Democrats & Liberals Archives

Republican Noise Machine is Gearing Up

It’s hard to choose because there have been so many terrible incidents, but probably the worst event in the Iraq War is the recent killing of civilians in Haditha by Marines. Regardless of how you feel about the Iraq War itself, the Haditha massacre is a tremendous blow to all Americans. Under such horrible circumstances, what do Republicans do? They activate their noise machine and place the blame for all their self-inflicted problems upon Democrats, liberals and the media.

I know Rush Limbaugh says wild things, but I was taken aback when he said this:

"This Haditha story, this Haditha incident, whatever, this is it folks, this is the final big push on behalf of the Democratic Party, the American left, and the Drive-By Media to destroy our effort to win the war in Iraq. That's what Haditha represents -- and they are going about it gleefully. They are ecstatic about it... Folks, let me just put it in graphic terms. It is going to be a gang rape. There is going to be a gang rape by the Democratic Party, the American left and the Drive-By Media, to finally take us out in the war against Iraq. Make no bones about it.

Can you think of anything more ridiculous than this? The Republicans declare a war. They do not plan for it. They just jump in and depend on luck. Everything goes wrong and every single problem is blamed on Democrats and the American left. Who is responsible for sectarian killings? Liberals? Who is responsible for torture? Democrats? Who is responsible for warrantless spying on Americans? The left?

Liberals are gleeful? This is outrageous. The Democrats are going to have a gang rape? This does not belong in decent discourse. Limbaugh wants us to stay in Iraq forever? This is unAmerican.

Reason and logic and civility are not Limbaugh strong points. Other Republican smearers are getting into the act as well. They are screaming and yelling about Democrats and the left destroying all their wonderful, idealistic plans. All this tawdry negative shrieking has worked wonders for the Republicans before. But no longer.

Everybody sees how incompetent this Republican administration is. Whatever it does fails. It declares an unnecessary war on Iraq and produces a worse-than-Vietnam catastrophe. It incarcerates detainees in a way that brings deserved criticism from rights groups. It condones torture thus turning off our friends and allies. By spying on Americans it divides the country and makes it weaker in a time when great strength is needed. It allows victims of a hurricane to turn and squirm in the wind.

Republicans are bad at governing, but they are good at smearing the opposition. They are good at it because they do it constantly. They have lots of experience. Whenever anything goes wrong with their plans, they immediately find a scapegoat. And that scapegoat is more often than not a Democrat, a liberal or the "liberal media."

It has become routine. So routine, in fact, that it is becoming obvious to the citizens of the U.S., even to those on the right. You can see it in the statistics. Bush, who at one time had an approval rating of 91% is now in the mid 30s. The Republican Congress, immersed in its "culture of corruption," has even lower approval ratings.

Republican leaders are worried about the low esteem people have for them. Instead of trying to do something the public likes to raise their approval ratings, they try to build a level playing field by smearing Democrats.

The Democratic answer to the smears of the Rush Limbaughs should be: First we call them on each smear, but we will not stoop to the Republican level. Then we will discuss the important issues facing the country in a civil way. Little by little, we will turn the political conversation to issues and not smears.

Posted by Paul Siegel at June 6, 2006 6:50 PM
Comments
Comment #154914

The people who listen to Rush are still on that[ poor mistreated republicans of the 1990’s]The media is now ownd buy corperations and fox news just for repulican reporting.I saw Ann Coulter on this morning an Matt almost argued with her.Wow thats the new liberal media for you.

Posted by: christian at June 6, 2006 7:37 PM
Comment #154928

Were “powerless and irrelevant” yet everythings our fault. Amazing.
I don’t know what rush’s problem is. He’s more popular when Democrats hold majoritys or the presidency. Easier to attack.
It must really suck though, to be a limbaugh or an Oreilly. Having to think of new ways to defend indefensible crimes against humanity just to hold on to power and ratings, everyday, must get tiring.
Luckily for them, their lack of conscience or soul makes it possible for them to do what they do. rush could easily have taken goebbels job.

Posted by: norby at June 6, 2006 8:36 PM
Comment #154935

Paul,

I never, ever listen to Rush Limbaugh. But then I never listen to anything. I’m “sand” deaf.

But, people here in my “Bible Belt” community know I’m a Democrat. They knew for sure when I put out my Kerry / Edwards signs not that many moons ago. Surprisingly my signs kept disappearing and I finally had to put my signs in the garage at night. Maybe folks just wanted to collect them as memorabilia.

I’ve spent more time in the hospital over the past several weeks than I’ve spent out, and I can guarantee you that everything that’s wrong in America today is due to us damn Democrats. Nearly everyone tells me so.

Has anyone else been force-fed on red koolaid?

It still just makes me sick.

My point is that many on the right point to “free press” when it serves their purpose, but when we Democrats make one single sound that they find offensive they go totally ballistic.

Need anyone wonder how such communities foster the existence of someone as vile as Fred Phelps?

It’s time for the Repuglicans to test the contents of their Kool-Aid. It’s poison to us true Americans.

KansasDem

Posted by: KansasDem at June 6, 2006 9:02 PM
Comment #154936

what did happen in Haditha? The only senerio out there is from the left wing media. For all you nit wits know the people killed by the marines deserved it. Only a pussy liberal would convict a soldier before learning the facts. But then to since when do you cry-babies ever care about the facts? Why do you traitors hate America? Is it because you are afraid to piss off the arabs? Dont you understand if they win you will be the first to lose (your virginity). At least those of us right wing radicals who stand and fight wont end up with our asses in the air.

Posted by: whitebigot at June 6, 2006 9:06 PM
Comment #154938

“Republican Noise Machine is Gearing Up”

When did it ever gear down?

Posted by: Tim Crow at June 6, 2006 9:09 PM
Comment #154939

I hate to agree with you Paul, because it’s an admission of how low the Republicans have sunk in their hatred and ineptitude.
Speaking of which, did you happen to catch Ann Coulter on the Today Show this morning? She certainly gave Limbaugh a run for his money when she spat out this insensitive venom:

” These self-obsessed women seem genuinely unaware that 9-11 was an attack on our nation and acted as if the terrorist attack only happened to them. They believe the entire country was required to marinate in their exquisite personal agony. Apparently, denouncing bush was part of the closure process.”
These broads are millionaires, lionized on TV and in articles about them, reveling in their status as celebrities and stalked by griefparrazies. I have never seen people enjoying their husband’s death so much.”

Disgusting. Simply disgusting.

Posted by: scoreggi at June 6, 2006 9:10 PM
Comment #154942

whitebigot Wow,how does not supporting a bullshit war make you a traitor?If we had a real war to defend this country I will bring my own gun,but stand behind your peverted ass.

Posted by: christian at June 6, 2006 9:14 PM
Comment #154948

You or your cronies wouldn’t know a real war if it kicked you in the ass. This is a real war dumbo. The only reason it wasn’t won long ago is because we are trying to fight a politically correct war to appease you pussys. If you guys would crawl back in your holes and leave the fighting to real men who aren’t afraid of a little collateral damage to the enemy it would be over in a heart beat.

Posted by: whitebigot at June 6, 2006 9:35 PM
Comment #154949

Anyone that responds to a post by someone that chooses a name like “whitebigot” or “coonyjay” needs to think twice. These are obvious “flame-baiters”. They don’t even begin to address the message and serve only to distract.

Although this is exactly the kind of mentality I see on the streets here in South Central Kansas every day. Must have something to do with not having a dental college in the whole damn state. I guess if you must walk around toothless then your mentality should match your looks.

KansasDem

Posted by: KansasDem at June 6, 2006 9:36 PM
Comment #154952

Don’t feed the trolls.

KansasDem

Posted by: KansasDem at June 6, 2006 9:38 PM
Comment #154953

The postings of whitebigot and coonyjay make me suspect that the only Republicans left defending the administration in this blog are Limbaugh and Coulter.

Posted by: Steve K at June 6, 2006 9:39 PM
Comment #154958

South central Kansas huh. I grew up in south central LA. My experience in war should be sufficent to make guys like you cry mama. It gives me a great belly laugh to read you psuedo intellectualls trying to dissect the reasons a bunch of third world murdering scum hate us enough to behead us. The only way to stop scum is to skim it off the top. In the case of the rag heads the skimming must be done with firepower. Anything less would be ludicrous.

Posted by: whitebigot at June 6, 2006 9:50 PM
Comment #154961

Is Haditha really the worst event? Why was there such a subdued reaction from the people of Iraq to this tragedy? Could it be because they have become accustomed to it?

Posted by: mark at June 6, 2006 9:56 PM
Comment #154964

Mark,

Now you’re onto something:

Source: Killing of Iraqi may have been ‘premeditated’
http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/06/05/iraq.probes/index.html

I also caught a brief clip of someone reporting today on CNN that it was common practice to carry discarded AK47’s as “throw downs” in case the military “accidently” neutralized an innocent.

The bottom line is that Bush & Co. have been very clear that this is a “no holds barred” war. To now accuse only those who followed orders is far beyond wrong.

Each life lost, whether American or Iraqi is all on Bush & Co. This Homophobe-in-Chief is taking many souls to the grave with him whether it be 20 years or 50 years from now.

He’s also destroyed a great deal of the “soul” of America itself.

KansasDem

Posted by: KansasDem at June 6, 2006 10:07 PM
Comment #154967
The Democratic answer to the smears of the Rush Limbaughs should be: First we call them on each smear, but we will not stoop to the Republican level. Then we will discuss the important issues facing the country in a civil way. Little by little, we will turn the political conversation to issues and not smears.

I do not believe this at all. Kerry did this. You’ve got to fight the animals, that’s all they respect. All we need to do is tell the truth: They’ve wrecked this country with their bigotry and lies. I don’t call that a smear at all. A smear would be a lie, which I don’t have to do to call them sleazebuckets.

Please don’t go the Kerry nice guy route. It didn’t work. Let Republicans like whitebigot above know how you feel. Guys like him need to realize that we’ll fight for liberty too, even if it means running him over.

Posted by: Max at June 6, 2006 10:12 PM
Comment #154972

Why don’t all you libs just admit it once and for all. Everytime you hear a story like Haditha or Abu Ghraib your hearts are filled with glee. It takes all the restraint you can muster to keep from jumping for joy in front of normal human beings when you hear the guy on the news say there were forty American soldiers blown to pieces by a roadside bomb. Your ravenous drive to be so much smarter than all the “white trash” conservatives has completely destroyed what little humanity you once had, simply so you can say “We told you so.” Pathetic!

Posted by: Duano at June 6, 2006 10:22 PM
Comment #154973

KansasDem,

Thanks for the article by Jamie McIntyre.
I agree that “each life lost” is all on Bush and Co., almost none of whom have ever fought in a war and do not have an inkling of what it can do to a person.

Posted by: mark at June 6, 2006 10:23 PM
Comment #154975

whitebigot
What war?

Posted by: BillS at June 6, 2006 10:27 PM
Comment #154976

BBurke,

Zat help you understand?

Yes, that does shed some light, but I still think there could be a lot more of this going on than what we are aware of.

Posted by: mark at June 6, 2006 10:29 PM
Comment #154978

“Fags dont roll in the dirt.”

Maybe that really was ol’ Freddie Fud Pucker that logged on last nite and now he’s being creative. Or maybe he invited his whole damn inbred family.

KansasDem

Posted by: KansasDem at June 6, 2006 10:37 PM
Comment #154980

whitebigot,

The “B” in BBurke stands for Betty. Yeah, she’s a chick and a pretty fiesty one. I don’t think you have the chops to take her on. Sorry.

Posted by: Duano at June 6, 2006 10:39 PM
Comment #154983

white bigot, coonjay, and duano:

Thanks for proving that the title of this column is correct. Your hate-filled diatribes are just more nails in the coffin of support for the wrong wing.

Posted by: ElliottBay at June 6, 2006 10:44 PM
Comment #154999

scoreggi,

I had to check out your story myself. Man are you right, I found many links but this is as good as any:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/russell-shaw/ann-coulter-bitch-is-t_b_22354.html

or:

http://editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002614297&imw=Y

where I quote:

“LAUER: What I’m saying is I don’t think they have ever told you, you can’t respond.”

“COULTER: Look, you are getting testy with me.”

Sheesh, after the kind of vile criticism she doles out she has the nerve to say, “Look, you are getting testy with me”.

Typical damn Repuglican.

KansasDem


Posted by: KansasDem at June 6, 2006 11:27 PM
Comment #155001

now I can fully understand why I can’t wait to get out of kansas when travelling through there

Posted by: marc reaume at June 6, 2006 11:40 PM
Comment #155003

Gee, I’m glad I checked my news alerts before I hit the sack. Just for all of you that still think this White House occupant gives two craps about our troops:

Border Mission Drains War Reset Fund
http://www.spacewar.com/reports/Border_Mission_Drains_War_Reset_Fund.html

Notable quote:
“The money was diverted at the behest of the White House in a last-minute bid to address growing political unrest about illegal immigration.”

Good nite George!

KansasDem

Posted by: KansasDem at June 7, 2006 12:01 AM
Comment #155018

whitebigot-
What does it matter what wing its from, so long as they have the facts straight. For instance, they counted two three year olds among the dead. Perhaps they had ninja training.

Our own armed forces have investigated this and found something wrong is going on. Will you doubt these soldiers trying to rationalize what other ones might have done?

Operative word being “might have”. If you actually read the accounts, you’d zonk out on all the hedging they do. If you looked for specifics on who did what, you’d be out of luck. Nobody’s being convicted by the media. They’re just saying something happened and a marine unit was involved, and a false story was given out.

Those are the facts, and I care about them, because with them, I judge what the right thing to do about them is. I don’t want one innocent soldier drawn into this, or blamed for what the true perpetrators did. Take that remark at face value because that’s the only answer you’ll get out of me on that matter.

What I care about is not dancing around the feelings of the arab people, it’s about getting them to dump the al-Qaeda bastards overboard. Whatever happens, this has to end in respect and equality, because the alternative is being stuck in that place with a bunch of angry sons of bitches attacking us and no progress to show for it. It’s not about political correctness. It’s about counterinsurgency. As in things that don’t quite work if you’re not friendly with the locals. The murdering scum who cut off heads, blow up soldiers, and do nasty shit to us in general depend on the people for their support. What we want to do, is to cut off our enemy’s means of support.

You don’t win a war by killing people, you win it by destroying their forces. The difference is that folks like this insurgency can summon up new recruits fairly easily. Kill some, others take their place. Because they can keep this up, and we can’t, they’ll eventually win if we take that tack. If instead, we do things to interrupt their ability to fight effectively, like depriving them of supplies, the will to continue, the support of others in the community, etc, then we can destroy them as an opponent. Killing and violence will be part of that- it’s armed combat, not pocket parcheesi- but it’s not everything.

Coonyjay-
If you’re going to attack Clinton on his “sexcapades”, you might as well dump on Reagan for his divorce, the current Bush for his drinking, Nixon for being party to a felony, and Eisenhower for his affair with this driver (a woman, before you hyperventilate)

As for our soldiers, they are the most appreciated and well loved group in this whole nasty story. The disgrace is that on the right, moral support of the troops has been priority over material support, even as the insufficient body and vehicle armor has cost lives.

A soldier asks for armor, and the rightwing media turns him into a plant because he asked a reporter earlier for advices on the question. Of course, the Right Wing media tries to make it look as if the reporter fed him the questions. It all becomes about protecting the politicians, in the name of giving the soldier’s moral support.

Meanwhile, men were dying as explosions tore through their vehicles. Why else did the men cheer the question?

I can separate the president from the soldiers, especially as he sends them into combat with not enough of the things they need to make a success of things. The question is, could you, so you could see the soldier get what they need?

Duano-
It takes no restraint not to jump for joy. It’s hearing about shit like that week after week that made me such an aggressive critic of this president. I have stated again and again that the troops have always had my support. It is that support that drives me to ask my government to give those soldiers what they need to win, or have the decency to ship them home. Seeing more troops coming home in bodybags, with bodyparts missing, or shell-shocked out of their skulls has been my motivation. I didn’t jump for joy, I sat down at my computer and wrote one entry after another for this site, chronicling in a reasonable manner, more or less my opinions on the matters before them. You dismiss our concerns as Bush hatred, and never get beyond the fact that it’s the policy that concerns us to start with.

If you folks had taken ten minutes to address those policies as first priority, rather than making Bush’s re-election the priority, we might have had the war done by now.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at June 7, 2006 1:53 AM
Comment #155019

———I would like all the brightest people who view these few questions, can give me an intelligent response as to why #1 why did the military after the city of Baghdad was taken and all their weapons were taken a few miles into the desert and left there.This pile of weapons considered of every type weapon Saddam had plus rocket launchers and all the ammunition that came with all these weapons. These weapons filled between 40 to 50 acres.————————-Why were these weapons never destroyed???of course we know who retrieved them.#2 ABC news found 3 bunker of C4 explosive devices and showed the military, two days later it was still there. Where do you think all these roadside bombs came from??I can not bring my self to believe this could be deliberate! why could such a colossal mistake be made twice.

Posted by: DAVID at June 7, 2006 2:05 AM
Comment #155021

Wow. The right wingers are pretty sensitive about their leader’s failure in Iraq. I’m talking about Coulter and Limbaugh, of course.

These guys all staked their reputations on electing a President who turned out to be a dud. It’s no surprise they’re all bitter and pissed-off now.

Posted by: American Pundit at June 7, 2006 2:27 AM
Comment #155040

Why do you traitors hate America?
Posted by: whitebigot at June 6, 2006 09:06 PM

If this poster indeed represents America, I pray his/her version is destroyed and what could possibly be more patriotic than particpating in the destruction of same.

Posted by: expatUSA_Indonesia at June 7, 2006 4:44 AM
Comment #155062

I do think that some folks were a little upset that so many in this country were apparently willing to try, convict and hang these soldiers without all the facts being known. Do we still “presume innocence” in this country?

Posted by: nikkolai at June 7, 2006 8:27 AM
Comment #155068

It is that support that drives me to ask my government to give those soldiers what they need to win, or have the decency to ship them home.
====

right on SD, right on.

Posted by: tree hugger at June 7, 2006 8:44 AM
Comment #155085

I have never been able to stomach anything from Ann Coulter.
But I agree with her diatribe against the 9/11 families. They are out of hand.

Posted by: Schwamp at June 7, 2006 9:38 AM
Comment #155110

What Repugs cannot admit in this discussion is that Democrats support the soldiers. What Haditha proves yet again is that a failed policy by government and military leaders is paid for by the those who serve.

Abu Gahraib - just a few bad apples, not the chain of command, right?

Haditha - just rogue soldiers, not behavior sanctioned from the top, right?

This disasterous policy is being paid for by our brave children. Repugs need to insist that crticism of the war is criticism of those who fight it because that is the shield they use to hide their cowardice.

Courage is admitting that the price of the war in Iraq is their responsibility - cowardice is blaiming the Democrats for daring to question the policy.

At least one out of every three soldiers returning alive from Iraq seeks psychological help for PTSD. Anyone who has served will tell you that real number is much higher because PTSD is a stigma and career ender in the military. Regardless, the reported number is at least double that of Vietnam, Gulf War I, Bosnia or Afghanistan.

“I cannot support a msn [mission] that leads to corruption, human rights abuse and liars. I am sullied. I came to serve honorably and feel dishonored. Death before being dishonored any more.” - suicide note left by Colonel Ted Westhusing, West Point professor who volunteered to train Iraqi police forces


The far right says liberals don’t have the stomach for war. I say the far right is cavalier with our most precious resource (not oil) - our children.

I love my children. I would give my life to defend them without hesitation. Questioning whether a policy is worthy of the possibility of their lives is simply basic parenting, nothing I deserve a medal for.

Giving up your children without question, however, is symptomatic of belonging to a cult. It is a clear sign of misplaced priorities.

Posted by: CPAdams at June 7, 2006 10:52 AM
Comment #155161

From Garrison Keillor, as ever, right on target:

You might not have always liked Republicans, but you could count on them to manage the bank. They might be lousy tippers, act snooty, talk through their noses, wear spats and splash mud on you as they race their Pierce-Arrows through the village, but you knew they could do the math. To see them produce a ninny and then follow him loyally into the swamp for five years is disconcerting, like seeing the Rolling Stones take up lite jazz. So here we are at an uneasy point in our history, mired in a costly war and getting nowhere, a supine Congress granting absolute power to a president who seems to get smaller and dimmer, and the best the Republicans can offer is San Franciscophobia? This is beyond pitiful. This is violently stupid.
Posted by: Mental Wimp at June 7, 2006 12:53 PM
Comment #155197

CPAdams — Excellent Post!

Kansas Dem, several good posts. I’m very fond of all your contributions here, and I hope you’ll be feeling better very soon.

Stephen, once again, you’ve done a tidy job of casting your pearls before swine.

Mental Wimp, liked the quote. Kellior is great.

As far as the article goes, I’m with Tim. I don’t think the Republican Noise Machine has ever geared down. In fact, I think they just keep making it louder with every passing year.

Coulter is a Hate-filled Nutcase Whore — no doubt her own excessive bile is reason she’s a vomiting bulimic stick-figure.
Limbaugh is a Big, Fat, Bellowing Idiot. And so are all his Ditto-heads, although probably not all are also drug abusers the way he is.

Schwamp:
“But I agree with her diatribe against the 9/11 families. They are out of hand.”

What utter bullsh*t. Who the hell does Coulter, or you, Schwamp, think you are to make judgements on the 9/11 families? Maybe they’re so “out of hand” because our Moron-in-Chief never gave a rats ass about getting Bin Laden. You remember him don’t you? He’s the guy who attacked America and took their loved ones — who all these years later is still alive and well, and taunting us all.

Posted by: Adrienne at June 7, 2006 2:12 PM
Comment #155208

For that statement Rush should be given the Nobel peace prize How true How true!!

Posted by: lookingout at June 7, 2006 2:27 PM
Comment #155210

Whitebigot-Thank you sir i could not have said it better.You are a true Patriot.

Posted by: lookingout at June 7, 2006 2:29 PM
Comment #155213

Coonjay where you guys been?Its about time some real men start setting these sissies straight.Hell there is still hope.Keep up the good work.

Posted by: lookingout at June 7, 2006 2:34 PM
Comment #155226

“lookingout” who was also “saying”, and “mystified”, is also “coonjay” and “whitebigot”.
Trolls are so transparent and pathethic they way they always end up patting their multiple personalities on the back.

Posted by: Adrienne at June 7, 2006 3:14 PM
Comment #155280

Touche Adrienne!

Thank You for exposing the bastard(s).

Posted by: mark at June 7, 2006 5:12 PM
Comment #155287

Adrienne:

Do I sense a little jealousy or is it just that time of the month? Why are you so hateful? Rush was saying that you dems will use this to your advantage. I never hear a dem say anything when fifty people are killed by an IED, but when some sick depraved Americans go psycho on some Iraqi’s, it’s all the media and you liberal nuts talk about. This story will be in the media for the next six months. You won’t hear anything about the 1,300 iraqi civilians killed in may.

Posted by: David at June 7, 2006 5:31 PM
Comment #155299

David-
A terrorist killing civilians is to one of our soldiers doing so as the dog crapping all over your room is to your ten year old son doing so.

Additionally, the soldiers represent us, much like the kid would. It’s disquieting to have one’s soldiers step over the line, much as it is to have one’s child engage in such disgusting behavior as a dog might.

You should start asking yourself whether this war represents American power well. I don’t think it does. By not going in with a good plan for occupation, Bush has made America look weak to both Iraqi’s and others abroad by making the 21st century army look like it couldn’t handle 20th century terrorists. We could, if we were geared for the right war, but the Bush administration still wants to act like this is the war that it started out to fight, rather than adjusting to the reality. If we have an image problem, it’s because this adminstration has a reality problem it’s not dealing with.

Posted by: Stephen Daugherty at June 7, 2006 5:54 PM
Comment #155306

David,
I have no idea what you’re talking about — maybe it’s that time of the month for you?
What am I supposed to be jealous of, exactly?
Hate? You mean for Coulter?
Who doesn’t loathe that woman? She’s a nutcase whose whole career consists of spewing violent and angry invective against liberals. She claims to be a Christian but her message is nothing but anger and hate. She’s a complete fraud.
And that stupid whore just had the temerity to write a book calling all liberals Godless, and feels she has the right to attack the 9/11 families because of what they have to say. I guess that proves that Coulter doesn’t believe in the first amendment if someone is a liberal.
But yes, if I sound a bit miffed with Ms. Coulter it might have something to do with the fact that I myself am a liberal, or because I know plenty of religious people who are liberals, or maybe it’s because I lost a dear friend on 9/11, and I don’t think his family deserves to get shat on by that cheap, ugly, bulimic hooker who wears a cocktail dress and a perpetual sneer wherever she goes.
Does that answer your question?

“Rush was saying that you dems will use this to your advantage.”

Another incomplete thought here. Can’t answer.

“I never hear a dem say anything when fifty people are killed by an IED,”

Then you’re not listening. We keep saying to bring the troops home.

“but when some sick depraved Americans go psycho on some Iraqi’s, it’s all the media and you liberal nuts talk about.”

Yeah, it’s shocking to know that our troops are starting to lose their minds. Or troubling to think that they’re getting such crappy leadership over there that there is no discipline. It reminds too many of us of what ended up happening in Vietnam.

“This story will be in the media for the next six months.”

Another incomplete thought. Which story is that, exactly?

“You won’t hear anything about the 1,300 iraqi civilians killed in may.”

No, we don’t hear anything about the Iraqi civilians. Dead ones. Live ones. Or injured ones. This president and his media machine doesn’t want the American people informed about this war — because if they’re informed, the majority would be calling for it to end. Much like many liberals (such as myself) have been saying from the beginning.

Posted by: Adrienne at June 7, 2006 6:17 PM
Comment #155315

Adrienne:
This story will be in the media for the next six months.” - The story about the US soldiers killing civilians.

“Rush was saying that you dems will use this to your advantage.” - You will use this to smear the republican party.

also: “We keep saying to bring the troops home.”

Explain how bringing the troops home would be better than leaving them there. I would also like to know what you think would happen in Iraq if we brought the troops home today.


If we leave now, do you honestly think Iraq will not turn into a shit storm. It will be much worse for the entire world if we leave now.

Posted by: David at June 7, 2006 6:37 PM
Comment #155343

David:
“This story will be in the media for the next six months.�€ - The story about the US soldiers killing civilians.”

What, you think it should just go away? I think not talking about something like this just makes it more likely to happen.

“�€œRush was saying that you dems will use this to your advantage.�€ - You will use this to smear the republican party.”

Yeah, some advantage. An atrocity. A national disgrace that only shames us more after torture at Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo, white phosphorus being used as weapon in Falluja regardless of civilian deaths, and extraordinary renditions to foreign gulags. If this is a smear, it’s one your leadership brought on, not Democrats and Liberals.
Btw, Limbaugh is such a loudmouthed liar — why do you people continue to listen to him like he’s some kind of a serious pundit or political authority?

“Explain how bringing the troops home would be better than leaving them there.”

It would be better because they’re only becoming more and more of a target all the time and because the Iraqi people tell us that they want the American occupation to end. The longer we’ve stayed, the larger the insurgency has grown, and atrocities like what happened at Haditha and elsewhere are only going to make things worse. Our troops were too few in numbers from the beginning, and there was no way they could have kept the country from having this civil war that has started.
Many of us who have been protesting this war saw this coming before the war had even begun. Saddam might have been a murderous and evil bastard, but he was able to keep the lid on the explosive divide amongst all the Iraqi factions for a long, long time. Bush Sr. fully understood this — which is why we didn’t invade Iraq after liberating Kuwait, but his son was obviously too stupid to grasp the subtleties of this situation before he invaded.

“I would also like to know what you think would happen in Iraq if we brought the troops home today.”

Iraq will have their civil war. But whether we stay or go, this will be the case. The only difference will be that if we redeploy, more American’s are going to come home alive.

“If we leave now, do you honestly think Iraq will not turn into a shit storm. It will be much worse for the entire world if we leave now.”

It’s already a shit storm. And our troops are right in the middle of that storm everyday. After all this time, the Green Zone is the only truly safe place for Americans in the entire country — and everyone who tries to get there is automatically a target for an enormous amount of violence. We must face facts, we are not winning, and we cannot keep this civil war from taking place. The blame for everything that has happened during this war rests squarely on the shoulders of the Bush Adminstration, not our troops who have done an amazing job in a truly impossible situtation.

Posted by: Adrienne at June 7, 2006 8:25 PM
Comment #155367

David,
I don’t know what would happen if the troops were brought home today but I do know it only gets worse as time passes and they stay.
It is a shit storm now and we have already made it worse for the entire world(ask Tony Blair who will be forced to step down soon). We have created uncountable numbers of terrorists and thanks to our actions they will keep coming for years to come. The longer we stay and keep doing what were doing the more we will create. Let them have their civil war and settle it. We can’t settle it for them.

Posted by: mark at June 7, 2006 9:25 PM
Comment #155417

CPAdams:

“This disasterous policy is being paid for by our brave children. Repugs need to insist that criticism of the war is criticism of those who fight it because that is the shield they use to hide their cowardice.

Courage is admitting that the price of the war in Iraq is their responsibility - cowardice is blaming the Democrats for daring to question the policy.

Let me second Adrienne’s kudos—I always look forward to your comments. On any subject. This statement of yours echos much of my thinking, and I appreciate hearing it confirmed by you.

Paul, another excellent post. Thank you.

Posted by: Tim Crow at June 8, 2006 1:09 AM
Comment #155421

David:

This situation in Iraq reminds me of a scene in the movie Ghandi, where an incredulous British general asks Ghandi,’You don’t expect the British to just walk out of India, do you?’ And Ghandi says, ‘Yes, that is exactly what you will do, because you will begin to see that 100,000 British cannot control 350 million Indians.”

Iraq is fast becoming a tri-partite entity, with Sunnis leaving Shiite areas, Shiites leaving Sunni areas, and the Kurds hunkering down in their northern enclave. The secularism that made Iraq work under Saddam is falling apart. I believe civil war is assured, we are seeing it now. And 140,000 Americans cannot control 25 million Iraqis bent on civil war.

I am tired of seeing centrist Dems on this blog say that this Iraqi fiasco was a matter of poor managment. Two hundred and fifty thousand soldiers would have made this horror twice as big. There was and is no way to make this catastrophe more efficient—for the simple reason that this was flawed policy to begin with.

So now we’re building a 100-acre embassy complex in Bahgdad (the largest in the world), and ten or so massive bases in the interior. We’re going to play cavalry and the indians.

We will walk out of Iraq, just as the British in India. The neocons think we are an imperialist power, destined to control the world. Somebody forgot to tell them that the American people don’t have the stomach for it—and are very leery of long-term, no-win entanglements. Vietnam is too fresh, even for a forgetful administration.

Which makes me wonder—what did the Vietnamese do with Cam Rhan Bay, the largest military facility in the world at the time it was built. Fifty-eight thousand dead Americans and 3 million Vietnamese.

I remember last October, the media made a big deal out of the 2000 American dead milestone. Here it is June, and there are 500 more Americans that will never see their families or their homes again. Thousands of Iraqis are no longer here. And for what?

And so the carnage continues with our troops smack dab in the middle. Who will be the last soldier to die for a lie? When history finally closes the book on this escapade, how many will have died? 5000, 10,000? How many innocent civilians? 200,000, 500,0000? A million?

And Republicans have the unmitigated gall to post self-serving articles on this blog about their perplexity regarding the hate America is subject to.

Posted by: Tim Crow at June 8, 2006 2:07 AM
Comment #155519

Does anyone think a country like Iran would come into Iraq if we leave? Would it be better for us to stay longer than have that happen?

Posted by: David at June 8, 2006 9:56 AM
Comment #155552

Whitebiggot,

I don’t understand why the editor has not excluded you for refgerring to people as “PUSSYS” or “CRY-BABIES.” Perhasp the editor got a little lax.

But the reports on Haditha now are official and NOT from the media. Regardeless of your obvious emotional difficulties, you seem confused.

Posted by: RGF at June 8, 2006 11:40 AM
Comment #155731

WE WANT A FREE INTERNET!


follow this link to send an email to your Congress people on the “Net Neutrality” vote!


http://www.itsournet.org/How_This_Affects.php

Posted by: Craig Dawson at June 8, 2006 6:48 PM
Comment #155800

Mark Replied:

Yes, that does shed some light, but I still think there could be a lot more of this going on than what we are aware of.

Oh yes, as to that, I agree with you wholeheartedly! I just wanted to explain why the Iraqis hadn’t made as much over Haditha as they had over Abu Ghra’ib.

But of course, this will make little sense to the Reader, because David Remer is still obsessively (and Hypocritically) deleting *ALL* of my posts; so catch them while you can!

:o)

Posted by: BBurke at June 8, 2006 9:14 PM
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