Why they hate America: (Liberals)

Unfortunately, as I write this America has been about its nefarious business, engaged in a hegemonic war for oil. It seems mercenaries have assassinated a prominant political leader and freedom fighter in Iraq. Truly, it is a sad day for peace; as I expect this can only further enrage peace-loving muslims the world over turning them into terrorists and perpetuating the (American-inspired) cycle of violence.

Michael Moore may have said it best when he eviscerated Bush for creating the insurgency:

The Iraqis who have risen up against the occupation are not "insurgents" or "terrorists" or "The Enemy." They are the REVOLUTION, the Minutemen, and their numbers will grow -- and they will win. Get it, Mr. Bush? You closed down a friggin' weekly newspaper, you great giver of freedom and democracy! Then all hell broke loose. The paper only had 10,000 readers! Why are you smirking? ~MichaelMoore.com

If only we had pulled out by now

Sadly, many today are glad that Zarqawi is dead. Bush voters, as well as many non-Bush voters, still don't get it. The cycle of violence will continue until America learns that it cannot bring democracy at the point of a gun; and that the relentless pursuit of oil profits is not a good enough reason to go to war.

I ask you, why do so many of our soldiers have to die for nothing?

If only we had the sense to pull out when John Kerry and John Murtha demanded it. Zarqawi might still be alive today and we might have the chance to stop the cycle of violence.

Until Americans learn that every 'enemy' we face today has been created by the actions of America itself, we will continue to be hated all around the world and continue to be the targets of terror because we refuse to address the underlying causes of the violence.

For instance, no less than Gandhi's grandson spoke out after Nick Berg's brutal beheading by Zarqawi (with a dull knife you may remember), about how America had failed miserably to end the violence after 9/11. His logic is unassailable.

He said the United States had an opportunity to change the cycle after the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, but did not take advantage.

"If we had not gone to seek revenge after 9/11 and reached out with the rest of world to improve the lives of the rest of the world, we could have achieved something. But we blew that,'' he said.

"One of the reasons for terrorism is that the (United States') relationship with the rest of the world has not been a good one. That results in the conflict we face today.''

~Gandhi: U.S. Continued Cycle of Violence with 9/11 'Revenge'


Root causes: who's to blame

Nick Berg's own father is speaking out about the murder of Zarqawi. Our culture of violence is evident even within this CNN article (amazing!) which prominently asks viewers to watch a video of the murder of Zarqawi itself... in essence, to watch as the weapons of mass destruction from our war machine obliterate any hope for peace and perpetuate the cycle of violence.

MICHAEL BERG: Well, my reaction is I'm sorry whenever any human being dies. Zarqawi is a human being. He has a family who are reacting just as my family reacted when Nick was killed, and I feel bad for that. (Watch video of the two bombs falling on al-Zarqawi -- 2:00)

I feel doubly bad, though, because Zarqawi is also a political figure, and his death will re-ignite yet another wave of revenge, and revenge is something that I do not follow, that I do want ask for, that I do not wish for against anybody. And it can't end the cycle. As long as people use violence to combat violence, we will always have violence. cnn.com

When will we learn?!? We are only creating more terrorists this way!

Now, take someone who in 1991, who maybe had their family killed by an American bomb, their support system whisked away from them, someone who, instead of being 59, as I was when Nick died, was 5-years-old or 10-years-old. And then if I were that person, might I not learn how to fly a plane into a building or strap a bag of bombs to my back?

That's what is happening every time we kill an Iraqi, every time we kill anyone, we are creating a large number of people who are going to want vengeance. And, you know, when are we ever going to learn that that doesn't work? cnn.com

Ann Coulter widows

But we know from other victims of terrorist violence, like 9/11, that it will not stop or be prevented until people like Ann Coulter and George Bush are stopped. The war on terror cannot be won until we have a President that will acknowledge that we are as much to blame for 9/11 as anyone else, and take steps to reverse the damage we have done in the world.

"Three thousand people were murdered on George Bush's watch."-- Kristin Breitweiser

"President Bush and his workers . . . were the individuals that failed my husband and the 3,000 people that day."

So we see, that if it were not for Bush, 9/11 might not have ever happened.

We created the theocracy in Iran -- and who knows what kind of horrible consequences will flow from the present atrocities we are committing in Iraq today. Just as we failed to protect the Jersey Girls husbands on 9/11 we are today creating another disaster in Iraq.

BERG: Well, you know, I'm not saying Saddam Hussein was a good man, but he's no worse than George Bush. Saddam Hussein didn't pull the trigger, didn't commit the rapes. Neither did George Bush. But both men are responsible for them under their reigns of terror.

I don't buy that. Iraq did not have al Qaeda in it. Al Qaeda supposedly killed my son.

Under Saddam Hussein, no al Qaeda. Under George Bush, al Qaeda.

Under Saddam Hussein, relative stability. Under George Bush, instability.

Under Saddam Hussein, about 30,000 deaths a year. Under George Bush, about 60,000 deaths a year. I don't get it. Why is it better to have George Bush the king of Iraq rather than Saddam Hussein? cnn.com

Postscript: a treasury of deathless quotes.

Al Gore has made his sharpest attack yet on the George Bush presidency, describing the current US administration as "a renegade band of rightwing extremists". gaurdian.co.uk - - -

Kerry agreed completely with someone’s assessment that everything that Bush does is solely for the purpose of looting the country. He basically said that Bush and his cohorts are criminals and that history will judge them so. hollywood liberal
- - -

There is no "War on Terror."

There is, however, a "war" on the U.S. Constitution. alternet.org
- - -

"And there is no reason, Bob, that young American soldiers need to be going into the homes of Iraqis in the dead of night, terrorizing kids and children, you know, women, breaking sort of the customs of the--of--the historical customs, religious customs. Whether you like it or not..." ~John Kerry

Posted by Eric Simonson at June 8, 2006 7:30 PM
Comments
Comment #155754

The majority of Americans know Bush erred in invading Iraq, the know he has managed it badly after invading, and they know Bush does NOT know what to do about the mess he got us in to. That includes a growing minority of Republicans.

So, I guess you must be preaching to the choir minority who still equate Iraq with the nobility and justness of WWII. That’s fine. Everyone in America needs a spokesperson, especially minorities.

Posted by: David R. Remer at June 8, 2006 7:46 PM
Comment #155763

Another “Liberals are Traitors” article…

Sometimes I think this is all you have left to argue with…

This and Clinton, that is…

Posted by: Aldous at June 8, 2006 8:18 PM
Comment #155764

Wow. Thanks for clearing everything up.

I love reading the REPs take on the liberal mindset… and you even found a way to wind Ann Coulter into it.

I guess if you’re lobbing 500 lb bombs, you don’t really need to be too close.

Posted by: tony at June 8, 2006 8:21 PM
Comment #155767

I can not believe that there are people on this planet so naive!!!!!!!Don’t like it here, MOVE!!!!Preferably to a muslim extremist area where you can suffer they way you would like.Or have yourself beheaded for the sake of peace.

Posted by: Mike at June 8, 2006 8:26 PM
Comment #155769

The sad thing is, I was expecting a “Liberals are Traitors” comment the minute I saw Zarqawi was dead.

What I DID NOT expect was a fullfledged Article on the Treason of Liberals.

This the face of the Republican Party. Everyone is a Traitor except themselves.

Posted by: Aldous at June 8, 2006 8:29 PM
Comment #155771

Mike:

Why don’t you mopve instead? If you look at those “muslim extremist areas” you mentioned, they resemble you more than us.

Muslim extremists like torturing people…

Muslim extremists like persecuting fags and queers…

Muslim extremists like controlling everything…

Muslim extremists like spying on everybody…

Muslim extremists like taking Human Rights away…

So you see, Mike, YOU would be far happier living among Muslim Extremists than Liberals.

Posted by: Aldous at June 8, 2006 8:33 PM
Comment #155772

Saddams sons helped Zarqawi heal after he was almost removed in Afganistan.Not part of terorrism?They had their own surgeons woking on him.The spawn of Satan needed to go.The only way this could have been better would be that the pilot duct taped a couple pieces of bacon to the bombs!!!!!!

Posted by: Mike at June 8, 2006 8:36 PM
Comment #155776

Unlike you,Aldous, I trust GOD,Love this country, and know the differece between good and evil.If you think a person who beheads 17 people is a victim,your values do not belong in a free country.

Posted by: Mike at June 8, 2006 8:40 PM
Comment #155778

Besides,do you like to vote? Did the Iraqis get to vote? They do now.Ask an Iraqi woman what she thinks of freedom.Seems to me you would like to be the slave-holder.

Posted by: Mike at June 8, 2006 8:44 PM
Comment #155784

“Unlike you,Aldous, I trust GOD,Love this country, and know the differece between good and evil.If you think a person who beheads 17 people is a victim,your values do not belong in a free country.”

Exactly where does Aldous or anyone on this entire blog mention Zarqawi as a victim. You assume this because it’s in your nature to automatically assume anyone who disagrees with you has to be completely evil.

As far as values - I don’t see them represented at all by you - and it’s not your choice to determine who belongs in a free country (the idea that you assume this base contradiction is mind boggling.

Posted by: tony at June 8, 2006 8:51 PM
Comment #155785

Mike:

You forget. The Muslim Extremists TRUST GOD, Love their Countries and know the difference between good and evil too. If you think a person who imprisons 500 souls without a trial or due process is not acting like a muslim extremist, you need a course on basic human rights.

Posted by: Aldous at June 8, 2006 8:55 PM
Comment #155786

Aldous -

It seems that all is fair in war, as long as you have a couple of flags or gods to help tell the various sides apart.

Posted by: tony at June 8, 2006 8:59 PM
Comment #155788

Yep, 100% correct, that’s what the extremes do.

Posted by: Rodney Brown at June 8, 2006 9:00 PM
Comment #155792

I don’t think liberals are traitors (which is a high standard to meet) but many as misguided.

Moore and Berg, for example, certainly dislike most of what American stands for. And among many it is habit to blame America for everything.

Aldous

Liberals seem to equate patriotism with Republicanism, not me. On many occassions, I have written something defending my country or saying good things about it - WITHOUT mentioning Bush or any party - and the first posts will almost always “accuse” me of parroting the Republican line. That is what liberals think about patriotism, not me. If I write America is a great county, I am sure I will get ten post telling why I am wrong. America is a great country. That is just true. Is that a Republican idea?

Posted by: Jack at June 8, 2006 9:02 PM
Comment #155794

It is just like a liberal to get things wrong.I said values,not person.When liberals stop being angry all the time and can stop and listen,and THINK for themselves without paranoya,this place will be better.

Posted by: Mike at June 8, 2006 9:04 PM
Comment #155795

Ahh, another post from the “hate Americans first” poster boy. More divisive, hate-filled rhetoric without factual basis.

Anyone who says that the left doesn’t love America IS A LIAR.

Anyone who says that the left doesn’t know right from wrong IS A LIAR.

Anyone who says that the left is sympathetic to al Qaeda IS A LIAR.

Posted by: ElliottBay at June 8, 2006 9:11 PM
Comment #155796

Aldous:
“Another “Liberals are Traitors” article…

Same old, same old.

“Sometimes I think this is all you have left to argue with…”

Isn’t this all he’s ever had to say? As long as I’ve been reading and contributing to this blog, it has. Every single article has all been just different variations on that one theme.

tony:
“you even found a way to wind Ann Coulter into it.”

It has occurred to me more than once that “Eric Simonson” might actually BE Ann Coulter.
Oh, and I’ve got the feeling that “mike” might be “lookingout” who was “saying” and “mystified” and “whitebigot” and “coonyjay”. Same MO: rarely puts spaces between sentences, same kinds of messages repeated over and over, same way of expressing his complete hatred of liberals.

Posted by: Adrienne at June 8, 2006 9:11 PM
Comment #155799

The idea of REPs actually representing anything close to American ideals is a crock.

REPs fight for flags and words and rhetoric - whatever it takes to keep the masses marching in the direction they want them to. REPs have tried to force freedom down the barrel of tanks - if that doesn’t strike you as moronic… you might want to read up what freedom is. Democracy does not fit on the warhead of a missle.

LIBs fight for freedom, personal expression and choices… We’d rather risk life and limb to protect freedoms… not give them up for false securities.

LIBs see what America could one day be and we will fight tooth and nail to see that come true… and that will take a lot of fixing and mending as we go. It seems that REPs simply want to call America perfect as is and would rather attack those who see faults rather than attacking the actual problems.

Posted by: tony at June 8, 2006 9:13 PM
Comment #155801

Jack and Mike:

The fact that you think Liberals “equate patriotism with Republicanism” just shows how ignorant you are about Liberals.

We do not equate Republicanism with patriotism.
We equate Republicanism with the same stupidity and insanity you find in Fascism and Islamic Fundamentalism.

Posted by: Aldous at June 8, 2006 9:14 PM
Comment #155804

Eric,

If you think that your perspective represents the majority of democrats or even self-discribed liberals you are wrong. I think what we are mainly looking for is a silver lining amongst a genuinely mismanaged and badly handled war. This whole war was riddled with screw-ups from it’s inception but every now and again there is a positive sign, this for the most part is one such example. But here’s the problem Republicans take everything and beat people over the heads with it and when we get mad and let you have it right back we wind up being the bad guys and thus made some form of example of in your own warped way.

First off ERic, I do not at all like being accused of being a traitor to my country as you have attempted to smear me as (which btw makes me angry enough to belt you cross-eyed). Secondly I am not pro-terror or pro-insurgent and certainly not pro-Saddam or any such BS of the like—got it?!!

Now here were the problems—we went in there with our troops too spread out between two theaters, Afghanistan and then Iraq. the case for the war was horsesh*t and could have waited until we had finished with Afghanistan or gotten closer to having finished the job there. thirdly there was bad intelligence and this administration onley heard what it wanted to hear and they got the sharp end of the stick for it. Fourth we did not protect those borders so that all the outside insurgents from Iran and Syria came-a-ramblin’-on-in. Fifth we had no exit strategy, sixth the republicans went into this without thinking ahead obviously. Seven: You did everything you people could politically to besmirch us and then wonder why you people did not have our support (which I still want to clock you for because it really angers me). Eight: we had to fix what we broke and we still have not, nor did the neocons reallize that that is also a part of war too—because they are idiots apparently!

Want more Eric? I have my reasons to say Bush has his head up his rear-end and yes they are quite valid. Let me know if you ever need a laundry list.

Posted by: Novenge at June 8, 2006 9:24 PM
Comment #155805

Aldous

But YOU do. You get indigant whenever anyone says anything good about the U.S. I often write posts w/o reference to Bush. I write things I could have written during Clinton. And yet any time I say anything positive, I can expect a counter attack. So evidently, SOME people either dislike America or they think I am defending Republican values when I defend my country.

Posted by: Jack at June 8, 2006 9:24 PM
Comment #155807

Jack

What does “America stand for” in your eyes?

Moore is over the edge. So are a lot of people. But when has he criticized the constitution? What I see a criticisms of policys and people, all of which are fair game in our free press system (mixed with poor taste and sophmoric behavior).

Posted by: 037 at June 8, 2006 9:26 PM
Comment #155809

Eric, your cynicism and simplistic thinking shine through in this post.

Apparently anyone that disagrees with you is aligned with those that say the most ridiculous, outrageous things. It appears in your mind that is what anyone who disagrees with your assessments is a protaganist for the opposite of what you believe. And now you shout vindication with the death of one man. Oh how mightily you elevate his significance.


I think we should have pulled out of Iraq. We should have taken away his raison d’etre before he established himself. We should have supplied the Iraqis with inteliigence and weapons to defeat these thugs themselves. I suppose the believer in self reliance you are, believe they couldn’t lift a finger to defend themselves.

We aren’t fighting a war on terror in Iraq. We are fighting a Sunni/Bathist sectarian war. We are fighting for control of the oil fields. Get a grip, and lose the propoganda.

Zarqhawi is dead and I will drink a shot of whiskey, and aim to the east in an attempt to piss on his grave.

As far as believing GW caused 911, I don’t know who believes that except radicals with skewed extremist viewpoints, such as you often espouse. A small minority of opinion, along with the tinfoil crowd.

As to believing he bungled the administration of several intelligence agencies, defense, state and homeland security departments you’ve got my number. He is the great bungler.

Ann Coulter is an insignificant writer who is willing to say anything and will probably next flash her boobs much like Paris Hilton in her desparate attempts at shocking the media so she can profit.

Posted by: gergle at June 8, 2006 9:27 PM
Comment #155810

This blog is called Republicans and Conservatives, so why are ther so many pinko libs posting their messages of HATE?! Don’t bother trying to tell me you have a shread of patriotic DNA, have any of you commies ever read The Constitution? Why are you so adamant about exposing every miscalculation by the military and blaming Bush for everything that goes wrong. You say he’s an idiot, but then in the same breath you accuse him of plotting against black people and successfully leveling New Orleans with a hurricane he created by not signing the Kyoto BS. I search for media that is not fair or balanced. I’m sick of the liberal BS I am constantly bombarded with. I was a lib as a teenager until I came to my sences and really opened my mind to another point of view, and found out what thinking really is. Question your liberal masters. REMEMBER CHAPAQUIDIK. (I don’t know how to spell it)

Posted by: pete at June 8, 2006 9:27 PM
Comment #155811

Mike

How does trusting God fit with “turning the other cheek”? was that not Jesus’s message?

Posted by: 037 at June 8, 2006 9:28 PM
Comment #155812

I am glad that Zarqawi was eliminated. That he was a natural creation stemming from our decision to invade Iraq seems to be escaping everyone. That he or someone like him would step up in the name of Muslims is an unfortunate consequence of invading a Muslim nation, no matter what our intentions were.

I will be far more impressed the day Bin Laden receives the same fate.

Posted by: Cube at June 8, 2006 9:28 PM
Comment #155816

David Remer:

The majority of Americans know Bush erred in invading Iraq,

Ahh I would love to see the stats on that. I will say that most Americans are most likely tire of it but that does not mean that they think we should never have started it to begin with.

Aldous

This the face of the Republican Party. Everyone is a Traitor except themselves.

First off hyperbole is below you I know you realize that not all Republicans think that liberals are traitors. I do not. I think that there are many liberals who do not like it here and I am not sure why they have stayed here so long but they can if they want to.

I wish to state “I wish the article was not titled so” there stated.

Now I wish to state “I wish those who consider themselves liberal would talk about what was quoted here.” there stated.

Many times things like this are brought up but never discussed. I would like to hear if most liberals agree or think these folks are way off. I am not being facetious here. The reason this is important for me to know is what they are saying really really offends me. I have a hard time comprehending why someone would think that way. People who equate us with some of the worst regimes in history. I do understand disagreeing with someone and making it vocal even strong but so much name calling by all these public figures I do not get.

I never participated in this not with Clinton not with Carter (well maybe Carter I think him a socialist if you call that name calling). I would like a well thought out statement regarding the statements here by a person who considers themselves liberal please.

Posted by: Randall Jeremiah at June 8, 2006 9:37 PM
Comment #155819

Simmons, what tripe. Some things are not even worth commenting on. Sad but true.

Posted by: Chris2x at June 8, 2006 9:42 PM
Comment #155821

Pete, et.al, halt the name calling of WB visitors and participants or lose your comment privileges, here.

And those who are criticizing the author of this article instead of what he wrote, this will be your only warning to comply with our Critique the Message, Not the Messenger policy.

Posted by: WatchBlog Managing Editor at June 8, 2006 9:43 PM
Comment #155823

Randall, try googling Bush Polls. Tons of ‘em out there demonstrating my words are accurate. You can think whatever you like, but the polls show the majority of Americans now believe invading Iraq was a mistake.

Posted by: David R. Remer at June 8, 2006 9:45 PM
Comment #155824

Mike are you a conservative extremeist (or whatever you might call yourself) who thinks that the only way for America to survive is to exterminate every Muslim on the face of the earth? Do you realize that makes you EXACTLY the SAME as the Muslim Extremeists?

There is a great quote out there that says, in essence, anyone who professess to know the mind of God is a fool.
I think of that quote whenever I hear/read someone like you or someone like them talking. No human being should EVER begin to think they have the a handle on that. That is one of the most heinous examples of arrogance there is. You cannot know what god’s plan is, neither do I. Until there’s a fax or whatever from on high - why don’t you assume that his knowledge is greater than yours and stop going on about how only people who agree with you should be allowed to live in OUR great country.

Posted by: kp at June 8, 2006 9:46 PM
Comment #155829

Jack?

“America is a great ‘county” did you say??? See that’s what we usually accuse the republicans of which is small mindedness, but perhaps that Freudian slip of the keystroke spoke volumes.

Patriotism is not a Republican sentiment thinking you have a copyright on it is. What you say is Bush+lockstep=Patriotism that can get a little irritating.

Posted by: Novenge at June 8, 2006 9:56 PM
Comment #155840

Novenge

I do not spell or proofread well. I never claimed to be smart, just prolific.

My point re patriotism is not that it is Republicanism. My point is that when I say good things about my country, when I say our method of democracy is one of the best and most stable in the world, when I say our economy has produced fantastic wealth, when I say they we have successfully absorbed more immigrants than anyone else in history, when I say that our founding fathers and leaders throughout our history have done a good job, when I say that of all the times when I could live, I would choose this time and of all the places I could choose to live it is here in America and now, when I say all those things w/o mentioning Bush or Republicans, I will be called Republican and probably attacked.

I understand we have done many bad things in our history and there are many bad things today. But I am 100% convinced that if you balance it all out, the U.S. is the greatest force for good in the world today. If you can think of something better, let me know.

Posted by: Jack at June 8, 2006 10:15 PM
Comment #155842

Patriotism is a tool to manipulate the emotions of the populace to support and not overthrow, a handful of leaders who use power and patriotism to have their way with the people.

Our Founding Fathers were traitors to their nation, Great Britain and their King George. Traitors and treasonous, every last one of them. Patriotism cuts like a two edged sword left or right and citizens should always beware of standing too close to those who wield patriotism as a sword.

Posted by: David R. Remer at June 8, 2006 10:18 PM
Comment #155847

David Remer

I stand corrected I did search and found that in every poll it is in favor of never having gone. Some were close and with margin of error almost equal while others were not even close. I will be interested to see polls now after Zarqawi and the 17 cells. That will be very telling if people are swayed with emotion or what is real. We shall see.

Posted by: Randall Jeremiah at June 8, 2006 10:28 PM
Comment #155849

Pete, what does Chapaquidik (I don’t know how to spell it either) have to do with in terms of this discussion? There is now an African American Kennedy, I didn’t know existed until a few days ago and still it has no bearing on this discussion.

what I disagree with in your post is that the miscalculations were the military’s fault—they weren’t because they were not driving the truck that went into Iraq. Rumsfeld, Cheney and Bush pushed for this the military wanted overwhelming force as Powell had complained—they did not get it. There were no detailed plans other than topple Saddam and no fuller evaluation than that. I question the Democratic leadership frequently but do you examine your own?

They thought that the oil revenues would pay for the whole war—ummm what happened to that? It was a mess. bush may be “fearless leader” to the whole moose and squirrel show but take some time and question these things that they do too. It is frought with some serious holes.

And yes Carter was a socialist as was Hilly Clinton (Global village who wants that?), there questioned—your turn.

Posted by: Novenge at June 8, 2006 10:33 PM
Comment #155851

I will begin with an apology. Liberalism has been a label that I have applied with a broad brush towards those who don’t fit in that “box”. What I and others often feel offended by, angered by or just plain mystified by is not Liberalism. Those of you who write from the Left (so to speak) have issues.

The main issue is the highjacking of your Liberal ideology by a clearly Marxist/Socialist faction. I am old enough remember discussions around the dinner table about Hubert Humphrey, once considered a Liberal Icon by my folks and others at the table. One of his last speeches included the following line: “It was once said that the moral test of Government is how that Government treats those who are in the dawn of life, the children; those who are in the twilight of life, the elderly; and those who are in the shadows of life, the sick, the needy and the handicapped,” which is sometimes described as the “liberals’ mantra.”

Sadly, in my opinion, the highjacking of your Democratic party by the above mentioned Leftists has turned that statement on it’s ear. The new Leftist Liberal mantra is death to those in the dawn of life if it’s inconvenient for the parents. Death to the elderly so they may die “in diginity” and death to the sick/handicapped because they wouldn’t want to continue to just “exist” like that. That’s what has happened, all that has happened. Liberals, take back your party - insist that the Leftists who are clearly anti-American become marginalized within your party, not the voice of it!

Posted by: Jr at June 8, 2006 10:38 PM
Comment #155853

Articles and posts like these convince me conservatives are petty, hateful, and spiteful.
Where is the “value added” from this article or the bait presented?

David,
These people aren’t patriots, they’re link textnationalists.

Posted by: Dave at June 8, 2006 10:39 PM
Comment #155855

Jack,

You’re saying it to bolster the Bushster, come on. I know alot of lefties tend to see this nation with all it’s senseless actions included does that mean they hate America? It means we have a way to go and there is room for improvement (and sometimes just plain wrong too as there is misinfo on both sides).

If a carpenter came to your house and told you that your gutters leaked and your windows need replacing and the front door was off the hinges—it doesn’t mean he hates your house Jack. Besides the democratic party is a huge tent and there are lots of voices.

Posted by: Novenge at June 8, 2006 10:50 PM
Comment #155857

David,

re: minority opinion…

Yup. Just speaking truth to power. That’s my job.

Posted by: esimonson at June 8, 2006 10:57 PM
Comment #155858

Aldous,

Another “Liberals are Traitors” article…

Sometimes I think this is all you have left to argue with…

This and Clinton, that is…

I’m not sure what you mean. I wrote this because you’ve finally convinced me. I’ve changed my mind. I’m a liberal now!

Did I get something wrong? Don’t we believe that Bush is responsible for 9/11? Isn’t the illegal invasion of Iraq compounding the growth of terrorism? Please, tell me what I got wrong.

I never once mentioned treason.

Posted by: esimonson at June 8, 2006 11:02 PM
Comment #155860

David

Try Googling Bush polls? Are you serious? First of all, you are making assumptions about who is being polled. Second, do not trust what data you get from Google. They have control over what is published (google that).

Aldous

If you don’t hate America (or for what it represents) you are doing a lousy job of showing it. Jack was dead on about you. You are just partisan. Nothing good ever comes out of this administration, according to you and yours. You come off like a very bitter person. I am sure it is just a blog-face, but that is truly the image you project (to me).

To everyone else:

I don’t believe liberals hate America. I do believe that the more extreme libs tend to parrot the wrong messages. By definition they tend to lean left, which is socialist/communist territory. Thus, they really aren’t ever going to like this administration or what it is trying to do in the world (help democracy thrive). As most people know, communism is the greatest form of government never to work in the real world. The libs don’t seem to get the fact that it will NEVER work for the same reasons that conservatives must fight against liberalism: It likewise does not work in the real world.

MOST people need to believe in something. They want to believe in a higher power, even it is just a really kick-ass leader. Interestingly, secularism is also tied to liberalism, for reasons I don’t completely understand. You’d think a group of people so interested in freedom of everything wouldn’t have such a hard time with freedom of religion. They have, in fact, tried (failed) to prove that our nation is not a christian nation! CRAZY TALK!

But I digress (as usual)…

Thank God we removed Saddam and now al-Zarqawi. Perhaps in a few years we will look back at these events fondly. I doubt it, but it’s better than letting them believe they really are going to rule the earth without a fight.

Posted by: Bruce at June 8, 2006 11:14 PM
Comment #155862

Dave, your Patriots link sent my computer flying to my Yahoo Front page, where their now showing pictures of the dead Al- Zarqawi.?

Posted by: Rodney Brown at June 8, 2006 11:24 PM
Comment #155863

Novenge

That seems to be the issue with your party. Many voices - fine - one voice above all screeching about how Bush lied, it’s an illegal war, the wanton slaughter of innocents by US forces, on and on and on.
What happened to making a statement, when challenged on it’s validity providing factual sources for verification and continuing the debate? It has become a huge mud wrestling contest, the more vile the lie the more voices pick up the chant. Americans can and should disagree all the live long day, but in the end though, America has to be supported, not torn apart by innuendo, smears and jeers.
“A house divided against itself cannot long stand”. President Lincoln was despised by the South, attacked with every invective known at the time. What did he say at his first inaugural?
“I am loath to close. We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battlefield and patriot grave to every living heart and hearthstone all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature”. AMEN!

Posted by: Jr at June 8, 2006 11:27 PM
Comment #155864

“a body of water near Seattle bay” claims the following:
Anyone who says that the left doesn’t love America IS A LIAR.
Funny, why is that I can never see an American flag that is being pissed on or burnt at leftist protest ralles in Seattle? Oh, that’s right, burning or defiling the symbols of our nation demonstrates your profound, deep, and truly abiding love and respect for our nation. Silly me.
Anyone who says that the left doesn’t know right from wrong IS A LIAR.
That is of coure why churches and christians must be banned from the classroom. Freedom of religion, not freedom FROM religion. What exactly do you secular humanists use as your standard for good and evil. Good communists know how to answer that question, welcome to the Gulaq Archipelagoes! Of course, here in Seattle, as Elliot Bay well knows, we have enormous bronze statues dedicated to Lenin in Fremont Square. That same district re-elects “Baghdad Jim McDermott” a democratic congressman who never saw a handout from a despotic dictator that he didn’t like.

Anyone who says that the left is sympathetic to al Qaeda IS A LIAR.
Really? I distinctly recall a rally in Seattle just before the election where brain-washed college idiots stinking of potchouli oil and ganja were shouting their fool brains out in front of the federal courthouse, and using the podium to lecture us passerbys that it was America who was the terrorists, and that Al queda was really the freedom fighters. I was there. So who is lying, pal? I was stuck in that traffic for nearly two hours because city officials don’t have the hairy testicular fortitude to tell their unwashed constituents “No” to unplanned rallys in the middle of the afternoon commute. Like they weren’t preaching to the choir in this town! In a real city, they would have been all given a much needed bath by the fire department and told to go home and file for a legal demonstration on city streets.
Liars you say?
What about that darling of the left Michael Moore? He thinks they are patriots and we are scum. How about the lovely, but sadly perished Rachel Corey of Seattle, who died in front of an Israili bulldozer while burning an American flag. (Smoke must of gotten in the operators eyes…you should see the video! A little grainy, but well worth it!) Dearly departed Rachel was a well known supporter of “peaceful” causes such as Alqueda and the equally peaceful types like Palestinian ax-murderers and bomb throwers.

Oh yes, do tell us more about the liars.
(Go ahead, hit me, I can take it, ya pathetic weenies!)

Posted by: HardHatHarry at June 8, 2006 11:30 PM
Comment #155868

I’ve always known that liberals were traitors. It don’t take no mental heavyweight to figure that out. The difficult part is to get liberals to admit that they would gladly trade American founding values, culture and freedom for anything else.

Posted by: Don at June 8, 2006 11:45 PM
Comment #155869

HardHat

Please, tell me again how you feel and don’t hold back this time! You may want to take a class on self-confidence, you seem a bit timid!!!

Posted by: Jr at June 8, 2006 11:45 PM
Comment #155877

Jack and Bruce:

Perhaps I wouldn’t be posting so many “negatives” if you and yours weren’t posting such unbalanced articles. As it is, one is forced to make corrections in the pursuit of truth.

Heaven forbid anyone actually believes some of your assertions.

Posted by: Aldous at June 9, 2006 12:00 AM
Comment #155878

Don:

The Conservatives have already traded American founding values, culture and freedom in exchange for the perception of security.

Apparently, all it takes to terrify a Conservative is a plane into a building. Then Conservatives start selling their souls to be “safe”.

Posted by: Aldous at June 9, 2006 12:04 AM
Comment #155886

Aldous

What founding culture, values, freedoms have we exchanged? Like the sanctity of life? Freedom OF religion or the right to bear arms? Whoops, I know - NSA GITMO DEATH PENALTY KEEP OUR HANDS OFF ABORTERS UTERUSES. The new Lefts love affair with dead babies, mercy killing invalids and the freeing of convicted murderers, that may be a shift in the old culture - don’t ya think? Did I forget something? I hate that false security stuff too, we all know that 9/11 was a ploy to get & keep Bush in the Whitehouse, those “planes into the buildings” were pre-staged, right? Who in their right mind would be fearful of people/religion that demands that everyone dies unless you bow to their hateful god. This is why folks get angry at what some call Liberals, I have decided not to include all in that category, I’ll call them what they are, anti-american leftist/socialists.

Posted by: Jr at June 9, 2006 12:31 AM
Comment #155889

Jack,

You would have me thank the arsonist who burned down my house for saving my cat.

Eric,

Tasteless. You have no respect for 9/11 widows or fathers of murdered boys. You’ve become so partisan you can’t see the nation for the flag.

Posted by: Max at June 9, 2006 12:48 AM
Comment #155890

This the face of the Republican Party. Everyone is a Traitor except themselves.

Posted by: Aldous at June 8, 2006 08:29 PM

Republicans have traitors. The Senate and Mr. Bush on the criminal immigrant issue. Both missed the boat and act just like the Democrats.

Also Mr. Bush and his Senate spend like Ted Kennedy in an all you can drink bar. sign said all you can drink for $1. Ted crawls back up on the bridge and says I’ll have $2 worth.

Posted by: lm at June 9, 2006 12:56 AM
Comment #155891

lm:

“Also Mr. Bush and his Senate spend like Ted Kennedy in an all you can drink bar. sign said all you can drink for $1. Ted crawls back up on the bridge and says I’ll have $2 worth.”

All the while, the Good Congressional Repugs build a Bridge to Nowhere and Railroads. HA!!!!

Posted by: Aldous at June 9, 2006 1:07 AM
Comment #155892

Eric,
You left out the most powerful opponent of all. This opponent is crushing the conservative agenda. He has forced the Bush administration to cave in to Iranian demands. Despite a Republican majority in the House & the Senate, and presidential backing, this opponent has defeated the repeal of the estate tax.

If necessary, this your enemy will force the US to withdraw from Iraq.

His name?

Ben Bernanke.

He is the Chairman of the Federal Reserve. Bernanke has made it clear; he will establish his chops as an opponent of inflation, and as a supporter of the integrity of US Treasuries, by doing what is necessary.

If the conservative Republicans will not do what is necessary, Bernanke will. Oil & other commodities are driving inflation. Much of the price of that inflation consists of a fear factor, perhaps $20 for oil.

It is no coincidence we caved to the Iranians in recent negotiations. It is no coincidence the Iraqis suddenly freed hundreds of Sunnis from prison, in exchange for finalizing the control of the Defense & Interior ministries. And it is no coincidence the Republicans did not push through a repeal of the estate tax, which would have cratered the annual budget deficit by an additional tens of billions of dollars.

Since the Republican conservatives will not conduct a responsible foreign policy or domestic economic policy, the Federal Reserve is intervening.

Not a good enemy to make. Not at all.

No more budget deficits. No more plunging dollar. No more rising oil prices. No inflating our way out of debt.

If the Republican conservatives behave, Bernanke may be disposed to be kind.

Failure to do so, and the recession will be here fast.

It is over, Eric. The War on Terror. Iraq. Threatening Iran. Tax cuts. It is all over.

If you want to remember an official date, it was Friday morning, June 2, 2006. The magic number was a non-farm payroll stat, 75,000.

Posted by: phx8 at June 9, 2006 1:08 AM
Comment #155895

To all those who write that Liberals, Democrats, Hate America:

I wish to take issue with all the posters here who claim that that Democrats, Liberals, i.e. HATE AMERICA.

I happen to care very deeply about America, as do all the people, (at least I hope so) who write here.

How anyone can read this blog, or the other ones, can possible insinuate that anyone who writes on these blogs HATES America is totally beyond me.

Actually I don’t think I’ve ever met an American Citizen who actually HATES America.

Why is so much time spent arguing about how the Democrats, Liberals, HATE AMERICA, or BUSH, instead of offering constructive criticism, is beyond me.

I absolutely LOVE my country. I do however, disagree with the direction Mr. Bush, and most of Congress are taking America.

BTW, I don’t HATE President Bush either, I’ve never met the man. I just don’t like the way he handles himself (publicly) and many of the deisions he has made.

Posted by: Linda H. at June 9, 2006 1:21 AM
Comment #155896

he Bernanke, pre warned them at his confirmation hearings that he was a inflation fighter, and did not like the high budget deficits. this guy is serious.

Posted by: Rodney Brown at June 9, 2006 1:26 AM
Comment #155897

Linda H:

You’re wasting your time. Republicans NEED to think Liberals are traitors. To do otherwise would force them to face reality.

Conservatives bloated the deficit…

Conservatives bloated the Government…

Conservatives limited State’s Rights…

Conservatives are incompetent…

Conservatives sold their Rights for Magic Beans…

Conservatives are in a neverending war…

And so on…

Its easier for them to call Liberals names. Patriotism is the only shield they have against the obvious Truth.

Posted by: Aldous at June 9, 2006 1:32 AM
Comment #155900

Rodney,
Bernanke is serious. Absolutely. It is not out of partisan considerations. The Federal Reserve represents the biggest money of the big money. These people do not care about partisan considerations. Their concern is protecting principle, tens of billions of dollars of principle.

Higher and higher oil prices are unacceptable to these people. So are debts and deficits. They do not care about the partisan considerations. It is unacceptable because inflation jeopardizes their principle.

I am tempted to start sputing Stephen Colbert lines about how reality has a liberal bias, but this really is not a partisan matter. Bernanke will hammer the Bush administration into the ground if necessary. Recessions are small potatoes compared to the long term integrity of the world financial system.

Tin hat time: anyone think representatives of the Federal Reserve made some phone calls to Republicans to ensure the estate tax would not be repealed?

Posted by: phx8 at June 9, 2006 1:53 AM
Comment #155901

I would just like to point out that Womens rights, as well as Religious rights in Iraq pre-war were a LOT better then in our partners Saudi-Arabia, or Kawait. Sadams secret police were touturing religious extremest. Bin Landen HATED the secular gov’t that Iraq had before the war.

Posted by: Matt at June 9, 2006 2:24 AM
Comment #155903

Matt:

I take offense in your post!!!

Women in Iraq have just as much Rights today as in Saddam’s time if not more!!! They are indeed free to wear what they like and do as they like without any danger of government persecution.

Ofcourse, if they get kidnapped and raped while going these things then it still has no bearing on their freedom to do so.

Posted by: Aldous at June 9, 2006 4:47 AM
Comment #155908

Mike,

The only way this could have been better would be that the pilot duct taped a couple pieces of bacon to the bombs!!!!!!

Oh, we don’t know but with some luck he was hidding in a farm and the nearest cows have, well, mixed with everything in the area after bombing.
But what’s your feelings if few nearby kids were, too?

Posted by: Philippe Houdoin at June 9, 2006 5:25 AM
Comment #155909

Bruce, your comments are hopeless. Google provides links to the same polls economicians and the White House and Congress use. Hopeless… what a pitiful retort. Facts are too much work, hyperbole is so much easier. Truck on, with comments like yours, little else has to be said, they defeat your conclusions on their face.

Posted by: David R. Remer at June 9, 2006 5:35 AM
Comment #155910
America is a great country. That is just true.

Sorry Jack, but it’s still an opinion, not a factual and universal truth.
While I basically share the same, it doesn’t mean it’s a plain truth and that everyone have the same opinion.

“America is a country” is just true, though.

Posted by: Philippe Houdoin at June 9, 2006 5:36 AM
Comment #155918

Yes, Eric, the whole world has to be rational about the violence we inflict on them, right? And nobody can hold pacifist views, right.

There is some merit in their beliefs, in my opinion. People can and do react against our policies, and we should understand that rather than foolishly ridicule it.

Some. We do of course have to defend ourselves and intervene on certain occasions. We should understand though that all wars make messes, and that cleaning them up is more difficult than making them.

Our troubles in Iraq can be traced mainly to the failure of the Bush administration to work out the consequences of the disruption of our invasion. Your friends there resisted the notion of letting the State Department handle the postwar proceedings (like they had in other wars). They were certain that there was going to be no need to have an occupational authority, that your exiles were going to be able to handle everything, sliding in over top of the decapitated government of Iraq.

Even if they were sure of these things, it would have been smart to have plans, because everybody knows things rarely go according to plan. Everybody except for them. For them, to acknowledge that things could go wrong would be defeatism, even if the purpose was to ensure victory. This is the arrogance, the rigid-mindedness about the complexity of war that has taken a slam-dunk invasion and turned it into a long-term headache for America’s foreign policy.

You, like them, refuse to believe that these troubles were not inevitable. The truth is, wereyour people more fair-minded, less overconfident, you might have done a better job of running this war. However, your party’s hatred and loathing of liberal and moderate approaches to fighting war has blinded you to the practical approach of defeating our enemies, and in fact, preventing enemies from arising.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at June 9, 2006 7:03 AM
Comment #155927

phx8,

In other words, Bernanke must do whatever it takes to defend the supremacy of the dollar, am i right?

You are dead on with your comments. Thanks for bringing a different perspective to this discussion.

Posted by: Greg at June 9, 2006 8:28 AM
Comment #155928

Eric,

This has to be one of the funniest pieces I’ve read. It has all of the stereotypical right wing ramblings. Attacks against Al Gore and Michael Moore, spinning Ann Coulter’s vile rant. It’s classic. You sir have a gift. That gift is making people laugh.
Thank you for starting out my morning with a chuckle and a smile.

Posted by: Andre M. Hernandez at June 9, 2006 8:31 AM
Comment #155932

JR,

I find myself in agreement with what you are saying to a good extent. The nuts do find their wat front and center and start nonsensically ranting when more substantive voices go muffled. And why within the left is everything supposedly influenced by this mysterious Israel lobby???

Hard Hat Harry, you got it right on target the marxist and communists have mixed and camoflaged themselves so well in the herd we think it is an ally. They espouse about fifteen percent of what the moderates think (in simple basis atleast) and then just out of range of sight go way overboard and we excuse it or ignore it still decrying that faction an ally.

What I’ve noticed on the college campuses is a shock the establishment stance as opposed to real debate of the issues. I was watching stanley Horowitz (I think his name is) on Cspan who wrote a book about liberal arts professors and how they were using their lecturns to espouse political viewpoints and racist or sexist rants etcetera. A women in her mid 40’s stood up and at the microphone asked “If you were taking a look at our teaching staff I would have expected a little more T&A..” Like that response substitutes for genuine debate of the issues. It’s shock the establishment like this was the 1960’s all over again. Instead of debating him to the mat it was just sheer juvenility as a response. At anti-war rallies early on I remember seeing a group going through the streets of New York playing ukeleles—WTF is that and how is that remotely pertanent to the issues? So far I’ve sen Vietnamese Communists foment anti-war rallies in black neighborhoods all the while wearing their yellow star on red teeshirts and guiding around African American schoolkids in this mock urban protest. There have been support of Venezuelan dictator Chavez from the left. Also overboard anti-israeli sentiment calling it “Zionism”, which I am quite sure in this day and age is, suffice it to say, quite nonexistent. So anyway, yep the commies are here and the nuts and Daddy-shockers are out of the bag. How to get them to shut the hell up and stop trying to represent us?—we can’t, why? because we’d have to lower our debate standards and start idiotically crowing to which is defeatist to the overall point. Democrats simply to some extent don’t believe these groups or factions exist because they don’t see them portrayed in popular media but they certainly do. Counterpunch perhaps one of my favorite sites online carries communist commentators as does DailyKos. WE can’t lid it up but instead we respect free speech and they continue to take over the scene more and more. So your post has some resonance.

Posted by: Novenge at June 9, 2006 8:55 AM
Comment #155976

Reasons we don’t bash our fringe so much:
1)Alienation between factions of a minority party is rarely of overall benefit. When you’re stuck out on a ledge a hundred feet above the pavement, now is not the good time to shoot yourself in the foot.

2)We’re the party of free speech. Let them say what they want, and we can say what we want. We can ignore what they say.

3)Why bother? The Republicans do more than their share of criticism of them. Besides, self hatred has done wonders for the Republican party.

4)Rumors of our hijacking are greatly exaggerated. You think a far-left hijacked party would nominate Clinton, Gore, or Kerry, rather than all the other darlings of the far left?

All in all, what it comes down to is that Republicans perceive more left-wing extremism in our ranks than there really is, and their tendency not to listen to us or believe what we say makes it difficult to set them right on the issue.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at June 9, 2006 11:12 AM
Comment #155988

Pete, you say you’ve opened your mind, and come to your sences(sic). Yet, you’ve closed your mind to other points of view. It seems to me you are regressing not progressing. A suggestion, you have access to a computer, try www.dictionary.com for assistance in spelling. Try reading differing points of view to open your mind, expand your vistas and educate yourself about history. Watchblog is a good place to vent and occasionally learn something, but don’t attack the posters or the watchblog manager wil boot you.

Posted by: gergle at June 9, 2006 11:32 AM
Comment #155990

Novenge,

Many Conservative wonder why there are so many Liberal instructors.

Could it be that many of them work at State funded schools and are payed by taxes? And since your party likes to cut taxes (ESPECIALLY EDUCATION) I think it would be an oxymoron for somebody in your party to teach.

Posted by: Vincent Vega at June 9, 2006 11:36 AM
Comment #155991

No one has said whether the quotes included in this article are accurate or not. Also no one has said whether they aggree or disaggree with the quotes. The quotes in the article make me sick in the stomach, the first post to the article implies that the quotes are inaccurate, but I get no real certainty.

Posted by: frankxcid at June 9, 2006 11:38 AM
Comment #155992

Stephen Daugherty ,

“You think a far-left hijacked party would nominate Clinton, Gore, or Kerry, rather than all the other darlings of the far left?”

Touche


If that were the case, Howard Dean would have been the parties selection last time.

Posted by: Vincent Vega at June 9, 2006 11:38 AM
Comment #155994

Looks like the evil BushitlerChimperor and cronies are dealing some serious punishment to Al Qaeda (sp?—I really don’t give a damn). Good job, men. Never doubt the US military.

Posted by: nikkolai at June 9, 2006 11:40 AM
Comment #155996

After reading the “that if it were not for Bush” link from the article, I have to say that it amazes me how low Republicans can go. This guys son had his head cut off and shown to the world. It must suprise you to hear his quotes yesterday saying “I do not believe in revenge.” when he heard that that piece of sh*t in Iraq was bombed. I know it did to the person interviewing him yesterday.

Eric, you should be ashamed of yourself for putting this in. They have their views, which I am sure is how they are dealing with this horrific incident. Is there anything wrong with them not wanting it to happen to other kids? Or do you just like to beat up on people who have lost their sons to beheadings?

Sick!

Posted by: Vincent Vega at June 9, 2006 11:48 AM
Comment #156006

Dearest David R.,

Hopeless…

Hopeless is always finding the worst in everyone. Hopeless is taking the easy path and always betting that the worst will happen.
Hopeless is the path taken by naysayers.

I do have a problem with Google. If you don’t think they can shape results, you are hopelessly wrong. They can and do. As a perfect example, look at their negotiations with China.

I am so tired of the negativity. It is NOT balanced. I will say that you may appear to be well-read, well-researched, but you still lean so far to the left in your posts that I can’t help but view you as a left-wing partisan. Stop hiding behind the fact that you believe what you say makes you balanced. Balanced, in the political arena, means you are “somewhere in the middle”. You, my friend, are not that.

List to me all the good things that this administration has done for the country. Can you do it? Can you find it in yourself to say something positive about this administration? This could be a real watershed moment for you.

The sad thing is, I am socially centrist. I am mildly fiscally conservative. Yet to you I am probably a wacked out right-wing activist. When Clinton was President, he was MY President. It sickened me to see the republican drag our country through the muck with the Lewinsky debacle. Just like it sickens me today to listen to the left take their freedom of speech to the extreme as they cast every possible aspersion at MY President. Then they complain about having their rights trampled. I just wish people would see how often they want to have it both ways. Perhaps then they would be happy with our nation.

It isn’t our leadership that is taking away our rights - It’s the enemy out there that wants to kill us all because we want to spread freedom and democracy. To be more accurate I guess I should say they hate us becaus we aren’t radical muslim extremists.

I really do love America. I love our diversity (like no other in the world). I love our freedoms. I love our free-market economy. I love our health care (the finest medical practitioners in the world). I love the fact that a guy with a few years in college can start with NOTHING and end up with 5 kids, a huge mortgage, two dogs, and enough money to never have to worry about it.

Only in America. God Bless it.

I love you too David R.

Posted by: Bruce at June 9, 2006 12:12 PM
Comment #156007

Eric

Liberals DO NOT hate America. They DO hate Bush, Republicans, and the fact they are not in power.

Problem is there is too much hatered on both sides and not enough intelligent debate. Just as the far left jeapordizes their chances of winning the mid-terms and ‘08 with fanatical statements about Bush and the war, Coulter’s comments also drives the middle away.

Posted by: jwl at June 9, 2006 12:18 PM
Comment #156008

I don’t know about you, but I’m really, really tired of the negativism shown by the Democrats/liberal left and the Media/liberal left. When is a Republican going to tell it like it is and call these people what they are? Why are the Republicans always dancing around the issues without stating what their constituents want and think? It’s time to put “niceness” aside and take these people on head first. I’m just a common American citizen, retired, without any political ambitions. Does anyone else out think like me or am I missing the story?

Posted by: Rich at June 9, 2006 12:20 PM
Comment #156009

Rich,

Your party is used to putting niceness aside. Just ask John McCain.

Posted by: Vincent Vega at June 9, 2006 12:23 PM
Comment #156012


America is in a battle for it’s very existance. Never in our history has our nation been more at risk. The neo conservatives stand firm in their defence of our nation from all it’s enemy’s both external and internal. Externally, our nation is surrounded by enemy’s. South America has become a haven for marxists. In Asia, countries like North Korea threaten our existance. And, in the Middle East, Islam is the greatest enemy any Christian nation has ever faced.

At home, our nation faces an even greater enemy. This enemy threatens to remove God as the ruler of our Christian nation. This enemy allows homosexuals and abortionists to openly flaunt their ungodly, anti-Christian and immoral lifestyles. This enemy allows an immoral pop culture to reflect American values in the world. This enemy gives aid and comfort to the Islamics who want to murder all Christians and Jews. This
enemy has even gone so far as to claim that Jesus Christ was one of them. This enemy is the America hating Marxist liberal democrats and they will destroy our Christian nation if we let them continue to corrupt our nation.

We neo conservative republicans call on all Patriotic Christians to join with us. With your help, we can win a great victory for America this fall. With the help of all Loyal Christians, we can have the mandate we need to restore God to our government and the mandate to once and for ever, rid this nation of the marxists liberals, the inteligencia and the academia which so threaten our Christian way of life. With the help of the Christians, we neocons will have a book burning the likes of which has never been seen in the entire 6000 year history of the world.

The only good liberal is one that is dead and unable to spout out his anti-God, anti-Christian, anti-American, marxist retoric.

Eric: Am I hearing the message loud and clear.

Posted by: jlw at June 9, 2006 12:37 PM
Comment #156014


Long live Ann Of Arc.

Posted by: jlw at June 9, 2006 12:38 PM
Comment #156015

Listen, as the nation that has started and leads the free world, we will always be at the blame. I know this. To think that only good, 100 percent of the time will ever come from tasks the US takes is foolish. Does that mean we stop all action all together, hell no!

The US isn’t to blame for Iran, Iraq, Osama, Saddam, or any other actions by them. The previously mentioned are to blame for anything they actually did themselves!

Liberals and the like tend to forget that they get the priviledge of 20/20 hindsight in their judgements that the leaders in history did not.

Posted by: ChrisC at June 9, 2006 12:43 PM
Comment #156017

I would love to see someone in the right column post a comment or write an article on the positive accomplishments of the Bush administration. Not postures, not poses, not political stands, not being a godly man, but positive accomplishments, preferably using hard numbers.

Posted by: phx8 at June 9, 2006 12:46 PM
Comment #156022

Steve Daugherty,

Perhaps I spoke a bit rash in saying those voices of the loonie tunes fringe are “taking over” but the point is that they are given the credence that the right wing needs to tear us all a new one with. It’s like handing them ammo—almost like them allowing Newt Gingrich host the movie “Boystown” on cable TV or even espouse his pot-head and implausible Toffler Future watch ideas in public. there is a point there in an above post, why was Howard Dean made the head of the DNC—where was my vote or yours and did not the Republican’s laughter and goading of his appointment sway the left from going that direction? The man (Dean) is not sensible but a fledgeling underdog shooting easily dismissble faux-facts from the hip and thusly so too who had the power to appoint him? I will tell you who, those who do not represent the majority which are sort of teetering both sides of the fence moderately but dislike the Republican platform immensely as it is too blind, corporately aligned and petty-minded to get caught up in. Now we are aversing ourselves in the same petty-mindedness with Bush in our determinationto hate him which I see as quite genuine. but back to point, the nuts are on the field, have the megaphones and do not represent us.

Look at the protestors who go out at these protests. why are we aligned with anarchists, anarchists are the very basis of communism as it was communisms first movement historically. They represent humanitarian issue by drumming and burning things. Where is solid debate? People on makeshift podiums on the Washington mall throwing out vitriol when they should be showing facts as usually CSPAN cams are watching. It’s giddiness and bias and we should be making more substantive debate. Maybe that’s just who is showing up to do that but teh party of the people have their issues too decentralized. I remeber some years ago watching a NOW meeting and a woman stood up in the back and began discussing Greenpeace and saving oceanic life—now what the hell does that have to do with feminism? Not to mention a point to make pornography acceptable and masterbation a needed hallmark in female history. What the hell is the damn Vagina Monologues on every college campus theatre—it is the inculcation of vaginal supremacy from the fringe and despite their daddy-shocking shenanigans we have real frickin’ issues still left to engage in. I expect the next movement to be “the Dick Diatribes” (I just made that up) where they show how demeaning penises are to women and it still has nothing to do with the real issues—it is all fringe lunacy to shock the parents with.

When are we going to come back to being centered again? Under Clinton we had issues and in lieu of all the Republicans hate-mongering and trifle we have become so hateful of them it is pushing us further from that needed center.

Posted by: Novenge at June 9, 2006 12:52 PM
Comment #156029
I would love to see someone in the right column post a comment or write an article on the positive accomplishments of the Bush administration. Not postures, not poses, not political stands, not being a godly man, but positive accomplishments, preferably using hard numbers.

I couldn’t agree more. I love passing by here every now and again just to see what everyone is saying. Unfortunately, more and more of the threads are devolving into left vs. right slap fights. In that way, I guess Watchblog has become a microcosm of the highly polar current political climate. And this fits, it makes sense. I was just hoping for better.

Posted by: Christian at June 9, 2006 1:05 PM
Comment #156031

Liberals as such don’t hate America. They disagree with Conservatives on how to get things done but that’s not hating America.
The liberal hate America crowd aren’t true Liberals. They’re a bunch of left wing extremist kooks that use the label liberal. Just like the right wing extremist use the conservative label. They ain’t true Conservatives. And the left wing extremist ain’t ture Liberals.

Posted by: Ron Brown at June 9, 2006 1:08 PM
Comment #156038

I am tired of hearing “Liberals hate America”. I am a liberal and I take offense. Has any ever heard a liberal say that?

I may not speak fo rall liberals, but this is how I personally see it.

Republicans have defined patriotism in their image. They have an idealistic view of how great America is; where democracy, Christianity and Militarism is all meshed together. And if you do not see it this way, then the problem is you. Conservatives are on-sided and see the world from the US view point only. They not open to other view points, they are not open to criticism. It is America first. A Conservative will have a “God Bless AMerica” bumper sticker”

Liberals are not blind patriots. We(I) see our actions as casue and effect. And putting the America first is the problem. We feel it is our patriotic duty to criticise policies when we make mistakes. We live in this world together with our fellow human beings throughout the world. A liberal would have a bumper sticker that reads “God bless the whole world - No exceptions”.

You may not agree with view point, but how is this hate America?

Posted by: jerseyguy at June 9, 2006 1:26 PM
Comment #156041

Ron Brown,

I never thought I would say this, but we actually agree on something. Excellent comment.

Posted by: Vincent Vega at June 9, 2006 1:34 PM
Comment #156048

Ron Brown is right, I’m a conservaitve, I don’t believe liberals hate America. I don’t even hate liberals, I hate extremists, Lib or con. I hate Micheal Moore, I hate Ann Coulter, it is people like them that tear America apart.

Hey liberals, instead of complaining (which seems to be all you do now adays) DO SOMETIHNG ABOUT IT!! The Iraqi people outvoted us! Get out there and VOTE!! I did, because I love this country! Stop demonstrating, that does you no good, it makes people hate you more. Write to your elected officials, let them know in mass numbers what you want.

If you want this country to be united you need to throw out your extremist beliefs, and conservatives need to throw out theirs.

You need to stop catigorizing who a Repub is and who a Dem is, I’m not rich by any means and I’m under 25 so I already break the mold of what you say a Republican is!!

Posted by: K. Carlson at June 9, 2006 1:52 PM
Comment #156055

“Stop demonstrating, that does you no good, it makes people hate you more.”

That quote scares me. It feels like a quote from Orwell’s 1984.

Posted by: Vincent Vega at June 9, 2006 2:08 PM
Comment #156060

OK, maybe that is a bit over the line. But it does get annoying, especially when theyre in the streets and it slows trafic. When it gets out of hand the police need to get invalved. It’s always on the news taking time away from important news.

This following comment is aimed twards extremists…PEACEFULLY ASSEMBLE!, stay off the streets, always obay the law, never infringe on the rights of others i.e. NEVER DEMONSTRATE AT ANOTHER HUMAN BEINGS FUNERAL!

Posted by: K. Carlson at June 9, 2006 2:23 PM
Comment #156063

K Carlson,

I couldn’t agree with you more. Unfortunately, it appears that both parties are stuck in a downward spiral of who can be the meanest, or nastiest in their remarks about each other. I frankly don’t really think that the majority of Republicans “hate” Democrats, or that the majority of Democrats “hate” Republicans. Let alone “hate America”.

The same is true of Bush. I don’t agree with over 99% of what he has actually done, but I still don’t “Hate” him. How can I when I don’t know him personally? I’ve no idea what he is actually thinking, or why he seems to follow the advice of of Kove, or others. Maybe his just really stupid, or more likely, he doesn’t trust his own judgement so it is easier to do what someone you respect tells you to do.

I believe the “fight between the Democrats and Republicans” has also become like the small child who goes ,”nah, Nana, nah na….” because they (either party) can’t honestly come up with something original to say.

Posted by: Linda H. at June 9, 2006 2:27 PM
Comment #156068

You know, you lost me when you actually quoted Michael Moore, of all people. Give me a break. Even Liberals know that Michael Moore is the king of all fat-headed (pardon the pun) propaganda.

Instead of listening to the media, I would encourage you to pick up books based on facts and not bias and READ. From what you’re saying, religious fundamentalists have every right to do what they do? You’ve got one thing right - Liberals truly do hate America.

Posted by: A Military Wife at June 9, 2006 2:39 PM
Comment #156073

A Military Wife,

How can you say something is fact about an orgenization that you are not a part of?

If your husband is in the military, thank him for me. I support him and I support what he is doing.

Liberals don’t hate America, extremists do. Because they are blood thursty for power over the far oposite end of the spectrum. As a converted conservetive extremist, I CAN say that as a fact.

Posted by: K. Carlson at June 9, 2006 2:54 PM
Comment #156105

as far as i am concerned, they should smear Zarqawi with bacon grease, stuff a jimmy dean pork sausage up his a**, cut his head off,& put it on a stick in bagdad square..i hope he rots in hell with his 72 virgins. is that conservative enough?

Posted by: kevin at June 9, 2006 4:19 PM
Comment #156106

1)Conservatives tell liberals that liberals hate America.

2)Liberals defend themselves, saying they don’t hate America.

3)Conservatives tell the liberals they’re lying.

4)Liberals tell the conservatives they’re being honest.

5)Conservatives still think the liberals are liars.

6)From there, the argument gets fricking nowhere.

7)Why?

8)Because each side is working off a different definition of love.

9)Agreement on such definition is possible, to an extent, but depends largely on the details and philsophies of what love is, much less love of one’s country.

10)That, though, is too much to work out for people, if hit-and-run sloganeering is all they’re trying to manage.

The hatred is steeped on both sides, but I think the intellectual habits of the right, the tendency to close ranks, the integrated media machinery, and years of ossified political prejudices combine to raise the intensity of the hatred on the right.

This has become harmful for the conservatives, as it has encouraged a rather unrealistic approach to government, and a groupthink-laden atmosphere of policy-making. They have lost touch with the political center of the country, having deemed political moderation a vector for the diseases of compromise, watering down their strongly brewed, strongly motivated agenda.

As the errors and outrages mount up, the political center in America is abandoning the Republicans. This is intensifying, at least for the short term, the alienated and alienating aspects of the party, intensifying partisanship to the point where even attacking the widows of 9/11 victims, because of the divergence of their views from the GOP establishment, has become rationalizable behavior.

I think Bush is so hated now because he himself displayed unbridled hatred for liberals and liberal principles first. He is the most politically hostile president in recent history.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at June 9, 2006 4:20 PM
Comment #156107

Eric-
If you live by the sword,you die by the sword. This is not a liberal statement,nor a conservative. It is a sad reality of life.
Bush and CO. put us into a illegal war. Period.
They continue to bleed American lives and resources into a situation that has no realistic time frame for resolution.
We are good at killing and only get better,
but the romantic notions of WWII and John Wayne movies are not anywhere near reality. We did not create a theocracy in Iraq. We did attempt to keep a powerful ally of America’s in power. Dictatorship is something that many American presidents have looked the other way on. Bush and CO. seem to feel that the logical transition is to go to a free society. But Democracy can only work if there is a desire and a knowledge regarding it. Right now,I see very little of either in Iraq.

Posted by: jblym at June 9, 2006 4:22 PM
Comment #156151

I keep hearing the refrain “liberals hate America” over and over followed by some of the most narrow-minded rationalizing imaginable. Many of those spouting this rhetoric seemingly would be comfortable living under a dictatorship as long as it adhered to their viewpoint.

I wonder if the real question is; ” Why do conservatives hate the rest of the world?”

Posted by: Tim in NY at June 9, 2006 7:14 PM
Comment #156158

I am in the USAF, I love our great nation it is the best country in the world. I am a liberal… I do not hate our nation, just the way our nation is ran. Do not speak for someone else, when you know not their mind… as I would not say that you hate computers, do not tell me I hate America.

-einghf

Posted by: Einghf at June 9, 2006 7:43 PM
Comment #156159

So Stephen…
Do you think it will be a Democratic sweep in November?

Posted by: Cliff at June 9, 2006 7:51 PM
Comment #156167

Einghf,

First of all, thank you for your service. Second, your right, it sickens me that extremist tend to think that just because you are this, that you must think like this. It is ridicules, and I hope we don’t mention anything like that again in this message board because we obviously proved it false.

As for Tim from NY, I am a conservative, and I do not hate the rest of the world, I have a good friend in Canada and I think their country is great, so is all the counties in Europe, sure I like to make fun of france, but it’s all in good humor. I believe this war is worth fighting because when Iraq is a democratic state they will be a great ally.

As for Cliff, yes, although I am a Republican, I believe the Democrates will win in November. I don’t even think it will be a bad thing as long as the person that wins is not a left wing extremist like John Kerry. This country needs a balance. It needs to shift and sway right and left, back and forth, that has been what has made this country so great right from the start.

All that being said, stop categorizing people, enough with the labels, enough with the hate, we are all Americans - we all believe this country is great.

Posted by: K. Carlson at June 9, 2006 8:12 PM
Comment #156187

hardheadharry

Your hate-filled lies prove me correct. Thanks.

Posted by: ElliottBay at June 9, 2006 10:21 PM
Comment #156190

I think that Republican fortunes, as they are now, are on the decline. Something could happen between now and November to change that, though.

I think it’s likely we’ll get a majority in one or both chambers. How deep that majority runs, and how long it lasts all depends on whether we can fill in the blank left by the departure of the Republican majority, or whether we’re just placeholders for a Republican resurgence, or a third party ascendence.

It’s our choice, really.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at June 9, 2006 10:40 PM
Comment #156196

Max, excellent comment - “You’ve become so partisan you can’t see the nation for the flag.”
That sums it up really doesn’t it. 9/11 has practically been trademarked by the Bush administration to justify wars, one of which was totally unrelated to 9/11. I should wonder at those who cannot see this quite obvious fact but then it’s clear that they’ve blindfolded themselves with the stars and stripes. The hardest hit place was New York, a bastion of diversity, a city built by immigration and a beacon of tolerance yet somehow an attack on New York justifies slandering as unpatriotic anyone who is not on the far right - and therefore intolerant of gay marriage, anti-immigrant and and probably not big on diversity (it’s the party of Strom Thurmond)…

Posted by: abhcoide at June 9, 2006 11:02 PM
Comment #156200

can’t be part of a party that preaches it is a constitutional right to privacy to murder babies, are against the death penalty for crimes that deserve it and can in all of this tell us a baby is not a baby until birth but a spotted owl egg is a spotted owl at conception.

Maybe they all drink from the same cup.

the one that destroys brain cells.

anyone know the penalty for destroying a spotted owls egg?

Posted by: lm at June 9, 2006 11:24 PM
Comment #156203

This article is sick venemous and offensive. Give it a rest. Don’t offer this kind of attack anymore, it’s destructive and wasteful. If you cannot respect you fellow Americans who disagree with you, you should not try to engage in any kind of meaningful dialogue.

Posted by: RGF at June 9, 2006 11:47 PM
Comment #156209

A Military Wife
Give your husband my thanks for his service to our great country. And I sure hope he’s at home with you instead of in Afghanistan, or Iraq. But if he is let him know that he’s got my prayers.


Vincent Vega
There’s always a first time for everything. As David Remer told me the first time I agreed with him on something. Stick around we just might find some more common ground.


Einghf
And thankyou too for your service to this great nation. Even if ya are liberal. ha.


Posted by: Ron Brown at June 10, 2006 12:16 AM
Comment #156215

Andre,

This has to be one of the funniest pieces I’ve read. It has all of the stereotypical right wing ramblings. Attacks against Al Gore and Michael Moore, spinning Ann Coulter’s vile rant. It’s classic. You sir have a gift. That gift is making people laugh.

Thank you for starting out my morning with a chuckle and a smile.

Thank you Andre. Without comments like these I would have given up blogging altogether. It’s comments like yours that keep me writing.

But one thing puzzles me. Can you point out to me the ‘attacks’ against Gore and Moore? I’m pretty sure all I did was quote what they said.

We are really getting somewhere when all I have to do is quote the left and it is immediately recognized as an ‘attack’.

Posted by: esimonson at June 10, 2006 12:46 AM
Comment #156216

“Apparently, all it takes to terrify a Conservative is a plane into a building. Then Conservatives start selling their souls to be “safe”.”

And, apparently, that same “plane into a building” is all it takes for liberals to fear for their (political) lives. They knew that once the 9/11 unity was over they wouldn’t get power back unless they turned against this administration. And, turned they did; or should I say are doing. Libs are terrified of 9/11 b/c they built their entire ideology on “What’s bad for America is good for them and what’s good for America is bad for them”. They hate the fact that we have any success in Iraq. They can’t stand that Zarqawi is dead or there have been 3 successful elections, or that they have a constitution, a newly formed gov’t and no (I repeat) no civil war that’s disrupting the progress with that country. Awwh, boo hoo, libbies.


And, anyone dares to have me back up what I just said with a quote; I suggest you look at the MSM for a quote. Take your pick, they’ve been anti-Bush/War for years now, and it freakin shows. We are going to win and we’ll do it inspite of the aforementioned.

Posted by: rahdigly at June 10, 2006 12:47 AM
Comment #156217

Adrienne,

It has occurred to me more than once that “Eric Simonson” might actually BE Ann Coulter.

Hmm. I’m prettier.

Posted by: esimonson at June 10, 2006 1:00 AM
Comment #156219

“Two things are infinite, The Universe and human stupidity…and Im not sure about the Universe” Albert Einstein
That about sums up your post Eric.

“Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel”- Samuel Johnson

“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile,but is morally treasonable to the American public”-Theodore Roosevelt.

That about sums up the conservative whiners .

Posted by: j2t2 at June 10, 2006 1:16 AM
Comment #156222

Bruce, no, your comments reflect an ostrich approach to debate. The polls are there Ipsos/ABC etc. You refuse to look at them because they negate your statement and view of the world. And you use some phony dislike for Google as justification for not doing your homework and looking up the polls. There are many other search engines besides Google, and your excuse of Google having an agenda for not using another search engine to look up the poll facts, is the most telling comment of all. Wriggle and squirm, the fact is the polls show a majority of Americans believe invading Iraq was a mistake. New one released just this week reiterating it again.

Do your homework, accept reality, or make obvious erroneous statements and try to defend them. What an exercise in futility. But, its still a partially free country. Enjoy your bubble.

Posted by: David R. Remer at June 10, 2006 1:45 AM
Comment #156242

“Apparently, all it takes to terrify a Conservative is a plane into a building. Then Conservatives start selling their souls to be “safe”.”

Not any true Conservative. The ones I know don’t like the Patriot Act, illegal wire taps on US citizens, the bullshit so called airport security, or any other government meddling in our lives.

Posted by: Ron Brown at June 10, 2006 7:42 AM
Comment #156246

Ron, that sounds like the liberals, libertarians, and us radicals in the center as well as conservatives, I think we are all closer than the yammering in this thread would have us believe. Through in a little restraint on spending and a wiser tax structure and well gee maybe we could go through a thread without the insults.

Posted by: j2t2 at June 10, 2006 9:00 AM
Comment #156251

Eric,

Excellent post! The left continues to expose their “we can do better” ideas, or lack there of. If their rhetoric is the “better” we are in trouble!

Message to liberals: Come up with some ideas that have not already failed throughout history. More important, I think, come up with an idea! Talk is cheap and your platform has been prostituted out to the Michael Moore’s and other Hollywood limousine liberals. These are people who have been rejected by the vast majority of ordinary people. Figure it out!

It’s always amazing when looking at things this way….

Hollywood Liberals…These are people who make a living pretending to be other people. Credibility, I think not!

Failed politicians….John Kerry, Al gore. Apparently the majority of Americans disagree with there ideology. Hence, neither was elected.

Their party (Democrat) has been hijacked by the extreme left leaving them morally bankrupt and without a hat in the ring of ideas.

Posted by: Jim at June 10, 2006 10:03 AM
Comment #156284

The old “failed throughout history” lie. Twas liberal/socialist/whatever FDR and his policies that saved the Country from the policies of the far right and caused the largest middle class in history. I would call that success, unless of course you have something against the middle class.

Posted by: j2t2 at June 10, 2006 2:05 PM
Comment #156301

Maybe Mike who suggests liberals move elsewhere ought to move to a country more to his liking. There are plenty of countries around where the wealthiest 1% control most of the wealth and the bottom 90% are dirt poor. Plenty of countries where the government spies on it’s people. Plenty of countries where the tinhorn dictator has all the power and the judiciary and legislature do his bidding. Plenty of countries that tax little and provide few services. They’re not very pleasant places but there are plenty of them.

Posted by: markg8 at June 10, 2006 4:36 PM
Comment #156305

i am about as conservative as they come, you see, i am an african-american muslim, i love god and therefore i hate america, and i hate the conservatives. my reasons may suprise you. america is founded in language of hypocracy, and my people are the glaring example to the world, whom if the conservatives had their way would still be getting their heads busted open in order to vote in this free and democratic country. the liberal media sold the country down the river by broadcasting those obviously fabricated anti-american newsreels back then,they should have been censored in the name of national security. a true conservative should never give this libelous and slanderous media any quarter. Anyway, I would leave but america has a debt to pay to my people and the world for re-defining the words freedom and inalienable rights, therefore i stay, mostly as a constant reminder to the conservatives that most of their leaders are rich,racist,narrowminded, pinhead opportunists, who plan to run this country like a business,and skim the profits off the top like enron did. this country is not a business,it should not be run by people who seek aggressive growth, that is called empire, it should not be run by people who lack compassion, that is called evil, it is the home of untold millions and should be run as such, not a money making multinational. however, jesus has more to say on that topic than i do. most of the conservatives i have met are basically good people who have been led astray by their leadership, i hate the conservative leadership, they are actually liberal, if the definition of liberal is the antithesis of conservation, the conservative leadership is not conserving the constitution, they are not conserving the fundamental rights of the people, they are not conserving the respect and admiration that america once commanded worldwide, it’s amazing but they aren’t even conserving the alliances and world bodies that america entered into to, and often times even initiated. these gingrich republicans are actually quite liberal if you look carefully, all that crap they talk about family values and morality and things of that nature, are undermined on a regular basis
by decidedly anti-family, anti-worker and anti-middle class policy,what ever happened to our wages? and our well paying jobs for that matter. using illegal mexicans to pick cotton and fruit because slavery has been outlawed, damned disgusting stain on the president his staunchest supporters and his amnesty plan. where is our security, when a catastrophe from god wreaks its vengence on a great american city, and all the leadership can do is plot it’s demise, and attempt to cover up the appaling poverty, which is the legacy of previous conservative regimes. yes my friends racism, sexism, and classism are conservative values in the united states, they have been with us from the beginning and the boys in D.C. have been working overtime to secure them.
So think about your motivations for being a conservative and ask yourself honestly if that is really how you stand. If so, please say so as loudly as you can, because your outward overtures of compassion and morality are confusing in light of your past and present deeds.

Posted by: james at June 10, 2006 4:45 PM
Comment #156320

j2t2,

Here we go with the Liar, liar pants on fire routine. Enough!

While I agree that FDR accomplished some remarkable things, I suggest a closer look at the situation and the time. The comparison you attempt to draw between the “Grapes of Wrath” and 21st century America are remarkably different. Going any further in the debate would be useless. The reasons are obviuos.

james,

Could it be possible that there is no better place in the world that the USA? Seems to me that Americans excuse me, people who live in American are much better off than any other nation in the world. This the reason you reside here, correct?

Also, you Love God but hate conservatives among other things? This seems a bit inconsistent with the teachings of religion. Many of us would venture to say that one of these statements is invalid. Meaning…they contradict. So either you love God or you just hate.


Posted by: Jim at June 10, 2006 5:42 PM
Comment #156442

Rahdigly-
Libs? Sounds like the nickname of a girl from the forties. It also sounds like the sort of people you wish you were arguing with, rather than the ones you’re actually debating.

You speak of the war as if it’s already over. you substitute confidence in the war, and in our leaders, for any real examination of the issues at hand. You won’t allow yourself to be troubled. That can be a bad thing when there is cause to be.

In the real world, those who succeed at risky enterprises are both careful and confident. They don’t second guess decisions needlessly, but they are open to signs that they made a mistake, and willing to take care of it.

The Republican party has a great deal of boldness, but the people do not take care, or often even pride in what they do. Why else would the party run up record deficits, expand government, and get America into another guerilla war, having having thrashed the enemy in the opening conventional battles? Why else would a party supposedly against entitlements pile another one on, and a party that talks about offsetting shortfalls from tax cuts with cut spending fails to do so?

You can excuse all this as partisan hatred, but the facts are the facts, and that’s whats eating your party alive at the moment.

Jim-
As I recall it, people packed theatres to watch Michael Moore’s film, and now to watch Al Gore’s. The polls have us ahead.

You state outright that many of our ideas have failed throughout history. What ideas are those, so that I might benefit from your superior knowledge.

Also, are you aware that you basically used every cliched attack against liberals that I’ve heard and read for the last five years? Good heavens, if your intent is to counsel the Democrats to come up with new ideas, you should at least lead by example.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at June 11, 2006 8:13 AM
Comment #156688

no, the reason i stay here is because my people were brought here in chains and were never given bus fare home, and on top of that they are so confused and intermixed that they probably wouldn’t be accepted anywhere else as natives,democracy is a failure, because we are not a democracy we are a representative republic, and the millionare boys club in the senate is proof positive of that. loving god requires that i hate evil, and as it stands the republicans are doing evil, therefore i hate them, until they change, like it has been said, hate the sin, love the sinner. and the republicans do not represent a single person, it is like an amoeba crawling over everything leaving it’s slime on the american political landscape.
it is not a contradiction, to hate their actions, but if you noticed i said that most conservatives are good people who’ve been misled by their leadership into believing that they live here alone and only need be concerned with their immediate needs and consumption. trust me i am not a communist nor socialist, money is great, but i’d rather spend it on infrasturcture rather than security. because with the correct infrastructure the security needs would be greatly reduced.

Posted by: james at June 12, 2006 10:48 AM
Comment #165400

I truly wish to be enlightened. If we are to blame for 911, what are the reasons. Why are we truly hated. What have we done? Is it oil plundering? (leftists say) Is it our very freedom that they detest?(righties) Is it our support of Jacob which is driving Esau crazy?

I have scoured the web in search of this info. I can’t find anything but the same old tired BS.

Posted by: Jared at July 7, 2006 10:14 AM
Comment #175052

Alcasser

Posted by: solana at August 12, 2006 6:42 AM
Comment #181277

What amazes me is the “9-11 happen on Bushes watch” comment. 9-11 took place only months after Bush was in office and only months after Clintons 8 years of weakness. R or D, we are at war and no, Bush didn’t start it, they did. Under Clinton we had embassy attacks, the USS Cole and the first Topwer attack. We did nothing in response, why? 3,000+ Americans died in 2001 but, your concerned with the treatment of POW’s. Where is your outrage for the innocents they kill. Why not speak out about the placing of rockets in schools and hospitals? Before you say “they don’t do that”, I am a 12 year vet of the US Army, etsed (got out) 1 1/2 years ago. Our nation is becoming so PC and afaid to offend anyone, it’s sad. We are allowing individuals to come into OUR nation and understand their culture. No, they need to understand ours and respect it. I will understand and respect yours when I visit your homeland.

In short, I see outrage for enemy POWs and civies but none in response to the actions against us. WE are not responsable for 9-11, if you want to blame a President, blame Clinton, unless you really believe that attacks over his 8 years had nothing in common with 9-11. That is why Dems are seen as weak on defence. During these attacks, Clinton was down-sizing our military and reducing retirement for the military, does that make any sense? We are being attacked and you weaken our forces?

just one soldiers opinion,

SSG. Camacho
1/75 Rangers

Posted by: Sua_Sponte at September 14, 2006 1:33 PM
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