Gotta Love Those Hollywood Elites

Anti-Christian Bush haters were in for a special treat, yesterday, at the opening of Madonna’s “Confessions” tour. Among other vile displays that fans were treated to, Madonna mimicked the Crucifixion of Jesus by hanging herself from a cross while wearing a crown of thorns (note: this picture may be extremely offensive).

Of course, no show would be complete without the requisite Bush bashing. Here’s a not too offensive original: Bush = Hitler.

Actually, the Hitler equation was part of a larger video montage that Madonna aired for her excited audience:

"During one of her half-dozen costume changes, another video montage juxtaposed images of Bush, members of his administration and British Prime Minister Tony Blair with footage of Adolf Hitler, Osama bin Laden, and Zimbabwe President Robert Mugabe." Reuters.

Midway through her new song, "I Love New York" — an insulting title considering her Osama bin Laden reference — Madonna delighted her fans with a crude reference to Bush and oral sex.

How can people put up with crap like this? Regardless of your political leanings, antics like these are extremely offensive, yet depraved elitists like Madonna remain indifferent to this fact.

The fans in attendance deserve a good deal of criticism as well. As a music lover myself, I can assure you that I would quickly exit a concert should the band subject me to such grotesque displays.

However, performances like these are hardly surprising. After all, the collective intellectual capacity of Hollywood elites — BTW, this may or may not be factual — falls short of a brain-damaged donkey.

Posted by Dr Politico at May 22, 2006 4:36 PM
Comments
Comment #150282

The purpose of this post was not to offend brain-damaged donkeys, and I apologize if it came out that way.

Posted by: Dr Politico at May 22, 2006 5:03 PM
Comment #150283

Dr. Politico,

How could you denigrate that poor donkey that way! Even dumb asses deserve respect.

Posted by: LeftCoastMark at May 22, 2006 5:07 PM
Comment #150285

Here’s your brain damaged monkey.

What’s so elitist about comparing Bush to Hitler and telling him to f himself? Crass yeah. Lame and juvenile, yeah. But what did you expect? This is the same woman that toured in her underwear and simulated sex as a part of her show. It’s just BS opportunistic huckstering off of Bush’s unpopularity. Who cares about HollyWood? Some of it’s junk and some of it’s great (See Goodnight and Goodluck) as always.


Posted by: Max at May 22, 2006 5:10 PM
Comment #150290

It’s asinine to compare Bush to Hitler; especially when there’s a modern version of Hitler (right now as we speak) in Iran! Duh!

Posted by: rahdigly at May 22, 2006 5:18 PM
Comment #150292

Right you are, Max. Hollywood types, both left and right, take themselves way too seriously. The ability to make lots of money pretending to be someone else is not a sterling recommendation to be a political pundit. Even those who have a background in politics are not really to be trusted as political observers.

I heard a good one the other day on XM radio. News flash!! Susan Sarandon has announced she will not support Hillary Clinton’s bid for a second term in the Senate! Poor Hillary will surely miss those 8 votes that this will cost her. Seriously, what does it matter that a person who lives in Brentwood, California is not going to support a candidate for Senate from New York?

Hey, Doc,

You may be giving too much weight to the collective intellectual capacity of Hollywoodians. Remeber Tom Cruise’s spectacular display of brain power in his confrontation with Brooke Shields? Or his demonstration of acrobatic ability in winning the couch jumping event? Or, anything from Barbara Steisand?

Posted by: John Back at May 22, 2006 5:20 PM
Comment #150294

Dr
Don’t get too upset with Madonna. After all she is just an actor. If she really wanted to make a point then carry out what history has already accomplished. Take the spear in the side and the nails in the feet and hands and see if she has the grace to say “Father forgive them, they know not what they do”.

Posted by: tomh at May 22, 2006 5:39 PM
Comment #150295

Madonna?
A concert?
And me without my parachute pants. Where has the time gone?

Where has the time gone indeed, when she was at the top of her 15 min. she was irrelavent at best. Now a full genaration later just what deserves comment?
The simple act of caring to respond to her antics lends more creadence to them than they deserve. I personnally have never given much thought to what an overpaid, spoilled, billious “star” has ever had to say from the right or left. If they can act or sing well then thats the only arena that I give points for.
As far as politics go they are even more inept than I.

Posted by: Ted at May 22, 2006 5:43 PM
Comment #150306

Madonna is supposed to be smart. Although she is on the way to being an old hag, she can hang onto her bad girl sexy image a bit longer by pandering to the leftish elites. They will pretend to take her seriously. We should not. Think of her in the Barbara Streisand category, and then don’t think of her anymore at all.

Actors in general are not all that smart. Not dumber than average, mind you, just nothing special. They sometimes play smart people on television and that fools us. It is like people think parrots are smart because they can mimic human speech. Did you ever watch a group of actors on Jeopardy? A lot of them cannot even get right answers about films they made themselves.


There seems to be a negative correlation between good looks and brains or maybe good looking people just never need to develop their brains.

Posted by: Jack at May 22, 2006 6:16 PM
Comment #150309

Madonna has mad millions over the years being controversial and over the top. The very fact that she is in this conversation keeps her in the green, which is where she wants to be. Politics has nothing to do with it. Political opportunism is the name of the game. Don’t worry, most of the people at her concerts don’t vote!

Posted by: dwight at May 22, 2006 6:18 PM
Comment #150318

Please. Madonna isn’t the only musical performer who doesn’t like Dubya. The Dixie Chicks and Neil Young make no bones about not liking him either. Jeeze, even Dolly Parton recently closed her shows with Dylan’s “Blowin’ in the Wind” and John Lennon’s “Imagine”, and made a few pointed anti-war comments, despite her loyal red-state following.
Madonna is just doing the same, albeit in a sluttier and flashier way.

Posted by: Adrienne at May 22, 2006 6:55 PM
Comment #150319

who gives a rat’s a** what Madonna thinks? She’s so fond of America that she made England her home. Personally, I wish she’d stay there and give up her citizenship.

Posted by: RN Student at May 22, 2006 6:56 PM
Comment #150321

Dr. Politico,
What exactly is the point of this? To bash Madonna? How juvenille can you get??? You’re offended by what Madonna does at a concert? Is she suppose to matter? I think this is yet another simple-minded swipe at “hollywood elites”. Okay, fine. You get offended by Madonna and I’ll get offended by something real, like the genocide in Darfur or the corporate tax loopholes that rob our country of needed revenue or the shrinking middle class or N. Korea and Iran’s nuclear ambitions or our wasteful healthcare system or the US deficeit or all the bribbery scandals in Congress, etc, etc.

To think Madonna represents anybody but herself is a giving her wayyyyyyyyyyyy too much credit. She’s trying to sell some more of her lame cds and she knows that getting publicity is her way to do it. If you want to marginalize her, it’s simple. Ignore her. That’s what I do.

I expected a little more from a doctor.

Posted by: Matthew at May 22, 2006 7:01 PM
Comment #150324

Anti-Christian Bush Haters????,


Enough with the flame-baiting. I am a Christian. I am a liberal. I do not consider Bush to be Christian. I don’t think he even comprehends what it is to be Christian.

Posted by: RGF at May 22, 2006 7:05 PM
Comment #150327

“Anti-Christian Bush Haters????”

People who hate the President? I thought he was talking about gay men… DOH!

All this about a woman who wears faux metal cones on her boobs. (Dang - she had both of the White House Dynamic duo on her chest, and didn’t mention it once? Much better than the Bush reference.)

Posted by: tony at May 22, 2006 7:14 PM
Comment #150329

Exactly how is Madonna saying these things any different than Michael Savage telling a gay person “I hope you get AIDS and die you pig”. Seems to me the Right has no claim to a higher ground on saying ridiculous offensive things.

Posted by: stevek at May 22, 2006 7:17 PM
Comment #150331

RGF,
“Anti-Christian Bush Haters????,


Enough with the flame-baiting. I am a Christian. I am a liberal. I do not consider Bush to be Christian. I don’t think he even comprehends what it is to be Christian.”

And yet, you didn’t mention anything about not being a Bush hater. Actually, you proved the point. Nice.

Posted by: rahdigly at May 22, 2006 7:19 PM
Comment #150333

RGF,

The anti-Christian remark was directed toward Madonna hanging herself from a cross. Separatley, the Bush hating remark was directed toward her Bush-Hitler-bin Laden tribute. I thought that was clear.

Matthew,

Let me answer your questions one at a time:

Q: “What exactly is the point of this?”

A: the point is to bash Madonna.

Q: “To bash Madonna?”

A: I just said that.

Q: “How juvenille can you get???”

A: I refuse to answer that.

Q: “You’re offended by what Madonna does at a concert?”

A: I’m offended by most manifestations of stupidity.

Q: “Is she suppose to matter?”

A: Again, I refuse to answer.


Posted by: Dr Politico at May 22, 2006 7:32 PM
Comment #150336

I was waiting for the first comparison of Madonna to a conservative talk show host. I don’t know what I’m more surprised by though: that the post didn’t come from Rocky or Adrienne or that stevek thinks that Michael Savage represents “right wingers”.

Agree with all others who say “who cares”.

Oh, and the Dixie chicks DO NOT APOLOGIZE for their Bush Bashing after all, so take that Texas! I know it hurts.

Posted by: Craig at May 22, 2006 7:42 PM
Comment #150337

Madonna has always been whacked out. Anything she does don’t surprise me none. She’s one of the most vulgar so called entertainers there is. But it seem that folks will waste their hard earned money to see her. If folks wouldn’t pay these types any mind, they’d dry up and go away.

Posted by: Ron Brown at May 22, 2006 7:45 PM
Comment #150338

As an anti-christian Bush disliker, I am offended by the implication that I support Madonna’s music (although “Papa don’t Preach” was kind of catchy). For real entertainment (i.e., “comedy”), most of us just watch the 700 Club.

Posted by: Homer at May 22, 2006 7:45 PM
Comment #150348

“For real entertainment (i.e., “comedy”), most of us just watch the 700 Club.”

Wow, now that’s some really twisted sh@t.

Posted by: tony at May 22, 2006 8:13 PM
Comment #150349

Somehow some people look at everything as Rep or Dem or Lib or Con or some other political shortsightedness.

In reality it is a spiritual issue. That is the mockery of Jesus Christ. I don’t hate anybody for doing what for example Madonna did. I have compassion for her and hope she sees Jesus for who he is and what he did for her personally. There are far worse things that are occuring in the world that mocks Jesus. And that is the tragedy of it all. There will be those who take their last breath cursing the creator and one who could be their savior. Then there are those who acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord.

Posted by: tomh at May 22, 2006 8:21 PM
Comment #150353

Craig,

“I don’t know what I’m more surprised by though: that the post didn’t come from Rocky or Adrienne or that stevek thinks that Michael Savage represents “right wingers”.”

Thanks for the comparison, if you considered an insult you missed the mark by a wide margin.

Though she and I are a bit apart politicly, I would be proud to be compared with Adrienne, though I don’t know if she would feel the same.

Posted by: Rocky at May 22, 2006 8:30 PM
Comment #150355

I keep waiting for a “I hate Fags” Thread but keep getting “I hate Hollywood” instead.

Posted by: Aldous at May 22, 2006 8:31 PM
Comment #150361
How can people put up with crap like this? Posted by Dr Politico at May 22, 2006 04:36 PM


(a) Free Speech
(b) Because not everyone thinks Jesus is anyone but an over rated rabbi.
(c) Because it’s pretty funny.

Posted by: Dave at May 22, 2006 8:37 PM
Comment #150362

I love Karl.

It’s the polls fault, It’s the Democrats fault, It’s the terrorist fault, it’s the liberals fault, it’s the press’ fault, It’s the CIA’s fault, It’s Valerie’s fault, It’s Shinseki’s fault, It’s a few rogue soldiers fault, It’s the illegal aliens fault, It’s Brownie’s fault, it’s holywood’s fault….. Do I see a pattern here?

Posted by: gergle at May 22, 2006 8:44 PM
Comment #150363

The sad part is this garbage slinging dim wit is actually listened to by aproximatly fifty percent of Americans. Madona and her ilk appeal to far to many voters. Thats scary It just shows the depths of depravity the American sheeple have sunk to.

Posted by: jc at May 22, 2006 8:45 PM
Comment #150364

I actually don’t understand what the big deal is.
Being an entertainer doesn’t change your citizenship rights.
Madonna is an entertainer, so what?
She does what she does for money, but that doesn’t mean she isn’t entitled to her opinion just like you are.

If you are offended by what she does or by her music, don’t go to her concerts, and don’t buy her Cd’s.

Is this realy worth getting ulcerated over?

Posted by: Rocky at May 22, 2006 8:48 PM
Comment #150365

Good post, Dr. You’ve proved that the Wrong wing can dish it out, but can’t take it.

Posted by: ElliottBay at May 22, 2006 8:55 PM
Comment #150367

Resident Hollywood expert Stephen Daugherty here. For years, Madonna has strived to be noticed, and has succeeded pretty well on several occasions, many of them involving full frontal nudity.

Congratulations, Dr., you just noticed her! Now other people visiting this site, if they are so inclined will want to see Madonna’s concert out of curiosity, or the wish just to shake their collective heinies at what they see as right-wing moralist elitism (and perhaps at some of here better songs, too)

Seriously, from my personal experience, the Hollywood Elite you so loathe have no more power than the feet, the remote, or the dollars the audience votes with. Madonna can be counted on to draw a certain audience at concerts, and rake in a certain number of dollars in CD sales. That’s all that gets her up there. When people thought she could sell movies, they put her up there, too.

And who’s doing this? The Corporations. Why? Because they are desperately trying to make profitable a business that has more than its shares of failures.

And as to those people enjoying her concert? Well, folks like different things, things that other people aren’t going to understand. That’s why there are more than just Madonna CDs out there.

If I showed up at my Grandparents with Madonna Tickets and asked them if they wanted to go, they would politely decline, perhaps a bit confused. If I got them Andre Rieu tickets, they’d be there if they could manage it. I wouldn’t want to come along, but that’s just me. Is there something wrong with this? Not really. People are born into different cultures and part of cultures, with different wiring in their heads affecting what will appeal to them.

So lay off Madonna and the other Hollywood Elites. They’re just people corporate America trust to sell their particular brand of goods and services. If you want better, then make something better and sell it well.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at May 22, 2006 8:55 PM
Comment #150372

I have always wondered why the right is so fixated with what hollywood (diminutive case intended) and such has to say. I consider myself somewhat left of center and yet found none of their views worth much. Then it struck me, the fear is based on their own crossover hits.
Reagan,
Thompson,
S Bono,
Eastwood.

Posted by: Ted at May 22, 2006 9:08 PM
Comment #150374

Have you guys ever seen Predator? 3 of the main “actors” are politicians. Watch that movie again, and then try to take government with a straight face.

Posted by: tony at May 22, 2006 9:14 PM
Comment #150378

Tony,
Good analogy (LOL)

Posted by: Ted at May 22, 2006 9:18 PM
Comment #150379


If Madonna upsets you this much,fight back. Get Rush a cone bra and have Dennis Miller right some nasty Clinton jokes for him. Hey, she could have done a lot worse. Think of what her name is. She could have had Bush and…….having…….

Posted by: jlw at May 22, 2006 9:22 PM
Comment #150384

Rocky,
Interesting. Why would you interpret my post as an attempted insult? Please explain.


Posted by: Craig at May 22, 2006 9:34 PM
Comment #150405

Craig,

“I was waiting for the first comparison of Madonna to a conservative talk show host. I don’t know what I’m more surprised by though: that the post didn’t come from Rocky or Adrienne or that stevek thinks that Michael Savage represents “right wingers”.”

When in nearly 2 years of posting here have I compared anyone to a conservative talk show host?
I may have made reference to someone listening too much to a certain talk radio host. But never as a comparison.

Believe it or not there was a time when I thought Limbaugh was entertaining, I never agreed with him, but as entertainment he was ok.

Admittedly that was quite some time ago.

Posted by: Rocky at May 22, 2006 10:39 PM
Comment #150412

I didn’t know that watchblog and the right wing were in the business of giving Madonna free publicity.

Honestly, you played into her little trap. If you ignored her she’d go away.

Posted by: chantico at May 22, 2006 11:02 PM
Comment #150415


Hey,I’m sorry. I thought you wanted someone to compare Rush to Madonna.

Posted by: jlw at May 22, 2006 11:09 PM
Comment #150422

Like most Republicans, Dr. Politico (I bet he’s not even a real doctor) is way too concerned with what’s going on in Hollywood and not nearly concerned enough with what’s going on in Washington.

Posted by: RMD at May 22, 2006 11:20 PM
Comment #150427

Umm… So all Madonna fans are “anti-Christian Bush haters”? C’mon, now. I’m sure some of them just like her music.

RMD, that’s a good point. Last week the big buzz in conservative Georgia was how — if the explosion is behind Tom Cruise — does he get blown sideways?

Seriously, you guys, it’s just a movie. It was written in the script because the director thought it would look cool.

I swear, it’s as if conservatives can’t tell the difference between Hollywood and real life.

Posted by: American Pundit at May 22, 2006 11:39 PM
Comment #150430

Once again, Steven Daugherty and AP make some great points.

Really, this is all about $$$ and that’s it. And aren’t all things about money in the end? Certainly, in the so-called “music” (the “music” is “so-called) biz, the more they can shock our good citizens, the more tickets they sell. TV? Hollywood? Rather than see these as loose-moraled agents of the liberal “elite,” the naked truth is that they are agents of a conservative corporate culture that *only* values profits for its shareholders. Otherwise, Mr. Murdoch would be doing a little more “family” programming on FOX and less of the sleazy crap that dominates those right wing airwaves. What’s more clear than that? Sex sells. Selling is the domain of corporations and industry. Corporations and industry are about profit. Period.

Our young men and women are being mutilated and are dying under false pretenses thousands of miles away, and here we are on a thread talking about some washed-up pop star who never had a musical bone in her body, anyway. You want offensive? *That’s* offensive.

And yet here I am spending my time writing about it! The Cons win again!


Posted by: DavidL at May 22, 2006 11:57 PM
Comment #150435

American Pundit,

Nowhere in my post does it say that all Madonna fans are anti-Christian Bush haters. Nice spin, though.

Also…

“I swear, it’s as if conservatives can’t tell the difference between Hollywood and real life.”

You almost got it right there. However, you should have wrote: I swear, it’s as if celebrities can’t tell the difference between Hollywood and real life.”

Finally, to all the lefties arguing—weakly, mind you—that conservatives and republicans are way too concerned with Holywood: GET REAL! It’s a post about a moron with a michrophone, not about conservatives, liberals, or anything in between.

Posted by: Dr Politico at May 23, 2006 12:17 AM
Comment #150437

Dr. Pol,


Um…I think the fact that this post is up (and has so many responses) shows that R’s and Con’s *are*, in fact, way too concerned with Hollywood. Frankly, it’s all I hear about from Conservatives, sometimes. Because clearly, Alec Baldwin is pulling all the strings.

Sorry, but I think you’re copping out.

Posted by: DavidL at May 23, 2006 12:29 AM
Comment #150438

Madonna will never give up her US citizenship and become Britain’s problem, not with the British taxation rates.

BTW, why does Neil Young want to impeach the Canadian president?

Posted by: goodkingned at May 23, 2006 12:41 AM
Comment #150439

The first song of “Confessions On A Dance Floor” is “Hung Up,” which may be the best thing Madonna has done, excepting “Ray of Light.” The songs on the cd follow a club mix format, which keeps it flowing along very nicely; catchy riffs, a great combination of techno and disco, although the 2nd & 3rd songs are rather weak. Song 4, “Future Lovers,” is also terrific. The song borrows liberally from “I Feel Love” by Donna Summers, and it works, absolutely. That song by Summers pointed the way, as Brian Eno enthused at the time, and even today we are following its musical draw. As Madonna asks in her song:

“Give me Evidence of Its Brilliance.”

The lyrics of “I Love New York” have apparently been changed a bit for the concert. The lyrics were pretty weak in the first place, but the melody is solid, and there is some insanely great reverb going on at the end of each verse. I am guessing this is the controversial verse, and I am guessing this is the slight revision Madonna makes to take a shot at Bush:

If you dont like my attitude Bush
Then you can “f” off
Just go to Texas
Isnt that where they golf
New York is not for little pussies who scream
If you cant stand the heat
Then get off my street
get off my street

(Reverb of “get off, get off, get off”).

Where is Madonna going with her music? My current favorite musician is Alison Goldfrapp from the group Goldfrapp. Supposedly Madonna is studying Goldfrapp, and learning from her example. These are two highly intelligent, extremely talented women. Look for Goldfrapp to lead the techno side of rock into a happy, joyous, sensual direction which simultaneously combines & contrasts the attractions of hedonism & phsycial pleasure with the draw of spiritual yearning. Madonna will take this to the mainstream for as long as she is capable.

Posted by: phx8 at May 23, 2006 12:42 AM
Comment #150440

You are delusional if you aren’t aware that Americans, both on the right and the left, love this kind of crap. It’s fresh meat for them to fight over. This kind of thing has benn happening over and over for years and it’s nobody in particular’s fault.

Dr., you must be running out of good ideas to write about. Madonna is old hat. (almost literally)

Posted by: Beijing Rob at May 23, 2006 12:51 AM
Comment #150442

It would seem to me that the whole Madonna thing is just another example of idiots using controversy to get airtime. This is not restricted to liberals (need I remind anybody about the Westboro Baptist Church?) but liberal Hollywood elitists are much more notorious about it. What I find really annoying is the rank hypocrisy. Madonna doesn’t have a problem using Christian symbolism to bash Christian beliefs, doesn’t mind the damage she does to young gir’s beliefs about thier self-worth by making out with Britney Spears on MTV but makes sure her own daughter didn’t see it, Barbara Streisand bashes Americans for being so wasteful and spends more in a month on air conditioning for her house that’s about 5 times the average for an American, the list goes on. Celebrities have a global voice and can do good. Its just a shame that so many of them hop on the liberal bandwagon and spend more time bashing people just to get a headline than doing something productive.

Posted by: 1LT B at May 23, 2006 2:10 AM
Comment #150452

I like how some are making the arguement that some conservatives in Hollywood are in politics. Yeah, and?! (most) Hollywood elites are mouth pieces for the wacko movement that uses “emotionalism” to combat problems. All they end up accomplishing is that their loud, opinionated and (flat out) wrong on the majority of issues.


Posted by: rahdigly at May 23, 2006 7:29 AM
Comment #150455

To all:

Of course Madonna has the freedom to express herself any way she chooses. So too does Natalie Maines, Neil Young and the rest of the crowd. But lets face it, there are repercussions to what people say and how they say it. Look at what happened to Trent Lott—he paid rather dearly for a poor choice of words.

I know, I know…Lott is a public figure (and not coincidentally a Republican) so that makes it a bit different.

The thing is that with the freedom of speech comes the responsibility to use this freedom wisely and with good caution. Consider the clamor that would occur throughout the world if Madonna were to dress up as the Prophet Mohammed and revile him in the same precise manner that she did Christ. Would people be so willing to excuse her bad taste? Of course, she’d likely not live to see the end of the concert tour.

Madonna makes no difference to me. Her opinions are hers alone, and I’ve not found them to be all that educated or wise through the years. She is a fantastic marketer on the scale of a PT Barnum, and she masks the simplicity of her opinions by making them sensational. It fools some people.

But even those who agree with her viewpoint should recognize that if the shoe were on the other foot, they would castigate her for her speech. Rush Limbaugh has been castigated for saying things….during the Clinton years, there was a concerted effort to muzzle talk radio hosts. We need to be either for free speech or against it… and even when for it, we need to recognize when it becomes irresponsible. We can still fight for the right of those to speak freely, but we can easily condemn what they say.

And with that, I condemn Madonna’s message, which has now gotten far more air time than it deserves.

Posted by: joebagodonuts at May 23, 2006 8:09 AM
Comment #150461

Dr. Politico,

“How can people put up with crap like this? Regardless of your political leanings, antics like these are extremely offensive, yet depraved elitists like Madonna remain indifferent to this fact.”

1)It’s America.
2)It’s your opinion, not fact that “these antics are extremely offensive.”
3)It’s Madonna, an 80’s pop star who can’t act or sing and is wealthy and knows her fans like controversy.
4)Who cares?

Posted by: Andre M. Hernandez at May 23, 2006 9:17 AM
Comment #150465

Can anyone say “Sodom and Gemorrah?”

Posted by: nikkolai at May 23, 2006 9:51 AM
Comment #150467

Madonna is offensive to Christians? You are really making me nostalgic for the 80’s here. Next you are going to tell me that Twisted Sister is corrupting America’s youth.

Posted by: Woody Mena at May 23, 2006 9:55 AM
Comment #150468

The world’s going to hell in a handbasket and all you can talk about is Madonna??? Pitiful!

Posted by: Lynne at May 23, 2006 10:05 AM
Comment #150469
You almost got it right there. However, you should have wrote: “I swear, it’s as if celebrities can’t tell the difference between Hollywood and real life.”

Holy Crap! Dr. Politico — if that is your real name — this is exactly what I’m talking about. Celebrities ARE Hollywood. It’s fantasy. It’s their life. It’s what they do. It’s all about the buzz. It just kills me that you guys swallow this stuff hook line and sinker as if it’s all real.

You need to spend less time caring about what actors are doing and more time finding out what your Republican representatives are doing. Come back to planet Earth.

Rather than see these as loose-moraled agents of the liberal “elite,” the naked truth is that they are agents of a conservative corporate culture

Sure. Not only does sex sell, but so does outrage, and FOX has a line on both. While FOX Entertainment is subjecting Americans to the worst raunchy filth on television, down the hall at FOX News they’re getting people all outraged over the filthy raunch on television.

This is pure and brilliant corporate media at its money-making best. The problem is, too many conservatives aren’t grounded enough in reality to appreciate it. They’re alternately mesmerized by FOX filth and up in arms in response to FOX outrage over FOX filth. Both the filth and the outrage are manufactured by a brilliant and very conservative Rupert Murdoch.

Kudos to Murdoch for being able to make money off of both extremes, but oh the toll it’s taking on America.

Posted by: American Pundit at May 23, 2006 10:08 AM
Comment #150488


American Pundit: How straight and true your arrow didith fly.

Posted by: jlw at May 23, 2006 11:14 AM
Comment #150493

dr. politico,

I know you have some roots in the middle east, what did you think of the Clint Black song “Iraq and I roll” (real song name)?

It’s really amazing how low some people will stoop to make a buck, I agree.

Posted by: Beijing Rob at May 23, 2006 11:33 AM
Comment #150516

Rocky:
“Though she and I are a bit apart politicly,”

Are we so far apart? I frequently agree with you, so I guess I’ve been operating under the impression that we weren’t…

“I would be proud to be compared with Adrienne, though I don’t know if she would feel the same.”

Thanks very much, Rocky! I don’t mind a bit being compared to you, although I must confess, I haven’t a clue as to what Craig was attempting to get at with his comment. Why on earth would I compare Madonna to a bunch of rightwing talking heads?
It’s a silly observation, but no doubt intended as some sort of a put down aimed in our direction.

Posted by: Adrienne at May 23, 2006 12:42 PM
Comment #150521

Reserving comment on the lengths that Modonna might go to to reinvigorate her career (though its not like tweaking the Christian establishment and the political powers-that-be to gain exposure is exactly new ground - for her or a gazillion other rock bands) but the “hollywood elite” bashing always makes me curious:

Do you include, oh I don’t know, Ronald Reagan, Arnold Swartzenegger, Fred Thompson, Clint Eastwood, Charleton Heston, and Ted Nugent among the sub-brain-damaged donkey set? Or is it just the ones you disagree with.

Why is it so stridently asserted that celebrity=idiocy. What makes the opinion of an (intelligent) celebrity with enough wealth, time, and means to deeply explore a topic they feel passionate about any less valid than the opinion of, say a Bill O’Reilly or Rush Limbaugh who are utimately just radio celebrities with enough wealth, time (or staff), and means to form opinions based on the reseach of others. How often do those talking heads actually leave their studios and ideological bubbles to travel to the places they ponitificate on - ala Bono, or Susan Serandon (oh my!) or even the much maliged and way too serious Sean Penn (Egads!)?

Do I agree with all these “liberal” hollywood elites? No - though I often find them far more sincere than the pundits and politicoes. Do I think that all celebrities that get on soap boxes deserve to be respected - absolutely not, if they are just loudly spouting uninformed opinion (i.e. Usher). But to summarily lump them all together as mindless wackjobs because they don’t share your world view is either naive, close-minded, or being perpetuated as politically lazy way to discredit the opposition.

Posted by: Juststoppinby at May 23, 2006 1:01 PM
Comment #150524

Guess I should have read the previous posts a little better. Didn’t notice that Ted had already played the “conservative” hollywood stars card. Sorry for the redundancy.

Posted by: Juststoppinby at May 23, 2006 1:07 PM
Comment #150529

“Its America”
“Even celebs are entitled to their opinions”
“The celebs have a right to speak their minds”
“Hollywood celebs dont represent ALL of the left”

So why isn’t it America for those evil Christians? Why aren’t they entitled to their own opinions and to vote accordingly? Why don’t they have the right to speak their minds?
And why is it that the “evil right wing Christians” DO represent ALL of those on the right?

Falwell and those guys ARE celebs in their circles, why do you care so much about what they have to say? Why not just brush their message aside as you do with scum like baldwin, glover and the such?
Oh yeah, its only harmless free speech when you agree with what is being said.

Posted by: kctim at May 23, 2006 1:17 PM
Comment #150531

“Bush is Hitler The Resume of George W. Bush”


Real classy! It takes real guts to attack you’re own President in America, doesn’t it? Please!


If you (really) had guts; you would’ve attacked the President of Iran; he’s the real-life Hitler. Yet, Bush hatred blinds people from that. Way to go! Another “Brave” American speaking out against the forces of evil. Yeah right!

Posted by: rahdigly at May 23, 2006 1:21 PM
Comment #150535

Adrienne,

“Are we so far apart? I frequently agree with you, so I guess I’ve been operating under the impression that we weren’t…”

A bit as in “a little”.

Posted by: Rocky at May 23, 2006 1:34 PM
Comment #150549

Kctim:

People like Jerry Falwell are RELIGIOUS LEADERS. Folks look to them specifically for guidance and leadership and to form their opinions. That’s why when Falwell blames 9-11 on the “homosexuals” and other so-called “bad people,” it’s incredibly destructive. When a Hollywood “liberal elitist” makes an assertion, people don’t view them as spiritual and moral beacons. They’re just not. They’re actors, even though they’re given a voice by a media looking for celebrity stories. Sorry, but your comparison is spurious.

Rahdigly:

Did you discount one point of that incredible post? Didn’t think so…

You know, the president of Iran can be bad, *too,* not exclusively. So both the president of Iran can be bad *and* the president of the US can be bad—and each in their own way! And as citizens, it is our *duty* to speak up when we see…*ahem*…”mismanagement.

When you have something meaningful to write that isn’t “nuh-uh,” we’ll look forward to it.


Posted by: DavidL at May 23, 2006 2:27 PM
Comment #150553


rahdigly: you are right, it doesn’t take a lot of guts to attack our president. What takes a lot of guts is defending him.

In the 1990’s, according to the republicans, the most evil person on Earth was Clinton. So you see, one man’s evil person is another man’s saint.

Many people consider Osama to be a very evil person for what he did to America. Many in the muslem world consider him a hero, he attacked the great satan to defend the muslem people.

Many people believe that Our presidents attack on Iraq and the killing of 100,000 Iraqis was a very evil thing to do. Others believe that although the deaths are regretable, our president did what he had to do to defend our country and save the people of Iraq.

You know, there are enough evil doers in the world for everyone to have their personal favorite.

Now, back on post. When it comes to Hollywood, the right has their super stars and the left has their super stars. Each side has said and or done things that upset the other side. What both sides of the hollywood stars have in common is the profit motive. And contraversy is good for profit. And, others have pointed this out far better than I can.

One last thing, the trick is not to put a boot in someone’s XXX. The trick is to put a boot in the right someone’s XXX at the right time and the right place.

Posted by: jlw at May 23, 2006 2:37 PM
Comment #150560

What’s wrong with you far-left liberal zealots? Comparing President Bush to Hitler is completely repugnant and has no basis in reality. Ahh, reality. Give it a try sometime and stop denigrating the memory of the millions of Jews who were slaughtered for no other reason than being Jewish.

Thank you Rahdigly!!! There is one man alive today who is calling for the death of an entire people based on their religious affiliation and if the rest of you can’t see that, I pity you.

Posted by: Dr Politico at May 23, 2006 3:13 PM
Comment #150567

After his first speech,during the first term,on C-Span,I saw President Bush surrounded by sycophants and well wishers,all older patting him and doing their atta boy routines. I was struck by the fact that this is how I would reward my dog for fetching a slipper. I don’t hate Pres.Bush I think that in a one on one he would be charming and affable. I protest in that it appears that he is so deeply entwined with special interest groups that his effectiveness as a leader is compromised. We need to think outside the box more now than ever. Short term solutions regarding oil and Middle East stability are bandaids on a major wound.

Posted by: jblym at May 23, 2006 3:51 PM
Comment #150571

Kctim,

Is your response directed only at my post? If so, you make some fairly spectacular assumptions as to my opinions, especially as that was my first post in this forum ever (as I am Just Stoppin By). Am I free to make similar broad brush assumptions about you - that you are part of the “ditto-head” type nation that brands every person who falls to the left of your sacred ground on the political spectrum as “you people (insert appropriate bile)…”. That us “liberal pinkos” all speak from a common heathen mouth attached to a giant conspiratorail Anti-Christian brain. Is that a fair assessment of you based on your three paragraphs? Do I go to far?

Can we set aside our contructed-to-build-avid-ratings-bases, talk-show/blog fostered, all-or-nothing, mega-stereotypes for a minute to actually have a coherent, real person exchange?

To address the charge I think you were leveling at me:

Falwell and those guys ARE celebs in their circles, why do you care so much about what they have to say? Why not just brush their message aside as you do with scum like baldwin, glover and the such? Oh yeah, its only harmless free speech when you agree with what is being said.

I don’t care so much about what the likes of Falwell say. Personally, I do brush aside their intolerant, vitrioloc, “I-speak-for-God/Jesus/the soul of America” comments with the same disdain I ascribe to the radical left that foster an us-againt-them, polarized world-view. One difference I do see though is that while most of the scream-their-politics at you celebrities actually have very little real influence or pull, the likes of (in my mind radical) Falwell and Robertson excert a tremendous influence on their “flocks”. And when I see them using this profound influence to fill the minds of many trusting people who are searching and questing to learn about how to live “Christ-like” lives with anger, fear, bile, hatred, and intolerance on a grand scale, I submit to you that this paragons of “love” are doing a graver disservice to the unity and values of the America I love and believe in than a few loud mouth celebrites (most of whom are pushing for more justice and freedom not less).

Once again, let me make clear, I do not, in any way, place the vast majority of religious figures, celebriteis, or just general Americans (whatever their political leanings) wholly in the camps of the extremes mentioned above. I honestly believe that a huge majority of people are simply doing their best, and what they think is right and just. But it seems it is the loudest among us that want to convince everyone that a half of this country is wrong - all the time. The take-no-prisoners, don’t-give an-inch, I-know-I’m-right, those-people-think- this, approach seems to being taking a chokehold on our ostensibly red vs blue country. How exactly is that an American value - or a boon to freedom of expression?

To reign this diatribe in somewhat and get back to the post that spawned it…

Which America are you refering to Kctim. Last I checked a large majority of Americans still profess Christiantity as their religion. Christains are not the oppressed few. As far as I know, no effort has ever been mounted to keep masses of Christians from going to the poles and speaking their minds (although I am somewhat less certain of certain groups of black Americans). I honestly feel this supposed “war on christianity” is one of the biggest red-herrings I have ever seen. An attempt by some to promote the idea that a heroic battle is being waged in order to overcome the apathy and guilt that the comfort and relative prosperity of being in a generations long place of political and cultral majority has wrought. When I see mega-churches springing up on every third corner and numerous TV channels, radio stations, and stores dedicated entirely to Christianity I have a real hard time feeling particularly woried for the opressed Christain victims. But of course, those who find it useful to create this furor will continue to pull out-of-context anecdotes out of obscure local newspapers and paint them as signs of the apocalypse.

I think the true issue lies in the fact that some have decided that Christian fundamentalism, Christianity, Republicanism, and American Values are all synonyms and are only valid if taken as an inseprable monolith. I am a Christian but I seperate myself from Christian Fundamentalism in much the same way that I think most Muslims seperate themselves from Islamic Fundamentalism, all indications from the loud-talkers aside.

Whew…all right I’ve said my piece (and then some). Sorry to crash the party. I’m sure I bounced around sufficiently to not make any of my arguments particularly sound or well-rounded. I guess outpourings like that come from being a perpetual blog lurker rather than participant. I’ll go back to that role now.

Oh, and Kctim, if I grossly misconstrued your comments, I apologize.

Posted by: Juststoppinby at May 23, 2006 3:54 PM
Comment #150576

juststoppinby Christian Fundamentalists and Moslem Fundamentalists are 2 peas in a pod. Zealots are bad news in any culture,any situation. No one has the right to inflict their particular dementia on the public as a whole. (with the possible exception of blogging) Subscribe to any belief system you wish,but know that good people will resist any attempt to create a monotheistic America

Posted by: jblym at May 23, 2006 4:26 PM
Comment #150592

Juststoppinby:
“Whew…all right I’ve said my piece (and then some). Sorry to crash the party. I’m sure I bounced around sufficiently to not make any of my arguments particularly sound or well-rounded.”

Actually, you did very well in both of your posts, in my opinion.

“I guess outpourings like that come from being a perpetual blog lurker rather than participant. I’ll go back to that role now.”

Aww, don’t do that! Why be a lurker? (I’ve never understood this.) I think you should stick around and contribute whatever you like to these discussions in all three columns — after all, that’s all anyone here is doing.
Oh, but do keep in mind what it says at the top — critique the message, not the messenger — otherwise you’ll be tossed out of here very quickly.

Posted by: Adrienne at May 23, 2006 5:03 PM
Comment #150600

Dr. Pol:


Comparing people to Hitler is an old Republican standby, no? I agree, it’s distressingly offensive. Now that Saddam is having his “day in court” (while the judges are trying their best to stay alive) who will next be in the “Hitler” category? I’ll go with the leader in Iran whose name I can’t yet spell. He’s a part of that “Axis of Evil” (an interesting choice of words, don’t you think?)

Again, Republicans should look at themselves before pointing at others. There is a log in their eye!

Posted by: DavidL at May 23, 2006 5:19 PM
Comment #150604

DavidL
“People like Jerry Falwell are RELIGIOUS LEADERS.”

The only difference is that they are overtly religious. To others, they are religous “celebrities.”

“Folks look to them specifically for guidance and leadership and to form their opinions.”

And folks don’t look to celebrities for the same?

“That’s why when Falwell blames 9-11 on the “homosexuals” and other so-called “bad people,” it’s incredibly destructive.”

So why isn’t it “incredibly destructive” when baldwin and his ilk compares our President to Hitler? Or when they happily plead for understanding for terrorists, but yet won’t give their own President a chance in hell?

“When a Hollywood “liberal elitist” makes an assertion, people don’t view them as spiritual and moral beacons. They’re just not. They’re actors, even though they’re given a voice by a media looking for celebrity stories. Sorry, but your comparison is spurious”

Care to explain the Madonna look that went crazy throughout the 80s?
People worship celebs and their actions speak loudly to volumes of people.

Posted by: kctim at May 23, 2006 5:29 PM
Comment #150624

“Is your response directed only at my post?”

Hmmm? Nope. Was in response to ALL the people who wish to limit one group while ignoring the groups they agree with.

“And when I see them using this profound influence to fill the minds of many trusting people who are searching and questing to learn about how to live “Christ-like” lives with anger, fear, bile, hatred, and intolerance on a grand scale, I submit to you that this paragons of “love” are doing a graver disservice to the unity and values of the America I love and believe in than a few loud mouth celebrites (most of whom are pushing for more justice and freedom not less)”

More freedom and justice to half of YOU. More govt intrusion, rights violations etc… the others.
Where and why do you draw a line? Only for those you happen to agree with? Or are you willing to accept the fact that BOTH sides are entitled to speak their words and each individual is free to listen and believe whomever they choose?

“Which America are you refering to Kctim. Last I checked a large majority of Americans still profess Christiantity as their religion.”

Yes they do, but doing so publicly is now frowned upon isn’t it.

“Christains are not the oppressed few. As far as I know, no effort has ever been mounted to keep masses of Christians from going to the poles and speaking their minds”

Yes, no effort has been mounted to do so, but the lefts effort to quiet them kind of backfired didn’t it. You piss them off and they don’t vote for you, as 00 and 04 clearly showed.

“(although I am somewhat less certain of certain groups of black Americans)”

Yeah, got to keep them feeling like they are victims so they vote for you.
Your’s is a really great post and I really hope you keep contributing, but bringing up make believe racism shows nothing.

“Oh, and Kctim, if I grossly misconstrued your comments, I apologize”

Thank you, but no need. I have very thick skin:)
But, hopefully for future posts from you, I am not religious in any way.

Posted by: kctim at May 23, 2006 5:57 PM
Comment #150643

kctim I enjoy reading your posts,but have to take a moment to question one statement. You say your not religious at all,why do you worship truth? Surely you would agree that to hold people to a standard beyond Angelina’s new baby,or Brad’s whatever is in fact a example of principle. You may say that your not religious,but I disagree,I believe you worship that which is noble in humans. That which in its finest moments sets us above the other life that we share the planet with. Our basic human decency.

Posted by: jblym at May 23, 2006 6:44 PM
Comment #150827

I checked this to laugh at the Madonna uproar but instead I see that there are a few posters who actually think and I’m glad to know that.
I guess what I have to say here is that even a semi lefitie liberal like myself takes everything with a grain of salt. I think we underestimate eachother. How ‘bout I stop think about every Christian as a “bible thumping robot for guns, pickup truck driving white people and no civil rights” and you stop thinking of every liberal as a “hollywood elite influenced non thinker”. And just so you know, as a person who’s supposed to be influenced by the “hollywood elite”, anyone with a brain in their head realizes that though these are people have an audience, it doesn’t mean they have any more of a grasp on the situation than anybody else. Sometimes they have even LESS. Maybe BOTH groups should focus on the raping and pillaging of the constitution going on right now instead of fighting over what some idiot celebrity is or isn’t doing. It seems as if the media is trying to distract us from what is important by showing us shiny object. (Madonna’s controversy mongering etc.)
Thanks for the insight.

Posted by: kp at May 24, 2006 10:08 AM
Comment #150829

JB
Thanks, but I don’t believe “worship” is the proper word to use.

Posted by: kctim at May 24, 2006 10:17 AM
Comment #151036

phx8:

I listened to Madonna’s new one and while it is better than her recent output, I don’t think it compares to Ray of Light (her only consistently good album). With the proper drug mix the new one would be a club hit (where the lyrics are unitelligible anyway), but it is no classic.

I’ll check out Goldfrapp next.

Posted by: goodkingned at May 24, 2006 7:23 PM
Comment #151040

Goldfrapp is pretty good, but their heroin habit will kill the band.

Posted by: goodkingned at May 24, 2006 7:32 PM
Comment #151087

kctim:

No, I don’t think people look to celebrities for moral and spiritual guidance the way they do from religious leaders. Yes, there are fads, but these are connected to clothing and cultural idioms, and not deeply held personal beliefs. That said, I’ll give you that celebrities have way to much influence in our culture. Why the hell should I give a %$@# what Alec Baldwin or Charlton Heston think about anything? Of course, they’re not claiming the backing of GOD, however—get what I mean? It’s hard not to.

As for people not giving “W” a chance, I think you’re wrong on that, too. How long did those poll numbers stay up through scores of mistakes, blunders, and missteps in handling our national security? The media is even talking about people being “scandal weary!” If that’s not giving him a chance, well…

It reminds me of the Kerry debates where he kept saying “it’s hard work to be President.” You don’t say?

Posted by: DavidL at May 24, 2006 10:44 PM
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