trafficking is across the U.S./Mexico border (10% comes through other ports-of-entry, and there have also been requests for funding to detect and prevent drug trafficking through ports-of-entry.
j2t2 wrote: What a drama queen D. Having a discussion with someone like D., unable to reason well, makes it hard to actually discuss the issue. And of course your nonsensical comment proves this point.
Oh, so you think your rhetoric makes sense?
Discussions are so much better with j2t2, who resorts to nasty, vulgar, hate speech whenever someone disagrees him.
j2t2 wrote: Anyway conservatives seem to be mobbing on this “the wall works” thing.
HHMmmm … many Democrats, leftists, and some other socialist extremists appear to be more prone mob-like behavior.
See here: www.breitbart.com/the-media/2018/07/05/rap-sheet-acts-of-media-approved-violence-and-harassment-against-trump-supporters/
j2t2 wrote: Then of course the point to TJ , a city and use that as conclusive proof of how well a wall works. But there is a wall there already. Trump is talking about many miles of wall along the entirety of the border.
Thank you for proving your ignorance (again). There are numerous other locations where illegal immigrants and drug traffickers cross where there are not physical barriers, and some of the existing physical barriers are nothing more than a wire, or thin sheet metal.
j2t2 wrote: So a wall in the middle of no f**king where may work to keep some people with little or no resources out but drugs and cartel members and terrorist would laugh at this contention.
That sort of logic is childish. No one ever said a wall is 100% fool proof. But, you seem to think that you know more than the experts, the DHS, and the Border & Customs Protection (BCP) border agents. The truth is, you want open-borders. phx8 does too, who stated “As for immigration, I would be fine with open borders.”.
j2t2 wrote: Further to this point the real issue here is political. Trump started this push for the wall because he lost the HoR in the past election. Spending $5.7b on a wall along the border is a bad use of anything but political points.
Yes, it is political.
Pelosi and Schumer are going against what the majority of people want, and it will cost them, and their hypocrisy is clear for all to see (since they already voted previously for funding physical barriers and border security fudning).
It was a major promise by Trump, and border security (which comes in many forms) is what the majority of U.S. citizens want, as shown by a Harvard-Harris Poll (17-to-19-JAN-2018); 980 persons polled (source: www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/jan/23/roughly-80-of-all-voters-say-us-needs-secure-borde/ ):
  • 79%: (87%Rep, 79%Ind, 72%Dem): Want Merit Based Immigration
  • 79%: (93%Rep, 80%Ind, 68%Dem): Want Secure Borders
  • 61%: (84%Rep, 64%Ind, 40%Dem): Say Current Border is Inadequate
  • 68%: (78%Rep, 65%Ind, 62%Dem): Want to End the VISA Lottery
  • 54%: (85%Rep, 54%Ind, 30%Dem): Want physical and electronic border barrier
  • 60%: (93%Rep, 80%Ind, 68%Dem): Say NO to DACA Relatives
Pelosi and Schumer are starting to get some push-back from some more centrist Democrats who understand the importance of border security. Besides, Pelosi’s and Schumer’s position is despicable. It shows how low they will stoop to win political points.
j2t2 wrote: Unless Trump is willing to sign off on a portion of the $5.7b and give up something significant, say a major tax increase along the lines of A O-C’s proposal, why give it to him?
Which [Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez] A.O.C.’s proposal?
  • (1)Raise taxes to 70%,
  • (2)or, address global warming now, so that the world does not end in 12 years?
Again, many thanks to j2t2 for being the gift that keeps on giving. Posted by: d.a.n at January 30, 2019 10:07 AM
Comment #437460
If a person is receiving something at no cost or charge, they are getting it for free.


Someone is paying for it kctim. If the hospital writes it off then the American taxpayer is footing the bill. The real issue here is the impression D. is trying to create. I am saying 25.9 million noncitizens as if all of them are here illegally and so destitute they have no money or resources. That none of them pay their bills. why that must cost us trillions or gazillions….right? Especially since our private sector system is so expensive. Perhaps the question should be how much could we save if we had a single payer system like the rest of the developed world.

Posted by: j2t2 at January 30, 2019 10:12 AM
Comment #437461

kctim, you are exactly right.
IF the person pays nothing, it is Free (for them).
Of course, the middle-class will get the bill. As with Obamacare, many will have to pay for others’ healthcare, while unable to afford to use their own insurance due to exorbitant co-pays, premiums, deductibles, and max-out-of-pocket limits.
j2t2 is twisting like a pretzel while trying to prop up a failing argument.
All politicians promising medicare-for-all, single-payer, universal healthcare, etc. are simply trying to buy votes.

70% of the mothers of all babies born at Dallas’ Parkland Hospital are illegal aliens (source: www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/parkland.asp) are getting free healthcare.

84 over-run hospitals along the U.S./Mexico border have closed. What do you think will happen with open-borders and a government-run healthcare system that is run as badly as Medicare is now ($70 Billion per year in fraud and waste), and the Social Security System (which has had many Trillion$ pilfered from it), and is no longer even pay-as-you-go ?

Socialist Extremists like j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy simply want free stuff, and they don’t care about the cost to others, or that the government is terrible at running these huge systems, which are always fraught with huge losses due to waste and fraud.

Socialist Extremists like j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy want open-borders because they see it as a way for the Democrat party to get more power, and get the free stuff that the Democrats are promising (healthcare, college, someone to wipe their lazy asses for them, etc.).

Posted by: d.a.n at January 30, 2019 10:27 AM
Comment #437476

J2,
If an illegal alien has no money or resources to pay their bills, they are an additional burden on our country. An unjust, preventable burden. Every dollar we spend on illegal aliens is one less dollar for whatever system they are taking it from.

If we had an unconstitutional single payer system and opened it to illegal aliens, they wouldn’t save us a dime. They would cost us billions.

Posted by: kctim at January 30, 2019 3:29 PM
Comment #437478

Also, 63% of non-citizen households receive welfare, compared to 32% for households of U.S. citizens.

But, that is nothing compared to 2,000 homicides per year by criminal non-citizens, which is a homicide rate that is 61% higher than the homicide rate of U.S. citizens.

Kamala Harris is pushing for Medicare for everyone, which is estimates to cost $3.3 Trillion per year, which is almost equal to the $3.4 Trillion in total IRS revenues for year 2017.

The current Ordinary Income Tax Rates:

  • 2017 ____ 2019-to-2025___single____________married
  • 10% _____ 10%________ $0-$9,525 _________$0-$19,050
  • 15% _____ 12%________ $9,525-$38,700_____$19,050-$77,400
  • 25% _____ 22%________ $38,700-$82,500____$77,400-$165,000
  • 28% _____ 24%________ $82,500-$157,500___$165,000-$315,000
  • 33% _____ 32%________ $157,500-$200,000__$315,000-$400,000
  • 33%-35% _ 35%________ $200,000-$500,000__$400,000-$600,000
  • 39.6% ____ 37%________ $500,000+ _________$600,000+

Therefore, all of those taxes would have to be doubled to produce enough to pay for Medicare for everyone.

Also, at the current time, people are costing 3 times more than they already paid in to Medicare taxes.

Therefore, in reality, those tax rates above may have to be more than doubled.

Now add 25.8 Million non-citizens (which includes about 12 Million illegal immigrants).

What the heck. How about a 95% tax rate. That should cover everything, eh?
j2t2, phx8, and Ed O’hrealy, and other socialist extremists probably think that a 95% tax rate is a good idea.

Posted by: d.a.n at January 30, 2019 3:57 PM
Comment #437479

When a country decides to be a welfare state, without borders, it is doomed.

Posted by: d.a.n at January 30, 2019 3:59 PM
Comment #437480

https://cis.org/Report/63-NonCitizen-Households-Access-Welfare-Programs

Posted by: d.a.n at January 30, 2019 4:03 PM
Comment #437483

Such negativity from our conservative friends. The government can’t do it. The rest of the first world’s government can but not the USA. It can’t be done. It would cost so much. Yet all the first world countries are able to do it. Rights aren’t violated in the real world. Just in conservativeland and other dictatorships. Costs are lower in the rest of the first world and more people have access to health care but we can’t do it here. Jesus guys you are pathetic with all this negativity and D. you with all your charts and graphs are foolish to think we can’t do it.


Posted by: j2t2 at January 30, 2019 6:17 PM
Comment #437512

D. you miss the point, I know whats new…right? Maybe it’s your bad intentions or maybe the Big Lie has used up any reasoning ability you may have had. Anyway your mischaracterization of single payer health insurance is pathetic.


But please lets play the stupid game. Tell me why you think private health insurance seeking record profits every year will bring down the costs of medical care. Since your boy Nixon allowed for profit health care “costs ” have skyrocketed. Hospitals and Insurance Companies have swindled the American public. They won’t change and they won’t stop, the ACA has proved that. The relentless attacks on the ACA has proven our elected reps serve the money not the people. Our current system is the most costly in the world, not the best in the world. The rest of the first world has passed us by in health care.

Your silly ideology that the government cannot do anything right is absurd when it comes to single payer insurance. The rest of the world proves you wrong even when you hide your head in the sand. Even when you refuse to acknowledge the rest of the world.

Posted by: j2t2 at January 31, 2019 9:31 AM
Comment #437514

The rest of the first world’s governments do not have to deal with the Constitutional limits, population or geography as ours does.
Like it or not, limited government and individual rights/freedoms, are our nations founding principles. Our Constitution, which was created to prevent abuses such as single-payer health care, is a hurdle those other nations did not have to overcome.
If this were not the case, we would already have your government controlled health care and be just another mediocre country like Canada or any of those European nations.

They also benefit greatly from our military presence and our overall generosity. Tell us J2, what would happen if Canada and all those European nations were suddenly responsible for taking care of their own security? What would happen if they had to spend an extra 20-40 billion (at minimum) in order to keep up with Russia?

Make your case, J2. Preferably in a mature and rational manner.

Posted by: kctim at January 31, 2019 10:12 AM
Comment #437517

Kctim, mature and rational? Since when do you guys want mature and rational? Hannity isn’t mature and rational, Limbaugh isn’t mature and rational, Trump isn’t mature and rational. Coulter, Carlson, where is the mature and rational on the right? Trickle on economics isn’t rational. Building walls to keep out drugs and gangs isn’t rational. Kctim, the list could go on but do you really want mature and rational?

Anyway, a system of health insurance that works for all American’s is rational. What we have had since the 80’s until now isn’t rational. In fact all other first world countries have constitutions and rights just as we do. The argument that non profit single payer violates the constitution isn’t rational. The idea that not for profit single payer health insurance is an abuse isn’t rational. Going bankrupt because of medical costs isn’t rational. Having the highest costs health care system in the first world isn’t rational. Trying to tell us other first world health care systems are mediocre when in fact they spend less and get better results than our system isn’t rational.


Yes Europe may benefit because we want bases all over the world but what is rational about doing just that if it means we can’t protect our own people in this country? It is our constant escalation of weapons and military strength that isn’t rational. Our war for oil around the globe isn’t rational. The Russian/Chinese military threat is due to our military buildup kctim, and that isn’t rational. Propping up right ring dictators in oil rich countries isn’t rational. Sending more troops to the southern border for a faux crisis isn’t rational.


Using misnomers like “government controlled health care” isn’t mature nor rational. Are you sure you want mature and rational?

“True individual freedom cannot exist without economic security and independence. People who are hungry and out of a job are the stuff of which dictatorships are made.” FDR

Posted by: j2t2 at January 31, 2019 12:13 PM
Comment #437518

OH and before you attempt to make a case that single payer health insurance violates the Constitution bear in mind Civil Asset Forfeiture has withstood the Constitution. I realize the ACA individual mandate didn’t but hey Conservatives and rational….well I will be mature.

Posted by: j2t2 at January 31, 2019 12:31 PM
Comment #437520
Your silly ideology that the government cannot do anything right is absurd when it comes to single payer insurance.
Nonsense. What is absurd is $70 Billion per year in Medicare fraud.

WASTE AND FRAUD BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT:

  • YEAR: 50B==60B==70B==80B==90B=100B=110B=120B=130B=140B=$150 BILLION
  • 2016: ########################################## $144 Billion
  • 2015: ###################################### $137 Billion
  • 2014: ################################ $125 Billion

QUESTION: IF:
  • (a)the government started a single-payer Medicare or Health Insurance for everyone, and
  • (b) the private insurance industry started either a for-profit or a non-profit health insurance system, … … which do you think would provide the best healthcare for the least cost?
  • j2t2 and similar socialist extremist ilk think more government is the solution for everything, because they want free stuff.

    Which countries have a single-payer government-run system is an acceptable model of efficiency ?
    Do they have long waiting times (sometimes years) for needed surgeries and treatments, rationing, and innovation? Why do people in those other countries come to the U.S. for treatments?

    There is no proof that a government-run system is more efficient or better.
    Also, the calls by some Democrats (and similar socialist extremists; such as Kamala Harris) to ban all private healthcare systems, is unconstitutional. Some other Democrats (such as Bloomberg) even acknowledge how stupid that idea is (to ban all private healthcare systems).
    That’s the problem with many socialist extremists - they don’t have a clue about the constitution, “live and let live”, and basic rights.

    I would not be opposed to the federal government creating a non-profit health insurance system, and members can voluntarily participate (i.e. not forced to participate), and that government-run non-profit system can charge the lowest premiums possible.
    IF the government can do anything as well (or better) than the private sector, then it ought to be great. Right?

    I would love to see that experiment, because I am 99.99999% positive that federal government-run healthcare system could not provide better healthcare at a lower cost than a private for-profit (or non-profit) system.

    There are some things that the government must do, but anyone who thinks the federal government can do most things better than the private sector, is a moron, and the federal government proves every day that it is incompetent, fraught with fraud, and wasteful at most of what it does. This list is only the tip of the iceberg (only a portion of the hundreds of billion$, and possibly trillion$ stolen or wasted each year by the federal government.
    Only a moron (i.e. socialist extremist) would that is efficient or acceptable, and then ask for more of it.

    Posted by: d.a.n at January 31, 2019 12:56 PM
    Comment #437521

    The Veterans Affairs (VA) is a good example of what happens in government-run healthcare.

    Posted by: d.a.n at January 31, 2019 1:17 PM
    Comment #437524
    Nonsense. What is absurd is $70 Billion per year in Medicare fraud.

    For starters it isn’t internal government fraud it is doctors and hospitals defrauding Medicare. Second even if your number is real overhead is still lower than private sector health insurance companies.

    B. The proof is in the pudding. Look at the overhead now.

    Do they have long waiting times (sometimes years) for needed surgeries and treatments, rationing, and innovation?

    Oh brother the obfuscation, this is only in the minds of conservatives using these types of what ifs without factual information to back it up. Ask people from Australia, Canada wherever, what problems they have.

    Why do people in those other countries come to the U.S. for treatments?

    Probably for the same reason some AMericans go to Toronto for certain procedures. Most likely for elective procedures and plastic surgery and such. Of course you realize hundreds if not thousands of Americans go to Mexico for dental and prescriptions daily.

    There is no proof that a government-run system is more efficient or better.

    Sure there is D., you just gotta be able to get over the cognitive dissonance.
    “Studies evaluated in this systematic review do not support the claim that the private sector is usually more efficient, accountable, or medically effective than the public sector; however, the public sector appears frequently to lack timeliness and hospitality towards patients.”

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3378609/

    I’m not sure where you get the idea anyone wants to ban private sector insurance because they would still have a roll to play. Anyway I am not one of those. In fact some Scandinavian countries have both and would provide a good model for us.

    There are some things that the government must do, but anyone who thinks the federal government can do most things better than the private sector, is a moron,

    The only moron is you D., for using “most things”. Some things the government does better. That’s what we are talking about not most things. Many other countries have proved a government single payer insurance system is a better system.

    and the federal government proves every day that it is incompetent, fraught with fraud, and wasteful at most of what it does.

    Under conservative control I would say you are right D.. They have set out to prove the centerpiece of conservative ideology and worked hard to achieve it. Back when we put people on the moon , before you guys crawled out from under your rocks, it was a different story.

    But we must also remember private sector business is the corrupter of government most of the time, you aren’t giving them a free ride are you? Trump has bankrupted almost all his ventures, frauded many people and cheated on his charity FFS. Then of course we remember Reagans false narrative about the “welfare queen” and such.

    Privatizing some government functions such as prisons hasn’t worked out so well. Other than busting unions and lowering wages it has flopped. So spare us your list because what you are describing for the most part is private business defrauding the government.


    So grow up D., waste and fraud may happen in government as it may happen in the private sector but that is the way of the world. Not a reason to abandon a better system because of your ideology.

    Posted by: j2t2 at January 31, 2019 2:05 PM
    Comment #437525

    Oh please D. the VA hospital is the poster boy for conservatives inflicting their ideology in the government, then pointing to it as proof they are right. You guys have underfunded the VA since the ‘70’s. Conservatism is the problem. Slow to update to computers, understaffed, underfunded. The systematic attack on the VA by conservatives is why the VA is where it is at with scandals and such today.

    Posted by: j2t2 at January 31, 2019 2:15 PM
    Comment #437528
    j2t2 wrote: Blah, blah, blah, … , blah blah, blah.
    I did not bother to read all of your lies, illogical and lame excuses. Only a moron thinks most government-run programs are better. Posted by: d.a.n at January 31, 2019 2:29 PM
    Comment #437529

    j2t2 tries to blame conservatives for withholding funding for Veterans. However …
    “The House on Monday (24-JUL-2017) rejected legislation that would have given the Department of Veterans Affairs another $2 billion to fund the Veterans Choice Program, which gives veterans the option of seeking care outside the VA in certain circumstances.”

    “But Democrats balked, as almost all of them voted against the bill. As a result, it failed in a 219-186 vote, far short of the two-thirds majority needed.”

    Posted by: d.a.n at January 31, 2019 2:47 PM
    Comment #437530

    phx8, j2t2, Ed O’hrealy (a.k.a. Dumb, Dumber, Dumbest), do you also want to ban private insurance and healthcare, as Kamala Harris proposed ?

    Do you understand why that is unconstitutional?
    One would think someone in Congress would understand that.
    But, that’s the mindset of socialist extremists, who don’t have a clue about the constitution, liberty, and basic rights.

    Posted by: d.a.n at January 31, 2019 2:57 PM
    Comment #437531

    J2, I am none of those people, so yes, I would like to have mature and rational discussions on topics, without your partisan hate for all who dare disagree with you.

    There is nothing that I wrote that is not rational. Facts, beliefs and opinions that you don’t like? Sure. Irrational? No. I can defend it all with logic and reason.

    No, other first world countries do not have constitutions and rights just as we do. To say it in a nice way, theirs are centered around ‘human rights’ and what they think is best for society. Not the individual, as ours is.

    I agree, a system of health insurance that works for all American’s is rational. For myself and millions like me, that system must protect individual freedoms and be completely voluntary.

    “Trying to tell us other first world health care systems are mediocre when in fact they spend less and get better results than our system isn’t rational.”

    Actually, I said other first world countries themselves were mediocre, which they are.

    Your rant about Europe and our bases is irrelevant to the topic of healthcare. The point I was making is that those nations are only able to do what they do because of the US and the peace we ensure.

    “Using misnomers like “government controlled health care” isn’t mature nor rational.”

    Sure it is, IF one is being honest with himself. If government is paying for it, government is controlling it. It dictates how it will run, how people will be covered, how money will used, profit margins, etc… and, as we already see, government will also attempt to dictate lifestyle in order to contain costs.


    “True individual freedom cannot exist without economic security and independence. People who are hungry and out of a job are the stuff of which dictatorships are made.” FDR

    freedom: the power or right to act, speak, or think as one wants without hindrance or restraint.

    independence (self-determination): the process by which a person controls their own life.

    It is irrational to believe that one must sacrifice individual freedom and independence in order to achieve economic security.

    Posted by: kctim at January 31, 2019 3:11 PM
    Comment #437533

    “Trying to tell us other first world health care systems are mediocre when in fact they spend less and get better results than our system isn’t rational.”

    Wow, so many half-truths and outright lies to address from j2t2. I will just challenge this comment right now as we all know j2t2 is flustered when asked for facts.

    Posted by: Royal Flush at January 31, 2019 3:40 PM
    Comment #437534
    I did not bother to read all of your lies, illogical and lame excuses.

    Then how did you conclude they’re lies illogical etc? Are you lying about this too D.?

    Only a moron thinks most government-run programs are better.

    Really IMHO only a moron would tell me he didn’t read it yet makes such an assumption. And only a moron would tell us the dems voted against privatizing the VA in 2017 to prove conservatives underfunded the VA since the ‘70’s. While we are at it D. it take a special kind of moron to then ask more questions after not reading the responses. Because that question was asked and answered already had you bothered to read. Speaking of morons D., what kind of guy uses such a silly deflection to keep from responding to the facts refuting your drivel. Is it a special type of moron or just your regular run of the mill moron?

    Posted by: j2t2 at January 31, 2019 3:47 PM
    Comment #437535
    Wow, so many half-truths and outright lies to address from j2t2. I will just challenge this comment right now as we all know j2t2 is flustered when asked for facts.


    The facts are on the table Royal go fluster yourself by trying to disprove them.

    Posted by: j2t2 at January 31, 2019 3:49 PM
    Comment #437538

    So sad that my Libby Pal can’t defend his comments. He just slinks off into the night.

    Posted by: Royal Flush at January 31, 2019 4:06 PM
    Comment #437540
    I am none of those people,
    But they are right wing influencers are they not? And you are right wing kctim.
    so yes, I would like to have mature and rational discussions on topics, without your partisan hate for all who dare disagree with you.

    Kctim, I have no partisan hate towards anyone here on WB or anywhere else for that matter. While it makes it easier for you to rationalize what you don’t want to hear you are mistaken. I have zero hate in my heart, unlike many on the right.

    No, other first world countries do not have constitutions and rights just as we do. To say it in a nice way, theirs are centered around ‘human rights’ and what they think is best for society. Not the individual, as ours is.


    Well this would be a good subject for a thread wouldn’t it. In general other constitution contain many of the freedoms we enjoy. They may not have had to amend slavery out of the Constitution nor have misconstrued the intent of the 14th to include corporations as people. So I guess we will need to get more specific on this issue..

    The point I was making is that those nations are only able to do what they do because of the US and the peace we ensure.

    But this is certainly no reason to have a single payer health care system here. We chose to become the worlds cops in order to gain control of the oil in other countries.

    So one more comment we cannot yell fire in a theatre. yet your definition of freedom seems to say you think we are .

    Posted by: j2t2 at January 31, 2019 4:10 PM
    Comment #437541

    j2t2, Where is the proof that conservatives are to blame for not funding the VA? I won’t hold my breath.

    The House (24-JUL-2017) rejected legislation that would have given the Department of Veterans Affairs another $2 billion to fund the Veterans Choice Program, which gives veterans the option of seeking care outside the VA in certain circumstances.

    But most Democrats voted against the bill. As a result, it failed in a 219-186 vote, far short of the two-thirds majority needed.”

    Why would Democrats deny healthcare for Veterans, since the VA isn’t getting it done? Many Veterans can’t wait any longer. It’s despicable that Democrats voted against that bill.

    Allowing Veterans the option to use a private healthcare provider is better than waiting years to get an appointment.

    Most people of average intelligence understand that governments are almost always horrible at managing most things.
    That is because there is often no accountability.
    In fact, the systems often reward failure.

    But, many Democrats love to reward failure, blame others, try to disguise their envy and jealousy as demands for equality, and they want free stuff.

    And many Democrats don’t care if walls work, and have clearly demonstrated the depths of their depravity, by their nefarious and despicable motives, to acquire more power via more VOTES and MONEY:

    • (01) because many Democrats, most of the Main Stream Media, others on the left, and similar ilk (despicably) pit U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other for votes, by pandering to illegal immigrants for 30+ years for more votes (via more representation in the House, via more U.S. House representatives, via apportionment of representatives (i.e. more electoral votes, and more federal funding), based on population, based on the decennial CENSUS, which does not verify U.S. citizenship;
    • (02) because many Democrats are also fighting against a check-box on the CENSUS, despite the check-box being totally inadequate to prove citizenship. Democrats disguise their desire for power (for THEIR party) as compassion for illegal immigrants, while despicably pitting U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other for votes and money.
    • (03) because many Democrats (and most of the main stream media) lie about crime by illegal immigrants, and refuse to report about 2 thousand homicides per year by criminal non-citizens; 32% of everyone in federal prison is a criminal non-citizen (source: Source#3: cis.org/Huennekens/32-Federal-Inmates-Are-Aliens);
    • (04) because many Democrats (and most of the main stream media) lie about how massive illegal (or legal) immigration is costing U.S. tax payers $296+ Billion (or more) per year in net losses (which does not include all costs, and does not include the cost of crime by illegal immigrants); that is a net loss of about $2,349.00 per year per household (126.22 Million households in 2017), or $916 per year per person (U.S. population=323 Million in 2017);
    • (05) because many Democrats are calling for open borders;
    • (06) because many Democrats are calling to abolish I.C.E. (Immigration and Customs Enforcement);
    • (07) because many Democrats want another shamnesty, like the shamnesty of 1986;
    • (08) because many Democrats refuse legislation to require employers to use eVerify (to verify eligibility for employment);
    • (09) because many Democrats want to give illegal immigrants drivers’ licenses, and also automatically register them to vote;
    • (10) because many Democrats want more mayors like Libby Schaaf (Oakland, CA), who warns illegal immigrants (including criminal illegal immigrants) before an ICE raid to arrest criminal illegal immigrants;
    • (11) because many Democrats want more sanctuary cities and states, like California, where Democrats have passed sanctuary city and sanctuary state laws that protect criminal illegal immigrants (i.e. an illegal immigrant by the name of Garcia Zarate (who had already been deported 5 times) can shoot and murder Kate Steinle, and be (www.cnn.com/2017/11/30/us/kate-steinle-murder-trial-verdict/index.html)for that murder, despite Zarate admitting to shooting the weapon that killed Kate Steinle (which should have been, at the very least, manslaughter);
    • (12) because many Democrats want to abolish the 2nd amendment, but many Democrats and many on the left call for restricting or eliminating 2nd Amendment rights, and say it is worth it “even if it saves only ONE life”, but conveniently ignore about 2 thousand people killed per year by criminal non-citizens (source: www.gao.gov/assets/320/316959.pdf);

    Posted by: d.a.n at January 31, 2019 4:15 PM
    Comment #437543

    Congressional Democrats revealed their border security proposal today. Democrats unveiled a measure that would not provide money for more U.S.-Mexico border walls/fences/physical-barriers, and also denies hiring of additional border agents (according to Associated Press).

    Why? (1),…,(12) in previous comment.

    Posted by: d.a.n at January 31, 2019 4:34 PM
    Comment #437544
    So sad that my Libby Pal can’t defend his comments. He just slinks off into the night.

    Royal first of all you made some vague generalizations, whats to prove. Specifically rebut what you think is wrong. Then I will accommodate you. Second how can I slink when I haven’t went away. Sounds like wishful thinking on your part my friend.

    Posted by: j2t2 at January 31, 2019 5:23 PM
    Comment #437546

    OK j2t2, focus on the shiny object in your playpen.

    You wrote; “Trying to tell us other first world health care systems are mediocre when in fact they spend less and get better results than our system isn’t rational.”

    I challenge you to prove your claim. Can’t you understand what you wrote?

    Posted by: Royal Flush at January 31, 2019 5:30 PM
    Comment #437549
    j2t2 wrote: Specifically rebut what you think is wrong.
    Nobody would live long enough to do that.

    But, summing it up, pretty much everything you write is opinion only, and rarely backed up by any credible source.
    Have you ever lived in a country that has healthcare for all?
    Do you realize that many of those countries have MUCH smaller populations than the U.S. ? Why not leave it to the states to figure out?
    Do you know what the tax rates are in those countries with government-run healthcare ?

    Sweden: 62%
    Japan: 56%
    Austria: 55%
    Denmark: 56%
    Finland: 52%
    France: 45%
    Germany: 48%
    Greece: 45%
    Iceland: 46%
    Ireland: 48%
    Italy: 43%
    Luxembourg: 49%
    Netherlands: 52%
    Norway: 39%
    Spain: 45%
    Switzerland: 40%
    United Kingdom: 45%

    The problems with government-run healthcare is:

    • long wait times (sometimes for years)
    • lower-than-free-market wages for doctors; so the government-run system ends up with the bottom of the barrel; it can also reduce the number of people that want to pursue a medical career;
    • no accountability for malpractice; can’t sue the government;
    • rationing;
    • taxes rates grow higher every year in nations with government-run healthcare;
    • waste and fraud are already rampant in Medicare and Social Security; government-run healthcare will be no different, and will increase the national debt; it could be the last straw (if it isn’t already too late for the $21.9 Trillion national debt);
    • governments are not great at running large systems (look at the waste and fraud in any U.S. government agency, all adding up to many hundreds of billion$ and possibly over a trillion, per year);
    • it forces healthy people (not necessarily wealthy) to pay for unhealthy people (many with drug and alcohol habits); in most government-run health care systems, the sickest 5% consume 50% of all healthcare costs;
    • since it is free, and since some people would be taxed for it (regardless), they may abuse the ERs and other systems;
    • with free healthcare, some people will be more careless and engage in riskier behavior (smoking, drinking, sky diving, skin diving, etc.), becasue they know it won’t cost them; the last 6 years of life consume one-fourth of the Medicare budget, half go to the ER in their last month of life, one-third wind up in intensive care, and one-fifth undergo surgery;
    • then add free coverage for 25.9 Million illegal immigrants; and in 2010, over 30 million people did not buy health insurance (many just paid the fines);
    Despite all of the above, I am not against a non-profit federal government-run health insurance system, in which U.S. citizens can volunteer to enroll (i.e. not forced to enroll).
    IF the federal government can prove that it can provide acceptable healthcare for the same (or less) cost, and for lower monthly premiums, then it should be a great thing.
    I seriously doubt that would ever happen.
    But, if some people (like j2t2) think government-run healthcare can be done better and for less cost, then why not simply start the non-profit health insurance program (with voluntary participation) and see what happens; see if premiums end up lower than with private health insurance; what are they afraid of? Or, what is it they really want? ?
    The problem is that socialist extremists want to create and/or turn all government programs into forced participation, and a huge welfare system. A lot of people want free stuff (a lot of people that won’t be paying any, or little in the way of taxes).
    Kamala Harris’ plan to ban private health insurance is nutty (and unconstitutional; did we wake up in N. Korea today).

    Posted by: d.a.n at January 31, 2019 6:35 PM
    Comment #437558

    * [01] phx8 wrote: Thank you for cutting and pasting my comments. I stand by every single one, and I am gratified to see such consistently high quality in my work. Much appreciated.
    * [02] phx8 wrote: As for immigration, I would be fine with open borders.
    * [03] phx8 wrote: Prejudice against immigrants among U.S. white1 is NOT new … So what is happening today is NOT new, or some sort of intractable problem. Racism and bigotry from the rural, white2 crowds of Trump reflect a long American tradition of hatred.
    * [04] phx8 wrote: if Tucker Carlson wants to spread hatred and white3 nationalism on FOX, he should expect consequences.
    * [05] phx8 wrote: Tucker Carlson is a white4 nationalist. THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE PROGRAM- catering to the bigotry and racism and fears of the white5 FOX audience.
    [phx8 is essentially calling all white people that watch Tucker Carlson racists.]
    * [06] phx8 wrote: We have seen an unconstitutional effort to ban all Muslims from coming to this country.
    [That comment by phx8 is false, because the ban was for specific nations with a lot of terrorism. There was never an executive action that banned Muslims only. The Supreme Court, in the end, upheld Trump’s travel ban]
    * [07] phx8 wrote: And heavens! Immigrants, legal and illegal, might vote for Democrats! LOL. Worst excuse for bigotry - ever.
    [Not true. The issue is, based on these 12 reasons, Democrats have clearly demonstrated that they have nefarious and despicable motives, by despicably pitting U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other to acquire more power, by pandering to illegal immigrants for 30+ years, for more votes (via more representation in the House, via more U.S. House representatives, via re-apportionment of representatives (i.e. more electoral votes and more federal funding), based on population, based on the decennial CENSUS, which does not verify U.S. citizenship.]
    * [08] phx8 wrote: Not the majority. 30% [of Americans are racist] seems about right. You might wonder how that can be possible. But we are not the first country to experience this. There are plenty of fine countries with highly developed cultures that have gone a lot farther down this path than the United States, with much worse outcomes.
    * [09] phx8 wrote: In other words, it is a lie. It is a classic example of xenophobia, and the implication with “Middle Easterners” [in the caravan] is intended to stoke Islamophobia as well.
    [However, the Guatemalan President, Jimmy Morales announced in October 2018 that 100 people were arrested and deportated, who were “highly linked to terrorist groups, specifically ISIS”. Source: www.snopes.com/fact-check/isis-terrorists-guatemala-caravan/]
    * [10] phx8 wrote: Oh, for Pete’s sake! That is the worst kind of fear mongering… . That is why Trump spreads the language of hate, claiming illegal and legal immigrants have been “sent” by Mexico, that they are “criminals” and “rapists,” members of MS-13, “hardened criminals,” “no angels,” and so on.
    [Most are only looking for jobs, but many are criminals, and many have already been deported many times. Also, 1,611 U.S. citizens are killed (on average) per year by criminal non-citizens (Source: www.gao.gov/products/GAO-11-187), and 32% of all people incarcerated in federal prisons are illegal immigrants, and that does not include all types of crime by illegal immigrants (Source: (Source#1: Source#3: cis.org/Huennekens/32-Federal-Inmates-Are-Aliens ; Source#2: www.fairus.org/issue/illegal-immigration/examples-serious-crimes-illegal-aliens/ ];
    * [11] phx8 wrote: So, yeah. A U.S. President declaring ‘I’m a nationalist’ scares the crap out of anyone who knows anything about history.
    * [12] phx8 wrote: Another reason the GOP continues shrinking is the fact that it is a party of ideology, unlike the Democrats, who are a coalition party. The idea that Republicans have “diversity of thinking” is laughable.
    * [13] phx8 wrote: And I do not subscribe to your thinking that only white6 men can represent women; that only white7 men can represent blacks; and so on.
    [Another lie by phx8, since no one here ever wrote that].
    * [14] phx8 wrote: There is a good chance today, Friday, will end with indictments.
    [another failed prediction (of many)]
    * [15] phx8 wrote: There are the racists, bigots, xenophobes, Islamophobes, and misogynists who support Trump, and there are those who are willing to overlook such vile stuff.
    * [16] phx8 wrote: Ohrealy is right. If d.a.n. continues cutting and pasting those long posts he should be banned. Don’t think I’ve ever called for a person to be banned from this site.
    * [17] phx8 wrote: The GOP resulted to the unfavorable demographic squeeze of the past decades by rejecting the change, and doubling down on its dwindling base of ageing white8, rural males with high school education or less.
    * [18] phx8 wrote: For the incoming 116th Congressional Republicans, there are 29 white9 males in the House, and one female. Overall, the House GOP will consist of 90% white10 males.
    * [19] phx8 wrote: The Democrats are incredibly diverse, including blacks, Muslims, and LGBT, representing the make-up of America. The Republicans? Eh, not so much. Just white11 identity politics as usual.
    * [20] phx8 wrote: Are you just g*ddamn stupid…
    * [21] phx8 wrote: Sweet J*sus, you are such a total waste of time. WTF.
    * [22] phx8 wrote: Prognosticators have successfully predicted 10 out of the last 7 recessions.
    [HMmmm…. 10 out of 7 ? math is not phx8’s strong suit? ].
    * [23] phx8 wrote (27-DEC-2018): That would also explain the wild gyrations in the stock markets. Earlier this year I predicted Trump would be impeached by May. I will stand by that prediction. IT will require a lot of Republican senators, and I think we are very near to the point where the evidence of Trump’s criminality and treason will be so overwhelming, there will be national agreement that he has to go.
    * [24] phx8 wrote: What it means is that, whereas Nixon and Bush #43 saw their approval ratings drop into the 20’s and even teens, the Trump floor may remain, with the 30% or so of the deplorables supporting the agenda of white12 identity politics no matter how bad the corruption gets, because very simply, white13 identity politics for that 30% is MUCH more important than honest governance or our democratic system.
    * [25] phx8 wrote: AOL [AOC (Alexandria Ocasio Cortez)] is awesome. You are seeing the future. She is charismatic, her political instincts are excellent, and she has already proven adept at using social media. This is what Millennial politics will look like. She is only 29 and she has a lot to learn. But she [AOC] comes from a generation that was destroyed by conservative Republican politics. An entire generation found itself graduating from college with enormous debts, health care was unaffordable, and Global Warming threatened the long term future of the planet; meanwhile, thanks to tax cuts and corruption, the wealth of the past four decades was increasingly concentrated at the top, even as federal deficits and the national debt ballooned. (By the way, the national debt has increased $2 trillion in just 2 years under Trump, and the deficit has increased to nearly a trillion). She is the political forerunner of a generation that is tolerant of race, gender, and religion, and intolerant of the racism of Trump and his ilk. Is it any wonder conservatives are both fixated and terrified of her? They should be. She [AOC] is the future, and that future does not include the darkness and greed and destructiveness offered by conservatism. To paraphrase AOL [AOC (Alexandria Ocasio Cortez)]: the dark hates the light.
    * [26] phx8 wrote: The Trump supporters fell for it because Trump played to the darkest, basest part of the American character, racism and bigotry.
    * [27] phx8 wrote: Remember all those slack jawed inbreds wearing MAGA hats?
    * [28] phx8 wrote about this comment: Gawd, another thread ruined by a Neo-Nazi post.
    * [29] phx8 wrote: And if anyone cares, Politifact and Snopes both offer detailed rebuttals of the false statistics posted by d.a.n. the Neo-Nazi.
    [Not true. IF phx8, j2t2, or ohrealy had any evidence, they would have posted the proof a long time ago. ]
    * [30] phx8 wrote: And remember, Trump is treason. I said it when traitor Roy Ellis encouraged everyone to run off and view Wikileaks during the 2016 campaign … I have said it many times since then. And I will say it yet once more. Trump is treason… . How will you justify supporting a traitor [i.e. Trump]?

    Posted by: phx8 at January 31, 2019 10:51 PM
    Comment #437584

    Great. Please do that (confessions) 3 times per day.

    Posted by: D.a.n at February 1, 2019 7:18 AM
    Comment #437590

    J2,
    You gave examples of people that you consider irrational because they disagree with your wants and worldview. You then asked “where is the mature and rational on the right?” and I am giving it to you.
    Don’t try to avoid things by deflecting to “influencers”.

    “I have no partisan hate towards anyone here on WB or anywhere else for that matter.”

    You have become so consumed by partisan hatred, J2. You never used to treat those you disagree with in such a hateful way.
    Leftists avoid facts and debate by screaming racist, sexist, fascist etc… at all who dare disagree with them, and after years and years on WB with you, it sucks to say that you have resorted to those same unfair and dishonest tactics.

    “Well this would be a good subject for a thread wouldn’t it.”

    Yes it would. I always enjoy discussing individual rights vs. the desires of society.

    “But this is certainly no reason to have a single payer health care system here.”

    It is but only one of the many many reasons for us to avoid a single payer health care system. If any of those nations had to start pumping tens of billions of dollars into their own security, all of their government programs would suffer the effects of it.

    “We chose to become the worlds cops in order to gain control of the oil in other countries.”

    Again, that has absolutely nothing to do with their healthcare systems.

    “So one more comment we cannot yell fire in a theatre. yet your definition of freedom seems to say you think we are”

    That is a dictionary definition, not mine. And yes, on this and most other issues, leftists basically ‘scream fire in a crowded theater’ until they get their way.

    Posted by: kctim at February 1, 2019 9:43 AM
    Comment #437592

    * [01] phx8 wrote: Thank you for cutting and pasting my comments. I stand by every single one, and I am gratified to see such consistently high quality in my work. Much appreciated.
    * [02] phx8 wrote: As for immigration, I would be fine with open borders.
    * [03] phx8 wrote: Prejudice against immigrants among U.S. white1 is NOT new … So what is happening today is NOT new, or some sort of intractable problem. Racism and bigotry from the rural, white2 crowds of Trump reflect a long American tradition of hatred.
    * [04] phx8 wrote: if Tucker Carlson wants to spread hatred and white3 nationalism on FOX, he should expect consequences.
    * [05] phx8 wrote: Tucker Carlson is a white4 nationalist. THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE PROGRAM- catering to the bigotry and racism and fears of the white5 FOX audience.
    [phx8 is essentially calling all white people that watch Tucker Carlson racists.]
    * [06] phx8 wrote: We have seen an unconstitutional effort to ban all Muslims from coming to this country.
    [That comment by phx8 is false, because the ban was for specific nations with a lot of terrorism. There was never an executive action that banned Muslims only. The Supreme Court, in the end, upheld Trump’s travel ban]
    * [07] phx8 wrote: And heavens! Immigrants, legal and illegal, might vote for Democrats! LOL. Worst excuse for bigotry - ever.
    [Not true. The issue is, based on these 12 reasons, Democrats have clearly demonstrated that they have nefarious and despicable motives, by despicably pitting U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other to acquire more power, by pandering to illegal immigrants for 30+ years, for more votes (via more representation in the House, via more U.S. House representatives, via re-apportionment of representatives (i.e. more electoral votes and more federal funding), based on population, based on the decennial CENSUS, which does not verify U.S. citizenship.]
    * [08] phx8 wrote: Not the majority. 30% [of Americans are racist] seems about right. You might wonder how that can be possible. But we are not the first country to experience this. There are plenty of fine countries with highly developed cultures that have gone a lot farther down this path than the United States, with much worse outcomes.
    * [09] phx8 wrote: In other words, it is a lie. It is a classic example of xenophobia, and the implication with “Middle Easterners” [in the caravan] is intended to stoke Islamophobia as well.
    [However, the Guatemalan President, Jimmy Morales announced in October 2018 that 100 people were arrested and deportated, who were “highly linked to terrorist groups, specifically ISIS”. Source: www.snopes.com/fact-check/isis-terrorists-guatemala-caravan/]
    * [10] phx8 wrote: Oh, for Pete’s sake! That is the worst kind of fear mongering… . That is why Trump spreads the language of hate, claiming illegal and legal immigrants have been “sent” by Mexico, that they are “criminals” and “rapists,” members of MS-13, “hardened criminals,” “no angels,” and so on.
    [Most are only looking for jobs, but many are criminals, and many have already been deported many times. Also, 1,611 U.S. citizens are killed (on average) per year by criminal non-citizens (Source: www.gao.gov/products/GAO-11-187), and 32% of all people incarcerated in federal prisons are illegal immigrants, and that does not include all types of crime by illegal immigrants (Source: (Source#1: Source#3: cis.org/Huennekens/32-Federal-Inmates-Are-Aliens ; Source#2: www.fairus.org/issue/illegal-immigration/examples-serious-crimes-illegal-aliens/ ];
    * [11] phx8 wrote: So, yeah. A U.S. President declaring ‘I’m a nationalist’ scares the crap out of anyone who knows anything about history.
    * [12] phx8 wrote: Another reason the GOP continues shrinking is the fact that it is a party of ideology, unlike the Democrats, who are a coalition party. The idea that Republicans have “diversity of thinking” is laughable.
    * [13] phx8 wrote: And I do not subscribe to your thinking that only white6 men can represent women; that only white7 men can represent blacks; and so on.
    [Another lie by phx8, since no one here ever wrote that].
    * [14] phx8 wrote: There is a good chance today, Friday, will end with indictments.
    [another failed prediction (of many)]
    * [15] phx8 wrote: There are the racists, bigots, xenophobes, Islamophobes, and misogynists who support Trump, and there are those who are willing to overlook such vile stuff.
    * [16] phx8 wrote: Ohrealy is right. If d.a.n. continues cutting and pasting those long posts he should be banned. Don’t think I’ve ever called for a person to be banned from this site.
    * [17] phx8 wrote: The GOP resulted to the unfavorable demographic squeeze of the past decades by rejecting the change, and doubling down on its dwindling base of ageing white8, rural males with high school education or less.
    * [18] phx8 wrote: For the incoming 116th Congressional Republicans, there are 29 white9 males in the House, and one female. Overall, the House GOP will consist of 90% white10 males.
    * [19] phx8 wrote: The Democrats are incredibly diverse, including blacks, Muslims, and LGBT, representing the make-up of America. The Republicans? Eh, not so much. Just white11 identity politics as usual.
    * [20] phx8 wrote: Are you just g*ddamn stupid…
    * [21] phx8 wrote: Sweet J*sus, you are such a total waste of time. WTF.
    * [22] phx8 wrote: Prognosticators have successfully predicted 10 out of the last 7 recessions.
    [HMmmm…. 10 out of 7 ? math is not phx8’s strong suit? ].
    * [23] phx8 wrote (27-DEC-2018): That would also explain the wild gyrations in the stock markets. Earlier this year I predicted Trump would be impeached by May. I will stand by that prediction. IT will require a lot of Republican senators, and I think we are very near to the point where the evidence of Trump’s criminality and treason will be so overwhelming, there will be national agreement that he has to go.
    * [24] phx8 wrote: What it means is that, whereas Nixon and Bush #43 saw their approval ratings drop into the 20’s and even teens, the Trump floor may remain, with the 30% or so of the deplorables supporting the agenda of white12 identity politics no matter how bad the corruption gets, because very simply, white13 identity politics for that 30% is MUCH more important than honest governance or our democratic system.
    * [25] phx8 wrote: AOL [AOC (Alexandria Ocasio Cortez)] is awesome. You are seeing the future. She is charismatic, her political instincts are excellent, and she has already proven adept at using social media. This is what Millennial politics will look like. She is only 29 and she has a lot to learn. But she [AOC] comes from a generation that was destroyed by conservative Republican politics. An entire generation found itself graduating from college with enormous debts, health care was unaffordable, and Global Warming threatened the long term future of the planet; meanwhile, thanks to tax cuts and corruption, the wealth of the past four decades was increasingly concentrated at the top, even as federal deficits and the national debt ballooned. (By the way, the national debt has increased $2 trillion in just 2 years under Trump, and the deficit has increased to nearly a trillion). She is the political forerunner of a generation that is tolerant of race, gender, and religion, and intolerant of the racism of Trump and his ilk. Is it any wonder conservatives are both fixated and terrified of her? They should be. She [AOC] is the future, and that future does not include the darkness and greed and destructiveness offered by conservatism. To paraphrase AOL [AOC (Alexandria Ocasio Cortez)]: the dark hates the light.
    * [26] phx8 wrote: The Trump supporters fell for it because Trump played to the darkest, basest part of the American character, racism and bigotry.
    * [27] phx8 wrote: Remember all those slack jawed inbreds wearing MAGA hats?
    * [28] phx8 wrote about this comment: Gawd, another thread ruined by a Neo-Nazi post.
    * [29] phx8 wrote: And if anyone cares, Politifact and Snopes both offer detailed rebuttals of the false statistics posted by d.a.n. the Neo-Nazi.
    [Not true. IF phx8, j2t2, or ohrealy had any evidence, they would have posted the proof a long time ago. ]
    * [30] phx8 wrote: And remember, Trump is treason. I said it when traitor Roy Ellis encouraged everyone to run off and view Wikileaks during the 2016 campaign … I have said it many times since then. And I will say it yet once more. Trump is treason… . How will you justify supporting a traitor [i.e. Trump]?

    Posted by: phx8 at February 1, 2019 9:56 AM
    Comment #437594

    This is really easy.

    * [01] phx8 wrote: Thank you for cutting and pasting my comments. I stand by every single one, and I am gratified to see such consistently high quality in my work. Much appreciated.
    * [02] phx8 wrote: As for immigration, I would be fine with open borders.
    * [03] phx8 wrote: Prejudice against immigrants among U.S. white1 is NOT new … So what is happening today is NOT new, or some sort of intractable problem. Racism and bigotry from the rural, white2 crowds of Trump reflect a long American tradition of hatred.
    * [04] phx8 wrote: if Tucker Carlson wants to spread hatred and white3 nationalism on FOX, he should expect consequences.
    * [05] phx8 wrote: Tucker Carlson is a white4 nationalist. THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE PROGRAM- catering to the bigotry and racism and fears of the white5 FOX audience.
    [phx8 is essentially calling all white people that watch Tucker Carlson racists.]
    * [06] phx8 wrote: We have seen an unconstitutional effort to ban all Muslims from coming to this country.
    [That comment by phx8 is false, because the ban was for specific nations with a lot of terrorism. There was never an executive action that banned Muslims only. The Supreme Court, in the end, upheld Trump’s travel ban]
    * [07] phx8 wrote: And heavens! Immigrants, legal and illegal, might vote for Democrats! LOL. Worst excuse for bigotry - ever.
    [Not true. The issue is, based on these 12 reasons, Democrats have clearly demonstrated that they have nefarious and despicable motives, by despicably pitting U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other to acquire more power, by pandering to illegal immigrants for 30+ years, for more votes (via more representation in the House, via more U.S. House representatives, via re-apportionment of representatives (i.e. more electoral votes and more federal funding), based on population, based on the decennial CENSUS, which does not verify U.S. citizenship.]
    * [08] phx8 wrote: Not the majority. 30% [of Americans are racist] seems about right. You might wonder how that can be possible. But we are not the first country to experience this. There are plenty of fine countries with highly developed cultures that have gone a lot farther down this path than the United States, with much worse outcomes.
    * [09] phx8 wrote: In other words, it is a lie. It is a classic example of xenophobia, and the implication with “Middle Easterners” [in the caravan] is intended to stoke Islamophobia as well.
    [However, the Guatemalan President, Jimmy Morales announced in October 2018 that 100 people were arrested and deportated, who were “highly linked to terrorist groups, specifically ISIS”. Source: www.snopes.com/fact-check/isis-terrorists-guatemala-caravan/]
    * [10] phx8 wrote: Oh, for Pete’s sake! That is the worst kind of fear mongering… . That is why Trump spreads the language of hate, claiming illegal and legal immigrants have been “sent” by Mexico, that they are “criminals” and “rapists,” members of MS-13, “hardened criminals,” “no angels,” and so on.
    [Most are only looking for jobs, but many are criminals, and many have already been deported many times. Also, 1,611 U.S. citizens are killed (on average) per year by criminal non-citizens (Source: www.gao.gov/products/GAO-11-187), and 32% of all people incarcerated in federal prisons are illegal immigrants, and that does not include all types of crime by illegal immigrants (Source: (Source#1: Source#3: cis.org/Huennekens/32-Federal-Inmates-Are-Aliens ; Source#2: www.fairus.org/issue/illegal-immigration/examples-serious-crimes-illegal-aliens/ ];
    * [11] phx8 wrote: So, yeah. A U.S. President declaring ‘I’m a nationalist’ scares the crap out of anyone who knows anything about history.
    * [12] phx8 wrote: Another reason the GOP continues shrinking is the fact that it is a party of ideology, unlike the Democrats, who are a coalition party. The idea that Republicans have “diversity of thinking” is laughable.
    * [13] phx8 wrote: And I do not subscribe to your thinking that only white6 men can represent women; that only white7 men can represent blacks; and so on.
    [Another lie by phx8, since no one here ever wrote that].
    * [14] phx8 wrote: There is a good chance today, Friday, will end with indictments.
    [another failed prediction (of many)]
    * [15] phx8 wrote: There are the racists, bigots, xenophobes, Islamophobes, and misogynists who support Trump, and there are those who are willing to overlook such vile stuff.
    * [16] phx8 wrote: Ohrealy is right. If d.a.n. continues cutting and pasting those long posts he should be banned. Don’t think I’ve ever called for a person to be banned from this site.
    * [17] phx8 wrote: The GOP resulted to the unfavorable demographic squeeze of the past decades by rejecting the change, and doubling down on its dwindling base of ageing white8, rural males with high school education or less.
    * [18] phx8 wrote: For the incoming 116th Congressional Republicans, there are 29 white9 males in the House, and one female. Overall, the House GOP will consist of 90% white10 males.
    * [19] phx8 wrote: The Democrats are incredibly diverse, including blacks, Muslims, and LGBT, representing the make-up of America. The Republicans? Eh, not so much. Just white11 identity politics as usual.
    * [20] phx8 wrote: Are you just g*ddamn stupid…
    * [21] phx8 wrote: Sweet J*sus, you are such a total waste of time. WTF.
    * [22] phx8 wrote: Prognosticators have successfully predicted 10 out of the last 7 recessions.
    [HMmmm…. 10 out of 7 ? math is not phx8’s strong suit? ].
    * [23] phx8 wrote (27-DEC-2018): That would also explain the wild gyrations in the stock markets. Earlier this year I predicted Trump would be impeached by May. I will stand by that prediction. IT will require a lot of Republican senators, and I think we are very near to the point where the evidence of Trump’s criminality and treason will be so overwhelming, there will be national agreement that he has to go.
    * [24] phx8 wrote: What it means is that, whereas Nixon and Bush #43 saw their approval ratings drop into the 20’s and even teens, the Trump floor may remain, with the 30% or so of the deplorables supporting the agenda of white12 identity politics no matter how bad the corruption gets, because very simply, white13 identity politics for that 30% is MUCH more important than honest governance or our democratic system.
    * [25] phx8 wrote: AOL [AOC (Alexandria Ocasio Cortez)] is awesome. You are seeing the future. She is charismatic, her political instincts are excellent, and she has already proven adept at using social media. This is what Millennial politics will look like. She is only 29 and she has a lot to learn. But she [AOC] comes from a generation that was destroyed by conservative Republican politics. An entire generation found itself graduating from college with enormous debts, health care was unaffordable, and Global Warming threatened the long term future of the planet; meanwhile, thanks to tax cuts and corruption, the wealth of the past four decades was increasingly concentrated at the top, even as federal deficits and the national debt ballooned. (By the way, the national debt has increased $2 trillion in just 2 years under Trump, and the deficit has increased to nearly a trillion). She is the political forerunner of a generation that is tolerant of race, gender, and religion, and intolerant of the racism of Trump and his ilk. Is it any wonder conservatives are both fixated and terrified of her? They should be. She [AOC] is the future, and that future does not include the darkness and greed and destructiveness offered by conservatism. To paraphrase AOL [AOC (Alexandria Ocasio Cortez)]: the dark hates the light.
    * [26] phx8 wrote: The Trump supporters fell for it because Trump played to the darkest, basest part of the American character, racism and bigotry.
    * [27] phx8 wrote: Remember all those slack jawed inbreds wearing MAGA hats?
    * [28] phx8 wrote about this comment: Gawd, another thread ruined by a Neo-Nazi post.
    * [29] phx8 wrote: And if anyone cares, Politifact and Snopes both offer detailed rebuttals of the false statistics posted by d.a.n. the Neo-Nazi.
    [Not true. IF phx8, j2t2, or ohrealy had any evidence, they would have posted the proof a long time ago. ]
    * [30] phx8 wrote: And remember, Trump is treason. I said it when traitor Roy Ellis encouraged everyone to run off and view Wikileaks during the 2016 campaign … I have said it many times since then. And I will say it yet once more. Trump is treason… . How will you justify supporting a traitor [i.e. Trump]?

    Posted by: phx8 at February 1, 2019 9:58 AM
    Comment #437596

    Here you go-

    * [01] phx8 wrote: Thank you for cutting and pasting my comments. I stand by every single one, and I am gratified to see such consistently high quality in my work. Much appreciated.
    * [02] phx8 wrote: As for immigration, I would be fine with open borders.
    * [03] phx8 wrote: Prejudice against immigrants among U.S. white1 is NOT new … So what is happening today is NOT new, or some sort of intractable problem. Racism and bigotry from the rural, white2 crowds of Trump reflect a long American tradition of hatred.
    * [04] phx8 wrote: if Tucker Carlson wants to spread hatred and white3 nationalism on FOX, he should expect consequences.
    * [05] phx8 wrote: Tucker Carlson is a white4 nationalist. THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE PROGRAM- catering to the bigotry and racism and fears of the white5 FOX audience.
    [phx8 is essentially calling all white people that watch Tucker Carlson racists.]
    * [06] phx8 wrote: We have seen an unconstitutional effort to ban all Muslims from coming to this country.
    [That comment by phx8 is false, because the ban was for specific nations with a lot of terrorism. There was never an executive action that banned Muslims only. The Supreme Court, in the end, upheld Trump’s travel ban]
    * [07] phx8 wrote: And heavens! Immigrants, legal and illegal, might vote for Democrats! LOL. Worst excuse for bigotry - ever.
    [Not true. The issue is, based on these 12 reasons, Democrats have clearly demonstrated that they have nefarious and despicable motives, by despicably pitting U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other to acquire more power, by pandering to illegal immigrants for 30+ years, for more votes (via more representation in the House, via more U.S. House representatives, via re-apportionment of representatives (i.e. more electoral votes and more federal funding), based on population, based on the decennial CENSUS, which does not verify U.S. citizenship.]
    * [08] phx8 wrote: Not the majority. 30% [of Americans are racist] seems about right. You might wonder how that can be possible. But we are not the first country to experience this. There are plenty of fine countries with highly developed cultures that have gone a lot farther down this path than the United States, with much worse outcomes.
    * [09] phx8 wrote: In other words, it is a lie. It is a classic example of xenophobia, and the implication with “Middle Easterners” [in the caravan] is intended to stoke Islamophobia as well.
    [However, the Guatemalan President, Jimmy Morales announced in October 2018 that 100 people were arrested and deportated, who were “highly linked to terrorist groups, specifically ISIS”. Source: www.snopes.com/fact-check/isis-terrorists-guatemala-caravan/]
    * [10] phx8 wrote: Oh, for Pete’s sake! That is the worst kind of fear mongering… . That is why Trump spreads the language of hate, claiming illegal and legal immigrants have been “sent” by Mexico, that they are “criminals” and “rapists,” members of MS-13, “hardened criminals,” “no angels,” and so on.
    [Most are only looking for jobs, but many are criminals, and many have already been deported many times. Also, 1,611 U.S. citizens are killed (on average) per year by criminal non-citizens (Source: www.gao.gov/products/GAO-11-187), and 32% of all people incarcerated in federal prisons are illegal immigrants, and that does not include all types of crime by illegal immigrants (Source: (Source#1: Source#3: cis.org/Huennekens/32-Federal-Inmates-Are-Aliens ; Source#2: www.fairus.org/issue/illegal-immigration/examples-serious-crimes-illegal-aliens/ ];
    * [11] phx8 wrote: So, yeah. A U.S. President declaring ‘I’m a nationalist’ scares the crap out of anyone who knows anything about history.
    * [12] phx8 wrote: Another reason the GOP continues shrinking is the fact that it is a party of ideology, unlike the Democrats, who are a coalition party. The idea that Republicans have “diversity of thinking” is laughable.
    * [13] phx8 wrote: And I do not subscribe to your thinking that only white6 men can represent women; that only white7 men can represent blacks; and so on.
    [Another lie by phx8, since no one here ever wrote that].
    * [14] phx8 wrote: There is a good chance today, Friday, will end with indictments.
    [another failed prediction (of many)]
    * [15] phx8 wrote: There are the racists, bigots, xenophobes, Islamophobes, and misogynists who support Trump, and there are those who are willing to overlook such vile stuff.
    * [16] phx8 wrote: Ohrealy is right. If d.a.n. continues cutting and pasting those long posts he should be banned. Don’t think I’ve ever called for a person to be banned from this site.
    * [17] phx8 wrote: The GOP resulted to the unfavorable demographic squeeze of the past decades by rejecting the change, and doubling down on its dwindling base of ageing white8, rural males with high school education or less.
    * [18] phx8 wrote: For the incoming 116th Congressional Republicans, there are 29 white9 males in the House, and one female. Overall, the House GOP will consist of 90% white10 males.
    * [19] phx8 wrote: The Democrats are incredibly diverse, including blacks, Muslims, and LGBT, representing the make-up of America. The Republicans? Eh, not so much. Just white11 identity politics as usual.
    * [20] phx8 wrote: Are you just g*ddamn stupid…
    * [21] phx8 wrote: Sweet J*sus, you are such a total waste of time. WTF.
    * [22] phx8 wrote: Prognosticators have successfully predicted 10 out of the last 7 recessions.
    [HMmmm…. 10 out of 7 ? math is not phx8’s strong suit? ].
    * [23] phx8 wrote (27-DEC-2018): That would also explain the wild gyrations in the stock markets. Earlier this year I predicted Trump would be impeached by May. I will stand by that prediction. IT will require a lot of Republican senators, and I think we are very near to the point where the evidence of Trump’s criminality and treason will be so overwhelming, there will be national agreement that he has to go.
    * [24] phx8 wrote: What it means is that, whereas Nixon and Bush #43 saw their approval ratings drop into the 20’s and even teens, the Trump floor may remain, with the 30% or so of the deplorables supporting the agenda of white12 identity politics no matter how bad the corruption gets, because very simply, white13 identity politics for that 30% is MUCH more important than honest governance or our democratic system.
    * [25] phx8 wrote: AOL [AOC (Alexandria Ocasio Cortez)] is awesome. You are seeing the future. She is charismatic, her political instincts are excellent, and she has already proven adept at using social media. This is what Millennial politics will look like. She is only 29 and she has a lot to learn. But she [AOC] comes from a generation that was destroyed by conservative Republican politics. An entire generation found itself graduating from college with enormous debts, health care was unaffordable, and Global Warming threatened the long term future of the planet; meanwhile, thanks to tax cuts and corruption, the wealth of the past four decades was increasingly concentrated at the top, even as federal deficits and the national debt ballooned. (By the way, the national debt has increased $2 trillion in just 2 years under Trump, and the deficit has increased to nearly a trillion). She is the political forerunner of a generation that is tolerant of race, gender, and religion, and intolerant of the racism of Trump and his ilk. Is it any wonder conservatives are both fixated and terrified of her? They should be. She [AOC] is the future, and that future does not include the darkness and greed and destructiveness offered by conservatism. To paraphrase AOL [AOC (Alexandria Ocasio Cortez)]: the dark hates the light.
    * [26] phx8 wrote: The Trump supporters fell for it because Trump played to the darkest, basest part of the American character, racism and bigotry.
    * [27] phx8 wrote: Remember all those slack jawed inbreds wearing MAGA hats?
    * [28] phx8 wrote about this comment: Gawd, another thread ruined by a Neo-Nazi post.
    * [29] phx8 wrote: And if anyone cares, Politifact and Snopes both offer detailed rebuttals of the false statistics posted by d.a.n. the Neo-Nazi.
    [Not true. IF phx8, j2t2, or ohrealy had any evidence, they would have posted the proof a long time ago. ]
    * [30] phx8 wrote: And remember, Trump is treason. I said it when traitor Roy Ellis encouraged everyone to run off and view Wikileaks during the 2016 campaign … I have said it many times since then. And I will say it yet once more. Trump is treason… . How will you justify supporting a traitor [i.e. Trump]?

    Posted by: phx8 at February 1, 2019 10:00 AM
    Comment #437598

    Great! Your “great” comments are certainly something to be proud of, eh?
    Of course, most people would be ashamed. But not you [phx8], j2t2, or ohrealy, because you revel in the depth of your depravity (as shown here).

    However, IF your “great” comments are so great, why do you refuse to answer the following questions about your “great” comments ?

    phx8 wrote: I said it when traitor Roy Ellis encouraged everyone to run off and view Wikileaks during the 2016 campaign.
    Why does that make Roy Ellis a traitor?
    phx8 wrote: Remember all those slack jawed inbreds wearing MAGA hats?
    Do you think MAGA hats should be banned? Why?

    Above, you make 13 derogatory references to “white” people.
    Why do you hate “white” people ?

    Why not tell us, since they are such “great” comments?

    Posted by: d.a.n at February 1, 2019 11:10 AM
    Comment #437608

    The Democrat Party at one time was the party of the working man and woman. They would advocate for lower taxes, more employment and better wages. I usually supported these efforts.

    Today, the Democrat Party does’t give a damn about working men and women and champions those who won’t work preferring to suck the blood of those who do. When unions lost most of their political power the Left had to find a new power base.

    They now find limited political power in the illegal immigrant community, in the morally bankrupt community of gender, age, s*x, ethnicity, and race hatred; and the community that desires the fruits of those who do work and produce.

    I look forward to the Democrat nominees for president yelling we want our “FAIR SHARE”. For them, and those who listen to them, “fair share” is that portion of my wages and assets they wish to confiscate.

    Posted by: Royal Flush at February 1, 2019 2:32 PM
    Comment #437614

    Yeah, One of the most prominent character traits of socialist extremists is “selfishness” and “laziness” (a.k.a. “sloth” ; one of the 7 deadly sins). That’s why they want free stuff, love the idea of huge government-run systems that will take care of them from cradle-to-grave, and wipe their lazy butts for them. That’s because they want someone else to pay for all of it. The feel like they are entitled to it. They try to rationalize and disguise their envy and jealousy as demands for equality. Pathetic. Much like this.

    Posted by: d.a.n at February 1, 2019 3:25 PM
    Comment #437616

    d.a.n., now, some Democrat’s running for president are not content with taking our earned income and wealth, they also wish to take away our health care and replace it with some new form of Obamacare.

    177,000,000 Americans will lose their health care if these morons are successful. I paid into Medicare nearly all my working life. Now that doesn’t count, and my contributions are pissed away into the wind.

    Obama made all kinks of promises to get Obamacare passed. Not a single promise, made to the public, has been kept. All were lies and the Democrats knew they were lies.

    Posted by: Royal Flush at February 1, 2019 3:57 PM
    Comment #437618

    Royal Flush, You are right. You know as most people with average intelligence also know, that allowing the government to acquire control ALL healthcare (and ban private health care and insurance like Kamala Harris proposed) is a recipe for disaster. It could be the last straw.

    The current system is not perfect, but government-run healthcare is not the solution.

    I would challenge the federal government to start a 100% non-profit health care and insurance system that is funded by the lowest-possible monthly premiums from people that can’t get insurance anywhere else.

    IF the federal government can administer that system as efficiently (without subsidies and tax revenues) and for the same or less cost as the average efficiency and cost as the private healthcare system, then that would be great, and it should continue that government-run system. There’s nothing stopping the federal government from do that.

    But you know as well as I do, that there are nefarious motives of many Democrats and for the socialist extremists, which is to take over the entire system, and acquire 100% control (and possibly ban private healthcare and insurance systems). That is not only un-American, it is unconstitutional. Imagine the mindset of the people that believe they have the right to ban private healthcare and insurance systems?

    Currently, Medicare fraud is about $70 Billion per year (and increasingly worse every year). Waste and fraud in the federal government is hundred$ of Billions per year. Look how horribly the Veterans are treated by the government-run VA healthcare system. Look at the billion$ lost per year due to Social Security fraud. Only a total moron (i.e. socialist extremist) would think that a new 100% government-run healthcare system would be better.

    I am too young to draw Social Security and Medicare, but it would not surprise me if they both go bankrupt before I reach the age of eligibility (after paying into it already for over 43 years). I am actually amazed that they have not already imploded from the crushing $22 Trillion national debt (which is growing by about $1 Trillion per year). However, IF the socialist extremists get control of the healthcare system, it will be the last straw. Like death by 1,000 cuts, the federal government will finally implode under the massive and rapid growth of the $22 Trillion national debt, which is already at nightmare proportions.

    Yes, you are right about the lies and corruption.
    Lies, Scandals, Fraud, and Despicable Release of Criminals from Prison by the Obama administration:

    • (001) Remember, Obama said: “Unlike some, I actually try to state facts. I believe in facts. I believe in a fact-based reality, and a fact-based politics.”
    • However, Obamacare cost Americans billion$ in losses (possibly, worse).
      • Remember, Obama said: “[Health Insurance] Premiums will be lowered by $2500”;
      • Remember, Obama said: “If you like your doctor, you can keep him, PERIOD.”;
      • Remember, Obama said: “If you like your health insurance, you can keep it, PERIOD!”;
      • After 5 years, Obamacare has failed miserably on 4 important metrics (cost, coverage, competition, and choice):
      • fewer health insurance providers, and none in some counties;
          Source: time.com/money/4503325/obama-health-care-costs-obamacare/
      • Five years later, it is clear that Obamacare failed:
          Source: www.forbes.com/sites/sallypipes/2015/03/23/obamacare-at-five-years-old-a-disappointment/#25d817506ad2
      • Many people’s deductibles trippled, the max-out-of-pocket doubled, and the annual premiums trippled (but on the upside, they now have coverage for things they don’t need).
    • (002) There were a record number of people collecting food stamps under the 8 years of Obama.
    • (003) Obama did not have a clue about economics, and said GDP could never rise about 2.0%. Yet, in 2018, GDP reached 4.2% (during Trump’s 2nd year).
    • (004) Obama said jobs that went off-shore are NEVER coming back. Yet, many corporations, money, and jobs ARE returning to the U.S. due to the common-sense reduction of the corporate tax from 35% to 21% (closer to the global average of 20%)
    • (005) “I will have the most transparent administration.”;
    • (006) “I have shovel ready jobs.”;
    • (007) “The IRS is not targeting anyone.”; [Lois Lerner was never indicted, but should have been (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lois_Lerner)];
    • (008) “If four Americans get killed…uh…. it is not optimal.” [re: Benghazi]: www.floppingaces.net/2012/10/20/obama-youtube-video-disgusting-four-americans-dead-not-optimal-reader-post/ ];
    • (009) “Benghazi was because of a youtubevideo.”; [Another disgusting lie; Hillary Clinton and Susan Rice also lied about what happened; Obama went along with all of it.];
    • (010) “ObamaCare will be good for America.”; [In Maryland, Obama celebrated 60,000 Obamacare signups, BUT 73,000 lost insurance BECAUSE OF Obamacare!];
    • (011) New Record: Price of Gas was greater than $3 per Gallon for consecutive 1,245 Days (3.41 years);
    • (012) “I did not say you could keep your health care.” [Regardless that 29 recorded videos show Obama did say EXCACTLY that];
    • (013) “No one making less than $250,000 will see their taxes raised one dime.”; Opppsss…that was B.S.
    • (014) “If I had a son…”; [This is not the only time Obama racially pre-judged an incident incorrectly];
    • (015) “I will put an end to the type of politics that “breeds division, conflict and cynicism”.; [Laughable].
    • (016) “You didn’t build that.”; [This reveals a lot about Obama’s philosophy: www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKjPI6no5ng ];
    • (017) “I will restore trust in Government.”; [laughable]
    • (018) “The Cambridge police acted stupidly.”; [This is not the only time Obama racially pre-judged an incident incorrectly];
    • (019) “I am not after your guns.”; [D.C. 23-year-old gun ban, which Obama had supported, was over-turned by the Supreme Court];
    • (020) “The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure.” [Senator Obama of 2006; yet, Obama set an all-time new record of spending, by doubling the national debt, leaving it at $20 Trillion by the end of 2016];
    • (021) “I have been practicing…I bowled a 129. It’s like — it was like Special Olympics.”; [HHMMmmm…that’s not nice, but it is doubtful even Obama meant to denigrate people with special needs];
    • (022) “I think when you spread the wealth around, it’s good for everybody.”; [Yeah, right. As usual, the middle-class gets screwed while their health insurance is destroyed; again, this reveals a lot about Obama’s philosophy (www.youtube.com/watch?v=OoqI5PSRcXM)];
    • (023) “The Public Will Have 5 Days To Look At Every Bill That Lands On My Desk”; [Did that happen? I don’t think so.]
    • (024) “It’s not my red-line; it is the world’s red-line.”; [Re: consequences for Syria using chemical weapons];
    • (025) “Whistleblowers will be protected.”; [Nevermind the numoerous cover-ups and stonewalling, Benghazi, IRS, Fast and Furious, VA, etc.];
    • (026) “I will close Gitmo.” (Guantanamo); [Almost! Obama released many from Gitmo, and they went on to commit more terrorist acts, killing and injuring more people (www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2017/jan/25/cory-gardner/how-many-released-guantanamo-bay-prisoners-commit-/); As of 23-JAN-2017, several Americans have been killed by the released terrorists; the federal government reported that 17.6% (122 individuals) had been “confirmed of re-engaging” and 12.4% (86 individuals) were suspected of re-engaging in terrorism].
    • (027) “The point I was making was not that Grandmother harbors any racial animosity. She doesn’t, — but she is a typical white person.”; [HHMmmmm … Obama said his mother is a “typical white person”?!?]
    • (028) “I am not spying on American citizens.”; [The NSA was spying on citizens!];
    • (029) Obama said (OCT-2013) government shutdown is all the “GOP’s fault”; [Maybe because they knew Obamacare was a disaster?: www.forbes.com/sites/quora/2013/10/03/why-did-the-u-s-government-shut-down-in-october-2013/#63ed5d157d9d ]
    • (030) “ObamaCare will lower costs for everyone.”; [but costs actually doubled and tripled for many, causing great harm and loss to many];
    • (031) “More Americans will be insured under Obamacare”; [but more harm than good was the actual result];
    • (032) “Islam is the religion of peace and tolerance…Muslims are our friends” [then Obama bows to the muslim leaders; very strange, and not the norm for national leaders who are essentially at a peer level; not subordinate; but then, I remember George Bush walking around while holding hands with the Saudi Crown Prince Abdjullah. That was also very strange. Might be the oil, eh? However, today, since 2017, the U.S. is no longer so dependent on foreign oil];
    • (033) “That’s the good thing about being President, I can do whatever I want,” ;
    • (034) “I am not a dictator.”;
    • (035) 2011 Arab spring: FAIL;
    • (036)America’s 2010 Summer of recovery: FAIL;
    • (037) Hiring a known palestinian terrorist to work on Obamacare in Illinois. [Didn’t bother to check her on e-verify];
    • (038) “I promise 100% transparency in my administration.”; [That’s laughable; especially in light of the IRS targeting conservative groups; the deep-state, and officials in the DOJ and FBI trying to use a fake Steele dossier against a political opponent];
    • (039) “Buying health care insurance will be like using Amazon.”; [Ha Ha! Do you remember how screwed up the web-site was, for a very long time? Another lie, and/or a massive example of incompetence];
    • (040) “I will end Income Tax for seniors making less than $50K a year.”; [That never happened];
    • (041) “I will bring ALL of our troops home within ONE year.”; [That didn’t happen];
    • (042) “I’ll put the Health Care negotiations on CSPAN so everyone can see who is at the table!”;
    • (043) “I’ll have no lobbyists in my administration.” [laughable];
    • (044) DOJ spying on the free press telephone calls;
    • (045) Blocking veterans from seeing their own WWII memorials during government shutdown; shutting down white house (people’s house) tours; but allows illegals to protest on the mall during the same government shutdown;
    • (046) Solyndra bankruptcy cost to taxpayer’s;
    • (047) “Obamacare will not be used to fund abortions.”;
    • (048) Eric Holder: “When they go low, we kick them”; way too many other incidents to list here for Eric Holder;
    • (049) Millions losing health care coverage, and forced to spend double and triple for health insurance;
    • (050) RECORD numbrer of people on welfare rolls;
    • (051) RECORD hollywood parties on the taxpayer’s dime;
    • (052) RECORD campaign tours on the taxpayer’s dime;
    • (053) RECORD exorbitant vacations on the taxpayer’s dime; [NOTE: Trump donates his salary to charity];
    • (054) RECORD secret service agents compared to ANY other president, on the taxpayer’s dime;
    • (055) Unconstitutional Obama recess appointment;
    • (056) Taking credit for SEAL Team 6 success;
    • (057) Forcing businesses to violate their religious beliefs about abortion with Obamacare; forcing businesses to provide insurance to fund abortions;
    • (058) Obamacare website no-bid contract website-cronyism that cost $634Mto build (and the website NEVER worked),amazon.com cost
    • (059) Supporting the Muslim Brotherhood terrorists with arms and money in Syria, on the taxpayer’s dime;
    • (060) NSA acting as Obama Gestapo, spying in ALL AMERICAN telephone calls;
    • (061) Proposed amnesty for illegal law breakers;
    • (062) Spying on Americans, on American soil, with drones;
    • (063) NEVER had a balanced budget;
    • (064) The Russians invaded Ukraine, (Obama did nothing);
    • (065) 6 million people losing their healthcare, thanks to Obamacare;
    • (066) “The United States maintains a ‘rock-solid’ commitment to Israel”;
    • (067) Illegal fundraising for Obamacare by Katherine Sebelius (solicitation of money from the companies she regulates);
    • (068) Katherine Sebelius TOTAL incompetence in rolling out Obamacare (and Obama did nothing abut it);
    • (069) ex-IRS official Lerner takes 5th amendment; the IRS later paid millions in fines and settlements to conservatives groups that had be targeted by the IRS;
    • (070) Failed to adequately fund our Nation’s military;
    • (071) Higher Spending and No Balanced Budget—EVER; doubled the national debt to about $20 Trillion (a new record);
    • (072) $1.2 Trillion in Higher Taxes (as of JUNE-2014);
    • (073) known Obama supporter is appointed to investigate IRS targeting scandal; lots of stonewalling followed; in the end, the IRS has to pay millions in reparations; but no one has yet to be held accountable in the so-called most accountable and “transparent administration”;
    • (074) former Soviet Union laughs at Obama’s Ukraine sanctions.;
    • (075) Over 70% of Obamacare signups are actually from people who LOST their insurance BECAUSE of Obamacare in the first place!;
    • (076) Obama did NOTHING to prevent some 150,000 people being killed in Syria, and he and the left were silent on the matter;
    • (077) On April 6th, 2014 Obama gave a speech on the 20th anniversary of the genocide in Rwanda lecturing about “the world’s failure to respond more quickly” and that “we always have a choice … we must never be indifferent.”; Then there is Syria? And the red-line?
    • (078) Obama demands “equality” but only pays women in his administration 88% of what it pays men;
    • (079) “We’re focused like lasers on job creation!!!”; however, by the end of Obama’s 8 years, record numbers were collecting food stamps;
    • (080) “Jobs are our number one priority!!!!”; under Obama, employment and the economy (for 8 years) was mediocre, at best;
    • (081) “Republicans still can’t bring themselves to admit that the Affordable Care Act is working.”;
    • (082) “If Republicans want to spend all their time talking about repealing a law that’s working, that’s their business.”;
    • (083) Syria uses chemical weapons, despite crossing Obama’s “red line”, and Obama is silent on the matter;
    • (084) China has become one of the biggest world economies, thanks to “ObamaNomics”.;
    • (085) Obama’s Iran deal was a joke; Obama gave Iran hundreds of billions of dollars, and immediately ramped up work on missiles, and Iran still continued its nuclear programs; John Kerry has had secret, unauthorized meetings with Iran during Trump’s time in office; Iran is one of the biggest sponsors of terrorism in the world; Iran has vowed to destroy Israel;
    • (086) in 2013, under the direction of Barack Obama, The Immigration and Customs Enforcement released 36,007 illegal immigrants who had been convicted of murder, s*xual assault, kidnapping, and aggravated assault, and drunk or drugged driving (source: cis.org/Report/ICE-Document-Details-36000-Criminal-Alien-Releases-2013 );
    • (087) incompetence at the Veterans Affairs Administration. Our veterans died …. Obama hires a “coverup” specialist Rob Nabors to assist in the White House’s reputation for deception;
    • (088) Many photos of Obama at the White house shows Obama with his feet on the historically significant antique furniture … it shows a lack of respect for its historical significance;
    • (089) 40 veteran patients die after being placed on a hidden waiting list that could last for up to a year, while officials at the hospital shredded documents and faked evidence to make it seem as if waiting times were under control;
    • (090) New Horizons in Presidential Dignity: President Obama does the “Shake Shack Shimmy” during his visit to the sandwich joint in Washington Friday May 17th 2014. U6 unemployment rate: 17.8% ;
    • (091) May 17th 2014: Greater than Fifty million working-age Americans aren’t working, according to the labor department, and Obama pushes immigration plan; record levels of people collecting food stamps under Obama administration;
    • (092) “STINKBURGER”: www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2014/04/02/obama_paul_ryans_budget_plan_a_stinkburger_or_meanwich.html ;
    • (093) numerous questionable “executive actions” by Obama; some ruled unconstitutional, and Obama has lost in the Supreme Court more than any modern president: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_executive_actions_by_Barack_Obama (Source: www.cato.org/publications/commentary/obama-has-lost-supreme-court-more-any-modern-president);
    • (094) Russia signs a contract with Iran to build two more nuclear reactors at its Bushehr power plant as part of a broader deal for up to eight reactors in the Islamic state;
    • (095) 5-30-14 ILLEGAL negotiation with terrorists: 5 gitmo Taliban terrorist leaders ILLEGALLY released for one American Army deserter: Bowe Berghdahl;
    • (096) Obama released many people from Gitmo, and they committed more terrorist acts, killing 6 U.S. soldiers, and injuring others (www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2017/jan/25/cory-gardner/how-many-released-guantanamo-bay-prisoners-commit-/); Seriously? As of 23-JAN-2017, several Americans have been killed by the released terrorists; the federal government reported that 17.6% (122 individuals) had been “confirmed of re-engaging” and 12.4% (86 individuals) were suspected of re-engaging in terrorism. George W. Bush released some too, so he is culpable too.
    • (097) Obama negotiates with terrorists to release an army deserter because “we can’t leave an American Behind” but does nothing for the Marine that was being detained illegally in Mexico, arrested in Mexico less than 1 mile from the U.S. border (news.vice.com/article/ex-marine-who-carried-loaded-guns-into-mexico-is-released); Even if Tahmooressi intentionally broke the law, how does the actions of Bergdahl and Tahmooressi compare?
    • (098) Barack Obama’s admits to a what he calls a “boneheaded” move in involving contributor Antoin “Tony” Rezko, a Chicago businessman, in the purchase of his property on June 15, 2005. Rezko’s wife, Rita, also an Obama donor, bought the adjoining plot in Hyde Park from the couple, Fredric Wondisford and Sally Radovick, for the $625,000 asking price, the same day that Obama bought the house for $300,000 less than the asking price. Antoin Rezko was under federal investigation at the time. Rezko was indicted on unrelated fraud charges 16 months later, in October 2006. Obama has since returned about $85,000 in campaign contributions made or raised by Rezko … In January 2006, Rita Rezko sold Obamas’ one-sixth of the lot, for $104,500, to expand their yard;
    • (099) Since Obama’s inauguration in JAN-2009, 1,100 elected Democrats have subsequently been ousted by Republicans, hold only 18 of 50 governorships, and 31 of 99 state legislature chambers. Obama asked Americans to cast their votes for a thumbs-up or thumbs-down, and they did. In almost every respect, Obama leaves behind a trail of failure and disappointment. Obamacare was a healthcare disaster, and Politifact dubbed Obama’s statement, which he repeated over and over (“If you like your health plan, you can keep it”) as the “Lie of the Year”. Obama’s foreign policy was a disaster, and Obama’s rush to pull troops from Iraq and Afghanistan created a vacuum which plunged the region into terror, violence, and inspired lethal terrorist attacks in the west.
    • (100) Obama promised to soothe America’s bitter and divisive politics, but the healer-in-chief never showed up. In Obama’s own words, his political strategy was one of ruthless escalation: Obama said: “If they bring a knife to the fight, we bring a gun.” During his 2012 reelection campaign;
    • (101) Obama and his administration had a filibuster-proof Congress in 2009, and failed to pass a pathway to citizenship for the “Dreamer” illegal immigrants; Obama was already too focused on Obamacare and what he thouhgt was going to be his benevolent legacy for America (which turned into a disaster);
    • (102) In Obama’s administration, Hillary Clinton broke the law (by sending classified information through personal email, and for destroying emails), and James Comey and Loretta Lynch (and others in the FBI and DOJ) protected Hillary from being prosecuted. Other people have spent time in prison for far less. Loretta Lynch subsequently met secretly in a private meeting Bill Clinton in Phoenix (29-JUN-2016) to signal Hillary’s exoneration decision by Comey. Hillary Clinton claimed that the private meeting happened by mere “chance”. Scum bags. It was later proven on 5-AUG-2017 that the meeting was “planned”. Lorreta Lynch used an alias email name of “Elizabeth Carlisle” in the letter to Bill Clinton about the meeting in Phoenix on 29-JUN-2016. The public fexoneration statements for Hillary were created before the meeting between Loretta Lynch and Bill Clinton. Peter Strzok was involved in editing and softening the Comey exoneration draft statement, and texts between Strzok and Lisa Page indicate that Loretta Lynch knew in advance that Hillary would be exonerated by Comey.
    • (103) More… What would be found in an investigation of the Clinton Foundation, and many people in the Obama administration (IRS, FBI, DOJ, VA, DNC, Robert Menendez, Lois Lerner, Comey, McCabe, Strzok, Page, John Brennan, etc., etc., etc.) if they were investigated the same way Mueller is investigating the current administration?
    • (104) Think the Obama Administration Wasn’t Corrupt? Think again: www.investors.com/politics/editorials/think-obama-administration-wasnt-corrupt-think-again/

    While Mueller is conducting his investigations, the worst crimes between 2008 and JAN-2017 (during the Obama Administration) are ignored, or the worst punishment is resignation-with-pension:

    • [01] The IRS targeted conservatives under Obama’s and Lois Lerner’s watch; Obama lied that no laws were violated: “There is not a scintilla of corruption in my administration”; Lois Lerner, head of the IRS Office of Exempt Organizations, stated she had not done anything wrong and then took the Fifth before the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform. Lerner retired (with pension) in 2013 after an internal investigation found that she neglected her duties and was going to call for her ouster. Joseph H. Grant, commissioner of the IRS Tax-exempt and Government Entities division, resigned (with pension) on May 16, 2013;
    • [02] VA’s deadly secret waiting lists for veterans; The Secretary of Veterans Affairs, General Eric Shinseki, voluntarily resigned (with pension);
    • [03] Hillary Clinton’s illegal hackable amateur server and emailing of classified information; the FBI investigation found that 110 messages contained information that was classified at the time it was sent; that is a crime that, beyond a shadow of a doubt, committed by Hillary Clinton. But James Comey, Loretta Lynch, and others in the DOJ and FBI protected Hillary from being indicted for those crimes.
    • [04] Hillary Clinton seized control of the Democratic National Committee which used Pakistani programmers who are now being prosecuted, and Wikileaks had a field day with the classified information that was exposed to our rivals (i.e. Russians, Chinese, North Koreans, Iranians, etc.);
    • [05] Hillary’s camp created and paid for the infamous “Steele Dossier” which claims that President Trump committed collusion with the Russian government. This classic frame-up is still going on as Hillary smiles at her accusers; this truly amounts to high-tech treason, and the fake news press, corrupt FBI, DOJ, and other officials did unbelievable things covering for Hillary, and continue to cover for Hillary, and many were working under the assumption that she would become the next U.S. president;
    • [06] Terence Flynn, an appointee of Barack Obama to the National Labor Relations Board, resigned (with pension) in May 2012 after being accused of serious ethical violations by leaking information to the National Association of Manufacturers;
    • [07] Martha N. Johnson (D), head of the General Services Administration, fired two top GSA officials and then resigned herself (with pension) after it was revealed that $822,000 had been spent in Las Vegas on a 4-day training conference for 300 GSA employees;
    • [08] David Petraeus resigned (with pension on 07-NOV-2012) as Director of the CIA after admitting having a s*xual relationship with his biographer, pleaded guilty (on 23-APR-2015) to a misdemeanor charge of mishandling classified materials, in which he was given a two-year probation period and a fine of $100,000; He got off very easy;
    • [09] Comey and others in FBI and DOJ that ignored Hillary Clinton’s numerous violations; Trump later fired Comey in 2017;
    • [10] Fast and Furious (a previous, similar program was started and ended during Bush’s administration called “Operation Wide Receiver”, but Fast and Furious started NOV-2009 during Obama’s administration, and Eric Holder obstructed the investigations for the gunwalking-program; Eric Holder’s “Fast and Furious” obstruction caused the murder of hundreds of Mexican citizens and some US border patrol officers with weapons supplied by the US government. Some ATF agents became concerned the weapons were being used for crimes. On Dec. 14, 2010, U.S. Border Patrol agent Brian Terry was killed during a gunfight. Guns in the shootout were involved in the Fast and Furious operation, it was later learned. Eric Holder was found to be in “Contempt of Congress”, but Eric Holder lost no sleep about it;
    • [11] Hillary Clinton lied about youtubevideo as the cause of attacks in Benghazi, Libya; Hillary lied to the victims’ families; Hillary was caught red-handed lying before Congress about Benghazi during that senate committee. It was discovered that Hillary had sent an email to her daughter explaining the people in Benghazi had been killed by Al Qaida-like terrorists. Hillary wrote: “Hey, this attack at Benghazi was caused by Al Qaida-like elements”. Yet, Hillary and Susan Rice went all over saying it was due to a offensive video.
      Source: www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5DEROUA568
    • [12] Susan Rice lied about a youtubevideo as the cause of the attacks in Benghazi, Libya;
    • [13] Obama’s Solyndra scam, which was a phony solar energy scheme which cost out tax payers $500 million. According to the magazine, The New American, “the administration funneled billions of taxpayer dollars into the pockets of wealthy Democrats and Obama supporters, who in turn gave some of the cash back via campaign contributions. More than 75% of the over $20 billion went to Obama financial backers, according to Department of Energy figures analyzed by researchers”;
    • [14] The Secretary of Health and Human Services, Kathleen Sebelius was determined to be guilty of violating the Hatch Act by campaigning for president Obama in her official capacity (on 13-SEP-2012); On 11-APR-2014, Sebelius announced her resignation from her position as Secretary of Health and Human Services, and Sebelius reimbursed the government’s expenses;
    • [15] Obama’s administration spun intelligence to suit his narrative. It was reported that 50 intelligence analysts said their reports on the Islamic State (who Obama called the JV (Junior Varsity) team) had been watered-down to suit the White House’s spin, and that pressure to do so had come from senior military and intelligence officials;
      Many Democrats and others on the left believe they will find a crime by Trump.
      IF all members of Congress were investigated, probably 80% of them would be found to have committed crimes.

    Socialist extremists want to have control of everything, but responsible and accountable for nothing.

    It’s like a disease. It’s unnerving that there are so many Democrats and socialist extremists existing in the U.S. today, and I think rampant illegal immigration (sanctioned by most Democrats) is contributing to the problem, and many Democrats are despicably pitting U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other for more votes, money, and power.
    It is one of the most despicable things I have seen in my lifetime. It is one of the most serious problems facing the nation.
    It may sound far fetched, but this country could be headed toward a civil war. IF that happens, hopefully, justice will prevail again, as it did after the U.S. Civil War.

    Posted by: d.a.n at February 1, 2019 6:50 PM
    Comment #437619

    Part of what illegal immigration is costing, which does not include all costs, nor the huge costs of over 2,000 homicides per year by criminal non-citizens.

    Some estimates place the annual net losses due to illegal immigration around $338.3 billion dollars a year.

    Posted by: d.a.n at February 1, 2019 7:00 PM
    Comment #437645

    IF you are inclined to want to do so, you can send messages to the White House and various departments and agencies by doing the following:

    • (a) Go to: WhiteHouse.gov
    • (b) left-click once on the = button (near upper-left)
    • (c) left-click once on Contact
    • (d) paste or write your letter (the length below is near the limit of characters allowed).
    • (e) left-click on Send or Submit
    • (f) Also see: Write or Call the White House.
    For example, I just sent this (maybe someone will read it?):

    These 12 facts are sufficient proof of the nefarious motives of Democrats (and other socialist extremists) to acquire more power via more votes and money, because many Democrats, the Main Stream Media, and similar ilk:
    (01) despicably pit U.S. citizens and illegal immigrants against each other for votes, by pandering to illegal immigrants for 30+ years, for more votes (via more representation in the House, via more U.S. House representatives, via apportionment of representatives (and more electoral votes, and more federal funding), based on population, based on the decennial CENSUS, which does NOT verify U.S. citizenship;
    (02) are also fighting against [x]check-box on decennial CENSUS;
    (03) lie about level of crime by illegal immigrants, and refuse to report 2,000 homicides per year by criminal non-citizens (source: DHS, GAO, cis.org);
    (04) lie about the cost of massive illegal (and legal) immigration (possibly $296+ Billion; source: www.washingtontimes.com) per year in net losses;
    (05) are calling for open borders;
    (06) are calling to abolish I.C.E.;
    (07) want another amnesty, like the shamnesty of 1986;
    (08) refuse requirement for employers to use eVerify;
    (09) want to give illegal immigrants drivers’ licenses, and also automatically register them to vote;
    (10) want more mayors like Libby Schaaf, who warns illegal immigrants before an ICE raid to arrest criminal illegal immigrants;
    (11) want more sanctuary cities and states, where Democrats (and A.G. Xavier Becera) passed sanctuary city and state laws that protect criminal non-citizens (e.g. an illegal immigrant, Garcia Zarate (already deported 5 times) can shoot and murder Kate Steinle, and be acquitted for that murder);
    (12) want to abolish or restrict 2nd Amendment rights, and say it is worth it “even if it saves only ONE life”, but conveniently ignore 2,000 homicides per year by criminal non-citizens;

    Despicable! Americans need to know about this (especially (01) above).

    Posted by: d.a.n at February 2, 2019 1:04 PM
    Comment #437646

    (02) above should be:

    • (02) are also fighting against a [x]citizenship check-box on decennial CENSUS;

    Posted by: d.a.n at February 2, 2019 1:08 PM
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