Is tipping your favorite waitress a form of corruption?

A new Harvard study finds a connection between tipping and corruption. Let’s consider the whole field of influence.

Some people get a lot of what they want because they are "charming". There are lots of components to this and less charming people tend to get annoyed by the success of their more charming colleagues. Socially adept people (this group overlaps a lot with charming) get more of what they want. Good looking people get more than unattractive ones. Celebrities benefit at the expense of ordinary folks. We can all add to this long list. The various gifts tend NOT to be distributed equally. Charming people often tend to be attractive, perhaps because being attractive is related to behavior as well as physical looks. These advantages tend to make them more successful in other areas of life. Is this wrong?

Humans are social animals. We spend most of our time in social webs and are constantly working on way to improve our position or influence others. It is what we do, coded into our genes. Those who don't do such things are thought to be weirdoes, maybe even psychopaths. Besides these sorts, we ALL care what others think of us. Those who claim they don't care about the opinions of others - like those who claim they don't care about money - are often the ones who think about it all the time. (If you really don't care about something, you don't talk about it at all. The opposite of love is not hate; it is indifference.)

Let's get back to tipping. It depends on the cultural context. Canada and India have a similar level of tipping, but Canada is low corruption country and India is very corrupt. The motives are different. In Canada tipping is recognition of good service; in India it is a advance payment for future service.

Some countries automatically add in 10%. In those countries you do not tip beyond that. Don't let those waiters in France convince you otherwise. I like this idea. It is not a tip for good service, but more of a piece work, i.e. the waiter makes more if he handles 100 customers than he does if he serves only one. That is fair.

In the U.S. I tip just under 20%, i.e. I figure the 20% then I round up to the nearest dollar below that amount so that the credit card bill is an even amount. I used to try to modulate my tip based on the service, but I don't anymore unless it is extraordinarily good or bad. This is rare. I think if you stay at a hotel that has a free breakfast, you should tip about 20% of what you would have paid. This can lead to a type of favoritism, however. I often stay at a hotel where I get a free happy hour. I leave my 20% tip and I have found that I now get much better quality drinks than I used to.

This brings me to loyalty programs. I am a gold member at a hotel chain and on an airline. This is a sweet deal. That is why I get those free drinks I mentioned above and I get to choose the best seats on my flights. This is very explicit. I get stuff free that others have to pay for because I have behaved in a particular way in the past and the firms hope to encourage similar behavior in future.

None of us wants to be treated "as well as" everybody else; we want to be treated better, i.e. as individuals. This is an inescapable fact of human life. When does it become corruption?

IMO, it becomes corruption when people are giving you things that are not theirs to give. If I offer a tip from my own money, it is entirely my business and not corruption on my part. If you accept the tip and do the same sort of job you would have done anyway, maybe with a little more joy, there is no corruption on your part. The problem comes when we are acting for others. I cannot be generous with the money of others, so if I give you a tip paid for by my employer, this is corrupt. If you grant me favors at the expense of your employer, this is also corrupt.

Things can be very unfair w/o being corrupt. If I own a company and I give you a special deal just because I like you, this is not corrupt. We all try very hard to cultivate relationships that will provide us with exactly this. We call it networking or making connections. It is the biggest part of many people's jobs. It is the biggest part of the job of people like presidents & CEOs. Once they get the relationships right, many other decisions are very easy.

Since we are in a political blog, let me take a political turn. Societies with strong respect for property rights are almost always less corrupt than those that have weaker property rights and/or more communal ones. Why? As I wrote above, you cannot be corrupt if you are giving away your own money. I cannot "bribe" you to sell me something of your own for less, since it is yours to decide. You can only be bribed to give something that is not yours.

The more you put decision-making power into the hands of government officials who are not spending their own money, the more scope you create for corruption. We need to be careful about this.

And remember that politicians cannot be generous when they are spending the taxpayers' money. Let me give an example of a government program that I think is great but is sometimes misstated. I am very fond of the Fulbright program. It does great things. But I get a little disturbed when people talk about the generosity of J. William Fulbright. I think he was visionary and maybe personally generous, but the Fulbright program is not an example of HIS generosity. In fact, I don't think we should name ANY government program after any living individual for that reason. ( I understand that he is dead now, but the program was called by his name before that). It may lead to politicians seeking personal aggrandizement at taxpayer expense and that is corruption.

Posted by Christine & John at November 25, 2012 10:38 AM
Comments
Comment #357708

“The more you put decision-making power into the hands of government officials who are not spending their own money, the more scope you create for corruption. We need to be careful about this.”

It does give one hope since money spending bills originate in the HOR.

Posted by: Royal Flush at November 25, 2012 1:33 PM
Comment #357709

Corruption needs power so to think a waitress can be corrupted by tipping is typical conservative logic but illogical C&J.

I wonder if this is now the new conservative strategy for political gain. Are we all corrupt now because Obama is in office? I can see the FAUX news propagandist now. You have had The fox, Daryl Issa in charge of the chickens for over 2 years now with little real corruption to be found, go figure.

http://www.crewsmostcorrupt.org/scandals-and-scoundrels


When you try to convince the movement followers that all of society is corrupt you let the truly corrupt power hungry bribing our elected officials become less of a issue, C&J.

Posted by: j2t2 at November 25, 2012 2:40 PM
Comment #357710

j2t2

What the heck are you talking about? I am not trying to convince anybody that all American society is corrupt. In fact, I bet my opinion of people’s honesty in general is much higher than yours. America is a generally honest country, not perfect, but very good.

I also mentioned nothing about Obama. I assume Obama is personally honest.

Re the waitress being corrupted, it depends on what you mean by that term. I get lots of extra stuff from people because I am charming. If it is within her usual discretion, it is not corrupt.

You seem to be a person who has traveled, but have you not learned anything? Visit the Middle East or Africa. In a corrupted society, everything is subject to influence and negotiation. It is not the big things that bother you, but the little ones. In some places you have to pay off everybody just to get things you would expect to get w/o problems in the U.S.

Maybe you heard the joke about Nigerian airlines-

Nigerian airlines in hiring a pilot. The first guy comes in is German. He interviewer asks:

Can you fly the plane?
Yes, I flew for Lufthansa.
How much do you want to earn?
I need $3000.
What for?
$1000 for me, $1000 for my wife and $1000 for savings.

Next guy is English. The interviewer asks:
Can you fly the plane?
Yes, I flew for BA
How much do you want to earn?
I need $6000.
What for?
$2000 for me, $2000 for my wife and $2000 for savings

The last guy is Nigerian. The interview asks:
Can you fly the plane?
No, I have no idea how
How much do you want to earn?
I need $9000.
What for?
$3000 for me, $3000 for you and $3000 for the German to fly the plane.

Anyway, how much do you tip in the U.S.? You know what my guess is? I think that if we were all honest, we would find that conservatives tip more in the 20% range, while liberals help the workers by giving closer to 10% while demanding government do more.

Posted by: C&J at November 25, 2012 2:56 PM
Comment #357711

You nailed the tip amount CJ. I almost always tip 20% unless the service is really lousy. If I get exceptional service then the tip is 25%.

Posted by: Royal Flush at November 25, 2012 3:22 PM
Comment #357719

Tipping in restaurants is a ‘tradition’, like Xmas, turkey, etc. Has nothing to do with corruption.

Here is corruption:

(from todays ‘Taking Stock’ section, WaPo)
Mathew Martoma, portfolio mgr, charged with what prosecutors called a record setting insider trading scheme that netted up to $276M for the hedge fund.

HP alleges an accounting scandal at its British software unit that will cost the company circa $8.8B

Wells Fargo facing lawsuit that accuses the bank of overcharging veterans under a federal loan refinancing program to the tune of some millions of dollars.

Ex UBS trader jailed for 7 years for biggest fraud in British history, which will cost the Swiss bank some $2.3B

USG filed a suit against KBR for submitting nearly $50M in inflated claims to install live-in trailers for troops during the Iraqi war.

Credit Suisse was sued by NY’s attny gen for selling shoddy mortgages before the financial crisis.

First Bank of Del. fined $15M for anti-money laundering violations.

Big article about research funded by BIG pharma’s. Alluding to research reports by folks who have received consulting fees, lecture fees, grant support, stock holdings and employment by the pharma(s) trying to bring a drug to market.

Then, there is China, India, Russia, and so on - - -

Some call it free market capitalism. I’ve other names for it.

Some number of lives lost in a fire in a Bangladeshi Wal-Mart garment factory. Cited numerous times, even by Wal-mart, as a fire hazard. Note too, that Wal-mart moved up its dividend payment to late December from early next year to help shareholders avoid a tax increase because of the ‘fiscal cliff’.

Would it be corrupt if the shareholders tip Wal-mart for their benevolence?

Posted by: Roy Ellis at November 25, 2012 9:06 PM
Comment #357720

Roy

“Some call it free market capitalism” - only people who don’t understand free market capitalism or oppose it use this characterization.

Posted by: C&J at November 25, 2012 9:13 PM
Comment #357721

CJ I was making an observation. Claiming that tipping a waitress is corruption seems to me will weaken our view of what corruption is. As an example the Koch bros spending millions to influence elected officials is corruption,IMHO, as it influences the laws of our nation. Power corrupts, money corrupts. Tipping a waitress 20% on a $30 meal isn’t corruption. However trying to make the case it is weakens the case against power brokers trying to influence government officials. We become desensitized to these things when we here it and see it more often, don’t we?

You seem to be a person who has traveled, but have you not learned anything?

For many years I did C&J but not so much anymore. I was referencing political corruption and the witch hunt of the repubs/conservatives when they regained the majority in 2010 more than society as a whole.


Anyway, how much do you tip in the U.S.? You know what my guess is? I think that if we were all honest, we would find that conservatives tip more in the 20% range, while liberals help the workers by giving closer to 10% while demanding government do more.

I’ll take that bet C&J, I know to many conservatives to lose. They are as cheap and vindictive with their own money as they come. Now if they are on the companies dime it is a different story. It is very common around these parts, where conservatives outnumber thinking people 3 to 1, to leave meager tips at the local restaurants. I tip waitresses at least 20% rounded up. My Bro-in-law a true talk radio conservative thinks 10% is to much for just bringing a few dishes to the table, as he puts it. He is typical of the conservative mindset that tells us these people should get a real job.

Posted by: j2t2 at November 25, 2012 9:33 PM
Comment #357722

I know, C&J. It’s just those .00000000001% who commit such acts and make the big corp’s look bad. Hogwash.

Bust up the monopolies and clean out the gov’t giveaways, carried interest, Cayman tax havens, etc. Abolish corporate personhood and free them of their bad habits.

Posted by: Roy Ellis at November 25, 2012 9:36 PM
Comment #357730

Roy

The world is full of people doing dishonest things, large and small. All of us do some questionable things. You do too and so do I. In the real world, the U.S. is fairly honest.

We would agree that the free market is doesn’t work as well when there are monopolies and government giveaways. These are things we need to fight constantly, like weeds in the garden.

Carried interest is a more technical subject. It depends. I recently bought 135 acres of pine, which I plan to harvest in around 5 years. I borrowed half the money for the purchase and I am paying interest. It is part of the investment expense and it makes perfect sense to deduct that from the profit from selling the trees five year hence. I would like to deduct it this year, but the tax code doesn’t allow it and I can understand that too. You need to show profit before you can be taxed on that profit and it makes sense that you have to have profit before you can deduct expenses. But profit and expense are not always earned or expended in the same year.

Tax havens are probably not what you think they are. We all oppose just dumping money to avoid taxes. But if you have operations in several countries and earn money in each of them, you would pay taxes in the places you have operations. Since the U.S. has the highest corporate taxes, every other country is a kind of “tax haven”.

Posted by: C&J at November 26, 2012 4:33 AM
Comment #357731

j2t2

As I wrote, when you live in a really corrupt society, the little things affect you.

Re the waitress, I was just playing off the Harvard study that found a correlation between tipping in little things and corruption in big ones.

The Koch brothers are the counterpart to Soros. I dislike Soros and you hate the Koch brothers. Both sides have their heroes and villains. I have not heard of any cases of either the Koch brothers or Soros engaging in illegal activities to influence officials.

Re liberal and conservative tipping - I have no data. My observations is that my liberal friends generally tip less than I do, while decrying the plight of the poor guys serving. It goes with the general trend of liberals giving less to charity. But I know of no reliable studies on tipping behavior related to political orientation. That is why I called it a guess.

I do not buy into the rising % however. I have had some people tell me that I should tip 25% because prices have gone up. That makes no sense, since we are talking %. If prices have gone up and % remains constant, waiters make more money automatically.

Posted by: C&J at November 26, 2012 4:41 AM
Comment #357733
The Koch brothers are the counterpart to Soros. I dislike Soros and you hate the Koch brothers. Both sides have their heroes and villains. I have not heard of any cases of either the Koch brothers or Soros engaging in illegal activities to influence officials.

C&J, Hate is a strong word, I don’t hate the Koch Bros.

The Koch Bros with direct access to elected officials they helped into office, Scott Walker the governor of Wisconsin being a shining example, is corruption. Soros contributes to campaign on a global level but hasn’t been known to call Governors for up dates on union busting activities. The fact that it is legal to buy politicians as Kock Bros do shows just how much more global we have become as conservatives push us into a 3rd world banana republic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBnSv3a6Nh4

Re liberal and conservative tipping - I have no data. My observations is that my liberal friends generally tip less than I do, while decrying the plight of the poor guys serving. It goes with the general trend of liberals giving less to charity. But I know of no reliable studies on tipping behavior related to political orientation. That is why I called it a guess.

I also think the data that you continue to brag about is tainted as well, C&J. I think the conservative that did the study was self serving a bit and included all donations to churches as being from conservatives which as we know is just wrong. My experience is conservatives are …….well conservative when it comes to giving tips to the wait staff.

One can make the case that because of the failed conservative policies and being trickled on the past 40 years, the income redistribution to the wealthy plutocrats and the dollar’s value shrinking the increase to 25% is justifiable. Wages for working people have been stagnant when compared to CEO’s, minimum wage hasn’t kept up and wait staff usually don’t receive minimum wage for one. The rise in the number of conservatives over the past 40 years has also led to tips being smaller as people have become more conservative so it is tough to make a living wage as a waitress. Of course it is just as easy to tip 25% if you choose.

Posted by: j2t2 at November 26, 2012 8:38 AM
Comment #357735

How much to tip a waitress, or server for y’all PC folks:), depends on the service you get.
If the service is good my tip is somewhere around 20%. If it is poor it goes down. If it it better than good it goes up. If it is non existent so is the tip.
I hate places that add a gratuity to the bill and I always end up fighting with the manager over it. I feel it’s my business how much I tip and not the restaurants. Adding a ‘gratuity’ to the check does nothing to improve service and I’ve noticed that service in these places a isn’t all that great. The servers already know about what they are going to get and there is no incentive for them to do any more than take your order and bring it to you.
The fastest way to lose a tip from me is to let my tea glass go empty.

Posted by: Ron Brown at November 26, 2012 10:30 AM
Comment #357742

j2t2

If you want to exclude charity to religious organizations, y0ou might make your data fit. Of course, religious organizations are responsible for lots of charity. I suppose you could keep on excluding classes of charity until there was nothing left except government, and then you would get to liberals. But studies that include charities as defined by the tax codes indicate consistently that liberals are less generous with their time and money.

Re tipping - as I said, I don’t have data on that. I still don’t see the logic of raising the % based on anything besides the desire to give more away. The % rises with the price. If the value of the dollar has decreased as you say, that means prices have risen and so has the dollar amount of the %.

Posted by: C&J at November 26, 2012 5:05 PM
Comment #357743

I’m just saying that liberals contribute to religious organizations as well, C&J. But don’t fool yourself when it comes to government charity,C&J, conservatives are at the trough as much if not more than liberals. You guys just like beating up on the disadvantaged, elderly, disabled,widowed poor amongst us:)

http://www.alternet.org/economy/ten-numbers-rich-would-fudged?akid=9711.1088605.3Idr3P&rd=1&src=newsletter748976&t=3

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/26/jim-greer-florida-voting-laws_n_2192802.html

Posted by: j2t2 at November 26, 2012 5:58 PM
Comment #357745

j2t2

Conservatives should take advantage of government programs, since they pay for them with taxes. It is just that conservatives tend to give more to charity than liberals, as many studies have shown.

I personally did not accept welfare or food stamps when I was eligible for them, since I did not need them. I just ate less and simpler things and actually was very healthy. I am proud of that and think others should do that too when possible. You can not have money and still not be poor and I think you should be a little ashamed to take welfare. We have to maintain some of the stigma. Being on welfare is not just an alternative lifestyle.

As a conservative, I want to do something to solve problems, whereas my liberal friends want to demand something be done. I want to help the poor as much or more than my liberal friends. I just take more direct action, whereas they want to rely on government bureaucracies and use other people’s money.

RE the rich - I am not particularly fond of the rich. I don’t really understand why Republicans defend them so much when many vote democrat and lots of them are the Hollywood types who dislike Republicans.

What I defend is the productive people.

Posted by: C&J at November 26, 2012 7:13 PM
Comment #357748
Conservatives should take advantage of government programs, since they pay for them with taxes. It is just that conservatives tend to give more to charity than liberals, as many studies have shown.

Using this conservative myth as logic yes they should, but they should also quit complaining about others doing the same thing. Because others, yes liberals, pay for government as well C&J, which seems to be something conservatives refuse to acknowledge. Whether conservatives give more or not to charity is open to debate C&J as the data is just not there.

However as far as corruption goes it seems conservatives give as well despite their outrage.

http://news.yahoo.com/la-money-manager-gets-no-jail-ny-corruption-230646991—sector.html

Posted by: j2t2 at November 26, 2012 8:21 PM
Comment #357758

j2t2

Let’s make this simple. Liberals love to claim it is hypocritical for conservatives to both oppose government growth and take advantage of it. This is mistaken.

Consider a situation with the two of us. You want to go to an expensive restaurant that I think we cannot afford. You win the argument and we both have to put up $100. Neither of us can get the money back. Is it hypocritical of me to eat what I paid for, or should I just go to McDonald’s and spend my own money?

I can still say that I oppose the idea of spending more. Unless there is an opt-out, however, I have the right to use what I am forced to pay for.

In fact, however, you have put your finger on the corrupting influence of government. Clever politicians can extort money from people and then essentially bribe them with their own money.

Generally speaking, government should create conditions under which people can prosper and create wealth for themselves and others. Government itself does not create wealth or prosperity. There is an important distinction in essential roles.

One more thing about getting stuff. I lived in Norway, which had a welfare state tradition and also grew up in Wisconsin, which was still progressive. The thing that made both those places work as well as they did was the tradition of work and personal responsibility coupled with strong social pressure. People helped each other and government helped all, but most people felt a strong pressure to do their part. Welfare benefits were available, but good people avoided them and felt some shame to fall into them.

Many Americans have lost this sense of shame. I am offended when I see welfare and food stamps promoted as just another alternative. I want to help you if you need it, but I want to be satisfied that you have done your part for the team. In the long run, the best thing most people can do to help others in their society is to take care of themselves and do their parts.


Posted by: C&J at November 27, 2012 2:43 AM
Comment #357764

j2t2
Did you ever work as a waiter? If so did you ask your customers if they were conservative or liberal? Then did you take note of the tip they left?
If no to of any of the above how does your experience tell you that conservatives are ‘conservative when it comes to giving tips to the wait staff’?
It’s been my experience that there are generous folks and stingy folks on both sides of the isle.

The biggest part of what the wait staff at most restaurants makes is in tips. Everyone should appreciate the job they do and leave something.If service is good leave more. If service is poor leave less. But leave something.
I have also noticed that a complement to the server for good service goes a long way for better service the next time your in there.
Instead of complementing the chef, complement the server.

Posted by: Ron Brown at November 27, 2012 8:08 AM
Comment #357801
If no to of any of the above how does your experience tell you that conservatives are ‘conservative when it comes to giving tips to the wait staff’?

By going out to diner with conservative friends Ron.

Posted by: j2t2 at November 28, 2012 12:34 AM
Comment #357802

oops should be going out to dinner , sorry

Posted by: j2t2 at November 28, 2012 12:35 AM
Comment #357808

By going out to dinner with conservative friends? By that bases I can conclude that liberals don’t tip at all.
Most my liberal friends think that the greedy restaurant owners should be paying the waitresses more [something I won’t argue with, but then they’d have to charge more] and won’t tip in order to try to force them too.
Restaurants are exempt from the minimum wage laws. Around here most waitresses get around $4 to $5 an hour. A good server in a good restaurant during supper can make $$8 to $10 an hour in tips on an average day. That’s $12 to $15 an hour. Figure in tips from the rest of the day and average it out it might come to $7 to $9 an hour for the day. On a real good day it could be even higher. But those days make up for the slow days.
Not the best of pay given that most jobs around here start between $8 to $10 an hour.
And these folks work there tails off to get you your food and drinks as fast as possible.

Posted by: Ron Brown at November 28, 2012 8:44 AM
Comment #357819

My first question would be, “Why pick on tipping?”. Second Question: what correlation are we drawing on here? Between social models of service and corruption, or between governments situated in countries with strong economic inequality, who don’t pay their people enough?

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at November 28, 2012 5:06 PM
Comment #357822

Stephen

I pick on tipping because the Harvard study showed the correlation between tipping and corruption.

Posted by: C&J at November 28, 2012 5:50 PM
Comment #357867

C&J-
I mean, why pick tipping out of all the other behaviors we might engage in? What motivates that choice of behavior to correlate with corruption? Tipping, in this country at least, involves people at a particular economic disadvantage.

What led this author to look for this connection, and why does he assume that the connection lies in the social surroundings of tipping, and not in other, perhaps more dominate socioeconomic forces?

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at November 29, 2012 3:14 PM
Comment #357885

Stephen

I cannot speak for the author, but I suppose they were looking for correlations between paying a small amount of money for better service and paying more in bribes for special treatment.

It depends on why you tip. If you hope to get better service as a result, it is indeed a form of corruption. If you are just generous, it is not.

It also depends on the attitude of the servers. If they are just happy to get tips, it is harmless. If they feel entitled and would contemplate giving poor service if not tipped, it is a minor form of extortion.


Re the larger socioeconomic forces, the author in fact is doing just what you ask, looking at the big forces in relation to the smaller ones.

Posted by: C&J at November 29, 2012 9:07 PM
Comment #357889
By going out to dinner with conservative friends? By that bases I can conclude that liberals don’t tip at all.

Well Ron it seems only libertarians and greens tip then.

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