Democrats & Liberals Archives

Disillusioned Republicans

“If you favor moral values, vote for the honorable Bush, vote for Republicans who believe in moral values. Don’t vote for atheistic Democrats who would not only not defend America against its enemies but destroy this Christian country and lead it into a demoralized and licentious abyss.” This was the Republican campaign message in 2000, 2002 and 2004. As everybody knows, the Republicans made it. Let’s see how Bush and the Republicans lifted our moral values.

The Gallup Poll, as reported by the Christain Post, found that:

"Eight of ten Americans feel the country’s moral values are getting worse – a record high for the annual Gallup survey since it began in 2002.... According to the poll of 1,002 adults conducted May 8-11 and released yesterday, 81 percent of adults say the nation’s 'state of moral values' is getting worse, compared to only 11 percent who say values are improving."

Bush and the Christian-right Republicans worked strenuously to improve American morals for almost 6 years. And it appears that the more they work, the lower our morals get. And it is Republicans who are the most dissatisfied. The article states:

"The latest figure marks a jump of 14 points since 2002 and a four point jump since 2005. The negative outlook on morality since 2002 took the greatest jump among independents (at 18 points) and Republicans (16 points). The change among Democrats was relatively low at 6 points."

So, Republicans (and Independents) think our moral values have decreased a lot under our dear leader. Bush was supposed to be the leader who would unite us and make us strong in our moral values. Too bad he accomplished the opposite. The poll also shows that divorce rates in the Bible Belt are worse than in the atheistic areas.

Republicans are disillusioned. They are worried. Perhaps the marriage amendment is not the solution to the high divorce rate in the Bible Belt. They think that maybe they should not impose their religious values on others, and that it might be better to leave other people alone to worship - or not worship - as they please.

And perhaps not. They have not faced reality for almost 6 years. Why start now?

Posted by Paul Siegel at May 26, 2006 6:41 PM
Comments
Comment #151750

Paul,

You are jumping to conclusions as always…

The big unanswered question, is WHY?
Saying it is Republicans is unsubstantiated unless you have proof…got any proof?

OR:

Is it the gay marriage issue?
Is it the Enron debacle?
Is it some of our slimy congressmen?
(who are disrespectful, lying, cheating and backstab on both sides of the aisle)
Is it big business?
Is it big oil?

Nope…Can’t be…It’s gotta be Bush…

Posted by: Cliff at May 26, 2006 7:00 PM
Comment #151751

Your purposeful misspelling of the word “Christian” did not go unnoticed and is perturbing.

Posted by: Discerner at May 26, 2006 7:04 PM
Comment #151752

Cliff,

“Nope…Can’t be…It’s gotta be Bush”

Nope, it’s gotta be FOX.

“American Idol” is bringing everybody down.

Posted by: Rocky at May 26, 2006 7:07 PM
Comment #151754

Perhaps the real answer lies in the fact that the American people understand that right is wrong and left is right.

Posted by: jblym at May 26, 2006 7:27 PM
Comment #151762

Why a load of garbage. Parents determine the morality of society through education of their kids. Regardless of what Hillary claimed, it takes a family.
Morality is falling due to the constant attack on religion by the liberal left and groups like the ACLU. Hate by the left for a man rather than a duty to serve a country. I’m not sure if democrats are frustrated (can’t win) or live in constant hate. Either way, its a shame. Bush is responsible for his own morality and his own actions. So is William Jefferson.
Atheist morals are all relative, if it feels right for you do it, right? That seems to be the direction the nation is heading. Nothing reflects this more than the events that took place on Mt Everest just a few days ago.

On another note, some guy backed in to my vehicle. Damn that Bush….

Posted by: curmudgeon-at-large at May 26, 2006 7:47 PM
Comment #151763

Paul S

“If you favor moral values, vote for the honorable Bush, vote for Republicans who believe in moral values. Don’t vote for atheistic Democrats who would not only not defend America against its enemies but destroy this Christian country and lead it into a demoralized and licentious abyss.”

i am not sure where this quote came from. Did you make this up or is this written or spoken somewhere? I honestly am not putting you down by saying this just I have never heard this and I am a conservative Republican Evangelical. The type many here seem to hate and even blame for so much.

I voted for Bush but not for any make the country more moral. I personally believe the only way a government can help to make the country more moral is to take their hands off of its people through less legislation and so forth.

Posted by: Randall Jeremiah at May 26, 2006 7:49 PM
Comment #151764

Hey I don’t know about you all but I’m excited, a Democrat just addressed morality like it actually exists!

Posted by: Craig at May 26, 2006 7:56 PM
Comment #151769

“Regardless of what Hillary claimed, it takes a family. “

Wow - now isolationism has moved down to individual houses. Keep it in the family… oh, how many fun things have happened in the home that have ended in this logic.

“Morality is falling due to the constant attack on religion by the liberal left and groups like the ACLU.”

Of course, it can’t be complete failure of this Administration… blame it on mis-construed assumptions of an organization aimed at protecting American rights. PLEASE - all whining whimpering Christians - PLEASE explain a single instance where you have been attacked, singled out or prevented from practicing YOUR religion. ONE…

Posted by: tony at May 26, 2006 8:12 PM
Comment #151775

Crmudgeon,
I thought about taking on your claims one by one. But they really aren’t worthy of that.
If you really think spouting bible passages and wearing your faith on your sleeve somehow makes you more “moral”, you’ve got enough problems to work out.
Your morality is in your actions, not your talk. How many innocents has the ACLU killed?


“I personally believe the only way a government can help to make the country more moral is to take their hands off of its people through less legislation and so forth.”

The, Randall, why the hell would you vote republican? Wiretaps, Terri Schiavo, ‘indecency’ laws. Is that how you take your “hands off”?

Posted by: norby at May 26, 2006 8:30 PM
Comment #151791

“How many innocents has the ACLU killed?”

I’m not sure. How many babies have been aborted now? Maybe, you would just like to count the patial bith abortions, use that number.

Norby, I know your reference is to Iraq which it totally ridiculous. ME insurgents and terrorist are killing their OWN people, our soldiesr only defend themselves against the savages. That is moral, right? When I served in the early 90s, I did the same. We (the US) are the good samaritans in this case. We removed the world’s number one terrorist from his post. We SHOULD have done it while I was serving.

Posted by: curmudgeon-at-large at May 26, 2006 9:21 PM
Comment #151797

“I’m not sure. How many babies have been aborted now? Maybe, you would just like to count the patial bith abortions, use that number.”

What the hell does the ACLU have to do with abortions?

“We (the US) are the good samaritans in this case. We removed the world’s number one terrorist from his post. We SHOULD have done it while I was serving.”

Wow - what an assumption… please prove it, because for now, your claim seems to be complete bunk.

Posted by: tony at May 26, 2006 9:55 PM
Comment #151805
Is it the gay marriage issue? Is it the Enron debacle? Is it some of our slimy congressmen? Is it big business? Is it big oil?

Hmm… You’re right Cliff. It’s not just Bush’s failing that’s causing the decline of morals, it’s the entire Republican Party’s failing.

Morality is falling due to the constant attack on religion

That’s completely lame. 83% of Americans are Christians. The idea that Christians are being persecuted is idiotic at best.

I’m not sure. How many babies have been aborted now? Maybe, you would just like to count the patial bith abortions, use that number.

First off, partial birth abortion is illegal. That’s not even an issue.

Second, it’s the Republican obstruction of anti-abortion measures that’s causing abortions.

Anytime Republicans want to dramatically cut the number of abortions, they can do so by passing the Title X Family Planning Services Act (S.844) rather than allowing the killing to continue.

Posted by: American Pundit at May 26, 2006 10:43 PM
Comment #151811

curmudgeon at large
Of course it takes a family. And a village. Do your kids go to sunday school,learn social behavior at school or girl or boy scouts,soccor team? That is their village.
FYI Anthropologicaly speaking the nuclear family has been the primary social unit only in times of warfare,being the smallest portable unit that can reproduce itself. The dominant unit was the tribe. Humans generally no longer know how to act in tribal units and modern life has many of the aspects of war. see: Mead

Posted by: BillS at May 26, 2006 10:55 PM
Comment #151814

“Ah could you and I with fate conspire
To grasp this sorry state of things entire
Would we not shatter it to bits and then
Remould it nearer to the hearts desire.”

The problem with not electing Republicans is that we are left with Democrats. We choose from among real world alternatives.

Posted by: Jack at May 26, 2006 11:03 PM
Comment #151819

Democrats have a better record on fiscal responsibility, Democrats want to focus on the al Qaeda terrorism threat, and from the beginning of Bush’s mismanaged adventure in Iraq, Democrats wanted more troops to secure victory.

Real world alternatives, indeed.

Posted by: American Pundit at May 26, 2006 11:22 PM
Comment #151823

AP…You are wrong. If democrats wanted to focus on defeating terrorisim, Clinton would have accpted the offer of Bin Laden from the Sudan. Clinton turned the offer down and we payed dearly for the decision.

Democrats and fiscal responsibility?? That is a joke…do you realize the it was the democrats that started social security? It is the biggest financial fraud in American History that makes the Enron debacle seem like dropping dime in a sewer drain! The Dems want to pay for all those people who do not want to work….financially respoinsible??

What about John Murtha wanting an immediate troop exit from Iraq?

You have a lot of education on the truths of your Democratic party

Posted by: Paul at May 26, 2006 11:49 PM
Comment #151828

You’ve raised a very good point, Paul. It would make more sense if the religious folk in America believed that things were getting better rather than worse, if they felt their leaders were truly reflecting their values.
The illogical replies from the righties on this thread are simply stunning. And in the other sense of that word, so was that little passage from the Rubaiyat that Jack quoted. Despite his negative little dig at Democrats, I considered it a lovely bit of poetry to toss into this thread.

Posted by: Adrienne at May 27, 2006 12:08 AM
Comment #151832
Your purposeful misspelling of the word “Christian” did not go unnoticed and is perturbing.

Huh? He transposed two letters and you assume there’s some sort of malicious intent? What would it be?

How odd.

Posted by: LawnBoy at May 27, 2006 12:23 AM
Comment #151833

Adrienne

Impressed that you recognized it so quick. Poetry is distilled language. It fits here. Actually, you would probably agree that the best poets have Celtic connections. Even the beauty of the Rubaiyat for us is the result of the Fitzgerald translation.

Of course you also know that the best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity.

Also check out this week’s edition of the Economist. It has a good article on Scottish devolution.

Posted by: Jack at May 27, 2006 12:31 AM
Comment #151839

Jack:
“Actually, you would probably agree that the best poets have Celtic connections.”

A great many, yes. It just seems to come naturally, and it’s a big part of social tradition, too.

“Even the beauty of the Rubaiyat for us is the result of the Fitzgerald translation.”

Fitzgerald did three translations, actually. They’re all slightly different. I like passages from all three.

“Of course you also know that the best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity.”

The best what? Poetry? Me, I’m fond of both conviction and passionate intensity. Take Yeats, for example.

“Also check out this week�€™s edition of the Economist. It has a good article on Scottish devolution.”

Thanks for the tip, Jack.

Posted by: Adrienne at May 27, 2006 12:57 AM
Comment #151841

That Clinton and Sudan Fantasy has already been debunked.

John Murtha wants a gradual pullout.

Man… the problem we have here is the mindless repetition of proven lies by the GOP Shills.

Its like Cheney repeating that nonsense about Iraq WMD and Saddam doing 9/11.

It’s incredible how brainwashed they are.

Posted by: Aldous at May 27, 2006 1:06 AM
Comment #151870

“It’s incredible how brainwashed they are.”

It’s like they washed and scrubbed, and when they rinsed away the soap, there was nothing left.

Posted by: tony at May 27, 2006 9:27 AM
Comment #151880

What amazes me is the hypocricy of of the wrong wing. You get Bill Bennett telling everyone about the a virtuous life … while running up huge gambling debts. You get Rush Limbaugh telling us how evil drug users are … while he’s commiting fraud to illegally obtain the drugs that he’s addicted to. You get wrong wing leaders constantly telling us that THEY are the party of morals, while their leaders are taking bribes, arranging no-bid contracts for their companies, leaking the names of CIA agents, lying to America, etc.

The wrong wing constantly tells everyone that people should take responsibility for themselves, but when THEY get caught with their fingers in the jar, do they do what they advocate? Nope. Instead we get lameoid excuses and finger-pointing - just like little kids, and exactly the opposite of what the wrong wing preaches. We get “it’s not my fault”, or “they started it” or “they’re just as bad” or “it wasn’t really wrong”. Excuses we wouldn’t let our children get away with. Excuses that aren’t really any more than a huge load of bovine byproduct.

Posted by: ElliottBay at May 27, 2006 10:34 AM
Comment #151891

Some Cheney favorites…

“My belief is we will, in fact, be greeted as liberators.” —March 16, 2003

I think they’re in the last throes, if you will, of the insurgency.” — on the Iraq insurgency, June 20, 2005

“Go f*ck yourself.” —to Sen. Patrick Leahy, during an angry exchange on the Senate floor about profiteering by Halliburton, June 25, 2004

I actually like the last one.

Posted by: Vincent Vega at May 27, 2006 11:17 AM
Comment #151976


33% of the American people disapproved of Bill Clinton. 33% of the American people approve of George Bush. One can’t help but wonder if this is the same 33%.

Posted by: jlw at May 27, 2006 6:06 PM
Comment #151991

“33% of the American people approve of George Bush. One can’t help but wonder if this is the same 33%.”

These party loyalist make me (LOL). When in Clinton’s presidency? For a whole eight years (LOL). Better check that percentage in 98’. Do you realize there is not a democrat who is higher right now? Comparing a current president to a past president is like comparing apples with oranges. We are in this war on terror because of a past president. Thanks for doing nothing slick Willie.

Posted by: curmudgeon-at-large at May 27, 2006 8:16 PM
Comment #151994
Better check that percentage in 98’.
Clinton’s approval rating in 1998 averaged about 60-65%, with a disapproval rating between 30-35%. What was your point exactly?
Posted by: Introspective at May 27, 2006 8:40 PM
Comment #152001

The Republican Party struggles with the same problem as the Democratic Party.

As the “American President” (Michael Douglas) said about his chief political rival (Richard Dreyfus): “His problem is not that he doesn’t get it. His problem is that he can’t sell it!”

And selling, my friends, is how you win hearts (and elections) and influence people.

Posted by: ulysses at May 27, 2006 9:01 PM
Comment #152009

I love when the rep. are all out of excusses then they go back and blame clinton.

Posted by: Dan at May 27, 2006 9:45 PM
Comment #152041

“Democrats and fiscal responsibility?? That is a joke…do you realize the it was the democrats that started social security? It is the biggest financial fraud in American History that makes the Enron debacle seem like dropping dime in a sewer drain! The Dems want to pay for all those people who do not want to work….financially respoinsible??”

Oh please tell me more. How did Social Security reduce the United States to, oh what is it, “the worlds only super power”.

Please reply “Paul”! I’d like to know just how much of the New Deal we should repeal. Hells bells, Bush and Co. have plenty of time. We could call it the RAW DEAL.

Check out some history on the New Deal. Shucks, we could do away with unemployment insurance, the SEC, and the FDIC all in one fell swoop. Sounds feasible to me.

After all when old “Bush daddy” was VP sweet little Neal got a pass on his involvement with Silverado Savings and Loan. I know. I got screwed out of nearly thirty grand.

I really, really await your reply about how Social Security has been a “bad deal” for Americans.

KansasDem

PS: I’ll even play nice.

Posted by: KansasDem at May 28, 2006 12:13 AM
Comment #152071

“Why a load of garbage. Parents determine the morality of society through education of their kids. Regardless of what Hillary claimed, it takes a family.”


I’d wager curmudgeon has never read the book.
This line of thinking implies that children raised in foster homes or orphanages are inherently destined to immorality while the 2.5 children raised by Mr. and Mrs. Joe Christain are inherently the gold standards for morality.


Some children, abandoned by their fathers and raised by crackwhore mothers SOMEHOW turned out to be of the highest moral fiber and are wearing the colors of our armed forces thousands of miles away on this Memorial Day weekend. How’d that happen?

In point of fact, some children raised by the most god-fearing moral people learn to be rat bastards at school and elsewhere despite their parents’ most diligent attention and moral intentions… and then George W. Bush was elected president.

Posted by: Thom Houts at May 28, 2006 4:53 AM
Comment #152143

Bill Clinton is an amoral, egotistical ass. But he is the consumate politican and statesman.

George Bush claims to be a moral, compassionate servant of the people. But he wouldn’t know a good politican and statesman if one bit him on the ass.

I don’t know what that makes me. I voted for both of them - twice.

Posted by: ulysses at May 28, 2006 12:54 PM
Comment #152173

The problem is not just Republicans or Democrats or Independents.
Parties are not the problem or solution.
It is what makes up the parties.
Government is corrupt, irresponsible, FOR-SALE, and we keep re-electing those very same irreponsible incumbent politicians.

So, we are the . All of us.

Government will not reform itself, and voters have forgotten the one, simple, common-sense thing that is right under their very own noses; the one simple thing they were supposed to be dowing all along. Stop re-electing the very same irresponsible, incumbent politicians.

Posted by: d.a.n at May 28, 2006 2:30 PM
Comment #152204

D.A.N. you do bring up something I have been observing myself recently. Blame the internet,or multiple news channels,or just general dissatisfaction. It does appear that more and more of the electorate are forsaking party lines in favor of common sense. Election Reform!
Down with the Electoral College!

Posted by: jblym at May 28, 2006 4:00 PM
Comment #152459

Repeal the 16th Ammendment

Posted by: Weary Willie at May 29, 2006 3:45 PM
Comment #152546

Paul,

This is what an intelligent disillusioned republican does:

Reagan’s Navy chief seeks Va. Senate seat

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060529/ap_on_el_se/webb_s_next_fight;_ylt=Ao5hiMbK1FxFP0nIf1Po1siyFz4D;_ylu=X3oDMTA5aHJvMDdwBHNlYwN5bmNhdA—

KansasDem

Posted by: KansasDem at May 29, 2006 11:19 PM
Comment #152573

curmudgeon-at-large,

We (the US) are the good samaritans in this case.

Yeah, and the world outside is all bad guys…

We removed the world’s number one terrorist from his post. We SHOULD have done it while I was serving.

You mean Saddam Hussein was the terrorist behind 9/11?! Prove it. Please.

If you could prove it, then answer us why, since he’s “removed” from his post, american soldiers are still in Iraq. No more world’s number one terrorist there anymore, right, so why stay there instead of moving to the now world’s number one terrorist. Is Osama Ben Laden in Iraq, or what???
Meanwhile, oil fields and permanent american air bases are still in Iraq.

Posted by: Philippe Houdoin at May 30, 2006 6:01 AM
Comment #152574

Paul,

The Dems want to pay for all those people who do not want to work

If by “do not want” you mean “can’t find a job”, “lost their jobs due to globalization”, “can’t, being handicaped, “, you may be correct.
Otherwise, provide facts backing that a large part of people on welfare do not want to work. Meanwhile, it’s just your opinion.

Posted by: Philippe Houdoin at May 30, 2006 6:09 AM
Comment #153390

Ulysses:

“I don’t know what that makes me. I voted for both of them - twice.”

Confused?:-)

Posted by: Tim Crow at June 1, 2006 1:43 PM
Comment #153755

I would like to re-itterate Go f*ck yourself Patrick Leahy.And by jobe i think the liberals are in their last throes so to speak!

Posted by: lookingout at June 2, 2006 2:53 PM
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