Democrats & Liberals Archives

America Contradicts Itself, For it Contains Multitudes

Glenn Beck’s response to a Super Bowl Commercial that showed a diverse selection of Americans, and “America the Beautiful” in multiple languages is correct in almost every way, except the way that matters most. He says that one’s reaction to such a commercial can set one apart, that if one doesn’t like the diversity presented, that you won’t feel like you fit in, that you’ll feel like a racist or something. Well, if the shoe fits…

The beauty of this country is in it's capacity to safely contain all the religions, the nationalities, the languages, the traditions and the races of the old world, yet do it with only the slightest fraction of the conflict that we see in other countries.

We don't define ourselves by a language. Yes, most of us are English speakers, but that very word, "English" speaks of the language of another nation entirely. Same thing with French, German, Czech, Italian, etc. Somebody tells you to speak American, they're either ignorant or joking.

We don't define ourselves by a particular race, at least not any longer. America has taken the literal promise of "all men are created equal", and even taken that promise beyond it, so that we now see women as equals in our society. You should read what people once said and thought about what would happen if these people were not treated as second-class citizens, if they had all the same opportunities. Much of it would strike us now as quaint at best, monstrously unfair and untrue at worse.

We don't define ourselves in terms of a national religion. We have no Established, taxpayer supported church, nor any laws meant to outlaw or ban a given faith. Even in the original document, religious tests, that is questions about religion and creed that must be answered a certain way, are not allowed. Owing to that, every flavor of Christianity that has warred, all the kinds of Islam that inflict sectarian violence on each other elsewhere, live in peace here. You can follow any path your heart allows.

Here, all kinds of different political beliefs coexist, even if not all them have the power they wish they had. And they coexist, largely without violence.

Is it some kind of magic? No. It's freedom, and that's a gift I think too many these days deny themselves. If you have a problem with somebody speaking another language on a TV Commercial, or that TV commercial showing a world's worth of different nationalities together, then that is your problem. It's not a problem for our country, because our country's done this for centuries now without any problem becoming great enough to destroy it. In fact, the nation we live in today would be unrecognizable, and our language much different, if we didn't have such a rich tradition of immigration.

Once, people feared that the immigrants in question would undermine the nation. Now they're integral to it.

You don't have to like the way people live their lives, but freedom means you don't have to care, for the most part. Every time I hear somebody talking fearfully about somebody imposing Sharia law in this country, I feel like calling them an idiot. "Don't you know that would be a direct violation of the Establishment Clause, if not the other part as well?" I feel like saying. We don't have to care whether somebody wants their meat halal or kosher, or whatever, because we don't have to forgo our bacon because they wish to themselves.

We also don't have to really care about other people's sex lives, or religious lives. That is a private choice, for the most part. I don't particularly care for or understand S&M, or people prancing around like they're ponies. But I don't have to. I don't believe in Islam, and I'd have to respectfully disagree about Shinto and Buddhism. But that doesn't obligate me to do anything about it, to safeguard my Christianity. Now some get worried about whether their children will follow their example, and view the decentralization of Christianity in our culture with paranoia and alarm.

I'd say don't center your faith life on your fears. Fear, I think, is the number one way through which people twist their religion into something unrecognizable, given the peace that religions claim to bring. They get so frightened and angry about the outside world's influence that they fail to cultivate their own on honest terms. Ironically, I think this is part of what has strained my generation's faith, made atheism, agnosticism and a casual attitude about religion fashionable again, after years of growing piety and spirituality.

The use of authority to try and impose religion tends to backfire, I believe, both when it's employed, and when it's relaxed. Look at Europe. For years, legal authority was put behind the church, and to some extent it still is. But as religious authority and state authority combined, the tendency for political authority to fall to scandal and disgrace, and the tendency for Religious authority to overplay its hand when the support of the state, and the politicians are available to it weakens people's faith in those religious institutions. We can see a milder version of this in our nation, as the Millennials abandoned conservative religion Pope Francis' new positions are probably not an accident. He gets that there's been a loss of faith in the institutions, as sanctimonious involvement in political issues combined with institutional butt-covering with the molestation scandals to create the image of a church that cared less about the wonderful things in the gospel (Things I had to find out for myself before the faith made sense), and more about itself as an institution bossing around people in their lives.

Conservative Christianity in other circles hasn't done much better. After years of raining on the parade of liberal church and synagogue goers, and those who have no such faith at all, a number of leaders in these sects have turned up doing some pretty sordid things. My segment of my generation can remember the Televangelist scandals of the 1980's, but they are far from the first examples of hypocrisy.

Freedom means that nobody has to overlook that hypocrisy, nor stick with a church that is not living up to its principles. You might think you or your movement are essential, but you can't force anybody to agree in this country.

That scares some people, especially people who have invested world-saving ambitions in their efforts. If you're trying to save the world, the logic goes, what are the other guys trying to do?

The Conservative movement in this country has succeeded in creating deep divisions. Glenn Beck admitted that he played a part in some during the height of his fame and influence. In general, it's been their way to keep people out of my party's hands. Trick is, many of the things they promise, such as restoring Christianity as a cultural foundation in America, are things they can't deliver on, thanks to our constitutional rights. That, or people are too used to things being a certain way. I mean, whatever battles the Republicans are trying to win about Birth Control were lost decades ago, and many women seeing the Republicans trying to rationalized their opposition can only shake their heads at how behind the times they are.

Regardless, people keep on rewarding them for promising to do these things.

Then you have the whole matter of political correctness. The long and short of it is, we started out a nation where women were little better than the property of men, where many blacks were the property of those same men, and where much of the immigration that would mix up the ancestry of the millions of Americans today had not yet occurred. We took quite a long time to face up to the gravity of what we did to the Native Americans and with slavery, and the consequences which are still unfolding.

Now, as a writer and an observer of human nature, I find that even those who benefit from that shift in the language don't strictly police themselves. Few do. People like to have fun, and socially speaking we tend to be more relaxed around friends. That's the thing to point out, I would say, when people complain that political correctness is being applied too much.

Simply put, a lot of what's done that we label political correctness is about adjusting the language to suit a culture where the male population is no longer the predominant population of breadwinners, where whites no longer hold the unquestioned majority of power, and where prayer and ceremony with obvious Christian bias have been pruned back. They think that's a problem.

Things have changed, though. The workplace has changed. it's not the Mad Men world anymore. It's one thing to make a bawdy joke in front of a bunch of other guys, or subtly grope your girlfriend or wife when you're having dinner with her at home. But making such jokes in front of your female co-worker, or copping a feel? No sir, that's not going to get tolerated. Women no longer have to take it. They no longer have to accept an unwelcome advance like that, because they're no longer so powerless that they must.

A great number of groups that once did not have power, now do. For some, that means trying to mount an effort to take back that power, fight back against them. Can I be honest, though? They're not terribly sympathetic. From the Men's Rights groups who publically ridicule women who come forward claiming rape, to the White Pride groups who seem to think defending the one group that had unmatched dominion of this country for three quarters of its history, to the folks who talk about the sanctity of marriage, even with divorce separating many more young couples than the fact that a LGBT couple might have used the chapel before them, their happiness seems tied to reinforcing the supremacy of one particular group of Americans from days gone by, rather than adjusting to the simple fact that they have to watch their mouths and their behavior a little bit more, as any of us would have the common sense to do if we were in mixed company, and didn't know everybody's background.

I know it can be a pain in the ass, but then for me, a lot of social rules and things like that are a pain in the ass. Nonetheless, I do my best to try and follow most of them, because, first and foremost, people like being given respect, and tend to give it in return, and second, it helps me avoid a lot of trouble that I don't care to have in my life.

Too much rage against political correctness has led to a culture where Conservatives like Glenn Beck can't seem to figure out why their comments are drawing backlash. Mark William's Massa Letter was obviously made by a man who was oblivious to just how awful it was.

We can say the same about Tod Akin's legitimate rape comment. This was a comment made by somebody who either didn't think through the implications of what they said, or did and came to the conclusion that he was right to make that implication.

I think what Republicans and Conservatives are missing out on, because they're so intent on defying PC, is that social adjustment that would allow people to be more comfortable with less PC. If they were to concede some of that fight for dominance in the culture, act more like partners in the whole thing, They'd be able to be more relaxed. Instead, because they've refused to move on with the times, They're stuck either having to be super-careful, or alienating people left and right.

Thus this reaction to the commercial. There is nothing really offensive in that commercial if you are a mature enough citizen to expect that not everybody belongs to your race or religion, or speaks English. It's a patriotic message to be sure, one consistent with America's welcoming embrace of the world within its own borders, the melting pot. America contains multitudes, to paraphrase Walt Whitman, so it contradicts itself, and out of that contradiction filters out a culture marvelous, complicated, and to a great extent an original construction of it's people.

We are an empire not so much of land or language, of religion or race, but of experience. Being an American can and should mean that you walk your own path. Let others walk to the beat of their own drummer, speak with their own tongue, worship with their own faith, and see the individual in them, in their strengths and their weakness. You have the freedom to do the same, and to ask others to follow you of their own free will.

Posted by Stephen Daugherty at February 4, 2014 6:36 PM
Comments
Comment #376064

English is the language of the U.S. It is the language of commerce, science, education and travel. People around the world are clamoring to learn English. It is impossible to be a truly successful scientist w/o knowledge of English. English is the future. We need not worry about immigrants speaking English. The ones that will be successful will learn English and their progeny will gradually forget their local languages.

The bottom line is that it is hard to learn and maintain a second language and there are very few truly multilingual people. I have met a few who are; I have met many more who think they are but are not up to standard. English is the world’s most useful language. Those who have the chance to learn it and don’t are stupid. It is their choice to remain poor and unconnected. Those who don’t have the chance will remain ignorant. It is the indispensable language.

Posted by: CJ at February 4, 2014 4:58 PM
Comment #376065

Is sure has taken Daugherty a long time to understand what most of us already know and practice. Welcome to humanity SD.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 4, 2014 5:05 PM
Comment #376066

America is a song from the heart and is sung in the language that is in your heart. Since many of us come from different countries we bring our language with us but we keep the reason we came in our heart.

This country will not be a good place for any of us to live in unless we make it a good place for all of us to live in. ~Theodore Roosevelt

Posted by: Speak4all at February 4, 2014 5:29 PM
Comment #376067

This has to be the lamest excuse for a controversy yet.

Yeah, Jack, people around the world are learning to speak English. When I was in Bejing in 1995 I learned that there is a park there where the residents go to speak English only.
Are we suprised?

Coke is found in the furthest reaches of the globe. It was comforting that I could find a taste of home everywhere I traveled, though I found the Coke product in Mexio superior to that of America.

The International Business Times reported on January 30th that;
“According to the NFL, FOX’s broadcast will reach 198 countries and territories in more than 25 languages.”

Perhaps Beck and the other conservatives forgot this is a drink popular around the world.

As for the controversy that Oh my gosh there were gays represented in the commercial, perhaps it’s not common knowledge that Katharine Lee Bates, the author of the poem that is the lyric of the song, lived it what was known as a “Boston Marriage” with Katharine Coman for 25 years.

That the music was written by a church organist is immaterial. “America the Beautiful” is a great piece of music no matter what language it is sung in, and no matter who sings it.

Does the fact the music of “The Star Spangled Banner” was an English drinking song diminish it’s greatness?

Anyone that was offended by this commercial needs to unwind their panties and get over it.

This is much ado about nothing.

Rocky

Posted by: Rocky Marks at February 4, 2014 6:04 PM
Comment #376068

Glen Beck is an evangelical conspiracy theorist. You are actually getting upset over what this moron said? Like the handful of race hustlers who try to hang on to relevancy, Beck doesn’t matter.

Posted by: Kevin L. Lagola at February 4, 2014 7:26 PM
Comment #376069

C&J-
One thing to keep in mind is that it’s fairly difficult to learn a new language once you’re past a certain age, especially if it’s not from your language group. Take Mandarin Chinese, for instance. It shares neither the tense structure, nor any real connection word-wise with the Indo-European languages. Try wrapping your head around words meaning different things, depending on whether you use a rising or falling tone!

It is useful to try and become multilingual, but at this point, with our current business policies, it’s not going to be America’s English people have to learn, but Chinese, or some other nation’s language.

America is not special because it’s people are somehow magically different from the rest of the world. Our people ARE the people from the rest of the world. What changes them, what made America great in the past, and what gives them the chance to be great in the future is that they are free to ask questions for themselves. Many German Physicists came to our shores at a time when German was the lingua franca of Physics. Why? Because people got some lethally odd ideas about Jews in Europe.

Here, our problem is that we think patriotism makes up for a lack of effort and investment here at home. We think we can simply believe this country into glory, like folks clapping to resurrect tinkerbell. We’ve promoted a culture that rests on the laurels of our past, rather than constructing our future.

Royal Flush-
This hasn’t just become my attitude. It was always my attitude, from before I even started posting on this site.

Kevin L. Lagola-
I’m sorry to inform you, but way too many of your Conservative friends out there are thinking the same way. There is a cost for indulging xenophobes and bigots, and this is it: a horrifying divergence of perspective that they can’t even seem to understand the problem with. You let Glenn Beck and the like gain a following with you, because he was a useful firebrand for drumming up opposition against Obama and the new Progressives.

But the cost of that is that people think they represent a considerable constituency in the GOP. Something which may not be wrong, at this point.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at February 5, 2014 7:59 AM
Comment #376070

Daugherty wrote…”The use of authority to try and impose religion tends to backfire…”

Indeed it does. And so does the use of authority to subscribe to government edicts regarding our personal health insurance.

http://spectator.org/articles/57659/victims-common-good

“…the theoretical foundation of the Obama presidency. The stimulus would borrow from a wealthier future generation to energize the economy. Obamacare would take resources from the health insurance companies and give them to the uninsured. Repealing part of the Bush tax cuts would force the rich to “pay their fair share” for programs to help the poor. The government, having defined the common good, then gets to enforce it on its own terms. It’s a nice gig, if you can get it.

The problem is, it’s spectacularly backfiring. Take yesterday’s report from the Congressional Budget Office. The above-the-fold headline was that the CBO is predicting a lower deficit for 2014 than it had last year. But the real news is that the accounting agency is increasing its projection of how many full-time employees Obamacare will eliminate from the workforce—by a long shot. The CBO had previously calculated the health law would kill about 800,000 jobs by 2024; now they’re estimating 2.5 million.

Obamacare, which was supposed to serve the economically vulnerable, is instead shrinking the workforce and socking the middle class in the solar plexus. The top one tenth might get smacked too, but they can easily absorb the damage. And it’s not CEOs who are seeing their jobs shredded by new Obamacare regulations; it’s Applebee’s waitresses and Papa John’s delivery guys.”

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 5, 2014 12:52 PM
Comment #376071

Obama and the left has promised America wealth and prosperity through debt. In the land of make-believe populated by many on the left, endless debt never needs to be repaid except in some distant and unexplained future. Their philosophy is to spend today and let tomorrow take care of itself.

“…the latest CBO report projects the deficit will shrink in 2014 and 2015, though it will increase steadily after that. But the long-term budget picture is far more unsettling. By 2024, Social Security outlays alone will reach $1.5 trillion. Health care spending, including Medicare and Medicaid, will hit $1.8 trillion. Other handouts will cost an additional $351 billion. Combined, that’s enough to consume the federal budget, and then some.

All of that will result in $7.3 trillion in deficits over the next 10 years and an astonishing $27 trillion in national debt, according to the CBO.”

http://spectator.org/articles/57659/victims-common-good

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 5, 2014 1:01 PM
Comment #376072

Paul Ryan Fact-Checks Republicans On Obamacare Job ‘Costs’

Posted by: Speak4all at February 5, 2014 3:42 PM
Comment #376073

Thanks for the link Speak. Isn’t it just great that fewer people will be working; or looking for work as a result of obamacare? I can’t put my finger on any statements by obama or the left that this was an expected or desirable benefit of the ACA, can you? obama was just to preoccupied telling us that we could keep our insurance and doctors if we wished that he forgot to brag about more people leaving the work force.

As these millions quit work and no longer are counted among the unemployed, the employment participation rate will decrease. As that happens, the official unemployment rate will go down and the left will celebrate the success of liberal policies.

Ain’t it great…fewer Americans employed will give the dems a chance to brag about lower unemployment?

Taken from the same playbook, the left brags that spending trillions in additional debt is saving the nation from financial ruin? Why, if we just went into debt deep enough we would be solvent. Those damn R’s and C’s just don’t have a working plan to help the nation.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 5, 2014 4:11 PM
Comment #376074

Obviously you did not read the link. I will post a small excerpt:

Ryan and Elmendorf combined to explain that Obamacare would lead to a decrease in the number of hours worked by up to 2 percent in 2024. Most of that drop, the CBO said, would be the result of Americans choosing not to work, for various reasons, but not because employers would want to hire fewer workers on account of the law. Translate those lost hours into full-time employment and it equals up to 2.5 million jobs by 2024. But that’s not the same as jobs being cut.

“Just to understand, it is not that employers are laying people off,” Ryan said.

“That is right,” Elmendorf said.

No one is losing their jobs, in fact the hours that people do not work because they are forced to just to get health care coverage will get picked up by people either looking for jobs or wanting to work more hours.

Your response is typical of the cranial rectal feedback loop of the conservatives today. Good news is it can be cured with correct information. Good luck with that.

Posted by: Speak4all at February 5, 2014 4:28 PM
Comment #376075

I SAY LET’S NOT ENCOURAGE FOREIGNERS TO COME HERE, THEY ONLY BRING TROUBLE IN UNDERSTANDING WHAT WE ARE ABOUT HERE.

NO MORE: Gingrich’s, Pelosi’s, Giulianni’s, Mafias, Kerry’s, Russian syndicates, Kennedy’s, Fire Island lezzies, Canadian “Queer as folkers”, Haughty Hindus, and so on.

You like foreigners only because you actually don’t know any—THEY ARE ALL FRICKIN’ COMMUNISTS AND FASCISTO OUT THERE!

Get to know some foreigners first, you won’t want them here either they are all Fascista a-holes.

What’s that 1950’s song? Dream-Dream-Dream

YOU LIBBIES ARE DREAMIN’ KID. There are no good people out there, all of them are commie infused wierdos and that’s it. It’s not in the brochure but that all that is out there on this earth—people that gulagged their whole nations—sorrie Libbies you are wrong here too.

Posted by: simpleheaded at February 5, 2014 4:33 PM
Comment #376076

Speak give this as a quote from the article he posted…”No one is losing their jobs, in fact the hours that people do not work because they are forced to just to get health care coverage will get picked up by people either looking for jobs or wanting to work more hours.”

The actual quote from the link stated; “Translate those lost hours into full-time employment and it equals up to 2.5 million jobs by 2024. But that’s not the same as jobs being cut.”

“Just to understand, it is not that employers are laying people off,” Ryan said.”

My poor illiterate friend confuses this quote to mean that the lost hours will be filled by full time employees and it doesn’t mean that at all.

Jobs aren’t being cut, people will quit because of various reasons. And all those who stop working would add up to 2.5 million jobs by 2024

I suggest that Speak remove his foot from his mouth to avoid brain death due to suffocation.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 5, 2014 5:13 PM
Comment #376077

Please, your obfuscation on anything to do with President Obama has been evident in the past. Paul Ryan himself in the linked article wanted to make clear that no one is losing their job over this (he wants to appear sane now that he is thinking about running for President in 2016). My foot is not in my mouth but I suggest you pull your head out of you know where if you can’t understand that losing jobs is not the same as not working as much because you don’t have to just to get health care coverage.

Oh and how did a posting about the song America get turned into another one of your rants about Obama bad, Obamacare bad, Obama bad, bad, bad. Get a life.

Posted by: Speak4all at February 5, 2014 5:21 PM
Comment #376078

Speaks writes; “…you can’t understand that losing jobs is not the same as not working as much because you don’t have to just to get health care coverage.”

Really? Fewer people working, or looking for work reduces the employment participation rate and this in turn lowers the unemployment rate. OH…WOW…obama has reduced unemployment because fewer people are working or looking for work. What a concept.

The CBO is not talking about people “not working as much”, but rather, those people not working at all.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 5, 2014 6:04 PM
Comment #376079

Speak4all,

If Royal Flush won’t believe Paul Ryan, he won’t believe you.

I could add the Factcheck article debunking the claims but he wouldn’t believe that also. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker

Posted by: Rich at February 5, 2014 7:54 PM
Comment #376080

In actuality the CBO report says that Obamacare will shrink the work force by 2 million FULL TIME workers{link cbsnews.com/news/obamacare-will}. This meaning more people will choose to work less hours thus shrinking the work force of FULL time workers.

Posted by: Rich KAPitan at February 5, 2014 8:30 PM
Comment #376082

I find it an interesting study to watch the partisan hacks, from both sides, both do their best to misunderstand and misrepresent what is being stated and what the impact will be. Its no wonder things are they way they are when this is the kind of political discourse both sides engage in. :/

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 6, 2014 8:59 AM
Comment #376083

The CBO report does not take into account the offsetting economic benefit of a healthier work force due to increased availability of health care for low income workers. It is well known that chronic health problems are a major and equivalent drain on hours worked (absenteeism) and economic lose. http://www.milkeninstitute.org/

In addition, the disincentive for work hours due to the discreet cutoffs for subsides is one of those fixable problems with Obamacare. A more continuous % reimbursement rate for subsides rather than the discreet cutoffs would go a long way to reducing any perverse disincentives. But, that would require good faith on the part of critics.

Posted by: Rich at February 6, 2014 9:06 AM
Comment #376084

Rich, part of that reason is that there is nothing in the law that would ensure that workers are more healthier in any way. Preventative medicine is actually more costly and provides little benefit, especially to workers who are already employed and have those healthcare benefits anyway.

The healthcare law was touted by Obama and Pelosi as a jobs bill that would create millions of jobs and lower the deficit. Both of those were wildly wrong, as many opponents of the law stated at the time. In addition, we now have disincentives for people to work.

People think that the result would be someone else taking those jobs, but there are already millions of jobs out there that go unfilled every day. The problem is they are either jobs that people don’t want to do because they feel that they are beneath them OR they are jobs that few people are actually qualified to do. The result is that businesses cannot expand because they are unable to get those jobs filled.

This will just make that problem worse.

The bigger problem is that government thinks it can fix a problem that it itself creates, often leading to more problems that they then think they can fix.

For years the Democrats have been labelled as wanting to provide cradle to grave dependency. They have shrugged that accusation off, but their defense of this report just bolsters that perception. Instead of seeing the facts as they are and recognizing the long term problem that is being created, the instinct is to defend short term for fewer losses in 2014 and ultimately the law itself being repealed.

As I said, a prime example of how things shouldn’t be done.

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 6, 2014 9:29 AM
Comment #376085

BTW, it benefits me greatly that there is less and less qualified competition in my work area. But this is not a good thing for the country as a whole. So yeah, while I benefit with being able to obtain a higher pay for my experience and developed skills though a hard work ethic, it just helps create the whole inequity problem that people who argue for this law say they are against.

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 6, 2014 9:32 AM
Comment #376086

Todays ‘liberals’ contradict liberalism.
You rant about respecting foreign cultures, but label all Americans who respect their own culture as “xenophobes and bigots.” You rant about people pushing their religious morals onto you, but you use government to push your morals onto everybody. You rant about profiling, but you automatically assume the white guy is guilty in some way.

You guys wouldn’t know the meaning of respect or tolerance if it bit you in the ass.

Fact is, you guys know you don’t have majority support for your policies, so you:

1 - separate people into different groups so you can pander to them as a group, instead of as fellow Americans.

2 - associate your opponents with the extremes. Moderate positions such as lower taxes now makes one a racist, sexist etc… Support of the 2nd Amendment now makes one a murder supporting racist gun nut. Repeating the words of our founders now makes one a radical extremist.

Americans aren’t becoming more intolerant with each other, they are just sick and tired with the way you guys are trying to redefine the nation.

Posted by: kctim at February 6, 2014 11:09 AM
Comment #376087

America the Beautiful poem did have several other iterations before being published in 1893, I wonder if they provoke the same responses as the multi-language version of the song does. Here are some examples:

“America! America! God mend thine every flaw, Confirm thy soul in self-control, Thy liberty in law! “

“America! America! God shed his grace on thee. Till selfish gain no longer stain The banner of the free! “

“America! America! God shed his grace on thee. Till nobler men keep once again. Thy whiter jubilee!”

Posted by: Speak4all at February 6, 2014 11:15 AM
Comment #376090

kctim,

“You rant about respecting foreign cultures, but label all Americans who respect their own culture as “xenophobes and bigots.””

Sorry pal but my calling someone a moron does not in any way actually stop them from being a moron.

The First Amendment swings both ways, and unless we start jailing morons, their rights to speak their mind, no matter how wrong they are, is still secure.

“Support of the 2nd Amendment now makes one a murder supporting racist gun nut.”

The Second Amendment does not usurp the First.

The far right constantly bitches about how people TALK about their rights, yet they still retain them.

Amazing how that works.

Rocky

Posted by: Rocky Marks at February 6, 2014 2:04 PM
Comment #376091

Thanks for the link Rich which simply enhances what I wrote. Here’s a quote from the link…

“The Pinocchio Test

The Fact Checker takes no position on the implications of the CBO’s analysis. Some might believe that the overall impact of the health law on employment is bad because it would be encouraging people — some 2.3 million – not to work. Indeed, the decline in the workforce participation rate has been of concern to economists, as the baby boom generation leaves the work force, and the health-care law appears to exacerbate that trend.

Moreover, the argument could go, this would hurt the nation’s budget because 2.3 million fewer people will pay taxes on their earnings. That’s certainly an intellectually solid argument — though others might counter that universal health care is worth a reduction in overall employment”

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 6, 2014 2:44 PM
Comment #376092

Rocky,

Calling someone a moron isn’t the same as labeling somebody a racist, sexist, homophobe etc… for saying something you disagree with.

And if you look at my post, I didn’t mention anything about rights. I am addressing the fact that leftists are constantly redefining what constitutes racism, sexism, hate etc…, solely for political gain.

What’s amazing is how some who claim to be Americans don’t see, or care, about the rights they have and are losing.

Posted by: kctim at February 6, 2014 2:48 PM
Comment #376094

The Senate failed to pass a bill calling for additional benefits for the long-term unemployed. Here was one way they proposed to pay for it.

“The bill’s cost would have been offset through “pension smoothing,” or allowing companies to make smaller contributions to employee pensions, thus earning higher profits and giving the government more tax revenue.”

Can anyone imagine anything more prejudicial and harmful to working Americans?

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 6, 2014 3:35 PM
Comment #376095

kctim,

“I am addressing the fact that leftists are constantly redefining what constitutes racism, sexism, hate etc…, solely for political gain.”

Really?

As I write this I am looking out my office window out onto the street I live on. I don’t see the thought police marching down my street to break in my door.

Rightists are also constantly redifining what constitutes socialism, et al, for their own political gain.

It’s a constant struggle, but these are just words, you know, sticks and stones.

This thread started out as a rant about a Coca Cola commercial and has disolved into the same baloney all of the threads on this site become.

Right good, left bad, left good, right bad. It is truly tedious, and hardly worth the time.

I often wonder about intelligent life on other planets, because I surely don’t see much intelligent life here.

Rocky

Posted by: Rocky Marks at February 6, 2014 3:41 PM
Comment #376098

This whole controversy has me thinking it might be interesting to hear the National Anthem sung in a different language other than English. I am sure that no one’s head would explode but it might be interesting to hear something like that and given the outcry from the Coke advertisement I am sure it would bring some people to a better understanding that our nation is diverse if nothing else. I think I’ve said it before but our country’s greatest strengths could be diversity, adversity, exceptionalism and at times imperfection.

Posted by: Speak4all at February 6, 2014 4:03 PM
Comment #376099

Whyyyyy do most foreigners come here and immediately become the civil libertarian hating right wing? Because they were (hence are) extremists, right? Look at what is happening in their home countries, aaaand secondly what role they played in that happening, of which we may never really know.

These people hate our civil liberties here, period.

Aaaand these people are desirables? They believe we have no rights and so do their dumb kids, and their kids and so on. Hell might be genetic and their nations are weirdo hells.

Posted by: simpleheaded at February 6, 2014 4:13 PM
Comment #376100

Rocky

The thread is about the left being po’d over some people objecting to the commercial. But rather than the left simply respecting and saying people have the right to object to the commercial, as you seem to believe they should, they have to throw around the “xenophobes and bigots” labels.

Blind group think is not a sign of intelligence my friend.

Posted by: kctim at February 6, 2014 4:24 PM
Comment #376102

Rocky, I offered factual rebuttal…perhaps you didn’t notice.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 6, 2014 4:40 PM
Comment #376103

Blind group think is not a sign of intelligence my friend.
Posted by: kctim at February 6, 2014 4:24 PM

Right…neither is being PC.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 6, 2014 4:42 PM
Comment #376106

kctim,

Former Congressman, and Fox News cotributor Allen West stated;
“If we cannot be proud enough as a country to sing “American the Beautiful” in English in a commercial during the Super Bowl, by a company as American as they come — doggone we are on the road to perdition. This was a truly disturbing commercial for me, what say you?”

Brietbart.com followed with;

“…shoving multiculturalism down our throats…”

Excuse me but while I support their right to their opinion, IMHO this is the worst sort of hyperbole and it makes these people look petty and not just a little foolish.

Perdition? Really?

All because of a commercial where “America the Beautiful” was sung in other languages than English.
I would submit that if we were to travel around this country, we would find “Americans” that speak their own kind of English. Words in some states mean something different than they do in others.
In other words “American” English isn’t a homogenized language, and to be offended by a commercial, that was, BTW, beautifuly done, is just lame in my opinion.

Coke is a product that is enjoyed by people speaking many different languages across the world.

As for the “labels”, are the “leftists” not entitled to their opinion as well?

And, OBTW, why is it when those on the right label people it’s considered normal, but when the shoe is on the other foot…

Royal,

“Rocky, I offered factual rebuttal…perhaps you didn’t notice.”

This was your first response to my comments in the entire thread.

Rocky

Posted by: Rocky Marks at February 6, 2014 5:42 PM
Comment #376107

Spent some time in Boston during my service to this country. Took me awhile to get used to some of their differences in language. An example:

Someone who is unfair is a cheater. Pronounced as cheetah to the locals. A big cat that lives in the jungle is a cheetah. Pronounced as cheater to the locals.

Thanks for clarifying the non-response to Royal, I thought I missed something.

Posted by: Speak4all at February 6, 2014 5:51 PM
Comment #376108

This was your first response to my comments in the entire thread.

Rocky

Rocky, I was responding to your statement…

“This thread started out as a rant about a Coca Cola commercial and has disolved into the same baloney all of the threads on this site become.”

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 6, 2014 6:02 PM
Comment #376110

Royal,

“Rocky, I offered factual rebuttal…perhaps you didn’t notice.”

What was that topic again?

BTW Rich’s information wasn’t necessarily wrong either.

Rocky


Posted by: Rocky Marks at February 6, 2014 6:29 PM
Comment #376114

BTW, to address a previous point I made, this is a poll result from the UK that is telling of the Labor party, this would most likely be similar in the US Democrat Party…

As can be seen, just over over half of UKIP and Liberal Democrat supporters and a little over 70 percent of Conservative supporters believe that the top rate of income tax should not be raised to 50 percent if doing so would not increase government revenue.

Shockingly, almost 70 percent of Labour Party supporters believe that it is worth raising the tax rate for the wealthy, even if doing so would not raise more money for the government.

The graph above is among the best illustrations of how the “tax the rich” mentality of many Labour Party supporters has little to do with a desire to grow government revenue and a lot to do with taking money from the wealthy just for the sake of doing so.

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 6, 2014 8:41 PM
Comment #376128

Rocky

WEST found the commercial “disturbing.” BRIETBART.COM found it “petty and a little foolish.”
That is no reason to label them and everybody else on the right as “xenophobes and bigots.”

“All because of a commercial where “America the Beautiful” was sung in other languages than English.”

I submit that it goes much deeper than that. We are a proud, exceptional nation. We have our own language, our own way of life, our own cultural. But for past few decades or so, we have been told we aren’t exceptional and that we don’t really have our own culture, or that if we do have one, it comes in second to all others.
IMO, people are saying they have been pushed far enough.

“In other words “American” English isn’t a homogenized language, and to be offended by a commercial, that was, BTW, beautifuly done, is just lame in my opinion.”

That’s just it, Rocky. You say it is lame, just words, sticks and stones and all that jazz, but you are NOT calling everybody “xenophobes and bigots” in order to push a political agenda.

“Coke is a product that is enjoyed by people speaking many different languages across the world.”

Yep, and I believe the point of this commercial was all about making money.

“As for the “labels”, are the “leftists” not entitled to their opinion as well?”

Of course they are, but those opinions should be based on facts, not politics. Being proud to be an American, of our history, of our culture and our exceptionalism does not make us “xenophobes.” Being against gay-marriage does not mean one “hates” homosexuals. Not supporting illegal immigration does not mean we are “bigots.” Disagreeing with policy does not make us “racists.”

“And, OBTW, why is it when those on the right label people it’s considered normal, but when the shoe is on the other foot…”

Just like with those on the left, it all depends on the label, the reason for it and how it is applied. Let’s be honest though, how often does C&J write a thread calling everybody who disagrees with them a simple-minded bigot who has been brainwashed by MSNBC?

Posted by: kctim at February 7, 2014 10:28 AM
Comment #376131

OMG, the victim complex card. I’m so picked on, leave me alone with my thoughts. I don’t think this country has our own language. I speak English but have no problem with people speaking in the language they choose to.

Still think the ad was a very good example of America’s ability to include people and thought it was very prescient of Coke to use some languages not as familiar as others. Sure they should have had a chorus for every language that could be spoken in America. If they did that the commercial would probably have taken 10 minutes. At $4 million dollars for 30 seconds I think they did a great job.

Posted by: Speak4all at February 7, 2014 11:20 AM
Comment #376140

Requirements for Applying for Citizenship in the United States

You can read, write and speak English.

Have you ever worked with a group of Mexicans? I have. In many places, actually. One thing they have in common is they refuse to speak english. When they are asked what they said in spanish they say it’s none of our business.

This isn’t a one time occurrance. This happens whenever there are groups of Mexicans working together. I have had people who speak spanish overhear Mexicans conspire to get english speaking people fired or to quit so the entire department is speaking spanish.

Given the fact that spanish is the second ranked language spoken in the U.S., what would happen if they decided they were going to start writing laws in spanish? What would english speaking people do when they ask to have the law translated and they say, “No”?


Posted by: Weary Willie at February 7, 2014 2:53 PM
Comment #376141

Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep.

Posted by: Speak4all at February 7, 2014 2:59 PM
Comment #376146

How’s your heart Speakfortheleft?

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 7, 2014 4:13 PM
Comment #376151

Pumping strong, how’s your rationality?

Posted by: Speak4all at February 7, 2014 5:11 PM
Comment #376152

Pretty good, I can rationally read and understand CBO findings…you?

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 7, 2014 5:20 PM
Comment #376153

OK, if I take the time to parse out the numbers but I usually don’t cause I’ve got better things to do. Why can’t you read and understand what Paul Ryan said.

“Just to understand, it is not that employers are laying people off,” Ryan said.

“That is right,” Elmendorf said.

Posted by: Speak4all at February 7, 2014 5:23 PM
Comment #376155

Speak reminds me of the Abbott and Costello baseball routine; “Who’s on First”. He draws conclusions because he fails to understand the terminology.

Paul Ryan is not the CBO. His comments don’t change facts.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 7, 2014 5:46 PM
Comment #376157

Ah, but Elmendorf is. Please try to keep up.

Posted by: Speak4all at February 7, 2014 5:50 PM
Comment #376160

Speak, I know you understand the CBO report is anticipating a loss of 2+ million jobs over a decade due to obamacare. You also understand the employment participation rate and what it means.

You’re a bright guy who simply must defend his views. Keep your views and I will keep to the facts.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 7, 2014 6:37 PM
Comment #376193

Rich, I agree that the FED is to blame for the ills we have endured over the past few decades, but it seems a bit disengenuous to claim that those they were ‘conservative’ actions by the FED. You seem to ignore the fact that Bernanke was renominated by Obama, Clinton renominated Greenspan several times, etc.

I guess you think you are making a partisan point, but in doing so you completely miss the real issue and problem. In addition, what is going to happen now that Yellen has been put into place and is a follower of Greenspan’s conceit?

I would suggest watching Money For Nothing - Inside The Federal Reserve for a very very good documentary on the FED and what the real problems are… They aren’t partisan, they are actually issues shared by both major parties.

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 8, 2014 1:45 PM
Comment #376194

Speak, no one is saying or has said to my knowledge that the CBO said that companies would be laying off anyone. It did state that 2.4 million ‘jobs’, meaning that 4,992,000,000 less hours would be worked by workers as a result of the Obamacare legislation.

That’s almost 5 billion less hours of taxation not collected by the federal government.

The fantasy that those hours would be ‘picked up by others’ is a prime example of why many don’t understand the problem with unemployment in the US today. Right now there are millions of jobs out there going unfilled because people aren’t a) applying for them or b) qualified for them or c) willing to move to where they are, etc… The conceit that people have to think that businesses are right now all fully employed and have no place for new workers is insane.

Worse, the left’s defense of this is just playing into the conservative’s hands because it reinforces the image that the Democratic party has been trying to get away from, a party that is for people working less, contributing less to society and getting more out of it on the backs of those who do work by providing cradle to grave sustenance. It also leads to a GREATER income inequality situation that the left seems to think is an important issue right now. You’ve basically just taken away a key talking point that has been carefully crafted to protect your political butts in the short term.

I say congratulations on that, that takes some hard work to accomplish…

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 8, 2014 1:54 PM
Comment #376196

Rhinehold, thanks for the link to the Fed video.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 8, 2014 2:08 PM
Comment #376198

Royal, no problem, it’s very good and I’ve watched it several times myself. There are interviews with many close to the FED including former chairs and state members. There’s even an interview with Yellen in there that was done before she was nominated…

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 8, 2014 2:28 PM
Comment #376343

Royal Flush-
The projection by the CBO is that people would work fewer hours of their own free will, not that they’d lose their jobs. Those fewer hours would not mean that the companies would need less work, meaning other people would likely get hired or work additional hours, and those people would likely not be working there merely for the healthcare. Given that we have an excess of people out of work, the freeing up of positions for new workers would not be a bad thing.

Also, I would note that if you’re complaining about people leaving the workforce, the Republican’s refusal to extend unemployment benefits has exactly that result. The problem with organizing your rhetoric around propaganda value, is that quite frankly your blind spots on your side are fricking huge. You don’t register the budget busting effects of those policies, the job-killing effect of policies that encourage the shipping of jobs overseas, or of the turmoil your little adventures in debt ceiling hostage taking create. We’d be recovering faster if we didn’t have to help the folks who your people pitched out of work, along with those your economic policies killed the jobs of.

People aren’t being laid off, they’re voluntarily working less, or working elsewhere. If the market forces that had them able to work those jobs or those hours hold true, then other people will benefit.

Also, can I point out that the Baby Boomers are aging out of the Workforce? they’d be going quicker, in fact, if it weren’t for the fact that they got kicked in the nuts a couple times in the last decade on account of your brilliant economic policies.

WaPo didn’t understand what the numbers meant. Fewer hours worked by some people doesn’t equate to fewer worked by all.

Rhinehold-
The rich have gotten extremely naïve. They made a promise: if you let us succeed our way, we’ll cycle back that money into jobs and higher wages.

Not only did this not happen, it NEVER happened. What happened was exactly what we were saying would happen, and exactly what did happen before. The Right and the Libertarians appealed to people’s hopes, people’s yearning to live in a less structured, more seat of the pants society. But instead of creating a system of greater opportunity, greater creativity, they helped create a system where money got funneled to the top, more people got screwed, the middle class got squeezed, and the bloom of creativity got stifled as conglomeration reduced competition, the disasters crippled venture capitalism, and everybody but the richest of the rich got dragged down into their problems.

The free marketers failed to deliver on their promise in an epic and measureable way. Yet, instead of conceding that more and better regulation in key places might be necessary, they instead attack those calling for it as socialists, and do their absolute best to stall any reform. Does this make people trust the system more? No, it makes them despair of it!

That’s what folks like you don’t get. You’ve lost the benefit of the doubt, and the more this crap happens, the more likely that when the reckoning does happen, it will be worse.

The imbalances of the economy, of the fiscal system, of our system in general isn’t an accident. You folks have gotten what you wanted, for the most part. You just don’t recognize the consequences of your actions, your policies for what they are. You’re addicted to the laudanum of ideological righteousness, addicted to the belief that if your policy fits a pre-formed partisan tenet, then it will do good, if not now, then eventually.

In truth, the world can always be different than what we want. Our political beliefs should reflect what our goals are. They shouldn’t reflect the only options we are willing to avail ourselves of. We should even be willing to change our opinions if repeated experience tells us something never works like we want it to.

We can say, “that government which governs least, governs best”, but I think “can govern least” should be that formulation.

When people see the private powers of the world screw things up, their reflex is to ask government to intercede, to take down the crooks and “banksters” If you listen closely, even Tea Partiers and Conservatives are looking down on the rich and the elite at this point. And why not? They screwed up big time, and they don’t seem to be getting their reckoning for that.

What you need to realize is that however well the Wall Street folks stall that reckoning, they haven’t permanently deferred it, and the interest is piling up on that debt they have to public opinion and the benefit of the doubt they squandered. So, some event is going to come along, and start the snowball rolling on putting them in their place once again.

If the rich want minimum supervision, they must present themselves in fact as well as public relations as being trustworthy stewards of our private financial institutions. If they continue to fail at that, people will note their excessive compensation and their Karma Houdini ways, and a greater thirst for their comeuppance will arise. People already want to send much of the financial sector leadership to jail for what happened, so they’re walking through a minefield as it is.

If the Financial sector doesn’t clean up its act, they will see 1933 happen again, one way or another.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at February 11, 2014 1:37 PM
Comment #376344

Sorry Daughy, I will take the CBO report and you can wallow in your fiction.

Posted by: Royal Flush at February 11, 2014 2:04 PM
Comment #376349
The imbalances of the economy, of the fiscal system, of our system in general isn’t an accident.

Actually, it’s not an ‘accident’, but it is the result of unforseen side effects of trying to do too much.

The fact is that what we did in the 1990s are still being played out today. The FED was originally invested with doing one thing. To make sure that there were no runs on banks and stableize the money supply. Their hand in the Great Depression is well known and admitted by them, yet you use that as a warning against ‘free marketing’? That’s such a ludicrious argument that I don’t really know where to begin. To be short, you have shown to have absolutely no understanding of economics, how our system works, who has control over it and who doesn’t and who is at fault when things turn south.

Take the Great Depression for example. The FED which was supposed to keep that from happening. When the stock market first crashed, the NY Fed did what it was supposed to do and loosened the money supply. And it was working, the stock market started to rebound and things were starting to work themselves out. But the FED board wasn’t happy with what the NY FED did and as a result, the money supply was tightened across the country. The result was the Great Depresssion. A combination of tight money supply and onerous tarriffs in place to prevent people from surviving let along thriving.

But that was the one job they had. When things got better, however, the congresses gave them a second job. To keep employment from rising… The problem is, you can’t really do both. As a result was the Great Inflation that took place between the 60s and the last 70s. It wasn’t until Volker took over in 1978 that the ship was started to be righted. It took a recession and interest rates rising to over 20%, but it worked and we had what happened next, the Great Moderation.

But, in 1987 just after Greenspan took over, Black Monday happened. Greenspan engineered a ‘soft landing’, which was all well end good, but it set a new precedent. Not just was the FED to ensure that the banks were taken care of. Not just was the FED to ensure that unemployment stayed low. (both things that are opposite things to each other). Now the FED had taken charge to make sure the STOCK MARKET was kept intact… That is a lot to put on their plate, all at odds with each other.

The result was the stock bubble of the 1990s that burst all over the place in early 2000. Worse yet, when LTCM went under, the FED bailed them, and Bear Sterns, out of their bad behavior. The FED was telling everyone ‘hey, if you screw up, we’ll be here to save you’.

The result was the implementation of Moral Hazard. In a nutshell, wall street was told ‘do what you want, if you screw up we’ll clean it up’. So of course they started doing stupid things! That was called the Greenspan Put.

Couple that with insanely low interest rates, to the point that borrowing money for 2 years was free, due to inflation, and companies that used to make money selling things started making money lending free money for a profit. GM, GE, AIG, etc all got into the game. The result was the housing bubble…

The result of trying to manipulate the market so there are never any down times ended up with rich people getting insanely rich…

But don’t try to tell me that is what Libertarians wanted, it wasn’t. With Moral Hazard in play, the market isn’t free. With that much manipulation of the market, the market isn’t free. When money is FREE, you can’t have capitalism. In effect, we haven’t had capitalism for decades…

That’s the sad story of Greenspan, who was a follower or Ayn Rand, who turned 180 degrees on those beliefs because, well, he wanted to be liked. He started to believe the hype that he could do now wrong. At one time in the late 1990s (1998 I think) Greenspan warned of the stock bubble… He was VILIFIED and he never spoke out against it again. He was warned of the housing bubble by many people, they were all called ‘kooks’. Most of them are Austrian Libertarians who for some reason, even though they have been proven right time and time again, are ignored still…

No one is saying that there shouldn’t be regulations, Stephen, no matter how much you construct that straw man. What people are saying is that we need to let businesses that perform badly fail as they are intended to do and remove Moral Hazard form the arena. We need the regulations to be smart and not in place to pick and choose winners and losers. Which is precisely what you are advocating for!

But it wasn’t just Republicans as you seem to think… IT was also Clinton and the Democrats that were happy to ride that train as well. That’s where your little narrative falls flat upon itself, how you believe the hype and don’t look at the facts.

How can you blame AIG and Bear Sterns and the other companies for doing what the FED was telling them to do? That’s a ludicrous position to put people in, isn’t it? Here, have some free money and if you screw up your betting, we’ll cover your losses. Do you think that they won’t go out and do something about it?

And yes, there was some failures in the FED to do it’s job. It was tasked by congress, by law, to regulate the mortgage system. They were tasked to regulate the derivatives markets. They choose to not do either one. The laws to regulate these things are ALREADY THERE, they just weren’t acted upon because both Democrats and Republicans didn’t want them to.

So when you are willing to be realistic and talk about the actual issues confronting our system, please feel free to do so. But if you want to continue down the path of ‘it’s all the Republican’s and Libertarian’s fault’, you are just making an ass of yourself and preventing anything real or meaningful from being done to solve real issues that we are confronting…

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 11, 2014 2:44 PM
Comment #376350
The projection by the CBO is that people would work fewer hours of their own free will, not that they’d lose their jobs. Those fewer hours would not mean that the companies would need less work, meaning other people would likely get hired or work additional hours, and those people would likely not be working there merely for the healthcare. Given that we have an excess of people out of work, the freeing up of positions for new workers would not be a bad thing.

Actually that is NOT what the CBO said, you’ve apparently just heard some administration wonk say it and it sounds good (even though it isn’t).

Here’s what the CBO report ACTUALLY SAID.

The ACA’s largest impact on labor markets will probably occur after 2016, once its major provisions have taken full effect and overall economic output nears its maximum sustainable level. CBO estimates that the ACA will reduce the total number of hours worked, on net, by about 1.5 percent to 2.0 percent during the period from 2017 to 2024, almost entirely because workers will choose to supply less labor—given the new taxes and other incentives they will face and the financial benefits some will receive. Because the largest declines in labor supply will probably occur among lower-wage workers, the reduction in aggregate compensation (wages, salaries, and fringe benefits) and the impact on the overall economy will be proportionally smaller than the reduction in hours worked. Specifically, CBO estimates that the ACA will cause a reduction of roughly 1 percent in aggregate labor compensation over the 2017–2024 period, compared with what it would have been otherwise. Although such effects are likely to continue after 2024 (the end of the current 10-year budget window), CBO has not estimated their magnitude or duration over a longer period.

The reduction in CBO’s projections of hours worked represents a decline in the number of full-time-equivalent workers of about 2.0 million in 2017, rising to about 2.5 million in 2024. Although CBO projects that total employment (and compensation) will increase over the coming decade, that increase will be smaller than it would have been in the absence of the ACA. The decline in fulltime-equivalent employment stemming from the ACA will consist of some people not being employed at all and other people working fewer hours; however, CBO has not tried to quantify those two components of the overall effect. The estimated reduction stems almost entirely from a net decline in the amount of labor that workers choose to supply, rather than from a net drop in businesses’ demand for labor, so it will appear almost entirely as a reduction in labor force participation and in hours worked relative to what would have occurred otherwise rather than as an increase in unemployment (that is, more workers seeking but not finding jobs) or underemployment (such as part-time workers who would prefer to work more hours per week).

CBO’s estimate that the ACA will reduce employment reflects some of the inherent trade-offs involved in designing such legislation. Subsidies that help lower income people purchase an expensive product like health insurance must be relatively large to encourage a significant proportion of eligible people to enroll. If those subsidies are phased out with rising income in order to limit their total costs, the phaseout effectively raises people’s marginal tax rates (the tax rates applying to their last dollar of income), thus discouraging work. In addition, if the subsidies are financed at least in part by higher taxes, those taxes will further discourage work or create other economic distortions, depending on how the taxes are designed. Alternatively, if subsidies are not phased out or eliminated with rising income, then the increase in taxes required to finance the subsidies would be much larger.

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 11, 2014 2:48 PM
Comment #376354

Rhinehold-
Read the second paragraph over again, and apply some simple logic: If some people decide not to supply labor, yet some others have it to supply, does it not stand to reason that the hours and jobs vacated will go to other people?

That’s why it won’t have a net effect on unemployment numbers.

I worked this out for myself, by the way. I haven’t been keeping up with politics as much lately. It’s funny that you need to imply that I’m pushing a talking point when we can say pretty explicitly that you definitely are.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at February 11, 2014 3:03 PM
Comment #376355

Stephen, YOU need to reread the second paragraph because what you wrote is NOT what it stated…

Although CBO projects that total employment (and compensation) will increase over the coming decade, that increase will be smaller than it would have been in the absence of the ACA.

First, you assume that the reason we have unemployment now is because we don’t have jobs. That’s just not factual at all. There are millions of jobs going unfilled all across the company. The people applying are either not qualified for them or not in the same area as the jobs, etc. Just because someone works less and enough work less for a job to open up (the math on this is not as easy as 1:1, thanks to the taxation and regulations on most businesses) that there will be a qualified person to fill that position.

Second, you are misreading the paragraph completely. It says that currently the unemployment rate is Y. And that without ACA, the unemployment numbers would be X, which is less than Y. But because of ACA, the unemployment numbers will be somewhere in between, higher than what it should have been. Because of the people being forced to leave the workplace because of the fact that their tax rates are increasing and thus discouraging them working. Not because ‘hey you don’t have to work anymore’, which in itself is pretty bad isn’t it?

I mean, you have spent years on here trying to convince people that the Democratic party is not trying to enact policies that discourage work and provide cradle to grave coverage, but the minute you get some bad news about the ACA you claim that is precisely what you like about it?

You’ve just thrown away everything you stated all that time and people seriously have no business ever taking anything you say as having any real merit anymore, the Democratic party has been shown for what it truly is, hasn’t it?

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 11, 2014 3:11 PM
Comment #376391

Rhinehold-
You address the what without addressing the why. Without understanding the why of the job market shift, you cannot understand why the equivalent of 2.5 million full time jobs not worked isn’t equal to 2.5 million lost jobs.

The CBO also tends to be rather conservative in its estimates, and won’t consider things like, perhaps, did people actually like those jobs, were they properly socially oriented in those jobs. Those, even if they don’t have direct numerical effects, will have effects on the behavior that affords us productivity and profit.

In essence, if a person was just hanging around for the healthcare, then the question is, were they really giving it their all in the first place? A person who is otherwise happy with their jobs will stay even after Obamacare gives them an out. So what are we talking about here?

We’re talking about social misalignments, people who remain in a job for the healthcare despite the fact they can’t stand the people there. Are these going to be the most productive workers, the ones who create the most productive environment?

We’re talking about people working two jobs, dividing their attentions between two different sets of work. Scientific research tells us that people dividing their attention and their time between two things are not as effective as people who focus on one job. So does preventing them from refocusing their attentions on one job alone help productivity or hurt it?

We’re talking about people working jobs for the sake of affording healthcare, despite the fact that they might be too sick or too old to do the best work. Retirement occurs for a reason.

My sensibility has long been that you have to look behind the data to see the reality behind it. There are things that have an effect on numbers that are not measureable or understandable numerically. People are not equations to be solved, they are complex organisms that defy easy solutions, not in the least part because of how they adapt to them.

You’re looking at this healthcare issue from an elitist economic standpoint. I don’t say that as a value judgment so much as an accurate description of the interest behind the theory. It’s the viewpoint of a person who sees their employees as assets of fixed value and a given cost, and which thinks of their productivity in terms of how much they can get for how little cost.

That viewpoint fails to comprehend the real needs people have, both physically in terms of healthcare and in terms of social needs. The irony is, too, that people are actually willing to forgo additional compensation if their social needs, needs for status, certainty, autonomy, relatedness and fairness (a model made by David Rock of the Neuroleadership institute.)

The elite these days have a “tough cookies” approach to their employees, to their companies, because they view things in a very individualized, very materialistic way. What they don’t realize is that this costs them. Study after study tells us that after our basic need are met, after people are comfortable, additional compensation and wealth actually has a neutral to negative effect on performance.

Watch this video.

Get people happy, comfortable, healthy, purposeful, and you will see gains both quantifiable in cash and not.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at February 12, 2014 11:08 AM
Comment #376394

FAQ from the CBO that hopefully can help clarify things:

Hope this helps those who don’t get it

Posted by: Speak4all at February 12, 2014 11:26 AM
Comment #376396
You address the what without addressing the why.

Actually, the CBO was very clear as to ‘why’.

Subsidies that help lower income people purchase an expensive product like health insurance must be relatively large to encourage a significant proportion of eligible people to enroll. If those subsidies are phased out with rising income in order to limit their total costs, the phaseout effectively raises people’s marginal tax rates (the tax rates applying to their last dollar of income), thus discouraging work. In addition, if the subsidies are financed at least in part by higher taxes, those taxes will further discourage work or create other economic distortions, depending on how the taxes are designed.
In essence, if a person was just hanging around for the healthcare, then the question is, were they really giving it their all in the first place?

The ‘they were just hanging around for their healthcare’ is a fantasy created by defenders of the ACA, it doesn’t appear in the CBO. And if you want to get into that kind of debate, I can go there, but it has no bearing on the CBO and what they found. My predictions will be a lot different than theirs.

You’re looking at this healthcare issue from an elitist economic standpoint.

No, I’m looking at this CBO issue with the economics that the CBO used to make their prediction.

MY healthcare views are much different. The problem is that basic health INSURANCE is a scam, to begin with. Health care costs would be lower if people paid for the health care like they do any other service, saving insurance for truly catastrophic needs.

Understanding the history of health care and health insurance are needed to debate the issues of today, but most people can’t be bothered. The reason we have employer based health insurance is because the government caused it to occur, and are STILL causing it to occur. This notion that the ACA will get people to buy their own insurance instead of their employers is obviously BS when the law gives huge tax breaks and benefits to both employers and employees if they stay on their employee offered healthcare, which companies are now REQUIRED (or will be, someday) to provide.

But that isn’t what the debate is about now, is it? It’s about the CBO report and what it says and why it says it. If you want to debate that, debate that, but quit making up supposeds and howabouts to try to deflect from what it is saying because you don’t like what it has to say.

Watch this video.

Nothing in that video is a surprise to anyone I know, though I can imagine it is one to a progressive who thinks that business is just about ‘greed’ and every decision that a business makes is about the bottom line…

People are individuals and laws shouldn’t be written based on the views / actions of some people without taking that into account. But the left and right do that routinely…

Again, a topic for another discussion…

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 12, 2014 11:42 AM
Comment #376397

Speak, the FAQ actually states exactly what I’ve been saying… Not sure who was directed at.

For example, under the ACA, health insurance subsidies are provided to some people with low income and are phased out as their income rises; as a result, a portion of the added income from working more would be offset by a loss of some or all of the subsidies, which represents an implicit tax on earnings. Also, the ACA’s subsidies effectively boost the income of recipients, which will lead some of them to decide they can work less and still maintain or improve their standard of living. Therefore, some people will decide not to work or to work fewer hours than would otherwise be the case—including some people who will choose to retire earlier than they would have otherwise, and some people who will work less themselves and rely more on a spouse’s earnings. (Many other factors influence decisions about working, including, for example, income and payroll taxes and the cost of commuting and child care. Moreover, under current economic conditions, a substantial number of people who would like to work cannot find a job.)

So because of the increase in taxes (The ACA *IS* a tax law, after all) cause people to not work as much because they won’t make as much. In addition, some people, getting money from others who work through a federal government transfer of funds, think ‘more welfare’, may think they are making enough and just stop working anymore.

It reminds me of the story I posted recently about an old roomate who was working at a job to pay rent, food, etc. He didn’t have a car and I felt sorry for him not being able to afford one so I drove him to work every day. One day he came into a little extra money (from selling some rare Magic:The Gather cards) and I told him that was great, he could buy a car to get himself back to work and he said ‘no, now I don’t have to work for 3 months’. So he didn’t, the money ran out and he tried to sell some more but was told they weren’t buying any more at that time. So he had to go back to that job and start working again, looking for someone to give him a ride back and forth to work since he still had no car…

Do you think I drove him back and forth to work anymore? Yes, it meant I had to pay more in rent because he was unable to pay his rent most months after that, but continuing to feed into his dependency and lack of taking care of himself wasn’t helping anyone…

So, what you are saying is that it is a GOOD thing that we are now giving the poor more money so that they can less better themselves? Does that make sense to you? I should work more to pay higher taxes to help them work LESS?

I don’t understand the logic here AT ALL.

Posted by: Rhinehold at February 12, 2014 11:50 AM
Comment #376715

I have an understanding, which I believe is based on the Bible as to why America is more stable than other countries, and I believe that America with the help of its Puppet of the European Union is being used by the invisible Devil in the role of false prophet mentioned in the book of Revelation.

This is why things are different in some other countries as has happened in Ukraine was directed by the Pope, and the Catholic Priests in Ukraine, and with the Pope’s Allies.

The West of Ukraine is mainly Catholic and Ethnically Ukrainian, and the East of Ukraine is mainly Orthodox and Ethnically Russian.

The Ukrainian President, Viktor Yanukovych maliciously slandered did not break any laws, or do anything against the Interest of Ukraine, or Ukrainians, but the Western Media has and will continue maliciously slander him, and the invisible Demons may torture him in the invisible realm to falsely confess to wrongdoing in order to cover up for some of the secret Devil worshipping Euro-American politicians and for the secret Devil worshipping Pope, even as many Ukrainian parliamentarians have been tortured in the invisible realm to cover up for Satan, by wrongly impeaching President Viktor Yanukovych.

People are asking how can they fund the World, and there could be some who are saying that the Catholic Church should give All of their money to the United Nations Development Fund, and to the Eurozone so that some of the Bankers and Some Politicians do not have to be inconvenienced.

These Bankers and European Union officials and other politicians need to know that it is Either Them or the Catholic Church, who Must be the First to give All their Money,and so that decision will be easy to make.

Those who know the Truth of what happened in Ukraine know that a Legitimate and Democratically Elected Government did not want to sign an Unfavourable Deal with the European Union, which would have increased the Price of Gas, and Created Massive Unemployment, Lowered Pensions, and probably led to Ukraine Defaulting on its Foreign Debts.

The way it was done, after the Ukrainian President did not sign up to the Satanic European Union’s Deal was with the Pope and with the Euro-American politicians asking the invisible Demons to cause Catholics to Riot rather than to wait for an Election to decide matters.

This small group was Funded by Euro-America, who then got the Invisible Demons to Torture, the Secret Devil Worshipping Catholics of West Ukraine in the invisible realm to Riot even if it cost them their lives, because they had Sold their Souls to the Devil, and they were Too Cowardly to Repent and serve God, and the Invisible Satan the Devil, his Invisible Demons, Euro-America, the Devil Worshipping Catholic Church, and the Western Media gave them the False Title of heroes (Mark 5:1-13).

The Pope and President Barack Obama could ask the invisible Demons to Torture the East Ukrainians so that they do not resist the Satanic Catholic Dictatorship in Ukraine.

The East Ukrainians have a Right to set up their Own Government, because the Eastern Version of the Ukrainian Constitution belongs to them, but the Invisible Demons may torture them in the Invisible realm to go along with the Lies, and the Injustice, and the Poverty.

Those Demon possessed Rioters had caused over 3 Billion Dollars of Economic and Financial Damage to Ukraine, and All Ukrainians had the Democratic Right to decide matters at Elections, and so the Government was morally obliged to Restore Order to the Country.

Regrettably, the Only way to have done that is to kill the Demonized Catholic Ferals, because they had rifles, even as Catholic Hitler was a Demonized Feral and had an army.

The Bible tells us that this will be repeated again and again, Until the God of the Universe Intervenes in Human Affairs and kills All of the Earth’s Demonized Ferals, and God has Instructed His Son Jesus Christ and the Heavenly Angels to ensure the Complete Destruction of All of Earth’s Wicked.

According to the Bible, this is going to happen Very Soon, because it does Not take a Genius to Understand the Signs of the Last Days, and Euro-America is building their Empire in Eastern Europe to the state, where WW 3 would be Inevitable unless God kills the Euro-American Devil Worshipping Politicians (Revelation 19:11-21).

The Bible tells us that the God will destroy All Liars, and we know that the Euro-American Politicians will Always be Liars until God Destroys them, and so it is vital for those who are Redeemable from among Humankind to Repent Fast and Serve the God of the Bible, because the World is going to end soon, and that means that Jesus is coming back Very Soon to Judge All of the People of the World (Revelation 22:7).

Posted by: Journalist at February 23, 2014 3:45 AM
Comment #376716

I have an understanding, which I believe is based on the Bible as to why America is more stable than other countries, and I believe that America with the help of its Puppet of the European Union is being used by the invisible Devil in the role of the false prophet mentioned in the book of Revelation.

This is why things are different in some other countries as has happened in Ukraine was directed by the Pope, and the Catholic Priests in Ukraine, and with the Pope’s Allies.

The West of Ukraine is mainly Catholic and Ethnically Ukrainian, and the East of Ukraine is mainly Orthodox and Ethnically Russian.

The Ukrainian President, Viktor Yanukovych maliciously slandered did not break any laws, or do anything against the Interest of Ukraine, or Ukrainians, but the Western Media has and will continue maliciously slander him, and the invisible Demons may torture him in the invisible realm to falsely confess to wrongdoing in order to cover up for some of the secret Devil worshipping Euro-American politicians and for the secret Devil worshipping Pope, even as many Ukrainian parliamentarians have been tortured in the invisible realm to cover up for Satan, by wrongly impeaching President Viktor Yanukovych.

People are asking how can they fund the World, and there could be some who are saying that the Catholic Church should give All of their money to the United Nations Development Fund, and to the Eurozone so that some of the Bankers and Some Politicians do not have to be inconvenienced.

These Bankers and European Union officials and other politicians need to know that it is Either Them or the Catholic Church, who Must be the First to give All their Money,and so that decision will be easy to make.

Those who know the Truth of what happened in Ukraine know that a Legitimate and Democratically Elected Government did not want to sign an Unfavourable Deal with the European Union, which would have increased the Price of Gas, and Created Massive Unemployment, Lowered Pensions, and probably led to Ukraine Defaulting on its Foreign Debts.

The way it was done, after the Ukrainian President did not sign up to the Satanic European Union’s Deal was with the Pope and with the Euro-American politicians asking the invisible Demons to cause Catholics to Riot rather than to wait for an Election to decide matters.

This small group was Funded by Euro-America, who then got the Invisible Demons to Torture, the Secret Devil Worshipping Catholics of West Ukraine in the invisible realm to Riot even if it cost them their lives, because they had Sold their Souls to the Devil, and they were Too Cowardly to Repent and serve God, and the Invisible Satan the Devil, his Invisible Demons, Euro-America, the Devil Worshipping Catholic Church, and the Western Media gave them the False Title of heroes (Mark 5:1-13).

The Pope and President Barack Obama could ask the invisible Demons to Torture the East Ukrainians so that they do not resist the Satanic Catholic Dictatorship in Ukraine.

The East Ukrainians have a Right to set up their Own Government, because the Eastern Version of the Ukrainian Constitution belongs to them, but the Invisible Demons may torture them in the Invisible realm to go along with the Lies, and the Injustice, and the Poverty.

Those Demon possessed Rioters had caused over 3 Billion Dollars of Economic and Financial Damage to Ukraine, and All Ukrainians had the Democratic Right to decide matters at Elections, and so the Government was morally obliged to Restore Order to the Country.

Regrettably, the Only way to have done that is to kill the Demonized Catholic Ferals, because they had rifles, even as Catholic Hitler was a Demonized Feral and had an army.

The Bible tells us that this will be repeated again and again, Until the God of the Universe Intervenes in Human Affairs and kills All of the Earth’s Demonized Ferals, and God has Instructed His Son Jesus Christ and the Heavenly Angels to ensure the Complete Destruction of All of Earth’s Wicked.

According to the Bible, this is going to happen Very Soon, because it does Not take a Genius to Understand the Signs of the Last Days, and Euro-America is building their Empire in Eastern Europe to the state, where WW 3 would be Inevitable unless God kills the Euro-American Devil Worshipping Politicians (Revelation 19:11-21).

The Bible tells us that the God will destroy All Liars, and we know that the Euro-American Politicians will Always be Liars until God Destroys them, and so it is vital for those who are Redeemable from among Humankind to Repent Fast and Serve the God of the Bible, because the World is going to end soon, and that means that Jesus is coming back Very Soon to Judge All of the People of the World (Revelation 22:7).

Posted by: Comment for Reading at February 23, 2014 3:50 AM
Comment #377094

rep vs dems in the end ….both parties are on the same side…america….and america is a fighter…we experiment with ideas and concepts….but we stand tall and proud

Posted by: mike ahuja at March 5, 2014 3:09 AM
Comment #377225


The Constitution of Every Country states that the Government of that Country has to Defend the Constitution from All Enemies, both Foreign and Domestic.

This Requires Patriots in the Government and the Opposition, rather than Traitors in the Government or the Opposition, and after examining All of the Evidence, and All of the Statements made by the Ukrainian Politicians, we can see that the overthrown President in Exile, and the overthrown former Government of Ukraine who are now too Threatened and Intimidated are the Patriots, and the Other Political Parties who were the former Opposition Political Parties in Ukraine who have seized power in a Coup are the Traitors.

What has happened in Ukraine is that 3 of the 5 Political Parties that have Representation in the Ukrainian Parliament, and who were in Opposition before the Coup, and who are now in Government, Only because they have been the Willing Domestic Enemies of the Ukrainian Constitution, and the Willing Accomplices of Foreign Enemies or Euro-American Enemies of the Ukrainian Constitution.

The Fact that the Enemies of the Ukrainian Constitution have conducted a Coup, and are now what is called a Government, and this so-called Government is an Enemy to the Ukrainian Constitution, and President Viktor Yanukovych is the Ukrainian Government in Exile who is Defending the Ukrainian Constitution from All Enemies both Foreign and Domestic.

The 3 Treasonous Political Parties in Ukraine are The UDAR Party, Fatherland Party, and Svoboda Party, and they replaced the Coalition Majority Government of the Party of Regions and the Communist Party.

A Country’s Territorial Integrity is Defined by its Constitution, and if the Constitution does not Function, then neither does that Country have any Territorial Integrity, and this is how it is with Ukraine.

The upcoming Election in Ukraine will be a Referendum on whether the People are Traitors to the Constitution, and therefore Traitors to the Territorial Integrity of Ukraine.

If the next Election in Ukraine gives the Traitors a Majority in Parliament, or a Traitor as President, then the Ukrainian People have Voted for Ukraine to have No Territorial Integrity, and this means that Crimea is also Independent from Ukraine also by the Will of the People of Ukraine, and the the Will of the People of Crimea is sufficient for them to be Independent of Ukraine, and to ensure that they can have a Constitutional Democracy.

Ukraine has had the Unconstitutional 2004 Coup, and the Unconstitutional 2007 Political Crisis, and now it has had the Unconstitutional 2014 Coup, and Ukraine has to accept the Consequences for that, because the People of Ukraine have been Denied their Constitutional Democracy.

The People who were in the Last Government were Rightly or Wrongly accused of being Corrupt, and we know that the rest of the Opposition People before the Coup are Also Corrupt with Yulia Tymoshenko who is a Billionaire and was Convicted and Jailed for Corruption.

There is also the Problem of Nazism with the Coup Leaders, and so if Ukraine is to become a Democracy, then Ukrainians should only Vote if all of the People who have ever been Elected in Ukraine or who have ever been Appointed in Ukraine would not be Candidates in the Elections, or for the Party of Regions and the Communists.

This is the fault to Varying Degrees of the Every Political Party, and so the solution is to Only have New People in the Political Process in Ukraine.

There could even be another Coup if the Corrupt and the Nazis are Elected to Government or the Presidency of Ukraine, and this is another reason why Crimea wants their Independence from Ukraine.

We have seen how Euro-America have been Lying all along over Ukraine, and they want to be in a position to lie about Crimea who want their Right to Self Determination and to Constitutional Democracy, and Russia is not stalling until after the Crimean Referendum, because Viktor Yanukovych is the Democratically Elected President of Ukraine, and his return to Office is Essential for Russia to recognizing Ukraine’s Territorial Integrity.

We will see if the Coup Leaders in Ukraine will show even some some Legitimacy, by Recognizing Crimea as Independent from Ukraine, which is a Direct result of the Coup which was Deliberately Engineered by Euro-America.

Posted by: Comment for reading at March 8, 2014 6:51 AM
Comment #377387


If anyone redrew borders of Europe, then it was England, Germany, and Euro-America, with England and Gibraltar, and who knows where else on Europe, and the English did this in Many Non European Countries.

Then it was Germany with Saarland, and Wikipedia says: Saarland is now one of Germany’s sixteen federal states, and that from 1947 to 1956 the Saarland was a French-occupied territory separate from the rest of Germany, and that Between 1950 and 1956, Saarland was a member of the Council of Europe, but in 1955, in another referendum, the inhabitants were offered independence, but voted instead for the territory to become a state of West Germany.

Then there was the redrawing of East Germany and West Germany, to make one Country, and there was Czechoslovakia that became the 2 Countries of the Czech Republic and Slovakia.

Then there was the redrawing of Yugoslavia, where Euro-American Countries, most notably Germany recognize Illegal Independence Declaration from those who were Germany’s Allies in WW 2.

Then there was the Illegal support and recognition of the Kosovo Albanian Unilateral Declaration of Independence, that was based Entirely on Lies, Unjustified Aggression from the Euro_American NATO, and Injustices by Euro-America on the Innocent Serbian People.

It was known long in advance by Euro-America and to this day that there was no genocide of the Kosovo Albanians by Serbia, but there was and continues to be a genocide of Kosovo Serbs by the Kosovo Albanians.

We know that Hitler redrew the borders of Europe, and this is why Non Nazi Alliance of England, America, and the Soviet Union had to redraw the borders of Europe after the Nazi Activity of Hitler.

The People of those days did not Vote for Territory to be changed because of Anti Democratic and Anti Constitutional Activities like they do today.

We know that the Disputed Territory of Gibraltar had a Sovereignty Referendum in 1967, and in 2002, at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gibraltar_sovereignty_referendum,_1967 , and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gibraltar_sovereignty_referendum,_2002 , and the Sovereignty Referendum 2013 Falkland Islands at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_Islands_sovereignty_referendum,_2013 , and Kosovo Unilateral Declared their Independence at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Kosovo_declaration_of_independence , with Euro-America’s Support and Approval.

However, unlike Crimea Legal Declaration of Independence, Kosovo Illegitimately declared independence and Violated the United Nations Charter and the United Nations Security Council Resolution 1244, which Legally Guarantees Serbia its Territorial Integrity over Serbia’s province of Kosovo, and no Referendum was organized in Kosovo, but Crimea had a Referendum, and followed the Legal Proceedure for Self Determination as Guaranteed by the United Nations Charter.

However, unlike Crimea Legal Declaration of Independence, Kosovo Illegitimately declared independence and Violated the United Nations Charter and the United Nations Security Council Resolution 1244, which Legally guarantees Serbia its Territorial Integrity and no referendum was organized in Kosovo, but Crimea had a Referendum, and followed the Legal Procedure of Self determination as Guaranteed by the United Nations Charter at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council_Resolution_1244 .

We notice that there has been Indisputable Evidence of Much Anti Democratic Activity by Anglo-America in Ukraine, and we know that Hitler was not a fan of Democracy Hitler was not a fan of Not Interfering in other Countries, and some People think that this was because Hitler was a Nazi, while other People think that it is because Hitler was an Anti Democratic Dictator.

We have noticed that the People of Crimea Voted Overwhelmingly at 97 % not to be under the Dictatorship of the Anti Democratic and Anti Constitutional Illegitimate Coup Leaders in Kiev at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_referendum,_2014 .

It is possible that the Illegitimate Foreign Sponsored Coup Leaders may do something Legitimate like change Ukraine’s Constitution to a Federal System, where the Oblasts have the proper level of autonomy from the Federal Government, but the Coup Leaders are Illegitimate, because they came to power Illegitimately, Illegally, and Unconstitutionally.

There has been another type of redrawing of borders in Europe by Euro-America in Europe, and they are the borders of Justice in Europe, where they Deliberately Pervert the Course of Justice, and use Taxpayers’ Money for that, and I mention the Sham Court Euphemistically called the International Criminal Court for the former Yugoslavia.

The News Article written by an Honest English Journalist is Titled: Milosevic: true or false at http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2006/mar/21/tenquestionsonslobodanmilo , says what is in the next paragraph, and People can read the entire Article for themselves, and it begins at the next sentence, and this is what All Euro-American Politicians and Journalist know, even before the Crimes against the Innocent Serbian People happened.

How much do you know about Slobodan Milosevic, the recently deceased former president of Yugoslavia? Here’s 10 statements that we’ve all heard many times in the western media these last seven days. But which of them are true and which are false?

How much do you know about Slobodan Milosevic, the recently deceased former president of Yugoslavia? Here’s 10 statements that we’ve all heard many times in the western media these last seven days. But which of them are true and which are false? 1) Milosevic was a dictator. 2) He was a Serb nationalist. 3) He was responsible for the break-up of Yugoslavia. 4) His 1989 speech at Kosovo Polje was a nationalist rant that inflamed ancient ethnic hatreds. 5) He started four wars. 6) He was responsible for the massacre at Srebrenica 7) He ordered a systematic programme of ethnic cleansing in Kosovo. 8) He was toppled by a “democratic revolution” in 2000. 9) The trial at The Hague had produced evidence of his guilt. 10) He will be mourned by “only a few”. How many do you think are true? Seven, eight- all of them? The answer is zero. Every single statement is untrue. How many do you think are true? Seven, eight- all of them? The answer is zero. Every single statement is untrue.

The Things are not Conspiracies, but they are Facts, and they are Written by Independent Honest Unbiased Sources, at http://www.michaelparenti.org/Milosevic.html , and http://www.newstatesman.com/node/144322 .

The Documentary Titled: It Began With a Lie at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pujC5qlujiA , and the Video: that shows the workings of the Corrupt NATO Show Courts is Titled: Slobodan Milosevic INNOCENT at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOvSTOmACzI .

Will Euro-America be consistent and withdraw their recognition and support for Kosovo’s Unilateral Declaration of Independence at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Kosovo_declaration_of_independence , and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_recognition_of_Kosovo , and Consistency for what is Good, Proper, and Just is not popular with Euro-America.

If Euro-America were then they would withdraw their recognition and support for Kosovo’s Unilateral Declaration of Independence which they Deliberately Schemed with Lies and Injustice and Aggression, along with the Physical, Cultural, and Economic Genocide of the Innocent Serbian People, and they would recognize Crimea as Independent from Ukraine, because of the circumstances that occurred there, and that was Deliberately Schemed to do the same to the Russian of Crimea by means of the Illegitimate Coup Government which is a Puppet of Anti Democratic Euro-America.

Posted by: Journalist at March 19, 2014 7:51 AM
Comment #377388
We have noticed that the People of Crimea Voted Overwhelmingly at 97 % not to be under the Dictatorship of the Anti Democratic and Anti Constitutional Illegitimate Coup Leaders in Kiev at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_referendum,_2014 .

Well, not actually…

There were some problems with the ‘referendum’. These include:

a) There was no option to select ‘do not leave Ukraine’. Basically, the options were ‘leave Ukraine now and become an independent nation’ or ‘leave Ukraine now and join with Russia’. There was no option to ‘stay with Ukraine’.

b) Many people were not allowed to vote.

c) Many people boycotted the vote.

So, in much the same way that Saddam Hussein and Kim Jong Un got 100% of the vote in their elections, this election really tells us nothing.

From your link:

The available choices did not include keeping the status quo of Crimea and Sevastopol as they were at the moment the referendum was held. Many commentators argued that both choices would result in de facto independence.
Choice 1: Are you in favour of the reunification of Crimea with Russia as a subject of the Russian Federation?

Choice 2: Are you in favour of restoring the 1992 Constitution and the status of Crimea as a part of Ukraine?


Posted by: Rhinehold at March 19, 2014 1:24 PM
Comment #377394

The Referendum Questions in the Democratic Self Determination regarding the Sovereignty asked whether the Voters of Crimea wanted to be an Independent Country, or if they wanted to join Russia.

Wikipedia says: The referendum asked the people of these regions whether they wanted to join Russia as a federal subject, or if they wanted to restore the 1992 Crimean constitution and Crimea’s status as a part of Ukraine. The 1992 constitution accords greater powers to the Crimean parliament including full sovereign powers to establish relations with other states at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_referendum,_2014 .

The attendance at the Referendum was 80 % , and 97 % of the Voters Voted to join Russia, rather than become an Independent Country.

What this means is that 97 % of 80% is a Minimum of 77 % of the Voters Voted to join Russia, and only 3 % Voted for Crimea to become an Independent Country.

If 100 % of the Voters did Vote, then the Voters of Crimea who wanted to Vote would be between 77 % and 97 % of the Voters of Crimea.

If we assume that the 20 % of Voters who did not Vote, because they wanted the status quo, then they are in a Minority.

It could be that among the 20 % of those Crimean Voters who did not Vote; that their reason is because they wanted the status quo, but it was not feasible for Crimea, given the Fact that Ukraine has no Constitution, and that Ukraine is under the control of Traitors to Ukraine’s Constitution, who are Criminals, and who are the Puppets of Euro-America.

This is why they did not Vote, because they knew that Ukraine needed to be an Independent Country or to join Russia, and so they decided not to Vote on this occasion, in order for the Ethnic Ukrainians to show solitary with other Ukrainians, but at the same time to allow sanity and common sense to prevail.

The Constitution of Every Country states that the Government of that Country has to Defend the Constitution from All Enemies, both Foreign and Domestic.

This Requires Patriots in the Government and the Opposition, rather than Traitors in the Government or the Opposition, and after examining All of the Evidence, and All of the Statements made by the Ukrainian Politicians, we can see that the overthrown President in Exile, and the overthrown former Government of Ukraine who are now too Threatened and Intimidated are the Patriots, and the Other Political Parties who were the former Opposition Political Parties in Ukraine who have seized power in a Coup are the Traitors.

A Country’s Territorial Integrity is Defined by its Constitution, and if the Constitution does not exist, then neither does that Country have any Territorial Integrity, and this is how it is at the present time with Ukraine, until all sides agree on a New Constitution for Ukraine.

This is not a land grab by Russia as the Euro-American Nazis are saying, because the takeover of Crimea was done by the Locals, and the Locals who happen to be Majority Russians, were the who wanted and organized the Referendum to bring Certainly and Good Government to Crimea.

It is said that the Media is the Essential Fourth Estate in a Democracy, and after seeing how the Ukrainian Media Deliberately and Repeatedly Lied on recent events that led to a Coup, then we can see that Many People in Crimea see that the Ukrainian Mainstream Media a Fifth Column controlled by Foreigners, and these People are Voting for their Constitutional Democracy, and the Video Titled: Terrorist Activities of ‘Peaceful Demonstrators’ explains why at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E18jWXbZY8U , and the Video is Titled: Breaking Estonian Foreign Minister Urmas Paet and Catherine Ashton at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkC4Z67QuC0 .

It is true that Crimea and Russia have an Agreement to have up to 25,000 Russian Military Personal in Crimea until 2046, and so Russia did not invade of occupy Crimea, as the Euro-American Nazi Liars and their Bribed and Corrupt Puppet Media are Lying to People.

The Illegitimate Coup Government in Kiev needs to Confess these things, if it wants Ukraine to be a Democracy, and the Nazi Euro-American Government need to Confess these things if they are to be Democracies.

It could be that you need time to examine the evidence I provided on how Nazi Euro-America used Lies, Injustices, and Aggression against the Innocent Serbian People for a Land Grab for Terrorist Albanians, and with the Violation of International Law.

After knowing this, we can Contrast what has occurred with the Deliberate Euro-American Coup in Ukraine, which resulted in the Democratic Referendum in Crimea.

The Bible tells us that situations like this will be repeated again and again, Until the God of the Universe Intervenes in Human Affairs and kills All of the Earth’s Demonized Ferals, and God has Instructed His Son Jesus Christ and the Heavenly Angels to ensure the Complete Destruction of All of Earth’s Wicked.

I am in no way advocating that any Human kills any Federal American Politician or any Anglo-American Mainstream Journalist, because I know that Jesus will kill them, but these People need to Careful, because not every Human has Faith that Jesus will take care of matters, but Enough Unbelievers know what is going on, regardless of the Expert Deception and they know that Anglo-American Politicians and Mainstream Journalists Must Die, because: You can fool all the People some of the time, and some of the People all the time, but you cannot fool all the People all the time.

It is Vitally Important that Everyone knows that this Secret Devil Worship by the Satan trained Deceptive Anglo-American Politicians is for their upcoming Execution by Jesus, and that the Death of All of the Anglo-America Federal Politicians and the Death of Most of the Anglo-American Mainstream Journalists is the ONLY way to save the Planet, given the Fact that they will Always want to do Evil, and Worship the Devil.

According to the Bible, this is going to happen Very Soon, because it does Not take a Genius to Understand the Signs of the Last Days, and Euro-America is building their Empire in Eastern Europe to the state, where WW 3 would be Inevitable unless God kills the Euro-American Devil Worshipping Politicians (Revelation 19:11-21).

The Bible tells us that the God will destroy All Liars, and we know that the Euro-American Politicians will Always be Liars until God Destroys them, and so it is vital for those who are Redeemable from among Humankind to Repent Fast and Serve the God of the Bible, because the World is going to end soon, and that means that Jesus is coming back Very Soon to Judge All of the People of the World (Revelation 22:7).

Posted by: Journalist at March 20, 2014 5:26 AM
Comment #377395

I hope that this comment puts my other comment in its proper context.

I am not saying that Most Americans who comment on Ukraine are aware that they are being Deceived, but they need listen to Unbiased News Sources.

There is a saying that for some things that, People should be careful for what they wish for, because they just might get it.

The People of the World, which includes the People of America, do not want WW 3, and that means that they do not want their Politicians and the Mainstream Journalists to risk enabling that.

While some Americans will believe whatever the Mainstream Media says, we need to know that in this day of the Internet and of private researchers and proper Investigative Journalists, that you Cannot fool all of the People All of the time, and one good Accurate News Website is the Activist Post Website at http://www.activistpost.com/ .

While Americans may remain calm over some situations, there just Could be enough Americans that will do a Preemptive Strike on American Federal Politicians and some Mainstream American Journalists to Prevent WW 3.

I am not encouraging any Human to do a Preemptive Strike on American Federal Politicians and some Mainstream American Journalists.

We know that it is impossible in a Democracy to have 100 % agreement on anything, and so I just say that there just Could be enough Americans that will do a Preemptive Strike on American Federal Politicians and some Mainstream American Journalists to Prevent WW 3.

It is Never a time for Partisanship, and it is Never a time for some Perverted Sense of Patriotism, when it comes to WW 3.

If we look at Euro-American History after the collapse of the Soviet Union, then we will see that America led NATO has been surrounding Russia, and the Intention is to try to break Russia up or risk WW 3.

If Russia looks like it is going to be broken up, then there might not be any way to account for half of Russia’s nuclear weapons, which might be given to Euro-America’s enemies, and they can fit in a suitcase.

We know that drugs are easily smuggled in suitcases, and who knows if the Soviet Union left nuclear weapons in Eastern European Cities that were in the Soviet Union, in case they are ever needed as a last resort in Defense of Russia if NATO causes WW 3.

If we look at what has happened in Ukraine, then it was a Deliberate Scheme by Euro-America to cause a Coup, using Ethnic Ukrainian Neo Nazis as the European Version of Al Qaeda, which is America’s Ally in the Middle East and in places like Libya.

America may suffer Economically, and in Terms of Trade, because the World is seeing the Insanity of the Anglo-American Politicians, and they do not like the Instability and Uncertainty that the Evil Schemes of Anglo-America are causing in Europe.

America broke every Democratic Principle, and Violated International Law, and told Numerous Lies regarding Russia and Ukraine, and if America keeps out of this, then the Russia, Ukraine, and the European Union may be able to come up with an acceptable compromise.

Posted by: Journalist at March 20, 2014 11:56 AM
Comment #377419

There is a Deceptive Argument being used by Anti Democratic and Anti Human Rights Nazi Euro-America that the Voters of Crimea did not have enough time to consider the Referendum Questions.

This is an Insult to the Intelligence of the Voters, because the Unofficial Referendum Campaign began in November of 2013, after Democratically Elected Legitimate President of Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych refused to sign what is Euphemistically called an Association Agreement with the European Union, which is an Unprincipled Anti Democratic Puppet of Anglo-America.

We know that one of the Most Basic Human Rights in a Democracy, is that no one should be made to sign anything under Duress.

This Most Basic Human Right is also extended to the President and the Members of Parliament in a Democracy, but the Terrorist Rioters who are called Pro Democracy Peaceful Protesters by Euro-America said that they would Riot and Terrorize until the Democratically Elected Legitimate President of Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych signed what Anti Democratic and Anti Human Rights Euro-America had wanted.

The Democractically Elected Legitimate President of Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych refused to sign what is Euphemistically called an Association Agreement with the European Union, which is a Puppet of Anglo-America, and which would have Lowered Pensions, Increased the Price of Gas, and Massively Increased Unemployment.

The Democratically Elected Legitimate President of Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych refused to sign that, and so Anti Democratic and Anti Human Rights Nazi Euro America began a Coup that after 3 months of Terrorist Rioting eventually resulted in overthrowing of a Democratically Elected Legitimate European Government.

Another Most Basic Human Right in a Constitutional Democracy is that Voters Vote for a Government that will serve its Full Term, and that Voters Decide matters at the next Constitutionally Scheduled Elections.

The People of Crimea have have had this Most Basic Human Right and Democratic Right Denied to them by Anti Democratic Nazi Euro-America.

The Interesting thing is that Ukraine was the President of the America Controlled Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, or OSCE, when Nazi Euro-America are Members of the OSCE were Scheming their Illegal and Immoral Coup in Ukraine.

The word Agreement for Euro-America is a Euphemism for Duress or because the other Person or Persons is a Puppet who has be Bribed and Corrupted by Anglo-America or Euro-America to Euphemistically Agree to a Euphemistic Agreement.

This is because Democratically Elected Legitimate President of Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych refused to sign the Euphemistically called European Union and Ukraine Association Agreement.

As we know, the Voters of Crimea saw these things since November of 2013, and they saw the 21 February 2014, where the Democratically Elected Legitimate President of Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych had to flee, because he Nazis would have killed him, and Viktor Yanukovych who remains the Legitimate President of Ukraine if Ukraine had a Constitutional Order, would like to return to Ukraine as soon as his security can be guaranteed, and this Fact also did not escape the notice of the Voters of Crimea, and heavily Influenced how they Voted for their Self Determination to be able to have a Constitutional Democracy.

Ukraine has had the Euro-American Schemed Unconstitutional 2004 Coup, and the Euro-American Schemed Unconstitutional 2007 Political Crisis, and now it has had the Euro-American Schemed Unconstitutional 2014 Coup.

The Coup Leaders in Kiev if they were Honest, and if they were not Puppets of the so called International Community should accept that Democracy Loving and Freedom Loving People have in Crimea exercised their Human Right to Self Determination under these Exceptional Circumstances, because the People of Ukraine including the People and Voters of Crimea have been Denied their Constitutional Democracy.

As I mentioned that America is Satan’s false prophet, and he is said to perform signs with which he gathers the beast to do Evil as his Accomplice, as has happened in Ukraine, and there are some People who think that the beast could be the Euphemistically called the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, or it could be the European Union, but we know that NATO acts like a beast, and it is much more under the Control of either the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, or the European Union (Revelation 19:11-21).

For more information with regards to Ukraine and Serbia, as to the past and present Activities of the false prophet and its beastly American led NATO Puppet, then People might consider reading the Global Research Website at http://www.globalresearch.ca/ , and by typing Ukraine in the search function at Global Research Website, then the News Articles are at http://www.globalresearch.ca/search?q=ukraine .

Posted by: Journalist at March 22, 2014 5:26 AM
Comment #377420

We see the President of America going and meeting with his Puppets in the European Union, and he will be Ordering Leaders of other Countries on what to do, or Deceiving them with Subtle Lies.

Obviously, the President of America will know how to Lie, because we know that the Expert Liars and Deceivers taught him how to Lie and Deceive.

We see that Democracy and Self Determination are not popular with Euro-America, and with Many of Anglo-America’s Puppets, and so this is why America might ask Saudi Arabia and Bahrain to help with Economic Sanctions against Russia, because Russia supported the Right of People to to have a Constitutional Democracy, which those People Requsted of their Own Free Will, but America suppresses the Greatly Persecuted Democratic movement in Bahrain, even though America has a Military Base in Bahrain, at http://www.globalresearch.ca/search?q=bahrain .

It was foretold Long in Advance that Economic Sanctions would be placed upon Freedom Loving and Democracy Loving People, by a Country that speaks like the Dragon, and performs great signs, and which forces All People to be its Puppet, if they want to buy and sell, which means if they want to be able to Freely engage in the Human Right of Commerce (Revelation 13:11-18).

This Country, which is America, is also called a beast, because its Evil Deeds are beastly, and it should be Obvious that this beast is not in favour of Democracy and Self Determination, even though it has to speak such Lies, because it is Satan’s false prophet that wishes to Enslave All the People of the World, in order to conduct WW 3.

I think that Most Americans have seen what has happened to the American Constitution, and there are Many People who that this because the Anglo-American led NATO is planning WW 3.

I think that People should seek Unbiased and Honest Sources of Information on Ukraine, because of the Concern of what is happening in Ukraine, because Russia is being Wrongly Accused by Euro-America, and although People have been Deceived, it is Russia along with a few other Countries who is struggling for Freedom and Democracy in the World.

Posted by: Journalist at March 22, 2014 7:56 AM
Comment #377472

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Posted by: replica handbags at March 26, 2014 3:23 AM
Comment #377479

We have seen a Group of Countries, including America from the American Led Group of industrial nations, who said that they will not attend a planned G8 summit in Russia, which they had said they would attend, before Euro-America destroyed the Constitutional Democracy of Ukraine, by performing an Illegal and Immoral Coup on Ukraine.

These things were Easily Predictable for those who have studied the Bible, and who therefore know who is the second Beast with 2 horns of Revelation 13: 11-18, and what is its character.

This second Beast of Revelation 13:11-18 has 2 horns like a lamb, and it speaks like a dragon, and at Revelation 20:2 the term dragon refers to the Invisible Satan the Devil, who is as Invisible and Real as Gravity, Earth’s Magnetic Field, and Radio Waves, etc, and I will present evidence for who is the second Beast of Revelation 13:11-18, who puts Economic Sanctions on others.

After reading Daniel 8:3,4,20, we see a description of a ram with 2 horns, and these Represent or Describes the Kings or Rulers of Ancient Media and Ancient Persia, which was an Ancient Dual World Power of what was Bible Prophecy at the time it was written, but is now Irrefutable World History, and to be certain of this we have to know what the Bible says that a Beast with horns is.

The Bible in Daniel Chapters 7 and 8 says that one horn is exactly one King or one Country, 2 horns are exactly 2 Kings or 2 Countries, 3 horns are exactly 3 Kings or 3 Countries, 4 horns are exactly 4 Kings or 4 Countries, but by studying the Book of Revelation in addition to the Book of Daniel, we find that 10 horns like the Ancient Roman Empire had, Represents as many Kings and Countries as there happens to be, and there were Many Countries in the Roman Empire, and it had over 100 Emperors.

We deduce this by the Fact that Revelation 13:1 only mentions 7 World Powers, and they are said to have a combined number of 10 horns, but as we shall see, the Sixth World Power of Ancient Rome had 10 horns, and since each other of these World Powers that were not Dual World Powers had at least one horn, then the calculation is Egypt with one horn, Assyria with one horn, Babylon with one horn, Media and Persia with 2 horns, Ancient Greece with one horn, Ancient Rome with 10 horns, Britain and America with 2 horns, this makes 18 horns for those 7 World Powers of Revelation 13:1, and which is described as a Beast with 10 horns.

The Only way that 18 can equal 10, is if the definition of 10 is defined to mean as many as there are, and this is why if someone speaks of the European Union which has 28 Countries or 28 horns, as the Beast that has 10 horns, and which its Puppet Master, which is Satan’s false prophet of Britain and America, then we know that 28 horns equals 10 horns, or is defined as 10 horns, by the way 10 horns are defined in the Bible, and it means as many as there happens to be, and NATO also happens to have 28 Countries, but not all NATO Countries are Officially Members of the European Union, because if we counted America as a Member of the European Union, and its Dictator, then there would be 29 Countries in the European Union.

The second Beast of Revelation 13 also has to be a Dual World Power, and America is definitely one of those 2 horns, because it is a Superpower, and therefore the Major Partner to World Power 7, then we must go looking for its Partner, and the Bible Prophecy, which after it is Fulfilled becomes History, and these tell us who it is.

America can Never be a World Power on its own in a Technologically Advanced World , because it Needs the support of one significant Nation, because no Country could be a World Power with the Entire World against it, and America Needs a Willing Liar, along with Puppets who will say good things about what America does, and so a little fairly simple background research is first needed to Positively Identify America’s Partner in Crime, who was a greater Power than America was, but America is now greater than that Country.

After reading Daniel 8:3,4, we see regarding the Ancient Dual World Power described as a ram with 2 horns that no Country of that time could stand against the ram with 2 horns of Daniel 8:3, 4, and no Country could rescue any Country from the Power of that Ancient Dual World Power of Media and Persia, until the goat with one horn came on the scene, and that Ancient World Power which Conquered Ancient Media and Ancient Persia of Daniel 8: 5-7, and Daniel 8:21 tells us that the goat is Ancient Greece, and the horn of the goat is the Ancient King of Greece.

There are four Beasts described in Daniel Chapter 7, and it begins with Babylon, then the Media and Persia, then Ancient Greece, and then Ancient Rome, which is described as having 10 horns, and where one of its 10 horns, which is described as a little horn comes from part of Ancient Rome, and it becomes another World Power, and is one of the Partners of the last World Power of Bible Prophecy, and it is described in Daniel Chapter 7 and 8 as the little horn that becomes great.

The little horn speaks Boastfully and Arrogantly and it speaks great things, and it will soon be Destroyed by Jesus, after God Judges the little horn as worthy of Destruction, and we can read this at Daniel 7:7-12, and Daniel 8:24,25.

This type of Arrogant Speech and Hubris can only come from the World Power, and a World Power speaks for the World, which are its Puppets, but that is far too Honest a term to use, and so the little horn that grew great uses Partners and International Community as Good Euphemisms.

The little horn is none other than little England, or the Ancient Roman Province of Britannia, which became the Greatest Empire in World History, and which is America’s Partner in Deception and Crime.

The speech of a Dictatorial World Power would place that World Power in a type of prophetic role, because Orders Must be Obeyed, but because much of that speech is Lies, then it is a false prophet, but because its Lies which are given to it are from the Invisible Devil and his Invisible Demons, and therefore Expert Lies, then it is able to Deceive, for the reasons described at Revelation 12:9; Revelation 13:14; Revelation 19:20.

This is how we know that Britain and America are Dictatorial and Anti Democratic, because its speech are Decrees, and so it Acts in the role of a prophet, but as Satan’s false prophet that Deceives People, and one thing about Deception is that the Deceived do not know that they have been Deceived.

We read that by means of the signs that Satan has given to the false prophet to perform, and the signs which Satan continues to give to the false prophet, then it has Deceived and it continues to Deceive Many People.

At Revelation 13:2-4, one of those World Powers is said to receive what appears to be a fatal wound, but it wound was healed, and at Revelation 13:12 the second Beast is said to exercise the All of the Authority of the first Beast whose wound was healed, and we know that Anglo-America has been the Victor in 2 World Wars, and this did not affect its Status as the World Power.

At Revelation 19:20 the false prophet is said to perform great signs in front of the another Beast, and there are People who think that it is the European Union, or NATO, or some other Organization, and Britain and America have deluded, and they continue to delude the World.

It was foretold Long in Advance that Economic Sanctions would be placed upon Freedom Loving and Democracy Loving People, by a Beast with 2 horns that speaks like a dragon, and performs great signs, and which forces All People to be its Puppet, if they want to buy and sell, which means if they want to be able to Freely engage in the Human Right of Commerce, and after reading Revelation 13:11-18, I think it is Obvious that this can Only happen in a Technologically Advanced World with Instant Modern Mass Communication, and it means some time after the beginning of the 20th Century.

This second Beast with 2 horns is Britain and America, and it uses Economic Sanctions to Dictate to others, and it is Obvious that Britain and America is not in favor of Democracy and Self Determination as Crimea Proves, even though Britain and America has to speak such Lies that it is not a Dictatorial Puppet Master, which Rules by Decree, because Britain and America is Satan’s false prophet that wishes to Enslave All the People of the World, in order to conduct WW 3.

Most Americans have seen what has happened to the American Constitution, and there are Many People who think that this because the Anglo-American led NATO is planning WW 3, with Economic Sanctions as a step before WW 3.

America is ruining the Earth with NATO, and America is ruining America with Hydrolic Fracking for Gas, and America and European Union would prefer to ruin Europe with Hydrolic Fracking in order to place Economic Sanctions on Russia in preparation for WW 3, and there are Many Voters in the European Union who hope there are Genuine Environmental Parties in the European Union at http://www.dangersoffracking.com/ .

One Example of Economic Sanctions place was placed on one of Many Countries during Technological Anglo-America is the Country of Iraq, and the Video which is Titled: Paying the Price: Killing the Children of Iraq at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHn3kKySuVo , and after watching that Video, then those who have average intelligent or higher, should know that the Anglo-American Federal Politicians are the type of People who want WW 3, and this is why Jesus will kill them.

It is Vital that People seek Unbiased and Honest Sources of Information on Ukraine, because of the Concern of what is happening in Ukraine, because Russia is being Wrongly Accused by Euro-America, and although People have been Deceived, it is Russia along with a few other Countries who are Struggling for Freedom and Democracy in the World at http://www.globalresearch.ca/search?q=ukraine .

Britain, America, and NATO are the Devil’s Servants, who want WW 3, and this is why Jesus will kill all of the Anglo-American Federal Politicians, in order to Save the Planet, and the Bible says People will be Saved if they Believe in Jesus who is the Lamb of God and these things are stated at John 1:29, and at John 17:3.

After reading Revelation 1:1-3, we can see that the Book of Revelation contains Prophecies given by God, and that Jesus will come back soon to Save the Planet.

Posted by: Journalist at March 26, 2014 2:46 PM
Comment #377525

The other reference that mentions Britain and America in its role as Satan’s false prophet, and in its Natural Association with the Dragon who is the Invisible Devil, and with another Beast, and this is found at Revelation 16:13, 14, and we can see that the British and American led NATO are warlike, because they are Secretly Working for Evil Spirits, who are the Invisible Devil, and his Invisible Demons.

This emphasis by Anglo-America with NATO to the exclusion of the Environment is not good for the Planet, because it is Ruining the Earth at Revelation 11:18.

America is ruining the Earth with NATO, and America is ruining America with Hydraulic Fracturing for Gas, and America and European Union would prefer to ruin Europe with Hydraulic Fracturing in order to place Economic Sanctions on Russia in preparation for WW 3, and there are Many Voters in the European Union who hope there are Genuine Environmental Parties in the European Union at http://www.dangersoffracking.com/ .

There are no Genuine Environmental Political Parties in Anglo-America, because they Lie that carbon dioxide causes Climate Change, when all of my Private Research shows me that it is deforestation that causes Climate Change, along with extinction of animal, incest, and plant species, along with increasing Desertification of the Planet, and carbon dioxide does not cause Desertification, but People who want to plant Palm Oil for bio fuels, which create carbon dioxide at http://www.rainforest-rescue.org/topics/palm-oil .

There are 5 Greenhouse Gases, which are water vapor, carbon dioxide, methane, nitrous oxide, and ozone, and greenhouse gases are either Vital to the Earth for producing Clouds to have Rain for Agriculture, or to prevent the Earth from freezing, or they are unavoidable, at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenhouse_gas , and carbon dioxide has been Maliciously Slandered at http://topher.com.au/50-to-1-video-project/ .

Britain and America Deliberately broke up the Country of Yugoslavia, and wants to steal Serbia’s Province of Kosovo, because they have built an Enormous Military Base in Kosovo called Camp Bondsteel, which they will need for WW 3, at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_Bondsteel .

Britain and America wanted Crimea for WW 3, and Many People believe that Europe and the Rest of the World is a Safer Place, because the Voters of Crimea Voted with a 97 % Yeas Vote in favour of joining Russia.

The News Article written by an Honest English Journalist is Titled: Milosevic: true or false at http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2006/mar/21/tenquestionsonslobodanmilo , says what is in the next paragraph, and People can read the entire Article for themselves, and it begins at the next sentence, and this is what All Euro-American Politicians and Journalist know, even before the Crimes against the Innocent Serbian People happened.

How much do you know about Slobodan Milosevic, the recently deceased former president of Yugoslavia? Here’s 10 statements that we have all heard many times in the western media these last seven days. But which of them are true and which are false? 1) Milosevic was a dictator. 2) He was a Serb nationalist. 3) He was responsible for the break-up of Yugoslavia. 4) His 1989 speech at Kosovo Polje was a nationalist rant that inflamed ancient ethnic hatreds. 5) He started four wars. 6) He was responsible for the massacre at Srebrenica 7) He ordered a systematic programme of ethnic cleansing in Kosovo. 8) He was toppled by a “democratic revolution” in 2000. 9) The trial at The Hague had produced evidence of his guilt. 10) He will be mourned by “only a few”. How many do you think are true? Seven, eight- all of them? The answer is zero. Every single statement is untrue. How many do you think are true? Seven, eight- all of them? The answer is zero. Every single statement is untrue.

The Things are not Conspiracies, but they are Facts, and they are Written by Independent Honest Unbiased Sources, at http://www.michaelparenti.org/Milosevic.html , and http://www.newstatesman.com/node/144322 .

The Documentary Titled: It Began With a Lie at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pujC5qlujiA , and the Video: that shows the workings of the Corrupt NATO Show Courts is Titled: Slobodan Milosevic INNOCENT at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOvSTOmACzI .

Britain and America have pressured the European Union to put Economic Sanctions on Serbia to give up its Province of Kosovo, because Camp Bondsteel is in Kosovo, and will be needed for WW 3.

I think that it would have been better if I had began with what is already known, concerning the second Beast of Revelation 13:11-18, which looks like a lamb but speaks as a dragon.

I should have said that one of the horns is known, and it is Britain, and so we have to look at who Britain would want as a Partner if it needed one, and the Obvious answer is its former English Speaking Colony of America, especially if it becomes close to the strength of the British Empire, or even stronger than the British Empire.

This is because if America became a Rival to the British Empire, which later became the British Commonwealth of Nations, then Britain would rather share its Global Hegemony with America, rather than have America as the sole Global Hegemony.

However, I do not think that America could be a World Power, without the expressed cooperation of Britain, which would do that in its own interests, given the circumstances.

What this means is that the one horn of Britain, which is called the little horn that grew great, was joined by another horn of America as its Partner, and these became a Beast with 2 horns that places Economic Sanctions on other Countries.

Historians will have differing opinions as to when the British Empire and America join up to become a Dual World Power, and I will just say that in my opinion, that happened some time after the beginning of the 20th Century.

Even if the British Empire, as one horn, placed Economic Sanctions on Countries, before it joined up with America, then this is not what Revelation 13:11-18 is describing, it is not a Beast with one horn that performs great signs to Deceive People, because it is referring to a Beast with 2 horns, which is Britain and America, and it is one of 7 World Powers that are mention at Revelation 13:1.

Revelation 13:2 uses the language of Daniel 7:2-6, where the Empires are described in reverse order as a Leopard, Bear and Lion, and at Daniel 7:2-6 they are given in their Chronological order of a Lion, Bear, and Leopard.

Reading another 2 verses at Daniel 7:7, 8, describes a fourth Beast, which was the Roman Empire, which had 10 horns, and then we read of a fifth Beast described as a little horn, which is Britain, and which has not been replaced by another World Power, because it has the Willing cooperation of America, and America does that in its own interests.

The first 2 World Powers of Egypt and Assyria have already come and gone, and the Prophet Daniel, who was in Babylon used Babylon as his beginning point, and he described the remaining 5 World Powers of Ancient Babylon, Ancient Media and Ancient Persia, Ancient Greece, Ancient Rome, and then the British Empire which is now Britain and America and this is read at Revelation 13:1-18.

Posted by: Journalist at March 28, 2014 5:29 AM
Comment #377526

I wrote in my other comment of Anglo-America’s Natural Association with with the Devil, but I should have said that it is an Unnatural Association, but that Evil Association comes naturally for Satan’s false prophet who is Britain and America.

We have seen Britain and America acting Unnaturally for Humans, by using napalm, and there are People who think that this is what is described at Revelation 13:13, where it says that the second Beast with 2 horns makes fire down down in front of People, and the Video Titled: Vietnam Napalm Run at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IACglchX9n0 .

At Revelation 16:13, 14, we read of a Beast is who is mentioned there alongside Britain and America, and we now know why NATO is an Evil Beast, and it is Certainly Scheming WW 3.

I have Proven this with regard to Kosovo and Camp Bondsteel, and Britain and America wants Ukraine to join NATO before it begins WW 3, and this was the Real Reason for the Euro-American Engineered Coup in Ukraine, because of not signing the European Union Evil Association Agreement, because the European Union is almost the same as the Evil NATO.

These are the Proven Facts, but we have and will continue to hear Many Lies from Britain and America.

Posted by: Journalist at March 28, 2014 7:51 AM
Comment #377595

The British Online Newspaper says: Nato appoints anti-war protester as next secretary general, and this News Article is at http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/10730509/Nato-appoints-anti-war-protester-as-next-secretary-general.html .

We Only have to look at the record of another Anti War and even Anti NATO Person, who became Secretary General of NATO, and knowingly waged an Illegal and Immoral War on Yugoslavia, and that Person is Javier Solana.

Javier Solana wrote a pamphlet that was Titled: 50 Reasons to say No to NATO, and Javier Solana had been on an American subversives list, until he became Secretary General of NATO.

Javier Solana had been on an American subversives list, because he knows that Britain and America are planning WW 3, but he decided to join the War Criminals in NATO.

This is proved by the Facts that he advocated what he knew to be a Totally Illegal and Totally Immoral War on Yugoslavia in order to steal Serbia’s Province of Kosovo to build the Largest American Military Base outside of America called Camp Bondsteel in preparation for WW 3 at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_Bondsteel .

Britain and America Deliberately broke up the Country of Yugoslavia, and wants to steal Serbia’s Province of Kosovo, because they have built an Enormous Military Base in Kosovo called Camp Bondsteel, which they will need for WW 3, at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_Bondsteel .

Britain and America wanted Crimea for WW 3, and Many People believe that Europe is now a Safer Place, and that the Rest of the World is a Safer Place, because the Voters of Crimea Voted with a 97 % Yes Vote in favour of joining Russia.

There are the European Union Puppets and the NATO Puppets of Britain and America, and we now know that the British and American led NATO is an Evil Beast, and it is Certainly Scheming WW 3.

I have Proven this with regard to Kosovo and Camp Bondsteel, and Britain and America wants Ukraine to join NATO before it begins WW 3, and this was the Real Reason for the Euro-American Engineered Coup in Ukraine, because of not signing the European Union Association Agreement, because the European Union is almost the same as the Evil NATO.

We should not believe that NATO can ever Change its Desire for War, but as a Conciliation, perhaps Euro-America may want to Confess that they were Total War Criminals with regards to the Innocent Serbian People, with the Illegal and Immoral Wars against the Innocent Serbian People, and that they Malicious Slandered and Perverted the Course of Justice of the Innocent Serbs with the Sham Court Euphemistically known as the International Criminal Court for the former Yugoslavia.

All American and All European Politicians, and Many Ordinary People know these Facts, as does the so called Anti War Jens Javier Solana Stoltenberg.

There is a News Item Titled: Special court for Kosovo crimes to be set up in Hague at http://www.b92.net/eng/news/crimes.php?yyyy=2014&mm=03&dd=31&nav_id=89819, and this will be used to Cover Up the Facts to follow the Lying Anglo-America false prophet Script.

Anglo-America can and does Pressure smaller Countries who are their Innocent Victims to Lie and to go along with the Satanic Anglo-American false prohet lying Script to Deceive the World, and to keep is Status as Satan’s false prophet.

We know that America has no problem Confessing its War Crimes, and the short Video Titled: General Wesley Clark: Wars Were Planned - Seven Countries in five Years at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RC1Mepk_Sw , but they Must keep Silent on their plans for WW 3, and if they were not planning WW 3, with their Need for Kosovo and Ukraine, then they would have Confessed these things concerning the former Yugoslavia long ago.

This false prophet of Satan’s is Scheming WW 3, and yet it presents itself as the hope of the World with a straight face, and the Anglo-American Federal Politicians and Many Anglo-American Mainstream Journalists Cover Up over the Innocent Serbian People to build Camp Bondsteel and what happened in Ukraine and what is because the Anglo-American NATO needs this for WW 3.

These are the Proven Facts, but we have heard Many Lies from Britain and America, and we will continue to hear Many Lies from Britain and America.

Posted by: Journalist at March 31, 2014 7:56 AM
Comment #377675


I have looked at a few Videos that say that no planes used for the 9/11 incident.

A Video that I found on this is Titled: Conclusive Evidence the 9/11 Planes were NOT REAL at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUoqwUVOxHE .

Those fake planes using Film Technology were added later to the film of the explosions in the World Trade Center buildings to coincide with the explosions that were planned and set up by American Citizens.

The Most Basic reason, and therefore Only necessary reason why no real planes could have been used, is that it is impossible for passenger planes to penetrate the World Trade Center buildings, which was needed for the Conspiracy, and for the motive behind the 9/11 Conspiracy for the Primary Conspiracy, which is a Conspiracy against the American Constitution, and therefore it is a Conspiracy against the American People.

If real planes were used with those buildings, then their fuel would have been poured down the side of the buildings.

This is because real planes could not penetrate those buildings, and some reason had to be given for what caused the explosions in those buildings, which allegedly caused those buildings to collapse.

However, the Truth is that those buildings collapsed, just like building 7 which was not hit by anything collapsed, because they were planned demolitions with the Video Titled: Building 7 Side-by-Side Controlled Demolition at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOslOtFZNgs .

The True reason is because American Citizens working for Other American Citizens Conspired to commit the 9/11 incident, and if we know this, then the 9/11 Commission, and Most American Politicians, including past and present Presidents, and Most of the Mainstream Media Journalists knew it long ago.

We know that the World Trade Center buildings had explosives on certain floors that would mimic the path of the pretend planes supposedly striking those buildings, and that those buildings were prepared for controlled demolitions, that were wrongly blamed on planes striking those buildings.

There could be People who think that the reason for the 9/11 incident conducted by American Citizens, who were working for other American Citizens, was to justify a war with Afghanistan, but that is not the real reason, because America can invent Lies for wars, and so the Real reason was, and the real reason Continues to be a Conspiracy against the American Constitution, and therefore a Conspiracy against the American People.

The short Video Titled: General Wesley Clark: Wars Were Planned, Seven Countries In Five Years at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8ityb0Ips4 , and this will prove that America can Always Invent Lies for their wars.

The war on Afghanistan was based on a Lie, and so the 9/11 incident was Engineered as a Conspiracy against the American Constitution and the American People, with the Patriot Act, TSA, NSA Spying, etc.

I was wondering if anyone has done any small scale models of exact replicas of the World Trade Center buildings in the context that the proportional size of alleged planes and quantity of aviation fuel that was travelling at 500 mph, and how it would flow.

I wonder if there was any aviation fuel in those buildings, and if there was, then I think that the fuel would have travelled through the other side of the building very fast and for a long way, and much much further than the explosion areas of those buildings seen in the films of those incidents.

Perhaps a group of Engineers can put these things, and some other relevant things into a Film, but it all has to be based on the Irrefutable Fact, that ordinary passenger planes could never have totally penetrated those buildings, or even come close to disappearing into those buildings, as is shown by the fake planes that were added using Film Technology.

The other thing that was needed was Bribed and Corrupted or Confused Selective interviews, along with Deceptive Editing.

One good way to prove this notion wrong or right, is to build a full size replica of one of the buildings using the same materials and specifications, and it only needs to be 3 times higher than the height of the full size replica of the alleged planes, and that replica of a plane does not have to be a real plane, or it can be an old plane that is to be recycled.

It only has to look like a plane and have several strong engines with wheels and a gearbox, rather than have jet engines to build up the speed needed, even though weights that are identical to that of jet engines and its fuel tanks of the alleged plane need to be in the right location.

The replica of the plane, or the plane that is old, and is purchased for this matter does not need to fly, but just needs to have the same speed on a flat salt lake runway or other suitable substitute for a runway, and it has to be remote controlled.

I have read that each floor is 4 meters high, and it is said that the first plane was travelling at 430 mph, and the second plane was travelling at 530 mph, and so the faster speed is what would have to be used in such an experiment.

I am not an Engineer, but I was wondering if the building structure was made half the strength, while keeping the length and the breadth of the 3 story replica the same, then perhaps the same effect would be noticed if the plane or replica plane travelled at half the speed, or at a speed calculated by Engineering formulas.

What this means is that scaled down versions of the World Trade Center buildings and scaled down versions of the alleged planes could be used to show us what would happen with cause and affect in the 9/11 incident.

This can be compared to Film makers who used scaled down models of what they are wanting to Film large and expensive objects such as Scenery in the old days.

There is so much Money wasted on NATO, and some of that Money could be used to investigated the 9/11 incident.

I do not believe that all of a real passenger plane can just disappear in the World Trade Center buildings, without at least more than half of the plane falling outside the building, but we see the entire plane disappearing into the buildings, and this is because, they are fake planes added by Film Technology.

People can Anonymously send a Copy of this comment to their Politicians, so that they may be without excuse, as to their Commitment to the American People, attitude toward their Responsibility and their Duty to tell Americans the Truth of 9/11, and as to their attitude to Reinstating the American Constitution as the Supreme Law of the Land.

People can talk on this on Talk Back Radio, and they can send Copies to other fellow American Citizens, and this reflects the Commitment of Americans for other fellow Americans.

Posted by: Journalist at April 3, 2014 7:51 AM
Comment #378694

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