Democrats & Liberals Archives

Bush & Ahmadinejad: Separated at Birth?

Sometimes it is in our greatest enemies that we find our greatest likeness. Now I know that you patriotic Iranian nationals, so proud of your President are going to take offense - but look at the evidence: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is not one whit better than George W. Bush.

Both men rely on a deeply patriotic citizenry to whip up support and silence dissent in pushing forward dangerous policies, whether it's enriching uranium or destabilizing foreign lands. Both make heavy use of plausible deniability when evidence suggests that covert programs aren't quite what they appear to be. Both men might sound reasonable to those who don't pay close enough attention to what's really going on around them, but both are accused of being vicious liars by their detractors. I know I wouldn't trust either one of them if my life depended on it. Both men pander to religious fundamentalists in their country, feigning to be deeply religious but acting in suspiciously secular ways. Both rely on a devoted following to counter growing discontent among moderates in their countries who fear their leadership. Both were democratically elected but some suspect there was something fishy about those elections.

Perhaps Bush is scarier because of the enormous power of the military he controls, but Ahmadinejad is scarier because of the absence of a long historic democratic tradition and system of checks and balances in his country. Funny how they both manage to address the UN on the same day, but somehow manage to completely avoid each other.

So George did it with Vladimir: looked into his soul and found someone he could work with; maybe he can do the same with Mahmoud. Oooh, now that's scary.

Posted by Walker Willingham at September 22, 2006 9:52 AM
Comments
Comment #183186

Walker:

Pure silliness. An interesting idea that you’ve conjured up out of thin air, and a fun read. But nothing but pure silliness in the end. I’m sure you’ll get the obligatory agreement from the bashers, and the obligatory disagreement from the supporters, but in the end…..pure silliness leading to nothingness.

Now, back to the real world….. :)

Posted by: joebagodonuts at September 22, 2006 11:25 AM
Comment #183190

walker,

It is too bad that your blog could not be seen by everyone in the US. It would ensure a Republican victory in November.

You forgot to mention Chavez, I am sure you would think he is a lot like Bush too.

Keep talking it up…

Posted by: Cliff at September 22, 2006 11:52 AM
Comment #183195

Stuff like this is counterproductive.

Posted by: Trent at September 22, 2006 12:24 PM
Comment #183199

Walker

I am sorry that a rational guy like you feels that way. You may want to consider the difference if an Iranian citizen made the same sorts of pronoucements about his president as you did about yours.

It is easy for Americans to bravely claim their government is oppressive because they know it is not. Sometime long exposure to their own rhetoric clouds their judgement and they equate their president with those of places like Iran.

Posted by: Jack at September 22, 2006 12:41 PM
Comment #183200

“Both men rely on a deeply patriotic citizenry to whip up support and silence dissent”

Who the hell silencing you? No one, that’s who! That’s such a tired liberal talking point. If you think these two guys are similar you must be morally bankrupt. Bush seeks to free people, Ahmadinejad seeks to eliminate an entire nation. You be the judge.

Posted by: Ken at September 22, 2006 12:48 PM
Comment #183202

Walker,

I wouldn’t trust either of them if your life depended on it either :-) Excellent points, BTW, no matter what others (trying to be nice here) might infer. Although I think Abimajudubbie is scarier than Bushie because (a) he really is a believer and (b) he has a majority fanatic electorate. We at least have history on our side and the fanatics are a minority.

Posted by: Dave1-20-09 at September 22, 2006 12:59 PM
Comment #183205

Is it just me, or do alot of REPUBLICANS & CONSERVATIVES read/post on the democratic & liberal pages…

I loved it Walker, every bit of it! True!

To the doubters - There is more truth in what Walker posted than there was in anyone’s report claiming there were WMD’s in Iraq…

Posted by: KupA at September 22, 2006 1:49 PM
Comment #183219

KupA:

On Watchblog, more people go both ways than in a transgender bisexual chatroom. Aint it a wonderful use of freedom of speech?

WB is a place where competing ideologies are presented on all three fronts. That’s how it works. Enjoy the fun.

Posted by: joebagodonuts at September 22, 2006 3:00 PM
Comment #183227

Ken & Jack - Bush seeks to free people? what a joke! Freedom and democracy to Bush means the freedom for American corporations to exploit the poor people of other countries. Bush hasn’t freed a single person since he started this insane war on terror (btw - you can’t wage war on a tactic). He has caused the deaths of many thousands (probably 15-20x more than Osama Bin Laden is responsible for). He has imprisoned and tortured innocent people (Arar & probably half the people at Git-mo). The man is clueless as to what democracy and freedom are.

Posted by: tcsned at September 22, 2006 3:30 PM
Comment #183229

Wouldn’t a transgender bisexual chatroom go against your conservative values? How do you know so much about these chat rooms? Are you, in fact, a transgender bisexual yourself?

If you are, I’m fine with that, being the all-accepting, bleeding heart, commie, liberal that I am. I was just curious.

Actually, was “just curious” the screenname you used when entering the chat room you had described earlier?

I understand that it was a “silly” post, but through humor, we are able to reveal many truths.

I don’t believe this post of “silliness” will lead to nothingness, which is what separates it from any REAL inquiry into anything this administration has done.

Posted by: KupA at September 22, 2006 3:33 PM
Comment #183230

I’m sorry, I forgot to address the last post… Joebagodonuts, that was for you.

Posted by: KupA at September 22, 2006 3:38 PM
Comment #183246

tcsned,

“Freedom and democracy to Bush means the freedom for American corporations to exploit the poor people of other countries”
I don’t think so! Bush wants corporations to exploit everyone who isn’t an old money “owner”.

“15 to 20x more” You don’t give the guy enough credit. Bush is responsible for hundreds of thouands dead. OBL “only” killed about 3000, Al’Q has too small a role in Iraq to give him “credit”.

Posted by: Dave1-20-09 at September 22, 2006 4:27 PM
Comment #183249

We are back to esentially calling Bush a Nazi, huh? No wonder Dems can’t gain the presidency. They are too busy with fixed elctions, 911 conspiracy theories and comparing our president to a man who claims the holocaust did not happen and that all Jews should be wiped from the face of the earth. Hmm, I wonder if they have considered what Ahmadinejad would do with the power of the US at his control?

What a sad bunch of losers the DNC has become. Remember you war cry YEEAAoohhwww in 08!!

Anyone noticed the similarities between Chavez and Clinton? Seriously, they both look like party animals, both are liars and both have some serious delusions.

Posted by: curmudgeon-at-large at September 22, 2006 4:38 PM
Comment #183258

Nice troll, curmudgeon.

You wrote:
“Hmm, I wonder if they have considered what Ahmadinejad would do with the power of the US at his control?”

We’re too busy worrying what BushCo is doing with the power of the US at THEIR control, to even think about Ahmadinejad having it.

“Anyone noticed the similarities between Chavez and Clinton?”

When it comes to Clinton, you righties just can’t move on, can you? Every single day, it’s Clinton, Clinton, and more Clinton. Admit it, all of you are still carrying a giant flaming torch for Bubba. Tell me, is it his Elvis-like qualities that have you all so fixated and overwrought?
Just curious.

Posted by: Adrienne at September 22, 2006 5:39 PM
Comment #183279

I have it on good authority that the Bubba-Elvis has definitly left the building….

Posted by: Tim Crow at September 22, 2006 6:58 PM
Comment #183289

Comparing the two is just stupid it serves no purpose. I think bush is the worst president of my life time ‘45 years’ but this is almost as dumb as the other blog Reps and cons about a nuclear attack.

Posted by: Jeff at September 22, 2006 7:40 PM
Comment #183294

your right repugnuts can get off Clinton I think they think if they keep telling us How bad he was they can some how rewrite history.

Posted by: Jeff at September 22, 2006 7:51 PM
Comment #183312

Walker, now we can add torture to the list of common traits shared by these two leaders.

Posted by: j2t2 at September 22, 2006 9:15 PM
Comment #183322

This is completely ridiculous. If if Bush deserves any of the criticism you offer, how do you expect to gain any respect for your views, presenting them this way? You demonstrate a complete disrespect of any kind of rational discussion of the issues, which demonstrates a disrespect for democracy in general.

Posted by: Ben at September 22, 2006 9:47 PM
Comment #183356

Ben, has Walker made any comment in his post that is untrue?

Posted by: j2t2 at September 22, 2006 11:22 PM
Comment #183359

Malmoud is a much better liar than George. At his press conference he made some interesting points. When asked if Iran sought nuclear weapons his response was no,why should they. He pointed out how usless they are. He noted that if they provided stability the Soviet Union would not of collapsed. If they provided security 9/11 would not of occured. He is much smarter than GWB.He also accuratly pointed out that Iran has not attacked another country since the Persian Empire. The debate he is seeking would be an embarrasing rout.He did dodge a direct question about the destruction of Isreal with an oft used politicians trick. You know,if you do not want to answer a question respond by answering a different one.

Posted by: BillS at September 22, 2006 11:40 PM
Comment #183364

Ben: Unfortunately, “rational discussion” for those on the right means no discussion and, certainly no criticism of GWB no matter how obvious. The emperor has no clothes, not a stitch.

The only rational discussion necessary regarding GWB is on the matter of his correct psychiatric diagnosis. He hears voices and acts on them. He mistakes fantasy for fact. He is unable to discern truth from untruth. He is unable to play well with others. He is unable to adapt to change. He presents a Messiah complex. He is narcissistic. And, he possesses a poor fund of knowledge. An Average-Joe American presenting these same symptoms would be involuntarily hospitalized and treated with anti-psychotic medications.

Walker’s post, while presented in a humorous manner, should provoke serious discussion for the similarities are striking between the two men.

Posted by: Dr. Poshek at September 23, 2006 12:19 AM
Comment #183365

I’ve just been so surprised that not a soul has come to the defense of poor Mahmoud Ahmadinejad after such a scurrilous defamation. Not one whit better than George W.! As a bona fide liberal Bush hater, how could I write such a thing!

Because we all know that any crazy view held by any liberal, must be held by every liberal.

Oh but what’s this?
Reliable sources tell me Bush and and Ahmadinejad were born 10 years apart and on different continents. Darn! My whole premise is blown. Geez! Liberalism has just been disproven as a rational explanation for anything. Sign me up for the right hand column!

Ahem.

OK, so I’ve gone from whimsy (in the post) to satire to utter sarcasm. Not my usual style, and maybe I stink at it, but I disagree that only humorless discussion is useful. All of us, liberals, conservatives, whatever, are subject to getting stuck in certain ways of thinking, and out of the box comparisons sometimes might jar us into a new and useful perspective.

Obviously Bush and Ahmadinejad are very different men from very different cultures leading very different nations. But honestly having seen more of M.A. over the last year, he really does remind me in many ways of our own President, and I couldn’t resist the comparison.

joebagodonuts (who at least seemed to get the whimsical tone) would be right that this was not a carefully researched article, but no the comparisons were not out of thin air, I think some of the parallels are pretty remarkable. And so I remarked.

Must we all be so humorless? I was kind of hoping people on both sides might have a little fun with this.

Ironically, perhaps the most inaccurate suggestion of any in my original post is that Ahmadinejad’s election might not have been valid. In fact I’m afraid his popular support at the time of his election was indisputable. It then started to sag terribly until Bush loudly challenge Iran’s nuclear ambitions at which time nationalist pride in Iran worked in A.M’s favor.

Also dissent in Iran isn’t (or wasn’t) as routinely squashed nearly to the extent that it is in places like N. Korea, Zimbabwe, or even Saudi Arabia. Go to this thread to see what a lot of Iranians did dare to say immediately after the election of Ahmadinejad in a public forum. Now maybe those who expressed dislike for him were using aliases, but I really don’t think so. Iran is still trying to keep some veneer of democracy and open society, though hardliners like Ahmadinejad are a real threat to that.

We often caricature leaders we don’t really know, quite inaccurately when we’re trying to be serious. Caricaturing them in a surprising way can actually sometimes shed a little truth not previously noticed.

Posted by: Walker Willingham at September 23, 2006 12:20 AM
Comment #183393

nice article… it kinda reminds me of the similarities between Clinton and the drug cartel leaders, or was that a brothel he was running up there? Hmmm… don’t you wish you could be president?

Posted by: d at September 23, 2006 3:17 AM
Comment #183404

Walker,

Our actions in Iraq have only served to embolden the Islamic extremists. Staying won’t fix it. Pulling out won’t fix it.

Under GW Bush we’ve lost at least one theatre in the war with Al Queida already. And WE can’t recover without one of two things:

#1. Full international support.
#2. Reinstating the draft.

Neither will happen and our only option will be to launch an even larger scale war against Iran so we can use a Nukular weapon.

Vote Republican, vote Nuke!

Vote Demo something? What are we doing?

I honestly think we Dems are just f**ked.

Can I still collect my social security if I move to Mexico?

KansasDem

Posted by: KansasDem at September 23, 2006 4:43 AM
Comment #183416

Hillary: If what you write is true, then more Americans are immoral, ignorant fools than I had realized and hence, they perhaps deserve an immoral, psychopathic fool not only in the White House but in every governmental office. What they clearly wouldn’t deserve is a constitutional republic.

However, I take courage from the fact that the poll to which you refer still suggests that a clear majority of Americans aren’t ignorant.

BTW, “looking like a leader” isn’t much of a qualification for holding office in America. Ahmadinejad and Chavez both look like leaders as do Hitler, Stalin, Franco, Castro, etc. We call this the fuhrerprinzip. However, they don’t like an American leader—nor does GWB.

Posted by: Dr. Poshek at September 23, 2006 7:37 AM
Comment #183434

You call me humorless, but I think its a sad fact that so many democrats do present their views in such ridiculous ways. I think humor is a good thing, but its counterproductive if everyone’s not in on the joke.

Yes, its a hard line to draw, but people that say “Unfortunately, ‘rational discussion’ for those on the right means no discussion” will never cease to disgust me.

In this case I don’t think you can expect “both sides” to join in the fun, when you really offer no satire of any liberal views.

Posted by: Ben at September 23, 2006 10:24 AM
Comment #183459

Ben:

In this case I don’t think you can expect “both sides” to join in the fun, when you really offer no satire of any liberal views.
Well, that’s not my job or my inclination, but I would have welcomed some humorous jabs in the other direction in response. Scott Ott, a much better writer of satire than I am, does so from a conservative point of view over at Scrapple Face. I bet you conservatives who go over there will laugh. When I visit, I usually laugh myself. Now occasionally I may have the reaction that jbod had to my post, but I never get all offended. Rather I cherish the freedom that Ott and I have to present such views without fear of reprisal.

I recognize that Scrapple Face is ALWAYS satire, while this is a serious discussion board, but what’s wrong with a little variety. I don’t think my whimsical post was vicious or mean. Unless maybe I came a little too close to truths people don’t want to have pointed out.

Part of the source of the raw nerves here, I believe, is the simplistic caricaturing of Ahmadinejad as an “evil devil.” Now let me be clear here: I don’t like him one bit, I see him as a dangerous player on the world stage, and his repeated calls for wiping Israel off the map are reprehensible. But beneath all that, just like George W Bush or you or me, he is a human being, and if some of his foibles earnestly remind me of the foibles of GW, I’m not going to apologize for pointing them out.

HK: “truly saddened by this day”?
Oh please!

Posted by: Walker Willingham at September 23, 2006 12:40 PM
Comment #183508

God, how I hope for a pretzel dinner at the White House!!!

Posted by: Ron at September 23, 2006 7:35 PM
Comment #183593

How many times in a news week do you see conservatives spending their time downgrading the Liberals, Rush, Yes because he makes a living doing that.
You people need to realize that conservatives are interested in our country’s health and welfare, When you stop Bush bashing you might get back on track to being a so called competitor. Set aside Hillary. everyone has something to say about that devil.

Posted by: Roy Hill at September 24, 2006 8:33 AM
Comment #183730

Roy H,

Conservatives our interested in a portion of our country’s health and welfare, definitely not the entire country’s health and welfare. If they were, we’d have taken all that money we’re spending in Iraq and given food, clothing, and shelter to our own citizens in need.

Control…

I want a revolution! If I have to lead it I will! I honestly expect one in my lifetime…

Posted by: KupA at September 25, 2006 9:00 AM
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