Republicans & Conservatives: Archives

Chops,
Good article as this is borderline conspiracy dome but something that deserves attention. I think a lot of governments are getting this way and the US will get this way soon. I think it can be beneficial. I do get the impression that you are paranoid about this. All I know is that if the government goes to far, mass rebellion will occur. I don’t count on Mr. Livingstone to be that stupid. I will say one thing about the current state of Europe. I expect a far right Nationalism considering the new Pope. It is tough to say but it has a purpose for the good. They can track down all the cars if a car is stolen. That is a good thing. If the government wants personal information, there are far cheaper and sufficient means of doing that. I wouldn’t be paranoid about it.

This info is peanuts in comparison to the information the US gathers through the US Patriot act.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Just because a technology is introduced for good purposes does not mean it will remain good. Tracking down stolen cars and having a fair congestion pricing system is all nice, but what happens when a government that you don’t like - be it far right or far left - takes control? I oppose the Patriot Act for the same reason: the government shouldn’t have even the capability of imposing totalitarian control.

Look at occupied Western Europe during the Holocaust. Some 30 or 40% of France and Belgium’s Jews were killed. In Holland, it was 70%. Why? Most historians point to meticulous government record-keeping and a culture of obedience to government. This is just one example out of many where a government has harmed its citizens inadvertantly by inserting itself into too much of their lives.

Chops, we are in lockstep on your comment above. I see the present tense security benefits of those who want Big Brother surveillance. But, the future potential of such programs being abused and yet accepted is too great, for freedom loving people.

Chops
One of the most important topics posted on here in a long while. To bad we are nothing but paranoid conspiracy nuts huh.
The left won’t say much because they are all for govt control of our personal lives and the right won’t complain because its their man in office right now.
Meanwhile, lawmakers, left and right, are destroying our rights and liberties more and more, day by day.

The left won’t say much because they are all for govt control of our personal lives

kctim, which left are you referring to? because this sounds waaaay off to me.

who’s been fighting the patriot act from the beginning? the left. who fights for the gov’t to stay OUT of personal lives (against the gay marriage amendment, protecting roe v. wade, etc)? the left.

The UK in the last decade or so has become a giant experiment in state surveillance. We have comfortably more CCTV cameras than any other country in the world, and keep adding more, despite the fact that they don’t reduce crime or the fear of crime.

In addition to this, there is something of an uproar about the proliferation of speed cameras around the country. Again, with large doubts over their usefulness.

The biggest recent privacy issue in the UK has been the debate over whether or not to have a national ID card. This scheme will cost several billions of pounds, not even accounting for the UK Government’s utterly useless record on implementing large IT projects. The arguments in favour of an ID card are less than convincing in my opinion.

On the political side, most of the justifications for CCTV, ID cards and to a certain extent the satellite monitoring of cars have been driven by traditional right wing issues - crime and terrorism in the case of CCTV and ID cards, and toll charging in the case of London cars. Also, similar to your PATRIOT laws, we have also implemented anti-privacy/anti-terrorism laws enabling things such as information sharing between Government departments and covert surveillance by security services. Again, the liberal left has been at the forefront of opposing these measures.

All these measures I described above have been supported by both the (nominally) left wing Government and the (definitely) right wing opposition (with the exception of speed cameras). The only major party which has opposed these invasions of individual privacy is… the Liberal party (who incidentally are poised to do rather well in the upcoming elections for these reasons and others including their opposition to the Iraq war).

Chops,

We already have the same technology in this country, and have for years.

It’s called LoJack.

Um, isn’t this an American blog? Who cares about England? Weren’t you just screaming about activist judges who invoke international law in court? Slow news day, eh?

God, I can’t believe people think this is conspiracy theory stuff. Apparently privacy isn’t really important in today’s world.

As for LoJack, at least you have to want to sign up for it. Government requiring this would be a bigger deal.

I think we should care very much about what happens in the United Kingdom, our closest ally. What happens there could very well happen here. In this case it already is here in America in the form of the Patriot act enacted by Congress three and a half years ago.

Why do we always have to believe technology is bad? Just because the Brits have the ability doesn’t mean they will track everyone for every reason. This computer I am writing on probably has more informatiobn on me which is used by business than I really want but that is part of doing business on the internet.

Don

Of course the government is going to use technology to track us. The government has funded a great deal of technology research for that purpose! That and military purposes.

The government taxes us, they use our money to develop technology to track us, why is anybody surprised about this? If it were that big a deal, there would have been a revolt years ago. The only people who need to worry about privacy, are those breaking the law.

Fortunately, in America, we still have the constitution. The Patriot Act does not allow the government to infringe on personal rights because the constitution overrides it. As far as I am concerned, illegal aliens and terrorist detainees have no rights anyway, so who are you trying to protect?

You libs always invoke the Patriot Act because you think it is the only chance you have left to tear down our President. Get a clue.

Norman Witte,

Thank you for having some common sense. Few people understand we have the power of the vote. If we don’t like what a group of elected people are doing we only have to wait until the next election to change what they did. We vote them out and elect other to do as we want.

A vote is a terrible thing to waste.

Don

“The government taxes us, they use our money to develop technology to track us, why is anybody surprised about this? If it were that big a deal, there would have been a revolt years ago. The only people who need to worry about privacy, are those breaking the law.”

Hey Norman,

Would that be the old “if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear” ploy?

If you belive that I have a bridge I’m trying to sell.

The gates of totalitarianism are unlocked and open.

This is the Future the Republicans want for America. Complete and Total Government Control is Bush’s Legacy.

I’m surprised you posted my whole comment, because you only responded to half of it.

We still have the constitution and we still have a vote. Short of that, who’s going to start the revolution? You?

Stock up on your duct tape and get out your tin-foil hats folks!

Norman,

There has to be something to say for the complacent Ammerican.

Hey they wouldn’t do that, we have a contsitution.

You bet, pal.
The right has nothing to hide and the left has nothing to fear.

Some folks are going to be in for a very rude surprise one day in the not too distant future if trends continue in their current direction.

Norman, please describe for me one revolution that came with ample warning and announcement? Revolutions creep up, then there is a flash point, and before most people knew it, they are in the midst of a revolution. I personally know two folks who are prepared for the day and waiting for the moment, and I am a pacifist belonging to no groups advocating violence like the NRA or Aryan Nation. I would put an estimate of at least a million watching for and prepared/ing for the day.

The divisiveness of these last 13 years is still growing with no limits in sight. That should be of concern for all peace loving Americans and pollyanna doubters who say it could never happen here.

At what point should we consider your pacifism treason?

Norman,

Finaly someone brings up the “T” word. I would bet that Traitorous and Un-American will soon follow.
David it must be time to roll over and surender.

Norman, about the same time the British called our founding fathers traitors and treasonous. You see, it won’t be the first time a Revoulutionary War will have been fought in this country.

That’s why I know it is possible.

The experiment in London is not very different from what we have already along many toll roads in the U.S. and Europe. It is done for the good reason of regulating traffic. Traffic is one of the biggest problems of our age. This one is not something you need be concerned about. It can be easily solved politically. Simply allow people to buy prepaid tags. The police can track the tag, but they don’t know who owns the tag.

There is a silver lining. The government can’t really process all the information they can gather. It is very boring and unattractive work and for what the government pays such analysts, they don’t always get the brightest bulbs.

It is a general informational problem. You can gather all sorts of information electronically, but a human has to interpret and use it. The fact is that the government just isn’t interested in most of us. I think that might be the biggest insult of all. The CIA isn’t tracking you, because they just don’t care.

If you guys are really worried about surveillance, why do you write on this blog? It is pretty easy to track anyone who uses the Internet and you are volunteering all your opinions for anyone to read. The easiest way to track anyone is by following their computer.

You are already giving the authorities hundreds of times more access to your private lives than they can get by tracking your car in central London.

Dave, they did not label them traitors because of their pacifism. If our forefathers were pacifists none of this would exist. I am asking you when YOUR pacifism becomes treason. Or are you just waiting for someone else to begin the revolution? Is it really worth whining about?

Excellent point, Jack. The liberals jump around different blogs and forums acting like they are concerned conservatives. If you call them out on their idiocy they start shouting about how Bush is a liar and a traitor and how he is destroying the constitution. They never stop to think about REAL constitutional atrocities like Waco Texas, Elian Gonzales, Roe V Wade, Income tax, Social Security, the FDA, etc. etc. etc. This is not even a domestic issue, and if it were, nobody would have the charlies to do anything about it anyways.

Chops, let’s get to some real issues.

Norman,
Are you calling Chops a liberal in disguise? Let’s talk about paranoia.

It wouldn’t surprise me, seeing that they post him on Yahoo! as a “Conservative” blogger. But, I am willing to give chops the benefit of the doubt.

I was really referring to the people who repsond to the blogs and who post in conservative forums. I can walk down this list of repsonses and point out all of the liberals. They are completely transparent.

I guess everybody had to be new once.

David
This comment is not aimed at you as an individual but to your belief structure. A pacifist professor back in Indiana was asked if he was an absolute pacifist. His response was yes. The interviewer then asked the rhetorical question that if he was witnessing the rape of a family member would he then still be a pacifist? He did not respond. As for a revolution in this country, Our constitution is the greatest document devised my man in the whole history of mankind. One of the amendments provided for the absolute ownership of firearms. This is one of the factors that will keep the wolves away from the revolution door. There are many other dangers that can cause a challenge to our republic. The most notable today is the problem of legislative judges. That is another topic for discussion another time.

Tom,

If Aristotle hadn’t existed where would we be?

http://www.oycf.org/Perspectives/1_083199/politics.htm

“In his famous book The Politics (written between 335 and 323 BC), Aristotle points out that one basic principle of the classical democratic constitution is liberty. To Aristotle, liberty means two things: (1) “ruling and being ruled in turn” and (2) “living as one chooses.” As such, liberty and equality are “inextricably linked.” In fact, the first element of liberty, “ruling and being ruled in turn,” is based on a fundamental conception of equality, which Aristotle labels as “numerical equality” (as opposed to “equality based on merit”). “Numerical equality” means an equal share of the practice of ruling for all, regardless of individual ability, merit or wealth. “Thus understood, equality is the practical basis of liberty. It is also the moral basis of liberty.”

If the Magna Carta hadn’t been written would our Constitution exist?

If the French hadn’t joined us in our Revoulutionary War, would our Constitution exist?

Give it a rest Tom.

Jack said:

The experiment in London is not very different from what we have already along many toll roads in the U.S. and Europe. It is done for the good reason of regulating traffic. Traffic is one of the biggest problems of our age. This one is not something you need be concerned about. It can be easily solved politically. Simply allow people to buy prepaid tags. The police can track the tag, but they don’t know who owns the tag.

My father, who is a well-known professor of transportational engineering said the same thing. However, there are two key differences. With the EZPass and FastLane transponders we have here in the U.S., you can be charged (but again, not identified) from a short distance. The London system would differ by (a) identifying the vehicle and (b) doing it secretly and from a great distance.

Imagine if you had a credit card like that: it could be charged without you knowing it by satellite. If a corporation/government/bank promised that it would only charge you rightly - but you could never unlink it from your accounts - would you want the card? That’s essentially what the London government is asking for: a blank check on our freedom of movement, based on the good faith that they’ll never use it to follow political opponents, unacceptable minorities, suspected enemies, etc.

This is the essence of big government: it gets to the point where democracy cannot rein it in. If you’ve been watching the efforts of the right for the past 20 years, you’ll know that after a while of trying to shrink government, they basically gave up and are shooting for a bunch of consolation prizes.

Chops, it’s not that I disagree with you. There are many ways that Republicans and Democrats have been expanding government in front of our eyes that make me sick at times. This is not one of them.

I think you are forgetting that driving is a privilege and not a right. If our roads and highways were completely unregulated by government, there would be no roads, unsafe vehicles that spill out massive amounts of toxic pollutants and there would be massive chaos to the point where it wouldn’t even be safe to drive. The government has every right to regulate cars and highways as long as taxpayer money is paying for them, and we entrust those whom we give the tax money to use it properly. As long as they are using that money to improve the safety of our roads and vehicles, I am all for it.

We already have vehicle registration, insurance requirements, VIN Number identification, computers in vehicles that track velocity and other sensitive information, cameras on street corners, city cops, county sherrif, state police, DNR, etc. etc. etc. How is this going to make it any easier for big brother to watch over us? Remember you always have the right NOT to drive.

I recognize the dangers in identifying vehicles secretly from a distance, but I still have to trust that our constitution will protect our individual rights if the government takes this technology to an authoritarian extreme.

Should I give up now, or wait until it hurts?

There was crime before. There is crime now. There will be crime in the future. Please, oh please, do not continue to further erode my liberties in the pursuit of eradicating the “bad things” in this world. Alongside my liberties, I will also take the unsavories.

It’s been said before: Give me liberty, or give me death!

Very interesting article, Chops.

David:
“You see, it won’t be the first time a Revolutionary War will have been fought in this country.”

But first people would have to feel and see the threat, wouldn’t they? What seems rather scary about this kind of technology is that no one will necessarily get that sense, that is, until their activity is somehow interpreted as “wrong” by members of an intelligence agency.
I personally try not to be too paranoid, but I also know a few Liberal’s who suspect the neocon’s version of “terrorism” automatically includes their viewpoints, and who are preparing to be J. Edgar Hoover’d at any moment.

“That’s why I know it is possible.”

I wish I knew whether it was still possible — I fear American’s have become terribly complacent. If the abridging of our rights in the Patriot Act(s) doesn’t bother them, and all the unanswered questions surrounding the accuracy and verifiability of our elections don’t upset them much, I truly begin to wonder what could…

Rocky,
LoJack!? — does it look like a lollipop? :^) No really, what is it? I’m getting all these James Bond style images in my head.
Enjoyed the Aristotle post, too. (I like that nerdy stuff)

Adrienne,

LoJack is a car security devise that enables the police to locate a stolen car. Ostensibly the owner tells the police to activate the device and it pinpoints the location. Check it out here.

http://www.lojack.com/lowjack.html

Norman, you forget the life sentence and death row prisoners who have been released by DNA testing. You say you have faith in your Constitution. That is well and good. But, the Constitution does not arrest people, does not plant evidence to convict people, does not wrongfully imprison innocent people depriving them of their lives with their families and their freedom to pursue their goals and happiness. Officials with power do these things. And that is why Chops and I and many, many, many millions of Americans get our shorts in a twist when the government wants even more power watch our every move.

schtaple
“which left are you referring to?”

The left that is trying and slowly getting rid of the 2nd Amendment. The left that brought us the no-knock rule. The left who believes in unfair and excessive taxes. Both sides are guilty friend, its just most people choose sides and only complain about the other side.
It is not only Repubs who vote and agree with the Patriot Acts and other infringements. This one is not left vs. right, both sides are guilty.
And if it were a Dem president, the left would be sitting quietly by as they did in the 90s.

Norm,
I checked out your sight. Have to say that the name fits - Witte - pronounced wit?. Especially liked the ‘links’ page and PETA - laughed outloud.

There are some people in society that should be watched 24/7. At least that’s the way I feel about it.

Jack says:

There is a silver lining. The government can’t really process all the information they can gather. It is very boring and unattractive work and for what the government pays such analysts, they don’t always get the brightest bulbs.

In real life, I’m a professor in something called the Center for Automated Learning and Discovery, at CMU, and my professional comment is: what Jack says is absolutely true, today. But don’t count on it staying true for more long. Our ability to analyze information like this is growing by leaps and bounds - largely driven by government-funded research, much of it from the intelligence community, defense, and homeland defense.

I will have to agree with David and Chops on this one but possibly for different reasons…

My problems with ideas like this are less about the right to privacy as much as the financial ramifications to the citizens…

Some have given the arguments that “if you not breaking the law then you don’t have anything to worry about” and “They may be able to monitor you but they won’t because it’s too much information”. Both are fairly valid statements in the present time.

But what about the future when new technology (faster computers, intelligent software that can better sort the gathered information automatically, etc…) allows them to begin using this information on all of us who were comfortable thinking that we wouldn’t be effected because we are one of the law abiding masses.

In California they are already testing the waters on a bill that would track and tax you by the miles you drive instead of (or more than likely in addition to) the tax you already paid for the gasoline you purchased. This is said to “make up for” the loss that they are receiving in tax revenues from hybrid cars. Makes buying that hybrid a little less attractive does it not?

The problem is that once core systems like these are in place we have no way of knowing how far the government will try and push them.

While I do understand and to some extent believe in the fact that we can control them by using our power of the vote, the problem still exists because most people will not react until the problem hits them in the face (or more likely the pocket book). History has shown that virtually all “programs†that are started by the federal government (even those with good intentions) that result in additional revenue being generated will generally always become inflated and abused to fund other areas of government, eventually getting so entwined that it takes a huge undertaking and uproar from the voters to get them “reformedâ€. IMHO It is far easier to try and stop things like this before they start.

Brad
Doing it in Oregon also.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/cgi-bin/PrintStory.pl?document_id=2001972174&zsection_id=2001780260&slug=mileagetax05m&date=20040705

Knowing where you are at all times. But hey, no problem if your not doing anything wrong. Sheesh!
Whats next?
We have to stop at a “checkpoint” and PROVE we’re NOT guilty?
Or, the govt will have the power to search your property without you even knowing about it or without a search warrant?
Oh yeah, its already like that NOW.

But hey, we’re just conspiracy nuts aren’t we. It’s all good.

Sorry about that.
I must have missed something in the link. Here it is.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/cgi-bin/PrintStory.pl?document_id=2001972174&zsection_id=2001780260&slug=mileagetax05m&date=20040705

kctim:

“which left are you referring to?”

The left that is trying and slowly getting rid of the 2nd Amendment.

No, the left that read the 2nd Amendment in its entirely, including the part about the well-regulated militia.

Rocky
Sorry for the late response. Just got out of bed. The Magna Charta and Frence comments are rhetorical. As history has recorded it the answer is no. But if the answer then would have been no, then also maybe there would have been something or someone else to to the work. I’m not sure what you mean by giving it a rest. My comments were to assure that there are some things in place that make it harder for someone to step in and commit people to a cause or purpose for a revolution. The politicians in Washington and in our state capitols are as close as we are coming to that. Laws are enacted daily that put a crimp into our constitutional way of living. One example is that the constitution provides for the Senate to do a vote on nominations that the executive branch presents to them. They are to do what they call the up and down vote. Or in other words vote for or against. Its just that simple. They are not to filibuster nominations. They can filibuster legislation and that is constitutional. Whether you agree with the judicial nominee and their postition is something else. There is to be no litmus test. But back to the basics. The government in Washington and the states have so many unconstitutional things going on that it would be a monsterous project to correct it all.

Rocky,

Lojack is very scary. They sound easy to plant, the signal is totally inaudible — and state law enforcement is in charge of the database — which means it is possible that they could already be tracking anyone they decided to go after.
Someone really ought to invent a Lojack detector.

Adrienne

I am sure the car thieves are working on one.

Et al

I don’t worry so much about privacy because I am a boring person The government knows more about me than I know about myself. Big deal.

I think people are attracted to paranoia because it makes them feel important. The Communist Student Youth Brigade leader who has to make ends meet by working at Pizza Hut likes to think she is the subject of FBI surveillance. Otherwise, she is just another Pizza Hut worker, at least until after the revolution. I remember talking to a Russian author who had defected from the Soviet Union. He was not happy in the U.S. “In Soviet Union,” he lamented, “at least KGB read my work. Now nobody does.”

Jack:
“I am sure the car thieves are working on one.”

No doubt you’re right. But then we know that fighting for our liberty in the past has often taken all kinds…

“I don’t worry so much about privacy because I am a boring person”

Hmm. Does this mean we should all be boring so that we don’t have to worry?

“The government knows more about me than I know about myself. Big deal.”

It means nothing until they decide to use it against you.

“I think people are attracted to paranoia because it makes them feel important.”

Maybe, maybe not. I think there is a least some reason to be concerned. After all, Rush and Faux News considers anyone who believes in global warming to be one eyeblink away from “environmental terrorist”.

Thanks Dawn, it’s pronounced Witty.

The Government has long been able to get information on anyone they wanted. The new technology just increases the number of people they can gather information about.

For more than 20 years (that I know of) the U.S. government has had in depth files on me and they do another investigation every five years. It troubles me not at all. I have confidence in the safeguards in our procedures and our constitution. On that we have to rely, because there is nothing else. If the government wants to know about you, they can know about you. Actually, their track record is pretty good. They rarely abuse the information they have gathered i.e. they use it for the official and legitimate reasons.

Privacy is great, but there are some things that are not private. For example, I don’t care if you are a current drug user, unless I plan to employ you. Then it becomes my business and if someone wants to hire you to drive a school bus, it becomes everyone’s business. The right to life trumps the right to privacy.

Some of you mention wrongful convictions later overturned by DNA. Those come as results of in depth investigations, not surveillance. As a matter of fact, the new techniques could provide alibis to the innocent.

Anyway, all of you writing on this blog are providing anyone with all kinds of personal information and clues where to find more. Anybody with a computer and just a little investigative talent could write your life story without ever leaving his office.

When you are talking about capabilities - that battle is lost and the war is over. You have to concentrate on protections. The U.S. has a robust system for protecting the innocent.

“The U.S. has a robust system for protecting the innocent.”

Do you mean civil liberties unions, for instance?

Tom,

My point was that there is more than one. “Worlds Greatest Document Ever”. To state so makes you look uniformed at best.

Since the House Un-American Activities hearings in the fifties, America has become a much weirder place. The government in this country has gone out of it’s way to turn us against each other. We are all now looking out for anything “suspicious”.

One by one our rights and freedoms are being stripped away, but we shouldn’t worry because we have a Constitution to protect us.

Franklin said that we should hang together, or we will surely hang separately.

Adrienne

I don’t like most of what the ACLU does, but I recognize that sometimes what they do has value,so yes. The ACLU is part of the robust American defense of the innocent.

schtaple,
The reason the left opposes the Patroit Act is because they didn’t think of it.
The real reason to oppose it is because it gives government to much power to snoop into our privit lives.
The government though isn’t the only ones that want to track your car. The insurance companies want to be able to so the can raise your rates if you don’t drive exactly like they want you to or you go somplace they don’t like.

I thought some of the new vehicles already have devices - a little black box - on them that tell how fast you were going and other things that insurance companies can use to prove you lie about a wreck being your own fault, so they don’t have to pay.
Technology that ‘keeps us honest’ and saves the insurance companies money?
Cameras on every corner? so when some jerk runs a red light and kills a family of four leaving no witnesses and lies to keep his/her ass out of jail - of course if the jerk gets a good lawyer the film of the wreck can be thrown out.
There are good and bad reasons for ‘big brother’ - and I still flip off the cameras once in a while.
The FBI should NOT be able to make their own warrants to search our homes. They should still have to wake a judge in the middle of the night and give a damn good reason.

Dawn
You must be some kind of nut also. These things don’t exist and even if they do, they are for our own good.

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/internetprivacy/2004-12-27-auto-blackbox_x.htm

a nut?

Joking Dawn.
Many times, those of us who see the negative impact of such things are called conspiracy nuts.
I didn’t mean for it to come across like I was calling YOU personally, a nut.

I realized that .. but I don’t see how what I said makes me a ‘conspiracy nut’.
I guess I was trying to point out another way that our insurance companies can back out of paying a claim.
I recently went through a slightly difficult time getting my vehicle repaired - which was hit while I was in a store - funny thing was … they have the same insurance company as I do. I practically had to beg to get a vehicle to drive because they were trying to say I didn’t need one bad enough.
Also … the insurance had lapsed on the vehicle that hit me - but the guy was ‘important’ enough to pay his premium and have his insurance reinstated to a date before the accident. (They would never have done that for me.)
Next time I go to that store I will see if they have cameras in the parking lot.
I flip the eyes in the sky off for fun. Waiting for the day the FBI knocks on my door to see what I am hiding because I do that.

if the government goes to far, mass rebellion will occur

Not likely; the first thing that a government trying to usurp the freedom of it’s people does is to implement the changes slowly, as happened in the rise of Nazi Germany. Secondly, most people, while content to blab away on the internet or over a cup of coffee, do not have the wherewithall to rise up and resist. This has been continually demonstrated throughout history; even in modern times Americans do not possess the either the “togetherness” (for lack of a better word) or the willingness to make the tough decisions and put themselves and their families at risk to rebel. Dictatorially minded leaders know this and will use it to their advantage. I don’t think we in America could truly say that we’re headed there, but I know a lot of folks do think so.

Jack, Brad makes an excellent point corralary to mine. It bears reflection. You believe the laws and Constitution protect us. But, the reality is, as any policeman, judge, or prison guard knows, laws, rules and the Constitution protect no one. It is those in power with the authority to enforce those laws and rules who protect, or fail to protect any of us.

How is it you are so easily lead to forget that power corrupts. The reason Brad, Chops, I, and many others are concerned is because this type of power will be wielded by human beings, and a percentage of them in any field, will not, at some point, be able to resist the corrupting influence of their power over others.

It is fine to think of it as a game of chance and relax thinking the odds of such corruption of power affecting you is small, which seems to be the heart of your argument. But, as we have seen over these last 30 years, our legal system once heralded as virtually infallible in the movies, on TV, in books and novels, is, and always has been, very fallible. As fallible as the people charged with the power of enforcement. And more fallible in some areas of the country than others.

At a time when when the religious right, for example, exercises more political power every year and moves more members of their ranks into positions of power, there is valid room for large numbers of Americans who see their positions as radical, to be very, very concerned about the potential future abuse of power and its corrupting influence over those with an “us” and “them” mentality. Surveillance of Americans without due process is a concept very much like a ticking time bomb. When abuse does occur, it will be particularly heinous, by virtue of its ability to target innocent Americans whose only crime was voicing alternate points of view.

Dawn,
I’ve heard that new vehciles have “black boxes” but if mine has one it’s well hid.
When the FBI starts kicking doors in to see what you have to hid, the they’ll have already been to my place.

I lived in Netherlands for 5 years. I found it remarkable that any of the police, even the Koninklijke Marechaussee (the Dutch Royal Military Police who have the authority to police even civilians) can and do stop anyone at any time to check the car’s registration, insurance, etc. Anyone can be pulled over for no reason at all. As far as I know it is not abused…

I found the speed and traffic light camaras a real pain while living in England.

Aldous,

You seem to derive great pleasure in relating ANYTHING negative to the President. Would you please offer something of substance to a blog here?

re: Little black boxes in cars.
(1) There are chips used by the engine to maximize fuel economy and engine performance. Coincidently, they use historical driving practice to predict what the engine should do. That includes a record of how fast you drive over some prior hours and can, therefore, tell the police and insurance company what really happened at the accident. I believe the law is that is that data is inadmissable since the ACLU managed to get it ruled as an invasion of privacy. (I might be wrong on that last point).
(2) Many (all?) new cars now come with GPS chips. Anyone with the proper codes can see where you are and where you’re going at any time.

David R., you’re too optimistic, 1984 is closer all the time…(P.S. I liked your equating the NRA with the Aryan Nation)

Robert D., please refer to Godwin’s Law