Democrats & Liberals Archives

Where’s Sarah Palin?

Since Ms. Palin’s awful interview (link) with Katie Couric last Thursday, where’s the pride of Wasilla Alaska been hangin’ out?
Answer: Philadelphia.

Yes, since last Friday, after the Couric interview hit the airwaves earlier and showed, to the few that were watching (and the many more watching on YouTube.com), just how awful McCain’s selection for VP was; Sarah has been hanging with ‘dem fluflians’ (philly-speak for ‘them philadelphians).

Gee, what’s been going on since last Thursday? Oh yeah… the economic meltdown. Oh and that whole the first Presidential debate thing too.

I’m sure many people would love to know what the Republican VP nominee has to say about how her partner did on his first Presidential debate. Evidently Palin doesn't want to say anything; she refused post debate interviews. (or at least the McCain campaign didn't want her to say anything.)

Following the debate, Mr. Biden, Sarah’s counterpart, was on virtually every major and cable network (not ABC) talking up the debate to anyone that would listen. Note: Biden didn’t appear on ABC because Palin wouldn’t appear. ABC evidently wanted both or nothing. Biden did talk up Obama on the other networks; he got his face-time.

Where’s Sarah’s face-time?

In Philadelphia.

Yes, in city that has a 2:1 ratio of Democrats to Republicans. Where, in the last Mayoral election, the Republican candidate for Mayor scoffed at his own chances to win the election. Where there hasn’t been a Republican Mayor elected since 1948, Ms. Palin was wooing voters.

Right.

Palin is being kept under wraps by the McCain campaign. Her comical responses for Couric were a better fit for Jeff Foxworthy on ‘Are you smarter than a 5th grader” than a Vice Presidential candidate interview.

It’s no wonder that the McCain campaign is putting a muzzle on her.

In any case, I hope she had a chance to grab a soft pretzel and a cheese steak, run up the art museum steps and watch the Phillies clinch the NL East.

Posted by john trevisani at September 29, 2008 7:51 AM
Comments
Comment #264920

John,

You do realize that if Pennsylvania goes for McCain this election, considering the way the rest of the country is falling, that he wins the White House, right?

It’s uncomfortably close for Obama atm, if you ask me…

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 8:05 AM
Comment #264921

Rhinehold:
‘You just don’t seem to understand…’

McCain will not win, nor come close to winning, Philadelphia.

As a point of reference, Pennsylvania is broken up into segments; there’s the big city portion (Philly and Pittsburgh), the suburbs surrounding the big cities and the Alabama part of state (everything in between the two cities).

Yes, that was meant to be humorous.

But in all reality, if you’re going to go with the ‘battleground’ discussion, (which i suspect the straw-graspers will do) the McCain campaign would have been better suited in the Alabama portion of the state.

Posted by: john trevisani at September 29, 2008 8:13 AM
Comment #264922

John,

It is not about winning Philadelphia, it is about convincing enough Philadelphians to vote for you.

Pennsylvania showed in the primaries that they are not convinced of Obama, and the polling since the debate has been very close. While you want to keep shoring up your base, I think the McCain campaign sees value in trying to pull as much support from the more liberal areas who have some strong anti-Obama/pro-Hillary sentiment out there.

Whether it will work or not remains to be seen, but the problem with attempting to infer motive based upon what you want it to be instead of what it actually is and isn’t makes it a tough game.

It may very well be that they are trying to hide her, but why Philadelphia then? Why not somewhere where she would be in more friendly surroundings? Have her parked in Texas or Tennessee?

BTW, the ‘Alabama of the State’ comment is interesting as well…

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 8:46 AM
Comment #264923

Rhinehold:
If Philly was so important for the McCain campaign to win over some Hillary voters (as you allege), then why not do some interviews FROM there?

Why not have Palin, surrounded by philly women, while she answered questions about the debate or the economy?

The McCain campaign has put the muzzle on Palin until the debate.

Posted by: john trevisani at September 29, 2008 8:56 AM
Comment #264924
You do realize that if Pennsylvania goes for McCain this election, considering the way the rest of the country is falling, that he wins the White House, right?

Not necessarily. At this point, Obama is close to overtaking McCain in Ohio and Florida (and maybe even Indiana). If that were true, PA wouldn’t matter at all. Heck, if Obama just picks up IA, CO, NM, VA, and Nevada of Bush’s 2004 states, he doesn’t even need PA, OH, FL, or IN. And it’s not that far-fetched - he’s ahead in all of those but Nevada, and even that state is close.

The bigger point, of course, is that Palin is becoming an albatross, and embarrassment beyond Quayle.

Posted by: LawnBoy at September 29, 2008 8:59 AM
Comment #264925

>It may very well be that they are trying to hide her, but why Philadelphia then? Why not somewhere where she would be in more friendly surroundings? Have her parked in Texas or Tennessee?

BTW, the ‘Alabama of the State’ comment is interesting as well…
Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 08:46 AM

Rhinehold,

Maybe because they don’t want to lose T or T? They know she can’t hurt them in a state they don’t have anyway? They may not want her stumbling around losing one they’ve got in the bag? A virtual myriad of reasons…

Posted by: Marysdude at September 29, 2008 9:00 AM
Comment #264926

Palin is being mishandled, McCain has expressed his displeasure with her handlers and is changing them. I think that if you think you’ve heard the last of Palin you are committing a political mistake.

You are ignoring the concept that she is going to be hidden from the media’s view until the debate, which will draw a LOT more viewers than it would have if this was not surrounding her. There are more than one way of looking at it.

I imagine that the debate on Thursday is going to be the changing point IMO. One of two things is going to happen.

One, she is going to do horribly and will go back into obscurity on the campaign trail and cost McCain probably 2-4%.

Two, she performs very well and then hits the ground running after the debate is over, putting the national polls back to McCain on top and Pennsylvania is the decision state.

The wrong thinking assume that the view they want to be the truth is. It happens with sports fans all of the time, ignoring the failings of your team or discounting your opponent. Politics is a full contact sport.

As for Palin and Quayle, considering I knew Quayle personally and know how he was mistreated by his opponents, I can say that you are probably correct in how a straw man is being built up to tear down, truth is a minor adjunct.

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 9:08 AM
Comment #264928

Looks like the start of another bad week for PALIN/mccain. Gallup has Obama up 50-42 and winning the debate handily. McCain is looking worse and worse on the whole “suspend my campaign for the good of my country” nonsense and blowing up the bailout meeting and supposedly doing more harm than good. Now all week will focus on Palin which is not a good thing for their campaign. In lieu of Palin actually talking to the press we will be seeing clips of Tina Fey all week and that isn’t good for the GOP.

If she does pull the mother of all upsets on Thursday and has been playing stupid with the press trying to lull Biden into a false sense of security then they will be back on track. But I wouldn’t bet the $700 billion bailout check on it.

Rhinehold - you’re right about PA - it will be hard for Obama to win without it in his column. He can still win without it but if he loses PA it means he is losing badly with white working class voters which also hurts in Michigan and Ohio among other states. But things are trending solidly Obama for now. He came across as much more appealing to independent voters in the debate, less angry, and less partisan.

The Palin gamble looks to be falling apart. It created a “wow” for a couple of weeks and solidified and energized the base of the GOP but the more she talks the worse it gets for her. She has dug several deep holes in lying about the bridge (& road) to nowhere and selling her plane on eBay, and the baffling stuff she has said about Russia and doesn’t seem to be willing to let them go. She apparently missed the memo about when you’re in a hole, stop digging.

Posted by: tcsned at September 29, 2008 9:24 AM
Comment #264929

What’s all the fuss about Sarah?

Right now, she is getting smoked BUT this is BD (Before Debate).

Old Blowhard Joe, probably reading a high school history book to find out when the Depression was and who was the president back then will surely step on his tongue again.

AD (After Debate) three things will happen: McCain gets a bounce, Sarah goes mad dog on Barry, and all thos 527’s begin to drop their Barry bombs …carpet bomb actually…and McCain steals the election.

By the way: The Eagle is taking a collection for Barney Frank. That guy looks like a stuffed sausage in those button down shirts he wears. The Eagle wants to buy him a couple new wide collar shirts in nice Republician white.

Anyway, Sarah, who has as much foreign experience as Bill Clinton did when he assumed office will do just fine.

I hope SNL has a retired comic to do a decent imitation of him!

Posted by: sicilian eagle at September 29, 2008 9:29 AM
Comment #264930
blowing up the bailout meeting and supposedly doing more harm than good.

This bill we have today is better than the bill as it was on Wednesday last week (I still oppose it), the House Reps were spurred on to demand their changes by McCain. How is that a failure and doing more harm than good?

As I understand it, all McCain said in the meeting was ‘Do not walk all over the House Republicans or you won’t get a deal’…

selling her plane on eBay

Which of course she never lied about.

And we know Obama and Biden have never, ever, stretched the truth at all…

If we want disqualifications on that point, we will be looking for some new presidential and vice-presidential candidates…

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 9:33 AM
Comment #264931

Hmm Alabammy of Pa.. must be where I am from, SW corner just north of the Mason-Dixon line, I guess the area of the state that does cling to it’s God and guns… Quite honestly Mrs. palin has no need to come over here although we would be happy to have her… Union working class county here, Big in Coal And EVEN with the unions backing Obama.. (which i have no clue why since the Dems have always been the ones trying to get rid of their jobs since coal is the debil(not even going to go into Gore’s comments about Civil Disobidience needed)).

But They about have the small town areas around here locked up for every Obama sign you seen 8 of MCcain. We didn’t like Gore, we didn’t like Kerry even though his wife is big in our favorite ketchup. We don’t have much use for Elitists or their mentality.

Posted by: Rhancheck at September 29, 2008 10:06 AM
Comment #264932

Rhancheck,

Retrace your post and then think about the last line you wrote. I have friends from Sunbury and Chambersburg who wanted to get out of the center of PA for the “Philly-Pittsburgh-Texas in the Middle”
mentality that a lot of people there exude.

If you buy into the right wing’s use of the words “Elitists” “Liberal Media” or “Left-Wing Conspiracy”, then consider that you have bought into spin and sold out.

The same goes for the left wing’s use of “God N’ Gun toting Repubs” or that all Republicans are oil barons, etc.

You know the middle of PA, there’s not many people who’d claim to be financially rich, you won’t find 20 acre mansions like some places in NY or NJ. It looks pretty much like Illinois, or Ohio rather than Texas or Arizona.

And for the jobs you mentioned that Democrats have been trying to get rid of, most, if not all if you go company to company, are for either violations in safety, environmental violations using the same practices they’ve been using since the 70’s, or trying to get them to convert to cleaner ways to refine coal, one of the chief ways being coal liquefaction, turning it into gasoline or methanol. Many Republicans have disagreed with this citing it’s a waste of time and money, yet converting coal on a national scale would reduce demand for oil because we’d have a viable alternative for the short term right here in PA, and Kentucky, and West Virginia.

Posted by: Jon at September 29, 2008 10:31 AM
Comment #264933

Rhinehold

At this point none of us have seen enough of her to form any kind of solid opinion of her strengths. She certainly has managed to appear a bit ditzy and lacking in knowledge in the few rather fluffy interviews she has done. I don’t think there can be any doubt that she is in training for the job at hand. It sure looked to me like she was looking at her hands a lot during the Couric interview. Cliff notes maybe? The impression I have is that she may be your typical politician in that she has more knowledge of standard rhetoric than actual fact or educated opinion surrounding fact. I certainly am not discounting her. But to date all indications are that she is well out of her league.

I see the debate will consist of eight 10 minute segments of individual issues in which the candidates will comment individually and be encouraged to actively respond back and forth. It will center on domestic and foreign policy issues. People will be looking to see if she is capable of responding in depth and with actual knowledge and understanding of issues. The latter has been her failing to date. She has not appeared as confident and assertive of late. I suspect that is because she is lacking enough knowledge on a broad range of issues to make her so. Campaign slogans and short John McCain histories will not get it done for the American people Thursday night. Anything less than an appearance of being emotionally strong, fully knowledgeable and crisis ready will not be enough.

Posted by: RickIL at September 29, 2008 10:32 AM
Comment #264934

If Sarah Palin is so unqualified to be VP and a detriment to the McCain campaign, why is the left trying so hard to get her taken off the ticket? Could it be, they are terrified of her? With all the talk of BHO being up in the polls, (and of course, when he is down in the polls, the polls don’t mean anything – you know who you are) and Palin being so unqualified, she is still bringing 10’s of thousands to her rallies. Can you answer that?

I believe this debate could go either way. If Biden makes more gaffs in the heat of the debate, I believe Palin is smart enough to respond. I have been to DC and listened to the house and senate debates several times. The house is much more exciting and emotional. The senate is frankly boring because senators spend so much time praising the other side of the isle. My point is, I believe Palin will go after Biden like a “pit bull”, and I hope she does. If Biden attacks her, the public will be sympathetic and he will be viewed as a bully. This will also cause women to be sympathetic to her.

I agree with RH, it has been well stated among conservatives, that the McCain campaign has stifled Palin and that she should be cut loose. I depends how the debate turns out. If she does well, she will hit the ground running.

I don’t think the polls mean a whole lot, when asked who they support; most people (especially democrats) do not want to be identified with racist, so they say BHO. But when they are behind the curtain, the truth will come out. Why do you suppose BHO’s campaign is so concerned about the large portion of blue-collar workers (who are normally democrat) not supporting BHO? That is why many pundits, including Dick Morris, believe BHO must be up by 7 to 15 points on Election Day, in order to win.

I noticed that Tom Brokaw interviewed Bill Clinton and he still can’t bring himself to support BHO, although he did continue to praise McCain. This will continue to hurt BHO and the Clinton’s will continue to undercut him. A lot of questions have been “where is Sarah” and my question is “where is Hillary”?

Posted by: Oldguy at September 29, 2008 10:50 AM
Comment #264935

oldguy

If Biden attacks her, the public will be sympathetic and he will be viewed as a bully. This will also cause women to be sympathetic to her.

I disagree on this. She agreed to enter a realm in which gender can have no particular advantage. Decisions made in this arena require toughness of character and vast knowledge of events surrounding issues. Any serious voter will not hold tough debate against her opponent so long as it is not intentionally condescending and demeaning in character as McCain attempted with Obama. This is not a congeniality contest.

Posted by: RickIL at September 29, 2008 10:59 AM
Comment #264936

Rhancheck

But They about have the small town areas around here locked up for every Obama sign you seen 8 of MCcain. We didn’t like Gore, we didn’t like Kerry even though his wife is big in our favorite ketchup. We don’t have much use for Elitists or their mentality.

I agree with you, I live in Ohio and I just noted to my wife the lack of BHO signs and yet there are many McCain signs. Even in democratic areas.

The NRA is strong among the “God and guns” people. Clinton told Gore, after his defeat, the NRA beat him in WV. Just today, I heard the leadership in St. Louis, has warned the NRA to not run any adds attacking BHO, by threat of arrest. So much for freedom of speech. This type of talk will only make people mad and encourage them to continue their attacks.

The left will never learn.

Posted by: Oldguy at September 29, 2008 11:08 AM
Comment #264938

RickIL said:

“I disagree on this. She agreed to enter a realm in which gender can have no particular advantage. Decisions made in this arena require toughness of character and vast knowledge of events surrounding issues. Any serious voter will not hold tough debate against her opponent so long as it is not intentionally condescending and demeaning in character as McCain attempted with Obama. This is not a congeniality contest.”

Let me prove you wrong. It doesn’t matter what realm she entered. It is not about Palin herself, it is about how the public perceives her. As long as the left attacked Palin, she received support, whether sympathy or not. Have you noticed how the left media has backed off their personal attacks. It is a fact, women did not like the way HRC was treated and they have and will watch very closely how Palin is treated.

You talk about “serious voters” as if most voters are really serious and thoughtful about their choices. Does this include the 90+% of blacks that are voting for BHO simply because he is black? I am sure they are serious.

Posted by: Oldguy at September 29, 2008 11:29 AM
Comment #264939

It is a fact, women did not like the way HRC was treated and they have and will watch very closely how Palin is treated.

Please reread this portion of my comment. Any serious voter will not hold tough debate against her opponent so long as it is not intentionally condescending and demeaning in character

I am sure all of us will be watching to see that she is treated fairly. We all should also be watching to see that she is not given lower expectations and advantage because of her gender. She is playing with the big boys now. As I said before, congeniality has no relevance in this game.

Posted by: RickIL at September 29, 2008 11:38 AM
Comment #264942

Rural folks at least up here in the finger lake region of upstate NY that i have talked too feel like Hilliary was railroaded by the DNC and the elite players in the Democratic party, they still are very angry and tell me that they will vote for MC cain -palin ticket or Nader.

Posted by: Rodney Brown at September 29, 2008 11:48 AM
Comment #264945

Rhinehold - from reports I have heard McCain sat silently through the first 45 minutes of the meeting then springs the “I have a different plan” on everyone. While all voices should be heard this was just a grandstanding play on McCain’s part. Very suspect.

Sorry Rhinehold - you are right Palin was just deceptive by saying she “put” the plane on eBay (implying she sold it there) it was McCain that said she sold it on eBay and for a profit - both untrue. Granted McCain isn’t familiar with the intarwebs and stuff.

OG - I haven’t heard of anyone on my side being so afraid of her that they want her off the ticket. Politically speaking, I say keep her there she’s such a horrid candidate that she is the proverbial concrete shoes sending McCain to the bottom of the lake. I would say that speaking in the best interests of my country, I say chuck her off the ticket on the off chances that McCain actually wins and doesn’t survive his presidency. I want the best person possible to lead the country even if that person is not from my party and she ain’t it. I would say the same about McCain but considering that Romney or Giuliani, the other viable choices, would have been much worse he is probably the best they had to offer. I thought if he wanted a Christian conservative he should have taken Huckabee - don’t agree with him on anything but he’s smart, funny, and a decent bass player. Though he isn’t a woman (that I know of) and wouldn’t be a good “pander to the Hillary crowd” pick.

You also said, “Just today, I heard the leadership in St. Louis, has warned the NRA to not run any adds attacking BHO, by threat of arrest.” Do you have a source for that? If that is true it is truly disturbing and very anti-free speech.

I also agree with you on the point about the Dems position on the 2nd Amendment hurts them with a constituency that might otherwise vote in their economic self interests with the Dem Party. I’m a pro-2nd Amendment Dem, or better said, I am a pro Bill of Rights Dem and #2 is one of them. That’s one of the reasons why Obama should be buddying up to Jim Webb and getting him to help out more in the part of VA I live in.

Posted by: tcsned at September 29, 2008 11:56 AM
Comment #264955

The Palin interview with Katie Couric was so bad, there are two incoherent answers they are withholding… for now. If Palin can’t handle Katie Couric, what will she do in a confrontational interview? Some Republican conservatives are calling for her to be pulled from the ticket. The debate Thursday night will determine that. I predicted she would be pulled from the ticket by mid-September, but the window of opportunity for the GOP is getting smaller and smaller.

Rhinehold,
I will hold to my prediction of a landslide for Obama. I predicted 56% for Obama. It’s looking better and better.

Posted by: phx8 at September 29, 2008 12:25 PM
Comment #264958

Dingle and others from Michigan have never said anything against the 2nd amend for good reason.

But the left dems can’t help themselves, they insist on disarming the public and abortion is the Holy Grail.

I think Biden is an idiot loose cannon, but I believe he is perfect for BHO. I would never want him to be replaced no matter what stupid things he says. I was with Rush Limbaugh, praying that BHO would choose him.

On a lighter note, Pelosi is addressing the congress. What is it with her hair, she looks ragged out. This morning Barney Frank’s hair looked like Albert Einstein’s. It was sticking straight out. The only thing I can think is, he must have had a bad night with one of his interns. Or were they pulling out their hair last night.

She is begging for a by-partisan vote under another threat of crisis.

Posted by: Oldguy at September 29, 2008 12:38 PM
Comment #264962

Rhinegold was right for once. She has been mishandled. If she would answer in generalities and openly admit she does not know the finer points the electorate would eat it up.

Look for that on Thursday. She will turn her lack of political saavy into a plus and beat Biden.

I have thusly predicted.

Posted by: Schwamp at September 29, 2008 12:55 PM
Comment #264963

Oldguy:
Where is Sarah Palin?

Posted by: john trevisani at September 29, 2008 12:55 PM
Comment #264967

Schwamp,
Inexperience and ignorance are not virtues.

Posted by: phx8 at September 29, 2008 1:13 PM
Comment #264968

“Inexperience and ignorance are not virtues”

No, but they sure will get you elected President.

Posted by: kctim at September 29, 2008 1:17 PM
Comment #264969

As I said in Ray Guest’s ‘Is This A Free Country’ thread below, I think the Katie Couric interview proved beyond doubt that Sarah Palin is certainly not of presidential caliber, and is in fact, embarrassingly stupid and clueless. But, I expect Palin to do extremely well in the VP debate against Joe Biden. In fact, she might even be perceived as winning their debate hands down.

The reason I think so is because the McCain campaign succeeded in getting the debate rules changed to help Palin do better than might be ordinarily expected for someone so unqualified for the VP position and with such a demonstrably limited intellect. Those changes they demanded are going to allow her to used a prepared script so she can simply repeat a bunch of canned GOP talking points — and there will be absolutely no follow up questions. Reading from a script is something that Sarah Palin is sure to be excellent at doing — after all, for a few years she made her living working on television.
What I expect to see on Thursday from Palin is the best acting job she can manage to pull off, not a real debate.

Posted by: Veritas Vincit at September 29, 2008 1:17 PM
Comment #264970

phx8,
but charm and candor are -
and don’t underestimate the countries willingness to root for an underdog.

Posted by: Schwamp at September 29, 2008 1:19 PM
Comment #264972

“In fact, she might even be perceived as winning their debate hands down”

And so the “just in case Palin does a good job” excuses begin.
How surprising, yawn.

Posted by: kctim at September 29, 2008 1:27 PM
Comment #264974

kctim:
Since Sarah was your first selection as the VP nominee; i’m guessing because of her impressive resume, explain to me why you think that McCain has put a muzzle on her?

Where is Sarah Palin?

Did you see the report about her, while in Philly, while she was dining with some supporters? Someone asked her about Pakistan and she agree with Obama to go in to Pakistan and take out the operatives. McCain issued a back-pedal response to explain her statement.

Where is Sarah Palin?

Posted by: john trevisani at September 29, 2008 1:31 PM
Comment #264975

kctim:

And so the “just in case Palin does a good job” excuses begin.

WTF are you talking about? I gave the reason why I expect her to do very well, and flat out said that she is likely to do so.

How surprising, yawn.

What’s not “surprising, yawn” is that your comment comes off as cantankerous and snarky.

Posted by: Veritas Vincit at September 29, 2008 1:34 PM
Comment #264977

“I’ve been hearing his speeches since I was in the second grade,” the 44-year-old Alaska governor said of her counterpart, who is 65 and a veteran of more than 35 years in the Senate.”

Palin’s latest. I don’t think there is any danger of her playing the candor card.

Posted by: Schwamp at September 29, 2008 1:36 PM
Comment #264978

VV -

I agree - it won’t be a real debate. That’s a true disservice to the American people.

LawnBoy -

Yes, an albatross is truly heavier than a quayle - good pun!

Posted by: Glenn Contrarian at September 29, 2008 1:39 PM
Comment #264979

Glenn,

I wish it were intentional :(

Posted by: LawnBoy at September 29, 2008 1:43 PM
Comment #264980

Sarah is a phenomenon whose newness has peaked. No doubt the Republican party felt she would salve the wounds of the Hillary supporters. That was a really poor attempt on their part and ended up quite a joke. People came out in droves to check her out and a lot resented that she was being foisted on us in an attempt to replace her.
Curiosity is killing the cat…..people are seeing that she is shallow and not very bright. Too bad, but she doesn’t appear to know the difference between humility and humiliate !

Posted by: janedoe at September 29, 2008 1:45 PM
Comment #264984

John T.
First, I am not a McCain supporter, so she isn’t really “my first choice.”
Second, she is not out and about for obvious reasons: she is learning and they are prepping her.
Third, who gives a crap if she agrees with Obama on some issues? She has her own mind and holds her own positions. Hell, I am a constitutionalist and I’ve even agreed with the annointed one at times. Who cares if its not what the GOP wants said or not, let her speak her own mind.
And lastly, all this talk about her being stupid or clueless is based solely on her having a different opinion on things such as abortion. There is no basis for it and it is nothing but BS partisan talking points meant to head off the huge interest her selection garnered.

Posted by: kctim at September 29, 2008 2:10 PM
Comment #264986

“WTF are you talking about? I gave the reason why I expect her to do very well, and flat out said that she is likely to do so”

Yes, because there is no way she could be prepared and more intelligent than you want her to get credit for, is there?
That is truly what this all about. You have no clue as to her intelect or what she is about. All you know is that she does not support what you personally want her too, so she is stupid and clueless.
Bottomline: More people like her than what you would like, so you must cast your partisan opinions around in hopes they will presuade others to not vote for her because she is “stupid.”

What happened to its not about experience, lets stick to the issues? Oh yeah, that went out the freakin window when your poor choice for a candidate made this a close race.

Posted by: kctim at September 29, 2008 2:16 PM
Comment #264987

kctim, if you truly don’t understand why we think she is stupid, go back and watch her interviews. You’ve got to know that the ones they have released are the best of the bunch, and just that alone should give you cause to be very afraid!!
Her views are her own, even though they don’t coincide with mine and many others’.
I don’t even agree any more that she is ignorant…..I’m throwing it all in the pot for stupidity.

Posted by: janedoe at September 29, 2008 2:17 PM
Comment #264988
Sorry Rhinehold - you are right Palin was just deceptive by saying she “put” the plane on eBay (implying she sold it there) it was McCain that said she sold it on eBay and for a profit - both untrue. Granted McCain isn’t familiar with the intarwebs and stuff.

No, only one untrue, McCain made the mistake of assuming that she sold the plane on ebay. She did put it on ebay, just like she said, and did so three times. That she eventually had to use a broker to sell the plane doesn’t change the story in the least, she still got rid of the plane and put the money back into the budget process.

I’ve never understood the fascination about this, it just seems that some people want to create a characture so badly that they will parrot any old line that comes along and then try to attack it. Just as we don’t want people saying incorrect things about Obama and McCain, so we too want to be correct when speaking about Palin.

So why not just focus on the other areas that actually are valid knocks about her and leave the other stuff that is not there out of the discussion? Just can’t help yourself?


Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 2:23 PM
Comment #264989

kctim, so are you dizzy yet from all your spinning?
Go back and READ what VV wrote.
The woman is going to be able to use a frikkin’ script, and won’t have to rely on her own brain. So whose words are we going to be hearing? They’ve had time now to see questions….create a script for her and there will probably be someone sitting in front of her giving her cues.
Way to go Reps….you’ve found yourself a puppet.
Here is the link VV….thanks for the heads up…

http://primebuzz.kcstar.com/?q=node/14514

Posted by: janedoe at September 29, 2008 2:27 PM
Comment #264990
all this talk about her being stupid or clueless is based solely on her having a different opinion on things such as abortion

Have you actually even seen her try to answer questions from an interviewer?

It’s not about her position on one issue or another, it’s her inability to produce a coherent sentence or paragraph when asked a difficult question (and sometimes even with softballs).

I disagree with Newt Gingrich on a lot, but that doesn’t mean I think he’s stupid; he’s very intelligent. Please don’t insult the intelligence of everyone here with whom you disagree by so grossly misrepresenting our objections.

Posted by: LawnBoy at September 29, 2008 2:27 PM
Comment #264991

Wait a minute, it is being insinuated here that she will have the questions in advance and can read from a script. Is this true? I find this hard to believe. Does anyone have a source? If this is true then this is just a photo op.

Posted by: Schwamp at September 29, 2008 2:38 PM
Comment #264992

kctim,

Yes, because there is no way she could be prepared and more intelligent than you want her to get credit for, is there?
That is truly what this all about. You have no clue as to her intelect or what she is about. All you know is that she does not support what you personally want her too, so she is stupid and clueless.

As Jane just said, go watch the celebrity style interviews that Palin has done thus far. If you don’t watch them, you simply aren’t going understand a word we’re writing. But the truth is, they are all the proof we need to say that she is absolutely unprepared for the VP role, and that she is most definitely and without a doubt, appallingly stupid.

What happened to its not about experience,


When someone doesn’t have enough experience in a job interview, their level of intelligence becomes overwhelmingly important. Palin has neither the experience or the intellect for the job she is seeking.

lets stick to the issues?

Palin’s serious and obvious lack of intellect IS an issue. This is due to the age and horrific health history of John McCain. We have also just been through eight years with a president whose intellect was terribly lacking — and it certainly shows. The precarious state of this nation at this very moment is simply too dire to take such a risk. This is also an important issue.

close race.

We’ll see. Personally, I believe America must still have an instinct for self-preservation. They already voted for the guy they wanted to have a beer with, and found that didn’t work out real well for them.

Posted by: Veritas Vincit at September 29, 2008 2:38 PM
Comment #264993
You also said, “Just today, I heard the leadership in St. Louis, has warned the NRA to not run any adds attacking BHO, by threat of arrest.” Do you have a source for that? If that is true it is truly disturbing and very anti-free speech.

http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Federal/Read.aspx?id=4192

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 2:39 PM
Comment #264994

All

I took this from janedoes link above. I think it says it all.

McCain advisers said they were only somewhat concerned about Ms. Palin’s debating skills compared with those of Mr. Biden, who has served six terms in the Senate, or about his chances of tripping her up. Instead, they say, they wanted Ms. Palin to have opportunities to present Mr. McCain’s positions, rather than spending time talking about her experience or playing defense.

In other words they do not trust her to be able to aptly defend herself anywhere outside the realm of standard rhetoric.

Posted by: RickIL at September 29, 2008 2:41 PM
Comment #264995

Not to belabor this insignificant point but that was precisely why Palin mentioned the eBay thing was so that people would believe that she actually sold it there. I don’t know why they would try to mislead in such a way because it doesn’t really matter if she sold the plane below its market value on eBay or privately. If she was being honest why not say we tried to sell it on eBay and couldn’t or that we just sold the plane? It does change the story. Seems like lying by omission to me. My mom would have washed my mouth out with soap had I done that. I think they thought that the eBay thing would sound like she was youthful and hip and internet savvy. Unlike her associate and soon to be former senator, and guy with a number on his orange jumpsuit Ted “Series of Tubes” Stevens.

You are right there are a lot more substantive reasons why she is a disaster than this lie by omission.

In other news the House just rejected the bailout - stock market is plummeting. Yikes.

Posted by: tcsned at September 29, 2008 2:43 PM
Comment #264997

I am hearing reports of threats of ‘hate crimes’ for ads as well, since Obama is black, from a St. Louis attorney working for the campaign, but I have as of yet found no evidence to suggest this is true, so until you see researched don’t believe it, is my contention.

If I do find evidence of this though, I will make sure to post on it.

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 2:44 PM
Comment #264998

LB
Yes, I have seen her interviews and yes, she is thinking too much of what the GOP thinks she should say instead of speaking her mind. That and nerves are what the problem is, not her intelligence.
Without his notes, Obama doesn’t sound smart enough to run a Pizza Hut, let alone the country, but how many people call him stupid? Only the extremes. But its not just the extremes with Palin, you guys are so afraid of her possibly helping McCain, you resort to questioning something you have no clue about.

“Please don’t insult the intelligence of everyone here with whom you disagree by so grossly misrepresenting our objections”

Your only objection is that she is not from the left.
You put up a leftist candidate for the #1 spot, with no experience and tell us experience is not important for that position, but it is to be #2.
You put up a leftist candidate for the #1 spot who has a hard time speaking with notes and say thats not important, but it is to be #2.
You put up a leftist candidate for the #1 spot with very questionable associations and tell us that is not important, but it is to be #2.

The only misrepresenting going on here is you guys acting like you have a clue as to how inteligent or not she is.

janedoe
Why should I be dizzy? I’m not trying to convince people to vote for Obama.

Posted by: kctim at September 29, 2008 2:47 PM
Comment #264999
that was precisely why Palin mentioned the eBay thing was so that people would believe that she actually sold it there. I don’t know why they would try to mislead in such a way because it doesn’t really matter if she sold the plane below its market value on eBay or privately. If she was being honest why not say we tried to sell it on eBay and couldn’t or that we just sold the plane? It does change the story. Seems like lying by omission to me.

Because it makes a more compelling story and soundbite to know that a governor put up a plane on ebay. Having to then say ‘but it didn’t sell three separate times so we ended up going with a private broker to get the best price for the citizens’ just doesn’t fit well on a bumper sticker or on the evening news?

My question is why ignore the obviousness of that and keep belaboring the point? I just makes people look like they are trying to invent an issue that doesn’t exist when there are other valid criticisms that people could be focusing on to make their point much better.

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 2:48 PM
Comment #265000

Rhinegold,
I’m willing to bet there is another side to that story - if there is a story - other than what NRA ILA says.
Those people need some way to relieve their testosterone other than in politics.

Posted by: Schwamp at September 29, 2008 2:50 PM
Comment #265002

Well, in regards to the NRA ILA story, they produced the actual letters that were sent. This isn’t the first time either, Obama’s lawyers did the same thing a few weeks ago with an email to followers to shut down an interview at a talk radio station concerning Ayers and ACORN, and also in regards to his fight with Hillary as well.

This isn’t an isolated incident but a pattern that is, to me, disturbing. Supporters will obviously defend him, but what about true independants when they see what is occurring?

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 2:55 PM
Comment #265009

Schwamp, it isn’t an insinuation…..here is the link again:

http://primebuzz.kcstar.com/?q=node/14514

Posted by: janedoe at September 29, 2008 3:05 PM
Comment #265011
Having to then say ‘but it didn’t sell three separate times so we ended up going with a private broker to get the best price for the citizens’ just doesn’t fit well on a bumper sticker or on the evening news?

Except Palin didn’t get the best price. She made her state take a loss on the cost of that plane. Moreover, the state used to use that plane to transport prisoners, but now they have to be bought expensive plane tickets when they have to fly them anywhere, where before it was only the cost of fuel Alaskans had to pay for. Palin should have kept the plane rather than sell it for so much less than the people of her state had bought it for — but of course then she wouldn’t have had a cutesy little narrative to later campaign on.

Posted by: Veritas Vincit at September 29, 2008 3:11 PM
Comment #265012
Your only objection is that she is not from the left.

tim,

You’re wrong, even more so than usual. You’re also arrogant in assuming you know what I and others think.

Please put your straw man down and deal with the actual arguments here instead of what you wish we were saying.

Posted by: LawnBoy at September 29, 2008 3:16 PM
Comment #265016

They should pull a switcheroo, and substitute Tina Fey for Palin.

Rezko is due for sentencing and is ready to play “let’s make a deal”.

The bailout failed today, and should now be the main issue in the election, instead of the personalities of the candidates.

Posted by: ohrealy at September 29, 2008 3:19 PM
Comment #265020
Except Palin didn’t get the best price. She made her state take a loss on the cost of that plane.

Actually, she *DID* get the best price. Of course she didn’t get full new price on a used plane, but she did recover money to put back into the budget for the people. The budget still came out ahead in the deal.

Now we are going to criticize her for not getting full retail price on a used jet?

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 3:24 PM
Comment #265022

Rhinehold -
Last I will say on the eBay thing - you said they did it because it makes a better soundbite - it’s still intentionally misleading. Sorry the true story isn’t as compelling as the misleading one. What I have read was that is was sold for below market value not below market value for the same plane new off the assembly line.

I read that article by the NRA and the letter - I didn’t see any threat to arrest the NRA or the radio station. They did try to dispel misinformation in an ad and cited the legal justification for pulling the ad it mentioned violating license rules but not arrest.

It was over the top and it is an issue that I disagree generally with many in my party over. I would give the Obama camp a thumb’s down for that one.

I don’t think we really have this right anymore for reasons that have nothing to do with hunting rifles, assault rifles, and ammunition and everything to do with going against the founders intentions for this amendment.

Though this is one of ten amendments in our precious Bill of Rights while my party has been pretty weak on this one seeing what has happened in the last 8 years to #1, #4, #5, #6, & #8 I would say the GOP is on pretty weak ground as far as standing up for the Bill of Rights goes. John McCain, the Maverick, hasn’t stood up against Bush in a substantive way that would indicate things would be any different the Bush.

Posted by: tcsned at September 29, 2008 3:28 PM
Comment #265023

Ah yes LB, you are correct.
I am so arrogant for assuming what you all think, but you are wise and noble for assuming you know how inteligent Palin is and what she thinks.
Obama politics at its best.

Posted by: kctim at September 29, 2008 3:29 PM
Comment #265024
Actually, she *DID* get the best price. Of course she didn’t get full new price on a used plane,

There was no reason to sell the plane at all. It was being used not just for Alaskan governors, but to transport their prisoners — which they now have to pay a lot to do. The state lost all the way around. But Palin got the little narrative she can campaign on.

but she did recover money to put back into the budget for the people.

Her state didn’t need that money. It’s not like the state of Alaska is poor and desperate.

The budget still came out ahead in the deal.

No it didn’t. Because they lost money on the plane, and now have to pay top dollar for their prisoner transport.

Posted by: Veritas Vincit at September 29, 2008 3:33 PM
Comment #265027
I read that article by the NRA and the letter - I didn’t see any threat to arrest the NRA or the radio station. They did try to dispel misinformation in an ad and cited the legal justification for pulling the ad it mentioned violating license rules but not arrest.

tc.,Rhinehold, I had just read the same thing, and agree that there isn’t anything there to be perceived as a “threat”. Merely an admonishment of proper journalism.

Posted by: janedoe at September 29, 2008 3:43 PM
Comment #265035

rhinehold:tc:janedoe:
can someone explain how we got from Palin going MIA to an NRA scare campaign?
Please folks, let’s stay close the thread.

Posted by: john.trevisani at September 29, 2008 4:11 PM
Comment #265044

sorry John -

After the stock market took a 780 point dive today I hope Palin’s handlers have given her something better to say about the economic situation than she told Katie Couric.

Posted by: tcsned at September 29, 2008 4:27 PM
Comment #265048

Is Palin really going to be allowed to read answers at the debate? That really strains belief. I must not be understanding it correctly.

777 down on the DJIA. Oh oh. Well, if the House can make an arrangement on the bailout, the markets will bounce back a good deal. Supposedly Pelosi and Boehner each agreed to deliver the votes of at least half of their parties. The GOP, despite the backing of the president and the presidential nominee, couldn’t deliver their party.

McCain gave a speech this morning taking credit for the bailout. What a dope.

EPIC FAIL

Posted by: phx8 at September 29, 2008 4:34 PM
Comment #265050

Rhinehold,

When the plane didn’t go on ebay, she threw one of her little fits, and in a snit, sold the plane for less than it was worth…she might want to use this little tid-bit for a fairy tail story, but the end result is still a fairy tail.

Posted by: Marysdude at September 29, 2008 4:37 PM
Comment #265051

Yes, john…..this is how we got diverted..

Comment #264997 I am hearing reports of threats of ‘hate crimes’ for ads as well, since Obama is black, from a St. Louis attorney working for the campaign, but I have as of yet found no evidence to suggest this is true, so until you see researched don’t believe it, is my contention.

If I do find evidence of this though, I will make sure to post on it.

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 02:44 PM


Posted by: janedoe at September 29, 2008 4:37 PM
Comment #265065

*sigh* No, though I find it interesting that the *4th* comment about the issue, the one with me defending Obama being ignored as well, is the one that got us ‘off track’.

Let me make it clear for you, k?

Comment #264936 (Ranacheck) Mentions the issue
Comment #264945 (tcsned) Asks for a source
Comment #264993 (Rhinehold) I gave a source I found, trying to be helpful
Comment #264997 (Rhinehold) I mention more in regards to the accusation and say not to believe it until it is fully investigated (as I did with Palin when attacks on her started though ignorance).

So, somehow that leads to me being the one derailing the conversation.

Imagine that.


Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 5:15 PM
Comment #265066
When the plane didn’t go on ebay, she threw one of her little fits, and in a snit, sold the plane for less than it was worth…she might want to use this little tid-bit for a fairy tail story, but the end result is still a fairy tail.

No, Marysdude, the listed it 3 times on ebay and then reluctantly consulted a private broker to find the best deal. Do you really think the broker would not have found the best price for the plane, foregoing a higher commission in order to sell it for below fair market value?

What source do you have that it was sold for ‘less than market value’ then if you are the one making that accusation and going against Occam’s razor?

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 5:19 PM
Comment #265084

phx8, that’s the only info I found after VV posted the original comment. It is truly hard to believe the committee…would consider changing the format.

I just saw this, too… Seems as though Couric scored a scoop ….. ;)
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/09/cbs_to_air_more_footage_of_cou.php

Posted by: janedoe at September 29, 2008 6:21 PM
Comment #265088
I couldn’t verify Kurtz’s contention that Palin’s answers will “likely prove embarrassing,” but…

…that won’t stop me from ‘reporting’ it anyway.

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 6:27 PM
Comment #265089

Jane, phx8,
Here is the article where I first read that they’d demanded specific rules especially for Sarah Palin at the McCain campaign’s request: Pact on Debates Will Let McCain and Obama Spar

The way they set it up is going to allow her to be carefully scripted for Thursdays debate by her handlers.

Posted by: Veritas Vincit at September 29, 2008 6:33 PM
Comment #265095

Thanks VV, and no matter how many times I read it, nothing changes and I still can’t believe that they bowed to the campaigns’ pressure.
What is actually sad, is that “her own people” know how lame she is and need to protect her.

Posted by: janedoe at September 29, 2008 7:04 PM
Comment #265112

Sure enough, another item from Palin’s interview with Katie Couric. When asked, Palin could not name a single supreme court case, other than Roe v Wade. Instead of blathering on, she opted for silence.

That’s pretty bad.

Posted by: phx8 at September 29, 2008 9:42 PM
Comment #265118

So, does anyone think we’ll be surprised at another “crisis” that she and McCain need to attend to, instead of her being at the debates??
And he is starting to tank now, too……getting caught up in all kinds of contradictions from things she is saying and those that has said….and forgotten about.
This is like slapstick comedy !

Posted by: janedoe at September 29, 2008 11:01 PM
Comment #265135

>What source do you have that it was sold for ‘less than market value’ then if you are the one making that accusation and going against Occam’s razor?
Posted by: Rhinehold at September 29, 2008 05:19 PM

Rhinehold,

What proofs do I need???

Her own handlers characterize her as ambitious, and they say she is impatient with anything that detracts her from her goals, and she describes herself as a pit-bull in lipstick…

I think we’ve found out where some of that foreign relations experience came from…didn’t that guy who bought her jet start using it to ferry rich hunters over to Siberia for some shooting sport? Isn’t Sarah a shooting sport enthusiast? Now, there’s some foreign relations experience for you…I’m pretty sure that qualifies her to take over as president, should the need arise…

Posted by: Marysdude at September 30, 2008 6:09 AM
Comment #265149
What proofs do I need???

Well, if you are making an accusation that she sold the plane for less than market value, I would say you would need some example of what market value for such a plane was and how much it was sold for and then a comparison of the two.

I know, I haven’t been a nuclear physicist for a little while, but that seems logical to me.

Her own handlers characterize her as ambitious

So she should fit in with quite a lot of people in the US, including most, if not all, politicians…

and they say she is impatient with anything that detracts her from her goals

Again, fitting right in.

Though if your contention is that since she is ‘impatient’ she probably sold it at a firesale price remember two things.

1) It was listed 3 separate times. Not something an ‘impatient’ person would do

2) She used a broker to sell the plane, which takes the ‘impatient’ out of it. The broker goes off to deal with that and she can move on to other ‘goals’. The broker is then, in his best interests, going to get the best price available for it.

Now, there’s some foreign relations experience for you…

Perhaps a little more than Bill Clinton had when he was elected president. Did he turn out ok in your opinion?

Posted by: Rhinehold at September 30, 2008 10:12 AM
Comment #265160

Rhinehold,

Bill went to school way over there in England…according to Palin’s standards that places him way ahead of her.

She took a beating of three hundred thousand on the plane. The payments were in the neighborhood of sixty three thousand per month. Not fighting the equity thing or beating this dead horse, I’ll give you that she didn’t exactly lose money on the deal, but the way she was using the deal to make her out some kind of fiscal hero, it sure didn’t help the state much, and because the plane was being used for other state purposes, may very well have cost in the long run.

No carrot…no stick…

Posted by: Marysdude at September 30, 2008 10:56 AM
Comment #265162

>Perhaps a little more than Bill Clinton had when he was elected president. Did he turn out ok in your opinion?
Posted by: Rhinehold at September 30, 2008 10:12 AM

Rhinehold,

Yes…BUT, I’VE SEEN BILL CLINTON IN ACTION AND, SHE AIN’T NO BILL CLINTON!!!

Posted by: Marysdude at September 30, 2008 11:00 AM
Comment #265179

Y’all just don’t like Sarah because she’s a hell of a lot better looking than Hillary ever thought of being :)

Posted by: Ron Brown at September 30, 2008 1:17 PM
Comment #265197

>Y’all just don’t like Sarah because she’s a hell of a lot better looking than Hillary ever thought of being :)
Posted by: Ron Brown at September 30, 2008 01:17 PM

Ron,

Yeah, but, Hill is better looking than all but a handful of past presidents…I mean, just how pretty were Ike and Lyndon?

Posted by: Marysdude at September 30, 2008 2:14 PM
Comment #265214

Marysdude
No argument there!

Posted by: Ron Brown at September 30, 2008 3:06 PM
Comment #265367

Apparently her proximity to Russia didn’t give her the experience she claimed. This article said that she has never met with any Russian delegation, ever.

But Steve Smirnoff, the Russian Federation’s honorary consul in Anchorage, said Palin never accepted his invitation to open a dialogue with Alaska’s neighbor.

So much for keeping a keen eye on the skies for the flying Putin.

The article also says that she was padding her resume with a non-existent meeting with the British ambassador.

Posted by: tcsned at October 1, 2008 9:48 AM
Comment #265508

Wall Street Welfare Queen.

Posted by: Stephen Hines at October 1, 2008 10:14 PM
Comment #265885

It should come as no surprise that McCain-Palin are now relying on smear and fear in a last ditch effort to win this election with unsubstantiated lies, despite McCain’s two-faced promise to run a clean campaign. First, because John McCain has nothing to run on except a failed policy of deregulation. Second, because he is desperate and knows that lies and smears work. Herman Goering once said that “…people can always be brought to doing the bidding of leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to greater danger.” Fear is a powerful motivator. And the radical right has learned from experience that if they repeat their lies enough people will begin to believe them. Moreover, the more outrageous the lie, the more likely people are to believe it. I for one find it very disturbing that John McCain would openly and proudly embrace the philosophy of one of history’s most notorious and despicable monsters!!!

Posted by: Robert at October 4, 2008 11:06 PM
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