Democrats & Liberals Archives

I like what Obama said today about this, “We all have to learn that we can disagree, but not be disagreable.”

And I believe Obama mentioned that he just cannot make everyone happy.

The gay agenda is not mainstream, the just want it to be, Propsition 8 prooved it. Obama is just appealing to the masses now. Smart play. He has probablhy two years of economic woes (we hope) and then has to start running for his second term. Or perhaps we’ll be blessed without a two year camapaign.

I don’t know how to feel about this…

I don’t like Warren because he’s bigoted against gays.

But I like that Obama is using him to stick it to the Wacko Left, who are bigoted against just about everyone but gays (and terrorists, of course).

I find my opinion on this matter nicely summarized at the ResaonsToBeCheerful3.blogspot.com blog: “Mega-Rev. Rick Warren in numbers.” It quantifies what he is searched in connection with in Google and computes a “progressiveness” (or lack thereof) result. Tongue in cheek statistics of course but revealing/funny for sure.

Denny Crane: But if he supports a law, and then agrees to let it lapse … then that would make him

Paul >he is ready for discussion

Paul, you’re right about everything you wrote here, so you won’t be hearing much from me about it (much to many people’s relief, I’m sure).

Suffice it to say that FINALLY after 8 long years of ruthless, dogmatic, right-wing ideology this nation has a fighting chance at uniting against our many problems, instead of being divided into multitudes of groups who are either in with or out of power.

Are you being hateful and intolerant toward his Christian view? Is Rick Warren entitled to his opinions?
Identities that are based on private sexual behavior are wrong headed.
Brothers, Sisters and close friends should and can form partnerships that share dowry rights and appoint conservators.
Marriages have existed for thousands of years mainly to establish a stable environment for the children that are produced as a result. It isn’t as obvious now due to birth control.
His views are logical and have no hint of intolerance.
Can you explain the logic in teaching minor children to form identies and associations based solely on the use of their sex organs?

Does it really matter who gives the inaugural prayer? I doubt it means much to Obama anyway.
Sense Obama doesn’t dare use his real religious mentor (Wright) I reckon Warren will do just as well.

Ron,

Obama doesn’t DARE use wright??? Why on earth would he want to? Obama has stated, for public record, that he abhors many of the things Wright was preaching. Wouldn’t it be more foolish for him to pick Wright, rather than daring? I surely don’t understand the undertone…??? If you are hinting that Obama still reveres Wright, it would be a stretch since Wright embarrassed him publicly.

I think you are missing a key point here. The problem with Rick Warren is not about policy. Disagreeing with the policy position of gay marriage is one thing, but using hateful and extreme rhetoric to express those views is quite another. Equating gay marriages with polygamy, incest and child abuse is the kind of rhetoric that contributes to anti gay hate and violence. I wonder exactly how extreme someone would have to be in their anti gay language for Obama to decide that they are inappropriate to share this important moment with him and with all of the nation. Its not about policy- its about tone and this tone is way off the principles Obama supposedly stands for.

>Its not about policy- its about tone and this tone is way off the principles Obama supposedly stands for.
Posted by: milosarah at December 20, 2008 08:28 PM

milosarah,

Okay, it is about tone rather than policy…Obama’s policy is opposite of Warren’s…but, Obama’s tone is about unifying our country. So…??? He has selected a gay person as part of his team and a bigot as part of his inaugeral…what is more unifying than that?

Its all so clear. The homophobic Warren is finally ,after much soul searching,is going to come out of the closet at the inaguration. We all know that anti-gay bigots are just having difficulty dealing with their own unresolved homosexual tendancies and this will give him a national stage to lead others out of the darkness of self loathing.

I’d be more inclined to believe Obama’s rationale if it were more personal, say, it were a holy dude openly supportive of the KKK and against biracial marriages… you know, Strong Thurman’s pastor, or George “Macaca” Alan’s holy dude…

Willing to talk is one thing, putting them on the national stage at the birth of your administration is quite another. There’s a fine line between compromise and compromiseD

M@
I like my theory better.

Well…we’ve all got to admit one thing…he ran on a platform of ‘change’, and he’s certainly changing the national scene, even before he’s inaugurated…

Paul
I did some poking around re:Warren: He believes in man-made global climate change and believes in helping the poor. He also believes addressing these problems is a moral/religious task. Because of the regard the still powerful ,wacko religious right has for him he might be able to bring them around on these pressing issues. This is valuable.

“The gay community is screaming about how Obama double-crossed them by picking a homophobe for the invocation. Many liberals feel the same way.”

Why? They didn’t seem to have a problem with “homophobes” playing a big part in getting Obama elected.

Funny how the left just ignores black Americans on this issue and concentrates all their so-called concern and hate on the “wacko religious right.”

kctim,

You may be overstating the case. I’m still doing some local ‘home meetings’, etc., for the Obama camp. Among those to whom I’ve spoken, the selection, while a bit of a surprise, was not all that unwelcome. Most who come to the meetings think ‘O’ is just trying to be inclusive.

I understand the disappointments of some gay people, and I empathize with those disappointments, but I think the stink is coming from a vociferous few and a media in a panic to get anything going against Obama’s grain.

It is very hard for the media to get anything tangible against Obama or his leadership selections, so they jump on anything they can to fill their twenty-four hour demand for ‘breaking’ news.

kctim,

Sorry, I did not see the quotation marks around the first part of your quote. I did track back to find it came from Paul.

Paul, how deep and wide is the rift? The folks I’ve spoken to directly, don’t seem to be all that upset.

Dude
I don’t doubt Obama’s intentions here at all. I also don’t doubt its coming from few or that media is trying to drum up a story.

I believe this anti-gay issue has more to do with our country as a whole rather than just the “wacko religious right.” They are nothing more than an easy target.

We have to change minds, left and right, if we ever expect to get equal rights for gays and I think Obama knows that.

kctim,

You had me right up until you said the ‘whacko religious right’ were an easy target. They are as Teflon as Reagan ever was…nothing ever said has any impact on them at all…they are impervious to insult, reasonable argument, hell fire…anything. Easy target??? Hardly…well…maybe…they are easy to hit…it just somehow doesn’t stick…

Dude
Too many people in our country are against gays for this to be layed in the lap of one group. This issue is not bound by political beliefs, so we must acknowledge its not only the “wacko right” that is holding us back and work for what is right from all sides.

kctim,

Have you ever heard the phrase, “the squeaky axle gets the grease”? The lunatic fringe right may not be the absolute cause, i.e., apathy on the part of the general public, bad policy moves on the part of the gay community, etc., but, you do see who’s getting the grease…

kctim,

The squeaky axle gets the grease…right? The squeakiest axle in this case has been the ‘whacko right’…apathy on the part of the general public and some missteps on the part of gays have factored in, but the noisiest by far has been you-know-who…

PS:

Apparently I can’t say this enough times…kctim, I don’t really think you’re that thick…

For those that have a problem with Warren, you might want to read this;

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/melissa-etheridge/the-choice-is-ours-now_b_152947.html

Rocky

Dude
“The squeaky axle gets the grease…right? The squeakiest axle in this case has been the ‘whacko right’…apathy on the part of the general public and some missteps on the part of gays have factored in, but the noisiest by far has been you-know-who…”

I realize who gets the most press, but look at actions.
Do you think black Americans, one of the Dems and Obama’s largest voting blocs, are part of this “whacko right?” Upwards of 70% of that group voted against gay marriage rights when those amendments were put on ballots and roughly the same percentage voted as such on Prop 8.

The “squeakiest axle” is loudest only because it is the one most publicized, while the other squeaky axle is ignored for politics.

Progress on this issue will only come when we face the whole problem, not just part of it.

“What I’ve also said is that it is important for America to come together, even though we may have disagreements on certain social issues.”

By this logic, ought not the Grand Dragon of the Ku Klux Klan give the invocation? No, of course not. Obviously, the best choice is Rick Warren - as he seeks not the President Elect’s death, but only the deaths of some of the President Elect’s strongest supporters. Thank you, Mr. President Elect. Your lack of concern for my life is illuminating.

>Obviously, the best choice is Rick Warren - as he seeks not the President Elect’s death, but only the deaths of some of the President Elect’s strongest supporters. Thank you, Mr. President Elect. Your lack of concern for my life is illuminating.
Posted by: Owen Broadhurst at January 1, 2009 02:19 PM

Owen Broadhurst,

Obama also chose a gay person for his cabinet. Sometimes the best way to change society, is to lead by example. If the lady meets or exceeds expectations, what better way to influence that change?

If this country is not big enough for gays, straights, blacks, whites, atheists, christians, Hindi, Islamics, bigots and liberals, why would we bother to call it free?

With the selection of Warren, he has been about as inclusive as it is possible to be…if there is room in America for gays, there is also room for bigots. That, to me is Obama’s statement to America.

Very well said Dude.
To be inclusive, he must include even those he may disagree with.

kctim,

He has shown almost too much inclusion…Richardson…I’m not sure he should have included someone from the ‘dark side’…:). Crooks need not apply…