Women & men get paid what they are worth

There is lots of talk that women get paid only 82% as much as men for the same work. This is illegal, but even if not, consider the results. If a firm can get the same productivity for 18% less, would profit oriented executives pass up this opportunity?

I think we have a dilemma here. Perhaps firms are not as greedy as we thought. They are willing to pay 18% more than they need to for workers because they are tied to tradition. Perhaps a 18% advantage in labor costs means nothing. Or perhaps there is some other reason why women are paid 18% less than men.

I accept less money than I think I could be paid elsewhere because I like my job. Is that stupid? Should I demand more money and feel oppressed or feel lucky that I have found such a good job? Maybe women are smart to take jobs they like better or maybe they have more options. There are still significant social pressures on a man to maximize his income.

When I graduated with my MBA, three of my close female friends were among those who got the best jobs. (General Mills, American Express and HP, all great in those days) Within two years, all three had "downshifted". They took lower paying jobs that gave them more personal time and better conditions. They were praised for their life balance. I had to put up with lots of shit for taking a "lesser job" that offered more personal growth but a lot less money. Until women have the same burdens that men do, we cannot expect equal salary outcomes. Maybe, however, their lives are fuller. That is worth a lot.

Posted by Christine & John at October 30, 2012 6:19 PM
Comments
Comment #355805

C&J: “Until women have the same burdens that men do, we cannot expect equal salary outcomes.”

Which burdens are those?

Posted by: Adam Ducker at October 30, 2012 6:49 PM
Comment #355812

Adam, When a woman can sling around a 4’X8’ sheet of 7 gauge steel on a shear, or brake. When a woman can work side by side with a man in a factory that requires heavy lifting. Yes then I believe a woman deserves equal pay. In an office environment all should be paid equally per knowledge of job level. Also in the technology field.

Posted by: KAP at October 30, 2012 8:18 PM
Comment #355816

Adam

Perhaps your generation not longer feels it. In mine, we (men) have to work and strive. If we fail we are less men. We cannot “downshift” or give up.

I had a good example. In 1990 I was getting my ass kicked at work. I would have quit, but I had a wife and family, so I stuck to it. Good thing.

There is also the danger and unpleasantness. Men are many time more likely to be injured or killed at work. Women get the safer jobs.

When I was young, we threw 94lb cement bags for 12 hours a day. There is not one woman in 1000 who can do that, no matter what they say on TV. We made good money because the job was literally tearing us apart. More recently I served in Iraq. My body armour weight 45lbs and then we had to carry gear. Few women can hump 100 lbs. They may think they can but they are wrong.

In the movies women can do these things. In real life the average woman cannot toss a hand grenade far enough so that she will not be hurt by the shrapnel. This is a disadvantage.

Posted by: C&J at October 30, 2012 9:13 PM
Comment #355818

I wouldn’t worry too much about this issue. Women now surpass men in receiving both undergraduate and graduate degrees. As soon as they catch on to what are the most lucrative degrees, Katy barr the door. In a few years, women will be writing the rules and I seriously doubt that it will be in favor of men.

Posted by: Rich at October 30, 2012 9:54 PM
Comment #355819

C&J,

Do you seriously think that relative physical strength is a significant factor? Given the responsibility, I have confidence that women could manage the task. The grenade maybe a little lighter but more lethal.

For success in the future, I am betting on the group that is steadily increasing its educational portfolio. When it comes to men vs. women, it is a no-brainer.

Posted by: Rich at October 30, 2012 10:06 PM
Comment #355820

I don’t think physical labor counts though does it? The study was talking about equal work, specifically with college graduates. What other burdens are you talking about? Social pressures?

Posted by: Adam Ducker at October 30, 2012 10:26 PM
Comment #355821

“relative strength is a significant factor.” Now that just depends on the task at hand as I stated in my comment Rich. I don’t doubt women will excel in the fields of technology, medicine, economics, and the like, but there are jobs that are best suited to men where women cannot compete. Maybe someday a women will be able to lob a grenade farther then a man or excel in a combat situation and I don’t think they are to far in the future. Take women Naval pilots, they have already proven themselves. Women enlisted in the navy can do most of the things men enlisted can, but they aren’t really in a combat situation as is the Army and Marines.

Posted by: KAP at October 30, 2012 10:40 PM
Comment #355822

C&J-
In real life women can and do toss grenades further than 45 ft, if properly trained.

I think women, given proper training, can do a lot that men can. Not all of course. Except, let me pause for a moment and note something: you and KAP seem to be limiting your scope to physical, blue collar jobs, and the military, where physical differences matter. Of course if a woman can’t push around the necessary things, she shouldn’t be doing that job. Qualifications matter.

The issue at hand, if a woman is just as qualified as a man, and can do the job, why in hell she should have to accept a lesser paycheck to do the same thing. If it’s the same job, it ought to be equal pay. There’s no rational reason to do it otherwise, no mental disparity, no question about the ability of women to make the same decisions men do.

I mean, hell, you tried running CEOs for Senate who were women. The question is why pay them less for doing the same exact job?

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at October 30, 2012 10:44 PM
Comment #355823

Adam, Why dosen’t physical labor count? You think because your a college grad. makes you immune to physical labor? Over half of college grads can’t find a job in their field, so what do you think they should do, stay home with mommy and daddy, or should they go and find something until better comes along? Adam you never cease to amaze me at how stupid some of your comments are.

Posted by: KAP at October 30, 2012 10:47 PM
Comment #355824

That’s what I said in the white collar section of my comment Stephen, but in todays world many women expect equal pay for doing less than their male counterparts in the blue collar area. By the way Stephen by properly trained I hope you mean in the same alloted time as their male counterparts because if they can’t, why waste the time and taxpayers money to train them for that longer time.

Posted by: KAP at October 30, 2012 10:55 PM
Comment #355826

KAP: “Adam you never cease to amaze me at how stupid some of your comments are.”

Excuse me, KAP, for again failing to impress you. I try so very hard. I promise to do better next time if you’ll give me another chance.

“Why dosen’t physical labor count?”

The article is talking about equal pay for equal work and you and John talk about moving cold steel and concrete for a living as if that’s relevant. No one denies there are jobs that only healthy, strong men can do. That is not the point. The point is between two people completely capable of doing the same job the woman is making significantly less than the man. John talks about burdens and I’m wondering what the burden is on the man in that situation.

Posted by: Adam Ducker at October 30, 2012 11:56 PM
Comment #355828

Adam, If a man and a women are both equally qualified to do the job then fine both should get the same pay, but when one or the other is less qualified then NO, much like in the affirmative action thing where an employer had to hire according to race or gender. Lets just go back to the physical part, women do work in factories and are in the military do you think a women must carry her load in both areas or should a man carry the load for them?

Posted by: KAP at October 31, 2012 12:09 AM
Comment #355836

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Posted by: Coach Outlet at October 31, 2012 3:53 AM
Comment #355920

Rich

You are right. And when women get more degrees than men, it does not imply that men are suffering discrimination.

It is past time to let this whole issue go. That is why it is so annoying that the Obama folks want to fire up something they must know is BS.

Stephen

Re tossing grenades - some can; most can’t. There are limits to training.

We have to understand how statistical distributions work. SOME women are stronger than some men. There are some men who also cannot qualify. But at the upper levels, is it only or mostly men who qualify.

RE “The question is why pay them less for doing the same exact job?” “We” don’t.

I am 100% in favor of pay equality. I am telling you that it generally exists when you factor in variables like type of major/work, hours worked, experience, time in labor force.

In fact in 147 out of 150 of the biggest cities in the U.S., the median full-time salaries of young women are 8% higher than those of the guys in their peer group.

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html#ixzz2AriTouOK


But answer the original question. IF you could get someone to do the same exact job for 18% less money, why would you not do that? And if firms could get such a good deal, would they not seek to hire only women?

Clearly this 82% number cannot be valid and is not valid when you actually understand the statistical factors that go into it.

Adam

Please see above. I mention the physical because it is easier to demonstrate. But we see that in other things too. Gender discrimination is largely a thing of the past. We all have stories we can tell. Every woman has a story of when she suffered but so does every man.

The “right” industry is deeply entrenched. Even though women now outnumber me on most university campus, they still push the agenda. They need to declare victory and stand down.

Posted by: C&J at October 31, 2012 5:05 AM
Comment #355937

I work in an office where degrees and such matter and our CEO and a Sr. VP are both women and most of our new hires are females. I think what is missing is the middle; we just have fewer women that stive for middle management positions and you have to go the entire route to end up in the upper management positions.

Lots of reasons why this happens but from my experience it is usually choice. Women have traded career advancement for things like flexible work schedules, telecommuting, better work environments, etc. especially during the child years where professionals typically advance to supervision and middle management. Just in our company the ones that want the Executive work style are the work-a-hollics. As a result, when you get to my age, there aren’t many women, there aren’t any currently in my company, who have the supervisory background and experience to compete for upper management jobs.

But that’s big corporate life. Many women I know are doing great, some fantastic, as a result of starting a small business once the kids are old enough. I’ve tried to get my wife to do the same several times since benefits are not an issue, but she just likes working in an office environment. Oh well.

Posted by: George in SC at October 31, 2012 7:32 AM
Comment #355971

We know that at the Democrat Convention, it was proposed to make the Democrats encourage America to be non religious, rather than genuine atheists.

This is because most People, even many People who do not go to Church believe that God made all things, and we know that the Invisible Devil and his Invisible Demons believe this, and they tremble in fear of God’s coming judgement.

“You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder” (James 2:19).

Even though the Democrat Party wants a non religious America, they do like some of the things of Islam like having multiple wives.

America and Islam are Allies, and the American Democrats would tolerate bigamy, and so there might even be a plan to make America a Military Dictatorship as an Islamic State under Sharia Law.

There are numerous examples of the American Democrats being Allies of Undemocratic Islamists, and the Serbian Province of Kosovo is just one such example, and Libya is another.

The News Item Titled “Kosovo is my personal matter, Hillary Clinton says”, and it can be read at http://www.b92.net/eng/news/politics-article.php?yyyy=2012&mm=10&dd=31&nav_id=82923 , and the Clintonites want to set up an Islam State in Europe by stealing Serbian Land.

An America where each man had multiple wives would save America money in the future because of the Unfunded Liability of Old Age Pensions, and other Unfunded Liabilities that was stolen to wage Illegal and Immoral Wars by America.

The Democrats want to deceive Christians and even non religious People who believe in only having one Partner, that they are against Islam, because Islam believes in having multiple wives.

The Democrats want a non religious version to this with President Bill Clinton, and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton as role models for Americans to look up to and to imitate.

The American Constitution says that bigamy is Illegal, and in most cases atheists do not want to hear speech regarding our Creator, or the Bible, and some would not even believe in Freedom of Speech for others, except themselves who would be free to speak Dictatorial Decrees.

This is why the American Constitution will be done away with, and Democrat Leaders have been cunning in even having Bush and other Republicans help destroy the American Constitution.

America has much debts and unemployment, and the American Males that survive will be happy to have a few of their wives go to work, on a rotation basis, while the other wives take it in turns to stay home, and attend to homely duties.

For many families that it takes at least two to go to work to have enough money for the Household.

Hillary Clinton has been setting the example for decades to American women, as to the joys of being part of a Harem, even though this has been done subtlety with Bill Clinton Affairs, while she was pretending to be the Champions of Women’s’ Rights, but I do not think the Men were as easily deceived.

The Democrats want to Disarm America, and set up a Police State and a Military Dictatorship, and those Males who Vote Democrat will survive Obamacare ‘Health Treatments’.

Nazi Doctor Joseph Mengele’s, also known as the angel of death, spared only those Jews who were Nazi collaborators.

We have heard how many People suspect that Obama and the Democrats as having deliberately mismanaged the Economy, in order to set up a Police State and a Military Dictatorship.

Democrats know how to make others Vote Democrat, just like they have done in Illinios, and the Bible tells us of one method, with the capability to buy and sell, and those American States who do not Vote Democrat, will not receive assistance because of not Voting the ‘ Approved’ way.

It is amazing how Illinois can just keep Voting for Democrats all the time, and that is because the Chicago Politicians of which Obama is one, knows how to do it in one State, and wants it all over America.

“He also forced everyone, small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on his right hand or on his forehead, so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of his name. This calls for wisdom. If anyone has insight, let him calculate the number of the beast, for it is man’s number. His number is 666” (Revelation 13:16-18).

The Video that is Titled: Man attacked by Killer Whale, at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWfzA29EhGY , shows us the Democrats or atheists are laying low on many matters until after the Election.

If Obama and the Democrats say that they deliberately mismanaged the economy, because they want to set up a Police State and a Military Dictatorship in America, then People should not Vote for them.

Obama and the Democrats have failed dismally to make any progress on lowering unemployment, reducing the budget deficit, paying off the national debt, and on improving the economy, and all these matters have become worse during the last 4 years.

The Voters have a Responsibility to the Nation and a responsibility to their Families, Friends, and Neighbors not to Vote for Obama and the Democrats at these Elections.

American Voters are encouraged to take no chances and actually Vote, and to Vote only for Candidates who will give America Good, Competent, and Constitutional Government.

Posted by: Election at October 31, 2012 3:56 PM
Comment #355988

Question: Do unions discriminate based upon sex?

Posted by: Royal Flush at October 31, 2012 5:29 PM
Comment #356025

Election,

What a wonderfully ironic rant! You do realize that the opposition candidate (Romney) to Obama is a member (bishop) of the Mormon faith. You do realize the history of polygamy within the Mormon faith. So, who are we going to vote for?

Posted by: Rich at October 31, 2012 8:24 PM
Comment #356065

The following Article was written the day after Obama won the Democrat nomination for President in 2008.

It was written by a Philosophy PhD who lectured on Aristotelian ethics, and we can understand more of a Person who is no longer as much of a Stranger with the passage of time, and even other People.

This is why I have added my brief analysis or opinions in brackets, which tend to disagree with the older assessment of motives.

The O-man, Barack Hussein Obama, is an eloquently tailored empty suit. No resume, no accomplishments, no experience, no original ideas, no understanding of how the economy works, no understanding of how the world works, nothing but abstract empty rhetoric devoid of real substance. He has no real identity. He is half-white, which he rejects. The rest of him is mostly Arab, which he hides but is disclosed by his non-African Arabic surname and his Arabic first and middle names as a way to triply proclaim his Arabic parentage to people in Kenya. Only a small part of him is Black African from his Luo grandmother, which he pretends he is exclusively. What he is not, not a genetic drop of, is “African-American”, the descendant of enslaved Africans brought to America chained in slave ships. He has not a single ancestor who was a slave. Instead, his Arab ancestors were slave owners. Slave-trading was the main Arab business in East Africa for centuries until the British ended it. Let that sink in: Obama is not the descendant of slaves, he is the descendant of slave owners. Thus he makes the perfect Liberal Messiah. It is something Hillary does not understand (does fully understand) - how some complete neophyte came out of the blue and stole (was given and entrusted with) the Democrat nomination from her. Obamamania is beyond politics and reason. It is a true religious cult, whose adherents reject Christianity yet still believe in Original Sin, transferring it from the evil of being human to the evil of being white. Thus Obama has become the white liberals’ Christ, offering absolution from the Sin of Being White. There is no reason or logic behind it, no faults or flaws of his can diminish it, no arguments Hillary could make of any kind can be effective against it. The absurdity of Hypocrisy Clothed In Human Flesh being their Savior is all the more cause for liberals to worship him: Credo quia absurdum, I believe it because it is absurd. Thank heavens that the voting majority of Americans remain Christian and are in no desperate need of a phony savior. That his candidacy is ridiculous (not ridiculous) and should not (should) be taken seriously (very seriously) by any (all) thinking American(s).

“He also forced everyone, small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on his right hand or on his forehead, so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of his name. This calls for wisdom. If anyone has insight, let him calculate the number of the beast, for it is man’s number. His number is 666” (Revelation 13:16-18).

Posted by: Election at November 1, 2012 5:26 AM
Comment #356086

Rich

Romney’s great grandfather had more than one wife. Obama’s father had more than one wife. Which is closer to the present?

Posted by: C&J at November 1, 2012 6:42 AM
Comment #356095

C&J,

Please, can we not have a small chuckle over Election’s ridiculous rant about Democrats and Obama secretly promoting Islamic law for the purpose of enabling multiple wives for some bizarre conspiratorial agenda?

It would be funny except that so many on the right seem attracted to such crazy and paranoid theories. Birthers, Obama is a Muslim, Kenyan anti-colonialism, etc. are the life blood of a large segment of the conservative right. What is worse is that mainstream conservative media, e.g., FOX, has exploited and promoted those paranoid fantasies. The Glenn Beck show was for years nothing but a conspiracy workshop. Many mainstream Republican politicians have also exploited this tendency. The “Donald” still promotes the birther idea despite massive legal evidence to the contrary.

Many of my thoughtful conservative friends are well aware of this problem but say, well, Romney is not part of that segment of the Republican party and can control them. They say he will coalesce moderate Democrats and Republicans into an effective legislative force. In other words, he is actually a RHINO giving lip service to his conservative base. Maybe, maybe not.


Posted by: Rich at November 1, 2012 9:00 AM
Comment #356118

I suggest that the things I write are not rants, but they are properly researched; neither is it a chuckling matter, because it is a serious mater.

I have found that at times, that some People who completely agreed with what I wrote, would try to deceive others, by trying to belittle me or what I wrote.

I only write proven Facts, and I only express opinions, which are genuinely held opinions.

Most of my genuinely held opinions are found to be correct, and I consider myself to understand Human Nature, and I consider myself to be a good judge of character.

It is not a conspiracy theory that the Democrat Convention said that they wanted a non religious America, because anyone can check the public record.

It is not a conspiracy theory that Bill Clinton is an adulterer who does not like the thought of marital fidelity.

I would say for a Fact that many men in America would want to have multiple wives, even as there are People in America who would be Pedophiles if the American Constitution allowed it.

We have heard how one White American ‘Journalist’ has said that anyone who Votes for the Republicans is doing it because of hatred for another race in America.

America’s so called Free Press should be the Vital Fourth Estate in a Democracy; however, Much of America’s Main Stream Media is functioning as a Fifth Column.

The Hard Left Leadership of the Democrats in America wants to pronounce those who do not Vote for the Democrats to be no longer Human.

They want to do it with Maliciously Slandering Republican Voters are motivated by Racial Hatred, and are therefore Guilty of a Hate Crime, for which they should be Disarmed, and placed in FEMA Concentration Camps.

The Democrats want the Republican Voters to have no Human Rights or Democratic Rights, and forget Constitutional Rights, because the Democrats will not keep the American Constitution, because of the invented Racial Hatred for accusations for not Voting for Obama and by extension for not Voting for the Democrats.

The Black Republican Voters will be pronounced to be either Uncle Toms or Aunt Jemimas, or mentally retarded and placed in FEMA Concentration Camps.

There is no Voter Identification in many Places in America, and no Paper Ballots, and Paper Ballots and Voter Identification are essential to any Democracy.

Joseph Stalin said that it does not matter who votes, it matters who counts the votes.

An Article Titled: Rigging Elections Electronically - How They Do It, can be found at http://originaldialogue.blogspot.com.au/2010/10/it-doesnt-matter-who-votes-it-matters.html#!/2010/10/it-doesnt-matter-who-votes-it-matters.html .

Barack Obama said “These are serious times, and they call for a serious debate about where we need to take the nation. We cannot continue to rely on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives we’ve set. We’ve got to have a civilian national security force that’s just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded.”

Yes Obama knows that it is serious that Americans do not want a Communist Dictatorship, and so Obama and the Democrats have done the ‘Right Thing’, and Soros has purchased the Companies that will Electronically ‘Count’ the Votes, or Rig the Election.

I have written what I have written, and my findings are that America would act wisely if they Voted only for Candidates who will give America Good, Competent, and Constitutional Government.

Questions are discussed at: Glenn Beck - Part 1 - Barack Obama’s Civilian National Security Force at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPF4oBcboCY , and Glenn Beck - Part 2 - Barack Obama’s Civilian National Security Force at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h78tsGxxxmc , and Civilian Army Part III at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92jNvsrTFsM , and Civilian Army Part IV, at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSBbeSfZc_s ,Civilian Army Part V, at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVdd0wkU1c4&feature=relmfu .

It should not surprise us that the ‘Need’ civilian national security force is to Disarm Americans to set up a Dictatorship, and once America becomes a Dictatorship, then what is to prevent a Haremocracy in America?

Romney’s great grandfather had more than one wife; and Obama’s father had several wives, and Romney is not personally familiar with polygamy; whereas, Obama grew up in such a polygamous household and Country, and Obama spent much of his youth in Islamic Countries, where polygamy is considered normal.

Many Male Democrats can tell us if President Bill Clinton would like to get rid of the American Constitution, so that he can have multiple wives.

Black Arabs do exist, and if Obama is a Dictatorial Arab, either racially or culturally; and if this is combined by the Dictatorial Communist Indoctrination as a youth, along with Chicago Mafia Training, then it explains a lot.
Libya was a Friend of America and shared intelligence on Al-Qaeda with America, and Libya had Christians and was as Free, Democratic, Tolerant, and Secular as you could possibly have in any Majority Muslim Country.

Obama and Hillary Clinton want to set up an Islamic Country in Europe, by stealing Serbian Land, and giving it to Muslim Albanians, and most People know that things said by the American Government against Serbia are Slanderous Lies.

Obama and Clinton want to continue to bring Dictatorship to Syria, which is in the same position as Libya was.

I have written several properly researched comments, at WatchBlog in the Third Party and Independents Column.

Those comments were published at the News Item: Second Debate Lacks Answers for Undecided Voters at http://www.watchblog.com/thirdparty/archives/008209.html , where I use the Moniker Election.

Other comments were published at the news Item: Big Bird Over the 11-Year War in Afghanistan at http://www.watchblog.com/thirdparty/archives/008193.html#comments , where I used the Moniker of International Community, and the other Moniker I used was Security.

I do waive any and all copyright on any of my writings, as long as they only change spelling and grammar errors, and obviously, I would like People to share them with others, because I wrote them to share my beliefs, and my genuinely held opinions with other People.

The sexual urge is powerful, even perverted sexual urges are powerful, and I hope that Americans can understand that, and that White ‘Journalist’ mentioned he has a thrill running up his leg, because of Obama and the Democrats.

If Americans want a period of Rest, Healing, along with Economic Recovery, then they will not vote for Obama or the Democrats at these Elections.

Posted by: Election at November 1, 2012 3:01 PM
Comment #356125

Rich

I cut the new guys a little slack and generally respond mostly to those who write to me.

For the record, I believe Obama is patriot, just has some wrong ideas about how government and society work. I don’t generally believe in conspiracy theories on either the left or the right. My experience indicates that nobody can really keep anything very big a secret for very long. I also cannot understand why a guy that already has one wife would need or want another. I have always thought Clinton was generally a good president. If he was running instead of Obama, I think there would be a real choice. But in the race between Obama and Romney, only Romney will bring us sustainable prosperity.

Posted by: C&J at November 1, 2012 3:49 PM
Comment #356198

I wrote a comment to correct a sentence in a comment that I wrote at WatchBlog in the Third Party and Independents Column.

I do have what might be called occasional dyslexia for Not writing the word Not, and this never happens when I speak, but just at times when I write.

The comment was published at the news Item: Big Bird Over the 11-Year War in Afghanistan at http://www.watchblog.com/thirdparty/archives/008193.html#comments , where I used the Moniker of International Community.

The corrected sentence says: I have understood that Revelation to Saint John was given as a Vision, and it contains some figurative and symbolic language, because we know that literal biological horses are Not in Heaven.

I provided additional information to my other comment, and it can be read at the web link that is mentioned in this comment.

Posted by: Election at November 2, 2012 5:26 AM
Comment #356344

There are many People who do not understand why other People do certain things, and we can think of non smokers who cannot understand why People smoke, but the smokers understand why they smoke, and why they enjoy it.

It is the same way with those men who only want one wife, and they cannot understand why other men want more than one wife, but those men who want more than one wife understand themselves, and why they want more than one wife.

History has shown polygamy was practiced, and is practiced to this day, and it has to do with what some males like, even though other males only like to have one wife or partner.

There are People who claim they do not to believe in Conspiracies, but a conspiracy is a crime that is planned by more than one Person.

The Fact that crime exists, and that the Law has a Criminal Offense called Conspiracy, means that People do engage in Conspiracies, and this is no theory, but it is a Fact.

I would say for a Fact that many men in America would want to have multiple wives, even as there are People in America who would be Pedophiles if the American Constitution allowed it.

We know that the American Constitution does not allow bigamy, but those who want to have more than one wife, have a problem, because their legal wife can divorce her husband and receive a good settlement from the Courts, if they have a good lawyer.

We know that the word marriage in the Constitution was to be between consenting People of the opposite sex, and such a Union is unique, and has no equal, even though the phrase marriage equality has been used by some People.

There are People who think that the Polygamists want Homosexuals to marry, because then they can change the definition of marriage to include polygamy, and have a Law where there is no money given to a divorced wife, and it is easy for a man to divorce one of his wives under that Law, even for no reason other than he wants a divorce from one of his wives.

The type of Divorce Law that suits polygamists is where it is easy, quick, and free divorce from one of his wives.

I wonder if People could say that the word Bank Loan does not mean money that must be paid back, but it now means Bank Gift, where the Loan is a Gift, because regardless of what was written into the Contract, because the Wordsmiths have changed the word loan to mean gift.

It could be because they do not wish to discriminate, because they want transaction equity, or in other words a transaction that is a repayable loan must, in the minds of a professional Wordsmith be equal to a non repayable gift, because it is discrimination, and it would not be Politically Correct.

The same could be said of legal taxation obligations, where there must be no discrimination, and so legal taxation obligations, becomes the criminal for a taxpayer to pay, because there must be equality of transaction, and this means that the Government sends each taxpayer a check for 15 % of their income, even though paying taxes is no longer an obligation, but is criminal, because a professional Wordsmith has changed the meaning of these words.

The American Constitution is a real problem for polygamists, and I think that if they can set up a Police State and a Military Dictatorship, then they have a multiple wives, but I think that some Polygamists may not tolerate Female Homosexuals, even if they are not Muslims.

I think that most of us know that some of the males in the Polygamist Dictatorship in America would be Pedophiles, and it would logical to think that the Polygamists will be able to marry young girls so that many of them will not be Pedophiles under American Law.

The Main Stream Media in America, and perhaps the Invisible Demons will help Obama and the Democrats steal the Election, in order to make America One Nation under Satan.

There is no Secret that the Main Stream Media are working for the Obama and the Democrats, and perhaps the Democrats were cunning enough years to Secretly Film their Puppet Journalists in Acts of Pedophilia or Bestiality, and now they are their Puppets, because they are Puppets, and only a Hermit could not recognize that.

There could be People who think that the Liberal Media Owners want to be Polygamists, and they hired Journalists who want polygamy, or who have agreed to be filmed in Acts of Pedophilia or Bestiality in order to ensure their Puppetship to the Polygamist Dictatorial Conspiracy.

The Media is publishing unreliable opinion polls showing that Obama and the Democrats are more popular than they are, and one of two things are happening or a combination of both.

One is Voter Fraud, and the other is the cooperation of the Invisible Demons, who will enter Voters, and they will hear a voice to Vote for Obama and the Democrats, because the Invisible Devil and the Invisible Demons want to make America One Nation Under Satan.

The Liberal Media are the king makers, and they find Politicians to support to make America a Polygamist Dictatorship.

A Copy of this comment should be sent to every American, because this situation could be considered Historic that America ghas become One Nation Under Satan.

Posted by: Election at November 3, 2012 10:46 AM
Comment #356355

We have heard of a tragic story, where one Person who was made a Pastor has admitted to having committed a heinous crime.

May the friends of the bereaved comfort then, and may the resurrection hope comfort them, as it comforts believers.

“I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life. I tell you the truth, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son to have life in himself. And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man. “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and come out—those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned” (John 5: 24-29).

The Media writes: “John White, an ex-convict, was ordered held without bond Friday, charged with the first-degree murder of 24-year-old Rebekah Gay. White was engaged to Gay’s mother, Donna Houghton, and frequently babysat her 3-year-old son. Houghton was also instrumental in getting White hired to lead the 14-member Christ Community Fellowship church in rural Isabella County, Michigan. White served almost 12 years in prison for manslaughter, after killing a 26-year-old woman in Kalamazoo County. He had previously been sentenced to probation in 1981, for choking and stabbing a 17-year-old girl in Battle Creek, Michigan. “He was absolutely contrite,” said Houghton. “All kinds of people turn around and meet the Lord and they are a different person. He was doing a lot of good in the community. … He was doing a lot of good and Satan did not want him doing good, and Satan got to him.”

If Impartial and Scripturally based principles applied with John white, then he would never have been appointed as a Pastor, and more reading of the Bible is needed, and I will provide some Scriptures to make this matter clearer, because it was a lack of experience that led to him being appointed as a Pastor.

Even if he had not been appointed as a Pastor, this would not guarantee that he was not a Secret Devil Worshipper who had slipped secretly into that Church.

“Dear friends, I had intended to write to you about the salvation we share. But something has come up. It demands that I write to you and encourage you to continue your fight for the Christian faith that was entrusted to God’s holy people once for all time. Some people have slipped in among you unnoticed. Not long ago they were condemned in writing for the following reason: They are people to whom God means nothing. They use God’s kindness as an excuse for sexual freedom and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ” (Jude 3, 4).

The following Scriptures are from the Old Testament, and it tell us how the ancient Israelites were to consider things, and it gives us a principle, but Christians are not under the Law that God gave to Israel by means of Moses.

“If a bull gores a man or a woman to death, the bull must be stoned to death, and its meat must not be eaten. But the owner of the bull will not be held responsible” (Exodus 21:28).

Saint Paul gave instructions on what are the requirements for someone to be appointed to a position of a Pastor or Priest of the Church.

“I (Saint Paul) did not take you with me when I went away from Crete, so that you might do what was necessary to put things in order there, placing men in authority over the churches in every town, as I said to you; Men having a good record, husbands of one wife, whose children are of the faith, children of whom it may not be said that they are given to loose living or are uncontrolled. For it is necessary for a Bishop to be a man of virtue, as God’s servant; not pushing himself forward, not quickly moved to wrath or blows, not desiring profit for himself; But opening his house freely to guests; a lover of what is good, serious-minded, upright, holy, self-controlled; Keeping to the true word of the teaching, so that he may be able to give comfort by right teaching and overcome the arguments of the doubters” (Titus 1:5-9).

We see that John White had strong Polygamist yearnings, but he did not display Pedophilia, against the young boy, but we do not know if he had been with a young girl, if he would have engaged in Acts of Pedophilia, because of his obvious Polygamist yearnings.

I shall offer one of at least two possible explanations, but my concern is that he realizes what he has done and repents, but he will have to pay for his crime.

God forgave King Manasseh, and so although he should be ashamed of what he has done, he should never think that he is unworthy of receiving God’s blessings and forgiveness, and he can be certain that God will forgive those who genuinely repent.

“Seek the LORD while he may be found. Call on him while he is near. Let wicked people abandon their ways. Let evil people abandon their thoughts. Let them return to the LORD, and he will show compassion to them. Let them return to our God, because he will freely forgive them” (Isaiah 55:6, 7).

It is no coincidence in my opinion that surname is White and that he was a Pastor, and Romney is white and was Bishop of his local congregation at one time.

This is because Obama and the Democrats want America to become One Polygamist Nation under Satan.

It could be that the Invisible Devil overpowered John White to commit this crime, or John White sold his soul to the Devil to commit this crime because it is Election Time, in order to try to throw mud on Romney, and perhaps he was promised a Pardon after the Election.

“They arrived in the territory of the Gerasenes on the other side of the Sea of Galilee. As Jesus stepped out of the boat, a man came out of the tombs and met him. The man was controlled by an evil spirit and lived among the tombs. No one could restrain him any longer, not even with a chain. He had often been chained hand and foot. However, he snapped the chains off his hands and broke the chains from his feet. No one could control him. Night and day he was among the tombs and on the mountainsides screaming and cutting himself with stones. The man saw Jesus at a distance. So he ran [to Jesus], bowed down in front of him, and shouted, “Why are you bothering me now, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? Swear to God that you won’t torture me.” He shouted this because Jesus said, “You evil spirit, come out of the man.” Jesus asked him, “What is your name?” He told Jesus, “My name is Legion [Six Thousand], because there are many of us.” He begged Jesus not to send them out of the territory. A large herd of pigs was feeding on a mountainside nearby. The demons begged him, “Send us into the pigs! Let us enter them!” Jesus let them do this. The evil spirits came out of the man and went into the pigs. The herd of about two thousand pigs rushed down the cliff into the sea and drowned” (Mark 5:1-13).

“So that we would not be outwitted by Satan; for we are not ignorant of his designs” (2 Corinthians 2:11).

“But the LORD said to Samuel, Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The LORD does not look at the things man looks at. Man looks at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart” (1 Samuel 16:7).

It is vital that God’s advice is closely followed for appointments to the positions of teaching, or of authority in the Church.

Posted by: Election at November 3, 2012 1:51 PM
Comment #356401

For a long time, there have been Conspirators scheming the overthrow of the American Constitution, in order to set up a Polygamist Dictatorship in America, and use subliminal and subtle language, and they scheme and manipulate Society for their Polygamist Dictatorship based on their language.

This subliminal or subtle language is the Polygamists way of Admitting to their Schemes and Advertizing it, and without it being admissible in a Court of Law as evidence, but their objective is to manipulate Society.

Also the lack the Justice shows that the System would cover up, and I think that the Leftist Media are for a Dictatorial Polygamist America, and this is why their Journalists who are obviously biased towards the Democrats cover up for the Democrats, and Senator Kennedy escaped Justice, and this intimidated those opposed to a Polygamist Dictatorship in America.

I think that the name of an island of Chappaquiddick inspired the American Polygamist Group to use Senator Kennedy to premeditate a crime in order to send a subliminal message of how things would be, including total lack of Justice, because there would not be much Justice in a Polygamist Dictatorship.

The word Chappaquiddick is made up of Chap A Quid Dick, and chap is a man, and quid is money, and dick has several meanings, and one of them is the male sexual organ.

This is how Male Democrats intimidated females to keep silent about their affairs, and it was Linda Tripp who made Monika Lewinsky’s indiscretions with President Bill Clinton known to the Public, because Monika Lewinsky had confided to her concerning the Affair she was having with Bill Clinton.

Linda Tripp’s action in secretly recording Monika Lewinsky’s confidential phone-calls about her relationship with President Clinton caused a sensation, with their links to the earlier Paula Jones and Bill Clinton Lawsuit with the disclosing of notably intimate details.

We all know Senator Kennedy who killed a female companion who was not his wife or girlfriend, because his automobile drove off Dike Bridge at Chappaquiddick, and how after that incident, the word dike was used by the American Democrats, the supposed champions of women and homosexuals to refer to mean a female homosexual after that incident.

This could be a clue as to how some Polygamists would view female Homosexuals in a Polygamist Dictatorship in America; after they managed to overthrow the American Constitution, by Disarming the People and setting up a Police State and a Military Dictatorship.

After that Chappaquiddick incident, and with Regards to Senator John DeCamp, the word camp came to mean male homosexual at the time Senator John DeCamp was making known his investigations of Pedophilia among prominent citizens of Omaha, Nebraska, as well as high-level American Politicians.

Senator John DeCamp’s investigations were made public in the Media in 1988, and he wrote his Memo in 1990, and he published the first edition his book, the Franklin Cover Up in 1992.

We see here that the American Polygamist Conspirators using word changing and trying to subliminally suggest that Senator Kennedy could not have had an affair with that woman, because they hoped that others thought that she was a dike, or a lesbian.

This is because the automobile came off Dike Bridge, and it may show the attitude of some of Non-Islamic Polygamists to lesbians or dikes, after the Polygamist Democrats overthrow the American Constitution, and set up a Polygamist Dictatorship in America.

The same method was used by the American Democrats who are the supposed champions of children and homosexuals with Senator John DeCamp, where the American Democrats invented and used the term camp, and were subliminally suggesting that he was camp or male homosexual, and because of that, People should not listen to Senator John DeCamp, or read his book.

The latest incident by the Secret American Polygamists is their effort to win the American Election, with a terrible incident in Michigan, which is a close race in that State.

The Media writes: “John White, an ex-convict, was ordered held without bond Friday, charged with the first-degree murder of 24-year-old Rebekah Gay. White was engaged to Gay’s mother, Donna Houghton, and frequently babysat her 3-year-old son. Houghton was also instrumental in getting White hired to lead the 14-member Christ Community Fellowship church in rural Isabella County, Michigan. White served almost 12 years in prison for manslaughter, after killing a 26-year-old woman in Kalamazoo County. He had previously been sentenced to probation in 1981, for choking and stabbing a 17-year-old girl in Battle Creek, Michigan. “He was absolutely contrite,” said Houghton. “All kinds of people turn around and meet the Lord and they are a different person. He was doing a lot of good in the community. … He was doing a lot of good and Satan did not want him doing good, and Satan got to him.”

I have expressed my hope that this criminal repents of what he has done, and even though he will be justly punished for what he has done, he should repent, in order to have the hope of everlasting life.

It is no coincidence in my opinion that his surname is White and that he was a Pastor, and Romney is white and was Bishop of his local congregation at one time.

This is because Obama and the Democrats want America to become One Dictatorial Polygamist Nation under Satan.

It is possible that the Invisible Devil overpowered John White to commit this crime, or John White sold his soul to the Devil to commit this crime because it is Election Time, in order to try to throw mud on Romney, and perhaps he was promised a Pardon after the Election, and I think the victim was chosen because of her surname.

Another thing that I noticed concerning his female victim, is that her surname is Gay, and it reminds us of Dike Bridge and the word dike, and it may show the attitude of some of the Non-Islamic Polygamists to female homosexuals after the American Constitution is overthrown, and a Polygamist Dictatorship is established in America.

The Main Stream Media in America, and the Invisible Demons will help Obama and the Democrats steal the Election, in order to make America One Nation under Satan, which is Satan’s scheme.

“So that we would not be outwitted by Satan; for we are not ignorant of his designs” (2 Corinthians 2:11).

I published comments that mention this in more detail in the News Item that is Titled: Women and men get paid what they are worth at http://www.watchblog.com/republicans/archives/008234.html#comments , and I used the moniker, Election.

There is no Secret that the Main Stream Media are working for the Obama and the Democrats, and perhaps the Democrats were cunning enough years ago to Secretly Film their Puppet Journalists in Acts of Pedophilia or Bestiality, and now these Journalists are their Puppets, because they are Puppets, and only a Hermit could not realize that.

There could be People who think that the Liberal Media Owners want to be Polygamists, and they hired Journalists who want polygamy, or who have agreed to be filmed in Acts of Pedophilia or Bestiality in order to ensure their Puppetship to the Polygamist Dictatorial Conspiracy.

We can see how the ‘Free Press’, which was supposed to be the Vital Fourth Estate in a Democracy, has become a Fifth Column to America.

The Media is publishing unreliable opinion polls showing that Obama and the Democrats are more popular than what they really are, and one of two things are happening, or even a combination of both.

One is Voter Fraud, and the other is the Invisible Demons, who will enter Voters, and they will hear a voice in their heads that only they can hear to Vote for Obama and the Democrats, because the Invisible Devil and Invisible Demons want to make America One Nation Under Satan.

The Liberal Media are the king makers, and they find Politicians to support to make America a Polygamist Dictatorship.

A Copy of this comment should be sent to every American, because this situation could be considered Historic that America has become One Nation Under Satan.

I have written several properly researched comments, at WatchBlog in the Third Party and Independents Column.

Those comments were published at the News Item: Second Debate Lacks Answers for Undecided Voters at http://www.watchblog.com/thirdparty/archives/008209.html , where I use the Moniker Election.

Other comments were published at the news Item: Big Bird Over the 11-Year War in Afghanistan at http://www.watchblog.com/thirdparty/archives/008193.html#comments , where I used the Moniker of International Community, and the other Moniker I used was Security.

I do waive any and all copyright on any of my writings, as long as they only change spelling and grammar errors, and obviously, I would like People to share them with others, because I wrote them to share my beliefs, and my genuinely held opinions with other People.

One good way to do that is to mention some of these things to Talk Back Radio Shows.

After watching the short Video that is Titled: Eric Holder we must BRAINWASH people antiguns 1995.mp4 at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omXeSnUx_V4 , we can see that this is an old project, and the Fast and Furious Scandal was intended to be used in Government Propaganda to Disarm the American People to set up a Military Dictatorship in America.

The Video that is Titled: Man attacked by Killer Whale, at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWfzA29EhGY , shows us the Democrats or atheist Polygamists are laying low on many matters against the American People like Disarming the American People, until after the Election.

Barack Obama said “These are serious times, and they call for a serious debate about where we need to take the nation. We cannot continue to rely on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives we’ve set. We’ve got to have a civilian national security force that’s just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded.”

Yes, Obama knows that it is serious that Americans do not want a Communist Polygamist Dictatorship, and so Obama and the Democrats have done the ‘Right Thing’, and Soros has purchased the Companies that will Electronically ‘Count’ the Votes, or Rig the Election.

I have written what I have written, and my findings are that America would act wisely if they Voted only for Candidates who will give America Good, Competent, and Constitutional Government.

Questions are discussed at: Glenn Beck - Part 1 - Barack Obama’s Civilian National Security Force at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPF4oBcboCY , and Glenn Beck - Part 2 - Barack Obama’s Civilian National Security Force at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h78tsGxxxmc , and Civilian Army Part III at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92jNvsrTFsM , and Civilian Army Part IV, at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSBbeSfZc_s ,Civilian Army Part V, at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVdd0wkU1c4&feature=relmfu .

Perhaps they need a civilian national security force of Polygamists to Disarm Americans to set up a Dictatorship, and once America becomes a Dictatorship, then what is to prevent a Haremocracy in America?

Many Male Democrats know that President Bill Clinton would like to get rid of the American Constitution, so that he can have multiple wives.

America has much debt and much unemployment, and the American Males that survive Onamacare ‘Health Treatments’ will be happy to have a few of their wives go to work, on a rotation basis, while the other wives take it in turns to stay home, and attend to homely duties.

For many families that it takes at least two to go to work to have enough money for the Household.

Hillary Clinton has been setting the example for decades to American women, as to the joys of being part of a Harem, even though this has been done subtlety with Bill Clinton Affairs, while the Clintons have been pretending to be the Champions of Women’s’ Rights, but I do not think the Men were as easily deceived.

The Democrats want to Disarm America, and set up a Police State and a Military Dictatorship, and those Polygamist Males who Vote Democrat will survive Obamacare ‘Health Treatments’; and Nazi Doctor Joseph Mengele, the angel of death, spared only those Jews who were Nazi collaborators.

We have heard how many People suspect that Obama and the Democrats as having deliberately mismanaged the Economy, in order to set up a Police State and a Military Dictatorship.

Democrats know how to make others Vote Democrat, just like they have done in Illinois, and the Bible tells us of one method, with the capability to buy and sell, and those American States who do not Vote Democrat, will not receive assistance because of not Voting the ‘Approved’ way.

It is amazing how Illinois can just keep Voting for Democrats all the time, and that is because the Chicago Politicians of which Obama is one, knows how to do it in one State, and wants it all over America.

“He also forced everyone, small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on his right hand or on his forehead, so that no one could buy or sell unless he had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of his name. This calls for wisdom. If anyone has insight, let him calculate the number of the beast, for it is man’s number. His number is 666” (Revelation 13:16-18).

Obama and the Democrats have failed dismally to make any progress on lowering unemployment, reducing the budget deficit, paying off the national debt, and on improving the economy, and all these matters have become worse during the last 4 years.

The Voters have a Responsibility to the Nation and a responsibility to their Families, Friends, and Neighbors not to Vote for Obama and the Democrats at these Elections.

American Voters are encouraged to take no chances and actually Vote, and to Vote only for Candidates who will give America Good, Competent, and Constitutional Government.

If Americans want better than the Incompetent, Corrupt, and Divisive Obama and the Democrats, and if they want Economic Recovery, then they will not vote for Obama or the Democrats at these Elections.

Posted by: Election at November 4, 2012 11:31 AM
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